DNA results from Ko Tao village head’s son don't match traces on slain British tourists

[shaurene]

the protected ones phone records would reveal where he was during the time period

cant be that hard to "persuade" someone at DTAC,AIS,TRUE to print you out a copy

You see this is what I don't understand, I know it's a different case and in a different country but the Dewani murder trial in SA at the minute are going through phone records and text messages, surely it can be done in any country?

The Police can get a number traced on where a persons calls came from on a mobile I was concerned long time ago with my First Lady, I got my lawyer to have her number check on certain dates it cost me 20k and my lawyer had it checked through a police officer in Pattaya and her calls came from her village on those dates.

[JOC]

Does anybody know if the UK police , Thai Police and Lawyers both sides have procedures in place to go over the different forums and media facebook etc in thailand as part of this investigation ?

Would it be a standard procedure for similar cases like this ?

Could you imagine the prosecutor show up in court with print-outs of all JTJ and jdinasia's posts!!

Adressing the court:

"Your honour, we have sadly screwed up the DNA-evidence, but according to two outstanding expat experts

there is no doubt about the accuseds guilt"

We would now like to call our first witness:

"Khun John, in your expert opinion..................................."

[Mooner]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

[boomerangutang]

"so it is unnecessary to forward the DNA results to the British government"

so this basically confirms the tests were bullshit.

The son's DNA was very likely processed correctly. The big question is: IS THE DNA FOUND ON VICTIM RELIABLE? ...the dna it used for comparison.

It would be very easy for Thai officials, WHO CONTROL DNA RESULTS FROM CRIME SCENE, to pull a ruse. It would be very easy for Thai officials to simply photocopy the results from the Burmese, AND CLAIM THOSE ARE THE SPECIMENS TAKEN FROM THE VICTIM.

Everything the Thai cops have done (and not done) since they fingered the Burmese has REEKED OF FRAME-UP, as well as SHIELDING THE HEADMAN'S PEOPLE.

Of course Thai officials don't want to pass the latest DNA results to the Brits. If they did, it would enable the Brits to compare it with crimes scene DNA, if they have it. It would blow the cover off the frame-up. Heads would roll.

They have it, they want to do a comparison.

I hope you're right, that UK officials have original DNA data from crime scene. If so, then by Thai officials not sharing data is further proof of their blundering cover-up, frame-up of Burmese, and tirelessly sheltering the headman's people.

[atsiii]

Police announce that the DNA test of the influential son does not match that found in the victim. But strangely, it does match that of the police officer who was responsible for obtaining the son's DNA sample for testing. The officer was overheard telling the worried influential father, "don;t fret, I guarantee the test won't match because I was in BKK at the time of the murders."

Point being: when there is no independent oversight, it's just too easy to manipulate all this sort of stuff. That's why if you are sincere, you welcome independent oversight.

[jdinasia]

Does anybody know if the UK police , Thai Police and Lawyers both sides have procedures in place to go over the different forums and media facebook etc in thailand as part of this investigation ?

Would it be a standard procedure for similar cases like this ?

Could you imagine the prosecutor show up in court with print-outs of all JTJ and jdinasia's posts!!

Adressing the court:

"Your honour, we have sadly screwed up the DNA-evidence, but according to two outstanding expat experts

there is no doubt about the accuseds guilt"

We would now like to call our first witness:

"Khun John, in your expert opinion..................................."

Sadly you resort to straw man arguments that lie. Not surprisingly

[jdinasia]

Does anybody know if the UK police , Thai Police and Lawyers both sides have procedures in place to go over the different forums and media facebook etc in thailand as part of this investigation ?

Would it be a standard procedure for similar cases like this ?

Could you imagine the prosecutor show up in court with print-outs of all JTJ and jdinasia's posts!!

Adressing the court:

"Your honour, we have sadly screwed up the DNA-evidence, but according to two outstanding expat experts

there is no doubt about the accuseds guilt"

We would now like to call our first witness:

"Khun John, in your expert opinion..................................."

Sadly you resort to straw man arguments that lie. Not surprisingly

[Bleacher Bum East]

the protected ones phone records would reveal where he was during the time period

cant be that hard to "persuade" someone at DTAC,AIS,TRUE to print you out a copy

You see this is what I don't understand, I know it's a different case and in a different country but the Dewani murder trial in SA at the minute are going through phone records and text messages, surely it can be done in any country?

Not without a court order. That requires probable cause.

No probable cause exists for someone that has been cleared.

Actually, at least according to the language of Thailand's Code of Criminal Procedure, a search warrant in Thailand does not require probable cause, while an arrest warrant does.

A search warrant only requires the investigator to be engaged in "discovering and seizing an article which may be used as evidence for the sake of an inquiry, preliminary hearing or trial."

This has implications for many aspects of the investigation ---not just limited to one particular person. For example, a demand for all available CCTV footage on the island would not require probable cause or reasonable suspicion according to the Code of Criminal Procedure.

