US advises against Ebola isolation

[JDGRUEN]

My guess is that some locals up there in Maine have found a way to send her a few messages about her visiting town and being welcome and all -- 'ya hearuh !!!

Kaci Hickox says she'll finally take precautionary steps around town, but defends her fight against state Ebola quarantines

The defiant Maine nurse who made headlines for openly disobeying New Jersey- and Maine-ordered quarantines upon her return from West Africa admitted Sunday that her 'community has been through a lot.' But she refuses to apologize for her battle, accusing Gov. Chris Christie again of mistaking 'an abundance of caution' for 'an abundance of politics.'



http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/kaci-hickox-finally-precautionary-steps-town-defends-fight-state-ebola-quarantines-article-1.1996335

[MJP]

Americans who have survived Ebola have done so mainly by being diagnosed early, being mostly younger adults - otherwise healthy and strong, plus having the best of treatment and drugs, serum available, and all surrounding care, IV fluids of all nature to keep tissues alive.

It is great that they are alive, however at a great cost. For the two American Nurses - THEY SHOULD NEVER HAD TO HAVE BEEN EXPOSED IN THE FIRST PLACE. It was never necessary Mr. Duncan, all other Liberians, people of Sierra Leone and Guinea should have been barred entry into the United States months ago...

And if all the effort and extreme cost was thrown into building a first class hospital or hospital ship in the region the Ebola Aid workers could have been treated there... We spend millions and millions here - exposing people as Dr. Spencer did to treat Ebola Aid workers BUT if America and other countries joined in and built and staffed a real Western style treatment center in the region or as hospital ship - No Ebola would be in America - it would still be in the region and American Aid workers would be treated just as well as in America.

But NO - politics of open borders, no hindrance of immigration - no talk of this having a negative medical connection can be made all because of political correctness and nothing else.

None of it should have ever happened in the USA - period - it was not necessary and could have been prevented.

Americans have a right to be protected by their government - Americans should never be or have been EVEN exposed to Ebola...

But we have what we have and what we have is a total failure for leadership.

1620918_856503234409807_715264291279090244_n.jpg

Thomas Sowell is a black American who should be President because he is actually intelligent - not just hyped as being intelligent and has an abundance of common sense.

Has the UK barred entry to people from Ebola affected countries?

[JDGRUEN]

Americans who have survived Ebola have done so mainly by being diagnosed early, being mostly younger adults - otherwise healthy and strong, plus having the best of treatment and drugs, serum available, and all surrounding care, IV fluids of all nature to keep tissues alive.

It is great that they are alive, however at a great cost. For the two American Nurses - THEY SHOULD NEVER HAD TO HAVE BEEN EXPOSED IN THE FIRST PLACE. It was never necessary Mr. Duncan, all other Liberians, people of Sierra Leone and Guinea should have been barred entry into the United States months ago...

And if all the effort and extreme cost was thrown into building a first class hospital or hospital ship in the region the Ebola Aid workers could have been treated there... We spend millions and millions here - exposing people as Dr. Spencer did to treat Ebola Aid workers BUT if America and other countries joined in and built and staffed a real Western style treatment center in the region or as hospital ship - No Ebola would be in America - it would still be in the region and American Aid workers would be treated just as well as in America.

But NO - politics of open borders, no hindrance of immigration - no talk of this having a negative medical connection can be made all because of political correctness and nothing else.

None of it should have ever happened in the USA - period - it was not necessary and could have been prevented.

Americans have a right to be protected by their government - Americans should never be or have been EVEN exposed to Ebola...

But we have what we have and what we have is a total failure for leadership.

1620918_856503234409807_715264291279090244_n.jpg

Thomas Sowell is a black American who should be President because he is actually intelligent - not just hyped as being intelligent and has an abundance of common sense.

Has the UK barred entry to people from Ebola affected countries?

I believe on a selective basis they have - but I will check. Canada and Australia have.

[Ulysses G.]

Didn't the UK ban flights to Western Africa?

