Crane collapses (again) over Emporium expansion on Sukhumvit Road

[kuiburi]

There are in Thailand very good construction company's , but also some corrupted ones , like it is in the west .

Probably in the west less then in SEA , but I think its not correct to put all the Thai construction company's on a pile and say that all is bad .

I am in construction 27 years , I see some great jobs done here and terrible jobs done here .

[Amantec]

It was the Negligent part imprinted in their genes.....i would say

[apalink_thailand]

To western eyes this is just poor workmanship, poor standards, poor workmen being supervised (?) by poor supervisors, everything about buidlings here is unlikely to built to western standards.

To Thai eyes and they know a thing or two about building, look at all those beach front condo blocks, its just bad luck, can't remember it ever happening before.

More often than not its a case of poor preventative maintenance and not following safe operating procedures on the machinery. That and lack of training and qualification on the part of the crane operators and banksmen. Shortcuts kill.

[Litlos]

Just to throw a different slant on it i have seen exactly this type of crane incident before in Thailand. The cause? Chinese copy shackles made to look like and sold as genuine shackles. Worked really well for about two weeks then broke.

[Jonmarleesco]

Stupid buggers! And a repeat incident. Not content with persisting with staying open for business while refurbishment takes place in their existing facility; that, despite expecting shoppers to negotiate an assault course, Emporium is evidently employing dangerously incompetent contractors to erect its new shopping mall.

[Jonmarleesco]

And across the road at the Emporium now under going upgrading, it is a nightmare waiting for an accident to happen. It's a full blown construction site yet some shops are still open amidst the chaos. On arrival, they should give you a hard hat and a map. Today, I saw two Japanese women fall on the uneven floor covered in felt. Why the Emporium owners didn't close the entire complex and just get on with it, I guess only $$$ guided them. I'm waiting for a German or American to sue them after such a fall.

'I'm waiting for a German or American to sue them after such a fall.' For a few thousand baht, if they're lucky.

Emporium's last refurbishment showed evidence of p . . . poor finishing, and they are part owners of Siam Paragon, which opened prematurely. What happened? A child fell through a hole in an unfinished floor.

[chooka]

Numbnuts, twice in 3 months and they want or build enormous skyscrapers. Take thier lego blocks off them as they are not ready to play.

Edited November 6, 2014 by chooka

[englishoak]

You cannot access this incident with western or first world standards. lift analysis,operation licenses . These incident will conti ue to happen due to the third world mentality, gross incompetence and corruption within construction industry in this part of the word. It will not change , you can do as many lift analysis as you like , people will still die. Serious legal consequences , fine and imprisonment with proper enforcement is what is required. And as mentioned with the people running the companies in with politicians, that is not likely to happen

surely your not suggesting construction cranes in the West don't collapse ? and for the very same reasons you state for Thailand and SEA,

a quick look at U-tube will prove other wise, my friend, cranes like this collapse all over the world for the same reasons, in review of these western crane collapse's go an see what the "legal" consequences where with respect to fines and imprisonment....

If you wish go an compare the number of cranes of this type that collapse in Farangistan versus Thailand and SEA and come back and tell us the numbers..

Just for the UK alone off the top of my head, and this is in a country which has some of the most rabid Occupational Health and Safety officials on the planet...

Liverpool tower crane collapse

Canada Square crane collapse

Batersea power station collapse

Go find a site where its happened twice on the same site in 3mths in those countries............ you wont, thats the point.

[Soutpeel]

You cannot access this incident with western or first world standards. lift analysis,operation licenses . These incident will conti ue to happen due to the third world mentality, gross incompetence and corruption within construction industry in this part of the word. It will not change , you can do as many lift analysis as you like , people will still die. Serious legal consequences , fine and imprisonment with proper enforcement is what is required. And as mentioned with the people running the companies in with politicians, that is not likely to happen

surely your not suggesting construction cranes in the West don't collapse ? and for the very same reasons you state for Thailand and SEA,

a quick look at U-tube will prove other wise, my friend, cranes like this collapse all over the world for the same reasons, in review of these western crane collapse's go an see what the "legal" consequences where with respect to fines and imprisonment....

If you wish go an compare the number of cranes of this type that collapse in Farangistan versus Thailand and SEA and come back and tell us the numbers..

Just for the UK alone off the top of my head, and this is in a country which has some of the most rabid Occupational Health and Safety officials on the planet...

Liverpool tower crane collapse

Canada Square crane collapse

Batersea power station collapse

Go find a site where its happened twice on the same site in 3mths in those countries............ you wont, thats the point.

Granted not the UK, but Aussie which has comparable "western or first world standards. lift analysis,operation licenses" everyone is bleating on about or is Aussie 3rd world now ?