Section 66 Arrest Warrants

A warrant of arrest shall be issued on the following grounds:

(1) When there is justifiable evidence supporting that any person is likely to have committed an offence [Note this is a "probable cause" standard] liable to the maximum imprisonment for a term surpassing three years; or

(2) When there is justifiable evidence supporting that any person might have committed an offence and there is reasonable belief that he may abscond, tamper with evidence or cause another danger.

Section 69 Search Warrants

A warrant of search may be directed for any of the following purposes:

• Discovering and seizing an article which may be used as evidence for the sake of an inquiry, preliminary hearing or trial [Note no mention of a "probable cause" or "reasonable suspicion" standard]
• Discovering and seizing an article whose possession constitutes an offence, or which has been obtained by unlawful means or which is reasonably suspected to have been used or intended to be used for committing an offence [Note this is a "reasonable suspicion" standard].
• Etc.

Edited November 1, 2014 by Bleacher Bum East

[boomerangutang]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

Probably because there are more holes in the police work than a tugboat full of swiss cheese. but seriously, the prosecutors work for officialdom. They're hand in hand with police. If the police are involved with a frame-up, then prosecutors will likely work with them to batten down the frame up. Otherwise, it could be yet more embarrassment for officialdom, if that's possible. I'd venture to say judges are in the same boat, but saying something like that could get me in trouble.

I went to a Thai court proceeding 2 weeks ago. Everyone entering the small courtroom is required to bow if moving anywhere in the room. One could say it's enforced respect.

[StealthEnergiser]

Can't wait to see how the pancake translater explains his version about the wine bottle that was used as a weapon,

[laobali]

Seeing that British subjects are involved, the British government should should look at all the evidence ( or lack of it ) and make an objection in the strongest terms and insist on being directly involved with an independant DNA test using sample that I believe the British must surely have ( fend or please ) If this fails the only meaningful and effective protest left open to the people who really and truly are genuinely committed to truth and justice in this case, is to boycott Thailand by staying away from there. Go to a country where there is justice with better personal safety records, where you're not likely to get raped and murdered by a psychopathic maniac who is left to go free to do it again.

That would rule out most of Southeast Asia!

[culicine]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

Because, basically that's all they have. And that is not enough for a conviction. There could be a number of inconsistencies and missing information as well. I guess the BiBs report was not so perfect after all.

[MJP]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

Because, basically that's all they have. And that is not enough for a conviction. There could be a number of inconsistencies and missing information as well. I guess the BiBs report was not so perfect after all.

It does appear to be so. Yes.

[taony]

My god, jd. Enough of the one line nonsense. Either post something of substance that adds to the conversation or shut the hell up already.

[Sueemily]

Many years ago a certain person from Chaingmai was tested on a polygraph ,on vital questions it came out that he lied,he was tested again and ,guess what ,he passed on all accounts.

Why take the second result and not the first,because it suited the Thais ,because of who he was.

This is the same unless the uk police can do an Independant DNA test then what's the point......and it's pretty doubtful that they will be allowed.

[JOC]

Does anybody know if the UK police , Thai Police and Lawyers both sides have procedures in place to go over the different forums and media facebook etc in thailand as part of this investigation ?

Would it be a standard procedure for similar cases like this ?

Could you imagine the prosecutor show up in court with print-outs of all JTJ and jdinasia's posts!!

Adressing the court:

"Your honour, we have sadly screwed up the DNA-evidence, but according to two outstanding expat experts

there is no doubt about the accuseds guilt"

We would now like to call our first witness:

"Khun John, in your expert opinion..................................."

Sadly you resort to straw man arguments that lie. Not surprisingly

Soidogs have more sense of humor!! Not surprisingly!!

[metisdead]

Posts with messed up quotes have been removed.

[StealthEnergiser]

the protected ones phone records would reveal where he was during the time period

cant be that hard to "persuade" someone at DTAC,AIS,TRUE to print you out a copy

You see this is what I don't understand, I know it's a different case and in a different country but the Dewani murder trial in SA at the minute are going through phone records and text messages, surely it can be done in any country?

Not without a court order. That requires probable cause.

No probable cause exists for someone that has been cleared.

What about the accused phones?

Would place them on the island. Near the murders.

Yes I know that bit but what about text messages and call records surely there could be something in them ?

Unlikely, but the defense attorneys would look at that if it could be useful.

I would say more than useful I would be begging for my texts and phone records to be looked at, your not telling me that no calls or texts were made? But this is just my opinion.

At 4am, who would you be calling or texting?

What a stupid statement if somebody has commited a crime like the first thing they are likely to do is panic and call for help.

You are really annoying me you are so disrespectful to these families.

[PaPiPuPePo]

Just reading on csiLA they are saying the pancake translator said that a wine bottle was used as a weapon.

CSI LA is about as trustworthy as the Thai police!!

Really, how do you draw that equivalence? Neither's 100% reliable, but does that mean 80% equals 20% so?

[Alwyn]

This is from the British government travel advisory - on the safety and security page https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand/safety-and-security Let's hope it gets stronger

[alfalfa19]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

[Bleacher Bum East]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

Because, basically that's all they have. And that is not enough for a conviction. There could be a number of inconsistencies and missing information as well. I guess the BiBs report was not so perfect after all.

It does appear to be so. Yes.