[JDGRUEN]

The U.K. seems to have done it to an extent. British Airways has suspended flights to Sierra Leone and Liberia until 31 March 2015 due to the deteriorating public health situation. And - The Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) advise against all but essential travel to Sierra Leone, except for those involved in the direct response to the Ebola outbreak,

Also Heathrow International Airport has instituted a screening program as has been posted here on TVF

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/sierra-leone

Also about 1/2 of other African countries have cut off travel/flight or entry in one form or another

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/10/02/these-countries-are-tightening-their-borders-over-ebola-fears-against-expert-advice/

Edited November 3, 2014 by JDGRUEN

[F430murci]

So, I was in church this am in the bathroom actually dealing with a work email when a guy during a conversation at the sink announced he just got back from Africa and was shaking hands with a mother guy.

Gotta admit, I wanted to kick his do gooder arrrsse for a ment their and I quickly existed the bathroom. I was even a bit noid when touching the door handle and I haven't the faintest where he had been. He could have been surfing at J-Bay for all I know.

Point is, easy to act like everything is all safe, but the noidism certainly sets in certain circumstances. I think I would have to butch slap that little red headed step sister Kaci on principal alone if she lived in my area . . , of course after the passage of 21 days though.

[JDGRUEN]

With information such as this ... showing the frightening aspects of Ebola in West Africa... IMO the political issue of Quarantine and even cutting off the issuance of Visas will become an even more hotly debated item... Perhaps the New Republican Senate and the increased Republican control of the House will bring to sanity to the situation.

Ebola rapidly advancing in rural Sierra Leone

London (AFP) - Ebola is spreading up to nine times faster in parts of Sierra Leone than two months ago, a report by the Africa Governance Initiative (AGI) said on Sunday.

"Whilst new cases appear to have slowed in Liberia, Ebola is continuing to spread frighteningly quickly in parts of Sierra Leone," said the AGI report.

http://news.yahoo.com/ebola-rapidly-advancing-rural-sierra-leone-201756826.html

[attrayant]

Meanwhile, just wondering, has anyone else pondered about this question/issue?

The death rate for Ebola in West Africa is pretty high, generally averaging about 70% from what I've read. And certainly, the available medical facilities there are minimal in quality at best.

But in the U.S., look at what's happened thus far (and I hope I'm getting these details correct):

The one West African guy who returned to the U.S. and got pretty sick before going to the hospital DIED.

But, the two original Americans working in West Africa who were diagnosed with the disease and later sent to the U.S. for treatment both survived. And the two Dallas nurses who contracted the disease in Dallas now have both survived and emerged clear of the disease. And from what I've heard, the NY doctor who contracted it seemed to be faring pretty well. WHY?

Is it because some/all??? of those folks treated in the U.S. received some of the experimental treatments? Is it because they had medical intervention at an earlier point in the disease than the one guy who died in the U.S.? And/or a combination of those things along with simply a better quality of supportive care in the U.S. compared to what's happening in West Africa???

The countries with the highest number of infectious disease deaths:

are the countries with the lowest per capita health spending:

Ebola is a symptom of a larger health crisis.

[thailiketoo]

The countries with the highest number of infectious disease deaths:

are the countries with the lowest per capita health spending:

Ebola is a symptom of a larger health crisis.

Ebola is Ebola. It's not the symptom of anything except Ebola. You isolate the people who have the disease and when they die it stops. I believe that is how it has stopped on the other occasions it has occurred. Outbreaks have been happening since 1976. http://www.cdc.gov/vhf/ebola/outbreaks/history/chronology.html

[attrayant]

Ebola is Ebola. It's not the symptom of anything except Ebola.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Are you saying you don't see any correlation between per capita health spending and the rates of death from infectious diseases? Because it's pretty clear there is one.

[thailiketoo]

Ebola is Ebola. It's not the symptom of anything except Ebola.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Are you saying you don't see any correlation between per capita health spending and the rates of death from infectious diseases? Because it's pretty clear there is one.