5 in 10 months....

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/yet-another-crane-accident-at-royal-adelaide-hospital-building-site-fifth-in-ten-months/story-fni6uo1m-1227030934396?nk=30811493f1a555a6b4e90e3caec1a9bc

Granted not on the same site, but interesting reading none the less

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/04/nyregion/one-killed-and-four-hurt-in-crane-collapse-on-west-side.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

Interesting commentary on site work safety in another first world country

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/lives-fall-cracks-city-lets-safety-lag-article-1.1239076

Yes yes....3rd world countries so bad, Western countries so perfect

[ExPratt]

Soutpeel, on 06 Nov 2014 - 16:25, said:

ExPratt, on 06 Nov 2014 - 16:15, said:

You cannot access this incident with western or first world standards. lift analysis,operation licenses . These incident will conti ue to happen due to the third world mentality, gross incompetence and corruption within construction industry in this part of the word. It will not change , you can do as many lift analysis as you like , people will still die. Serious legal consequences , fine and imprisonment with proper enforcement is what is required. And as mentioned with the people running the companies in with politicians, that is not likely to happen

surely your not suggesting construction cranes in the West don't collapse ? and for the very same reasons you state for Thailand and SEA,

a quick look at U-tube will prove other wise, my friend, cranes like this collapse all over the world for the same reasons, in review of these western crane collapse's go an see what the "legal" consequences where with respect to fines and imprisonment....

If you wish go an compare the number of cranes of this type that collapse in Farangistan versus Thailand and SEA and come back and tell us the numbers..

Just for the UK alone off the top of my head, and this is in a country which has some of the most rabid Occupational Health and Safety officials on the planet...

Liverpool tower crane collapse

Canada Square crane collapse

Batersea power station collapse

Its the frequency ad the following "Punishment" that is different though isnt it ?

I have just finished working on a 5 years construction project in Malaysia which had 9 fatalities. The company continue to be awarded government project because 8 of the 9 killed were foreign workers and 10,000 ringitt took care of them , plus the company is partnered by a high ranking politicians wife. IMO Thailand is worse than Malaysia. The company killed 3 foreign workers in a project in KL about 4 months ago, when launching viaduct beams

How many major construction projects have you been on yourself in Asia , what countries do you have this experience to compare to the UK ? No one was killed or injured ?

The subject riles me because people like yourself don't see or read how many die and the lack of action afterward, Its 3 Monkeys time, no one wants to rock the boat , its carnage and most of it covered up

[Soutpeel]

I have just finished working on a 5 years construction project in Malaysia which had 9 fatalities. The company continue to be awarded government project because 8 of the 9 killed were foreign workers and 10,000 ringitt took care of them , plus the company is partnered by a high ranking politicians wife. IMO Thailand is worse than Malaysia. The company killed 3 foreign workers in a project in KL about 4 months ago, when launching viaduct beams

How many major construction projects have you been on yourself in Asia , what countries do you have this experience to compare to the UK ? No one was killed or injured ?

The subject riles me because people like yourself don't see or read how many die and the lack of action afterward, Its 3 Monkeys time, no one wants to rock the boat , its carnage and most of it covered up

Just to put a perspective on in it I have been involved in industry projects in Asia a lot longer than you - sum total over the years 17 years, in many of the countries in this region

and yes in this 17 years there have been people killed and seriously injured on sites I have worked on

I have at no point have suggesting there isn't issues and things need to be improved, but please don't suggest the West is so perfect and Asia so bad as you have tried to do.

If the conduct of the companies on the project your so reprehensible to you personally as regards safety, why did you spend 5 years on the project, why didn't you walk off job and quit ?

for me personally if I worked in place where I thought the safety was so bad, I feared for my own safety, I would quit, and in fact this exactly what I did do one time working on a site, which was in the US funny enough.

As regards your last sentence, I am fully aware of what goes on, and I am not suggesting what goes on is acceptable, its not... people should not be getting killed or hurt anywhere in the world, but at the same time I an not singling out Asia as being so bad, and the West "so good" as you are, one only has to read the news papers, watch the news in various countries in the West to see they are not immune to this either

Maybe take a look at the links I provided in a earlier post which will give you examples of what I am on about

Fact is almost all the countries in this region are classed as developing, and when the UK US and various other "western" countries were developing nations, the same sh*t was happening

for example one only has to go back to the 1920/30's in the US while New york was developing and a person was being killed for every floor of every skyscraper they were putting up...