I think that one of the things that Hannah and David's families via the British government, people in the media, on social media and all of the Thai people can legitimately request is that the investigation include some basic things that any fair and thorough investigation would include, so everyone in the public can be confident that justice has been served and the killers are caught and unable to do this again.

In my opinion, Touch DNA is the single most important item that should have been investigated which the public has been given no information about to date (Not that they should have been given this information, just that they haven't been).

All the talk has been of DNA from semen on/in Hannah’s body and saliva on a cigarette butt. But it is highly likely, in fact almost certain, that there is Touch DNA on Hannah’s clothing and possibly David’s, as well as on the handle of the hoe, on the cell phone, etc., and that there was Touch DNA on Hannah’s body and possibly David’s as well.

If Touch DNA gathering and testing has not been done already, it still could be (on the clothes and murder weapon at least). And if the Thai forensics lab does not have the latest technology and capability, I think there are a few guys in town right now that do.

For all we know, a through and professional Touch DNA investigation has already been conducted. But if it hasn't been done, any objective observer would say it should be. And the prosecutor should request it to be done as well.

[jdinasia]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

What would they do with it? They can't interfere in Thailand's domestic issues.

[KunMatt]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

What would they do with it? They can't interfere in Thailand's domestic issues.

Yeah God forbid that the families in the UK would actually want to find out the truth behind who killed their loved ones instead of this pathetic spectacle they are being subjected to.

[jdinasia]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

What would they do with it? They can't interfere in Thailand's domestic issues.

Yeah God forbid that the families in the UK would actually want to find out the truth behind who killed their loved ones instead of this pathetic spectacle they are being subjected to.

Got it!!

Violate Thai sovereignty to not be able to prove anything?

[Number 3]

Hannah is laid to rest but the culprits are still alive.

Better we not forget that. Let's have some real justice. Not the Bull we have had to endure. Not the face saving

that has gone on. Where is our government. We are the police who went to observe.

A young woman who was brutally murdered in the prime of her life.

R.I.P Hannah

RIP David. You are not forgotten .

[StealthEnergiser]

If the RTP have found that the DNA of the Burmese boys matching that found on Hannah why would the prosecution keep sending the case back?

Because, basically that's all they have. And that is not enough for a conviction. There could be a number of inconsistencies and missing information as well. I guess the BiBs report was not so perfect after all.

It does appear to be so. Yes.

I think that one of the things that Hannah and David's families via the British government, people in the media, on social media and all of the Thai people can legitimately request is that the investigation include some basic things that any fair and thorough investigation would include, so everyone in the public can be confident that justice has been served and the killers are caught and unable to do this again.

In my opinion, Touch DNA is the single most important item that should have been investigated which the public has been given no information about to date (Not that they should have been given this information, just that they haven't been).

All the talk has been of DNA from semen on/in Hannah’s body and saliva on a cigarette butt. But it is highly likely, in fact almost certain, that there is Touch DNA on Hannah’s clothing and possibly David’s, as well as on the handle of the hoe, on the cell phone, etc., and that there was Touch DNA on Hannah’s body and possibly David’s as well.

If Touch DNA gathering and testing has not been done already, it still could be (on the clothes and murder weapon at least). And if the Thai forensics lab does not have the latest technology and capability, I think there are a few guys in town right now that do.

For all we know, a through and professional Touch DNA investigation has already been conducted. But if it hasn't been done, any objective observer would say it should be. And the prosecutor should request it to be done as well.

There is a video of them running a cotton bud over the handle of the hoe whilst on the beach not sure if they got any reults from that.

at 1.14

Edited November 1, 2014 by StealthEnergiser

[spud1]

This is from the British government travel advisory - on the safety and security page https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/thailand/safety-and-security Let's hope it gets stronger

The warnings have certainly expanded since this farcical investigation.I can only presume the unelected imbeciles currently in charge of Thailand are starting to piss some people off.

[Number 3]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

What would they do with it? They can't interfere in Thailand's domestic issues.

Yeah God forbid that the families in the UK would actually want to find out the truth behind who killed their loved ones instead of this pathetic spectacle they are being subjected to.

Whom ever speculated that the DNA of the son would be managed in a transparent manner and not as a media farce how dare you. If you are found you face 5 years in prison! Such speculating will no longer be tolerated. Your friendly plods

[KunMatt]

The circus continues. I bet it would not be hard for enterprising UK officers to get a real sample of this worm's DNA.

What would they do with it? They can't interfere in Thailand's domestic issues.

Yeah God forbid that the families in the UK would actually want to find out the truth behind who killed their loved ones instead of this pathetic spectacle they are being subjected to.

Got it!!

Violate Thai sovereignty to not be able to prove anything?

Because you know it all and this whole investigation has just been perfect from the beginning. The police accusing the friends of the victims and planting shorts in their luggage, the crime scene being violated by people who were accused by the police and then cleared by a flimsy alibi, the taxi driver forced to give a false witness by the police, the Burmese guys testing negative, the official translator being a local street vendor, all of this and so much more just screams such a perfect investigation that the UK police had to come here and get involved for what reason again? Tell me...