I am saying regardless of your attempt at obfuscation this thread is about Ebola and not the whole scope of infectious diseases. The topic is, "US advises against Ebola isolation."

[attrayant]

If you think I'm off topic then report my post, don't whine about it in the thread. Another poster asked a question about country-specific fatality rates compared to health facilities and I provided a very specific answer. That you refer to this as "obfuscation" says more about you than me.

[thailiketoo]

If you think I'm off topic then report my post, don't whine about it in the thread. Another poster asked a question about country-specific fatality rates compared to health facilities and I provided a very specific answer. That you refer to this as "obfuscation" says more about you than me.

The guy asked a question about Ebola you expanded it to include all infectious diseases.

Is it because some/all??? of those folks treated in the U.S. received some of the experimental treatments? Is it because they had medical intervention at an earlier point in the disease than the one guy who died in the U.S.? And/or a combination of those things along with simply a better quality of supportive care in the U.S. compared to what's happening in West Africa???

Above is the question the poster asked. You tried to change it to, "Ebola is a symptom of a larger health crisis" But it's not. Ebola is Ebola. Because there is a better health care it is still Ebola.

The way to cure Ebola is not by providing better health care to Africa. It is by isolating those ill and long term inventing a vaccine.

Edited November 3, 2014 by thailiketoo

[attrayant]

I give up. Perhaps there's a language barrier here. 'Symptom of a larger problem' is a popular metaphor.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/metaphor

metaphor

[met-uh-fawr, -fer]

noun

1. a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance.

Compare mixed metaphor, simile (def 1).

2. something used, or regarded as being used, to represent something else; emblem; symbol.

Edited November 3, 2014 by attrayant

[thailiketoo]

I give up. Perhaps there's a language barrier here. 'Symptom of a larger problem' is a popular metaphor.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/metaphor

metaphor

[met-uh-fawr, -fer]

noun

1. a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance.

Compare mixed metaphor, simile (def 1).

2. something used, or regarded as being used, to represent something else; emblem; symbol.

You wrote, "Ebola is a symptom of a larger health crisis." That is what I am disagreeing with. Nothing about metaphors. Ebola is not the symptom of a larger health care crisis. It is about Ebola.

[Scott]

Let's keep it civil and reasonably on-topic.

[JDGRUEN]

Here we go again ... Liberian man arrives - no fever - next day fever...Has Ebola - maybe he does - maybe not... but we know it is going to cost tens of thousands of dollars to isolate a man and run tests for Ebola to find out..

Why is he in America? Because he has a visa to enter America ... if he didn't have that visa he would be in Liberia... Oh well - at least he is in medical quarantine ...

But what about those few hours when the fever came out --- wonder what the details are on that? No details on timing - who was with him - how many hours of fever before he got to the hospital... If he has Ebola we will probably hear about it in great detail... and we will hear about people having to be checked for Ebola - self monitoring, yada yada yada and we will hear the cash registers ringing - kaching !

Patient being evaluated for ‘potential Ebola virus’ at Duke University Hospital

Officials said the patient left Liberia and arrived at Newark Liberty International Airport on Friday, which is one of five airports screening people for illnesses linked to Ebola. The patient had no symptoms upon arrival in the United States.

The patient arrived in Person County on Saturday and developed a fever on Sunday. The person was then transferred to Duke University Hospital.

http://myfox8.com/2014/11/02/patient-being-evaulated-for-potential-ebola-virus-at-duke-university-hospital/

Edited November 3, 2014 by JDGRUEN

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I give up. Perhaps there's a language barrier here. 'Symptom of a larger problem' is a popular metaphor.

I think there's little doubt that Ebola is and has been spreading the way it has been in West Africa, and with the high level of mortality, because of the comparatively poorer health of residents there, the environment in which many live, and the correspondingly poor medical system that's not up to treating those infected.