Edited November 7, 2014 by Soutpeel

[ExPratt]

Southpeel

Just to put a perspective on in it I have been involved in industry projects in Asia a lot longer than you - sum total over the years 17 years, in many of the countries in this region

and yes in this 17 years there have been people killed and seriously injured on sites I have worked on

I have at no point have suggesting there isn't issues and things need to be improved, but please don't suggest the West is so perfect and Asia so bad as you have tried to do.

If the conduct of the companies on the project your so reprehensible to you personally as regards safety, why did you spend 5 years on the project, why didn't you walk off job and quit ?

for me personally if I worked in place where I thought the safety was so bad, I feared for my own safety, I would quit, and in fact this exactly what I did do one time working on a site, which was in the US funny enough.

As regards your last sentence, I am fully aware of what goes on, and I am not suggesting what goes on is acceptable, its not... people should not be getting killed or hurt anywhere in the world, but at the same time I an not singling out Asia as being so bad, and the West "so good" as you are, one only has to read the news papers, watch the news in various countries in the West to see they are not immune to this either

Maybe take a look at the links I provided in a earlier post which will give you examples of what I am on about

So if you have worked here for so long in construction surely you are not saying European and Asian safety is of the same calibre. The UK and Europe are not perfect but are light years ahead of them here

I thought you list of crane incidents in the UK was a comparison to Asia crane incident , Apart for the frequency of the incidents in Asia being far more , what happened to the companies after it ?

The UK safety record had a massive improvement after massive fines and corporate manslaughter laws were introduce. This companies will only care about safety and killing people when it hurts them financially and I mean out of business kind of fine. Until this happens companies will continue to kill and injure people while it is cheaper to do that than employ proper safety standard. That mate is a fact.

Edited November 7, 2014 by ExPratt

[ClutchClark]

The green tarp was quickly placed over the crane after the incident. I watched them do it.

Really? Did they physically climb down the crane to secure the tarp so snugly?

[ClutchClark]

Southpeel

Just to put a perspective on in it I have been involved in industry projects in Asia a lot longer than you - sum total over the years 17 years, in many of the countries in this region

and yes in this 17 years there have been people killed and seriously injured on sites I have worked on

I have at no point have suggesting there isn't issues and things need to be improved, but please don't suggest the West is so perfect and Asia so bad as you have tried to do.

If the conduct of the companies on the project your so reprehensible to you personally as regards safety, why did you spend 5 years on the project, why didn't you walk off job and quit ?

for me personally if I worked in place where I thought the safety was so bad, I feared for my own safety, I would quit, and in fact this exactly what I did do one time working on a site, which was in the US funny enough.

As regards your last sentence, I am fully aware of what goes on, and I am not suggesting what goes on is acceptable, its not... people should not be getting killed or hurt anywhere in the world, but at the same time I an not singling out Asia as being so bad, and the West "so good" as you are, one only has to read the news papers, watch the news in various countries in the West to see they are not immune to this either

Maybe take a look at the links I provided in a earlier post which will give you examples of what I am on about

So if you have worked here for so long in construction surely you are not saying European and Asian safety is of the same calibre. The UK and Europe are not perfect but are light years ahead of them here

I thought you list of crane incidents in the UK was a comparison to Asia crane incident , Apart for the frequency of the incidents in Asia being far more , what happened to the companies after it ?

The UK safety record had a massive improvement after massive fines and corporate manslaughter laws were introduce. This companies will only care about safety and killing people when it hurts them financially and I mean out of business kind of fine. Until this happens companies will continue to kill and injure people while it is cheaper to do that than employ proper safety standard. That mate is a fact.

Does anyone doubt ExPratt "owns" this thread ?

SoutPeel, might be best to take a seat and get some schooling with the rest of us ;-)

[ExPratt]

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Does anyone doubt ExPratt "owns" this thread ?

SoutPeel, might be best to take a seat and get some schooling with the rest of us ;-)

Hahahaha , I feel I'm being set up for fall here, Southpeel has some pretty valid points , it doesn't only happen here.

Same as others Ive seen it year after year and all the bullshit excuses about "They" didnt do this and "They" didnt do that. Heavy fines for any safety transgression is the answer whether people are killed or not. If a Company have a Million baht fine hanging over their head they may well spend 50,000 on proper training,PPE and making sure safety regulations are followed

[TPI]

I'll say it again , until they make companies pay heavily for this kind of life threatening incident ,nothing will change

Ive been dealing with kind of shit for the past 12 years working in Asia and it annoys me no end that due to the corruption in the construction industry people , mainly foreign workers die. The problem being many construction companies have political "Partners" or board members

Look around, when was the last time you saw any safety equipment on a Thai construction site outside of BKK? There is no penalty for workers dying on the job so who cares, they're Burmese anyway!

The new hospital in Phrae!