Whether the original outbreak there is caused by those conditions -- or instead the presence of certain animals like bats that are hosts for the disease -- I'm not sure. But any way you cut it, Ebola in West Africa would be much less of a worldwide concern if the people there and their health care system were in better shape.

But acknowledging that doesn't really change or impact the argument being made here for quarantining those potentially exposed and at least requiring those traveling from Ebola-hit countries to either undergo quarantine first and/or restricting routine travel visas for the native populations there.

[F430murci]

Here we go again ... Liberian man arrives - no fever - next day fever...Has Ebola - maybe he does - maybe not... but we know it is going to cost tens of thousands of dollars to isolate a man and run tests for Ebola to find out..

Why is he in America? Because he has a visa to enter America ... if he didn't have that visa he would be in Liberia... Oh well - at least he is in medical quarantine ...

But what about those few hours when the fever came out --- wonder what the details are on that? No details on timing - who was with him - how many hours of fever before he got to the hospital... If he has Ebola we will probably hear about it in great detail... and we will hear about people having to be checked for Ebola - self monitoring, yada yada yada and we will hear the cash registers ringing - kaching !

Patient being evaluated for potential Ebola virus at Duke University Hospital

Officials said the patient left Liberia and arrived at Newark Liberty International Airport on Friday, which is one of five airports screening people for illnesses linked to Ebola. The patient had no symptoms upon arrival in the United States.

The patient arrived in Person County on Saturday and developed a fever on Sunday. The person was then transferred to Duke University Hospital.

http://myfox8.com/2014/11/02/patient-being-evaulated-for-potential-ebola-virus-at-duke-university-hospital/

Looks like everyone can relax, breathe a collective sigh of relief and enjoy their day now without fear of a rapid national outbreak due to this tosser from Liberia. I have it in good information that the sky ain't falling today.

---------

Duke Hospital patient tests negative for Ebola

Read more at http://www.wral.com/duke-hospital-patient-tests-negative-for-ebola-/14142583/#alVFxPs3WGmKFw2f.99

Edited November 3, 2014 by F430murci

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

California's contribution to this debate:

L.A. Times, Oct. 29, 2014

Anyone arriving in California from an Ebola-affected area and who has had personal contact with a person infected with the deadly virus will be quarantined for 21 days, according to an order issued Wednesday by the state's public health director.

The order provides a more nuanced set of guidelines to assess the risk associated with people returning from regions afflicted by an Ebola outbreak -- currently Sierra Leone, Liberia and Guinea -- than the controversial blanket quarantines in New Jersey, New York and Maine.

In California, county health officials will have the ability to screen passengers arriving from Ebola-stricken regions in West Africa, or who have worked with infected patients, to determine if they’re at risk for the disease and if they should be quarantined for the virus' three-week incubation period. Failure to comply with a quarantine order could result in misdemeanor criminal charges.

...................................

Anyone who arrives in California from regions where an outbreak is active, but who has not come in contact with an Ebola patient, won’t be quarantined under the guidelines, the California Department of Public Health said in announcing the mandate. Health workers will screen passengers on a case-by-case basis.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-california-orders-ebola-quarantine-protocols-20141029-story.html

And then further:

In an example of modified restrictions, San Mateo County health officials said Wednesday that Dr. Colin Bucks, a Stanford School of Medicine professor who recently returned from work in Liberia, has been directed to stay away from work and away from close contact with others for 21 days. However, he has been allowed "limited activity outside of his home, such as jogging alone," a health department statement said. Bucks must also take his temperature and contact county health officers twice a day.

Epidemiologist Ralph Frerichs, a professor emeritus at the UCLA School of Public Health, said he too was glad to see formal action taken on a quarantine that could also be modified depending on the situation.

"I like having the 21-day quarantine. I like starting with that hard point," Frerichs said. "This doesn't mean someone has to be put into a jail somewhere, or put in their house with no opportunity for leaving. It's a common sense thing."

[Emphasis added:] Frerichs said a quarantine was important because a test for the virus might not be positive in the early stages of the illness, when the number of viral particles in the body was still relatively small.

"People often say that the medical personnel going off to Africa are doing God's work," Frerichs said. "I don't discount that they're doing very important work and that it's selfless. The problem is, whether a person is very great or very bad doesn't make a difference to the virus."

http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-ebola-california-20141030-story.html

Edited November 3, 2014 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[japsportscarmad]

Americans who have survived Ebola have done so mainly by being diagnosed early, being mostly younger adults - otherwise healthy and strong, plus having the best of treatment and drugs, serum available, and all surrounding care, IV fluids of all nature to keep tissues alive.

It is great that they are alive, however at a great cost. For the two American Nurses - THEY SHOULD NEVER HAD TO HAVE BEEN EXPOSED IN THE FIRST PLACE. It was never necessary Mr. Duncan, all other Liberians, people of Sierra Leone and Guinea should have been barred entry into the United States months ago...

And if all the effort and extreme cost was thrown into building a first class hospital or hospital ship in the region the Ebola Aid workers could have been treated there... We spend millions and millions here - exposing people as Dr. Spencer did to treat Ebola Aid workers BUT if America and other countries joined in and built and staffed a real Western style treatment center in the region or as hospital ship - No Ebola would be in America - it would still be in the region and American Aid workers would be treated just as well as in America.

But NO - politics of open borders, no hindrance of immigration - no talk of this having a negative medical connection can be made all because of political correctness and nothing else.

None of it should have ever happened in the USA - period - it was not necessary and could have been prevented.

Americans have a right to be protected by their government - Americans should never be or have been EVEN exposed to Ebola...

But we have what we have and what we have is a total failure for leadership.

1620918_856503234409807_715264291279090244_n.jpg

Thomas Sowell is a black American who should be President because he is actually intelligent - not just hyped as being intelligent and has an abundance of common sense.

Has the UK barred entry to people from Ebola affected countries?

Not directly but there are some restrictions but we have been screening at the airports (actually we've only claimed to screen in practice were just asking if people feel ok!! Despite the hype from the politicians about full scale screening.

If some one arrives we can't send them back in any case as they can't be put on a flight, and like those turning up with HIV we couldn't send them back even if we wanted to as under EU law "as there's no effective treatment in their own country" it breaches their human rights unbelievable. We're supposed to have a "National Health Service" the clues in the word National not International.

If I was from one of the countries affected and even had even the sniff of been infected, had a passport and the means I'd be heading straight to the UK.

[JDGRUEN]

It seems that the obama Administration is quietly authorizing more Ebola patients to be treated in America... with no Congressional approval to begin or fund such a program.

Clinical Care of Two Patients with Ebola Virus Disease in the United States

Patient 1... The first patient was a 33-year-old physician who had been working in Liberia since October 2013, during which time he had remained healthy while taking daily combination therapy with atovaquone and proguanil as prophylaxis against malaria. Patient 2 ... The second patient was a 59-year-old female missionary who had been working in Liberia at the same facility as Patient 1.

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1409838#t=article

[JDGRUEN]

Sadly - the youngish Doctor dies from Ebola...

But it is safe you see -- just no problem at all to allow West Africans of the Ebola stricken countries to have visas and visit America...

Seems the Doctor was a resident legal alien of the U.S. He should have been given the best of treatment and was ... perhaps too much of a delay in that... Which is all the more reason that a First Class - Large 21st. Century Hospital or Hospital ship needs to be built or placed in the area. Plus helicopters from the U.K., EU, AUS and U.S. to ferry patients there... And a wing of the hospital devoted only to International Ebola Aid workers... to get them the best treatment without delay...

The subject of Ebola seems to destroy common sense...

Doctor with Ebola dies at Nebraska hospital

Martin Salia, 44, a legal US resident, was infected with Ebola while treating patients in his home country. The virus has killed thousands in West Africa since the start of the year.

http://news.yahoo.com/leone-doctor-ebola-dies-us-hospital-143107741.html

Edited November 18, 2014 by JDGRUEN