EU court ruling backs curbs on 'benefit tourism'

[webfact]

EU court ruling backs curbs on 'benefit tourism'

(BBC) The European Court of Justice has said member states can deny certain payments to unemployed EU citizens who move to that country just to claim benefits.

The court said Germany was right to deny an unemployed Romanian woman a particular allowance because she showed no sign of seeking work.

Correspondents say the ruling sets a precedent for the rest of the EU.

Politicians in several member states have promised to crack down on what they call "benefit tourism".

British Prime Minister David Cameron welcomed the ruling, describing it as "simple common sense".

Meanwhile German MEP Manfred Weber, the leader of the main conservative group in the European Parliament, told the Associated Press news agency that the decision proved EU countries could "avoid social benefits tourism without violating the free movement of citizens".

Full story: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30011512


-- BBC 2014-11-12

[NeverSure]

[bob4you]

How unusual, politicians using and invoking common sense,

[shirtless]

Its called sharing the wealth, where poor countries fleece the richer ones.

[JockPieandBeans]

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Edited November 12, 2014 by JockPieandBeans

[RustBucket]

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

I would think it would have been the same outcome because this is not like a u-turn of a previous law or anything like that. EU countries have always been able to run their welfare systems the way they want which have their own respective rules in respective countries. Thus far has not been centrally governed via Brussels.

But then again, the UK would have happily paid her anyway because our rules on benefits have always been the most desirable in the EU. That was the UK government's choice to allow such access to a welfare system they have paid not a single penny into.

I find it gross that Cameron is parading this as some sort of 'victory'...... You got to be kidding me. It is business as usual in Benefits Britain.

[siampolee]

And not before time either.

I find it gross that Cameron is parading this as some sort of 'victory'...... You got to be kidding me. It is business as usual in Benefits Britain.

Mind you we expat pensioners of course are still discriminated against and we paid our way for all of our working lives.

[wwest5829]

And not before time either.

I find it gross that Cameron is parading this as some sort of 'victory'...... You got to be kidding me. It is business as usual in Benefits Britain.

Mind you we expat pensioners of course are still discriminated against and we paid our way for all of our working lives.

I was disappointed to see that Brit expats are frozen in their state social security payments. Very glad that the U.S. does not have this policy. Just don't draw attention of this to the Republicans, they would want to implement the same saving taxes (to be passed on to the wealthier among us).

[Jay Sata]

Will this close the door on the scams such as the Roma Big Issue vendors?

I doubt it.

Selling the magazine as a self employed person opens up a Pandora's box of benefits.

A Roma gypsy can therefore bring his entire extended family to Britain, where they will be fed and housed by the British tax-payer.

Even former Labour minister David Blunket has warned of the invasion.

Millions sent back to Eastern Europe in child benefit to families who have never been to the UK.

Meanwhile people who have spent their entire working life paying in to the system have their pensions frozen if they become expats.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Jay Sata

[wileycoyote]

Not a healthy situation currently in Uk.hopefully this ruling will bring in "some common sense"

[Jay Sata]

No doubt the usual people be will be along defending the right of those who come here to milk the system claiming they 'make a contribution'.

Let you highlight what contribution the woman involved in this case made to Germany.

'Ms Dano attended school for three years in Romania, but did not obtain any leaving certificate. She understands German orally and can express herself simply in German. On the other hand, she cannot write in German and her ability to read texts in that language is only limited. She has not been trained in a profession and, to date, has not worked in Germany or Romania. Although her ability to work is not in dispute, there is nothing to indicate that she has looked for a job.'

In the UK she could claim to be self employed selling the odd copy of the Big Issue and then have the Full Monty including free housing etc.

[Liquorice]

After WW2 the British government invited Africans, Pakistani and Indian citizens to come and work to rebuild Industry.

They were given British citizenship and allowed to bring wives and children.

Along came the NHS and the Welfare system.

Comparing this system with what was offered back home, they brought over their Auntie's, Uncles, Cousins, Nephews, Nieces and Grandparents.

Many of these lived in community ghettos, never learning the language, and never working. They weren't integrated into the UK society.

They are British citizens. They have a right to claim benefits. Is it their fault...................No!

Blame the government, not the people.

That said the British youth of today has no motivation to work. Can't work.......or don't want to work!

Today, Migrants from Non EU Countries are allowed to work, but have No Recourse to Public Funds.

Chinese, Thais, all hardworking but get nothing.

One last note: Child Benefit.

British overseas in EU Countries also get Child Benefit paid by that Country. It's reciprocal agreements with EU Countries.

In effect it's paid twice, once by the citizens state, and once by the state they live in.

If a wife was so flippant with her housekeeping and your money................she'd be history.

PS. I agree with the ruling. If your not coming to work and contribute..................don't expect the UK to contribute to you.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Faz

[attento]

Wait for it !. Not time to celebrate yet.

Just maybe this judgement was given to neutralise some of the reasoning behind UK's flirtation with exiting the EU.

Wait until after 2015 Elections in UK, then the decision could be reversed following a formal EU challenge, it's objective having been accomplished.

However shaky the UK's finances are, they are better than most other EU members, and the richer EU nations certainly dont want to lose a major contributor.

[ableguy]

And not before time either.

I find it gross that Cameron is parading this as some sort of 'victory'...... You got to be kidding me. It is business as usual in Benefits Britain.

Mind you we expat pensioners of course are still discriminated against and we paid our way for all of our working lives.

Just because you worked and paid all your life. And then choose to live outside the UK I suppose you complain that you don't get yearly cost of living rises, whilst our brothers from Afgahnistan, Syria, Rumania and any other God forsaken countries arrive and are welcomed. With open arms , but only as long as African brothers can stay first in line, really you people need to learn political bullshit, sorry I meant correctness and stop complaining about pensioners being screwed, after all you should be used to it by now you've been getting screwed all your life in wonderful UK.

[Liquorice]

I haven't got any brothers in Afghanistan, Syria, Rumania or any other god forsaken Country that I invited...........so what's your point?

[Lissos]

That said the British youth of today has no motivation to work. Can't work.......or don't want to work!

Pleeeease, spare us such Daily Mail smearing of today's youth.

[MAJIC]

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Yes! you have it bang on the button,the manipulaters of the truth have now had something near comuppance time, but a long way to go yet!

Yes the same ones were forever talking about Thailand and other excluded countries ,and at the same time the EU Countries were flooding the UK with Migrants whose sole purpose was seeking Benefits and any thing freebee (like free medical care )

The lying politicians will tell the desperate, to be elect them,and plead that the people from EU countries that come to the UK and are enriching the UK, when in reality the Black Market money is shipped back home tax free to support their own bankrupt country which they escaped from! and will use our country to do the same,given enough chance!

Let's talk about getting out of Europe as I believe most of the Electorate of England want, vote for UKIP,who are in the fast lane to regain our Country back,lets vote with our hearts at the next Election,close down our borders and reclaim our Country back!

[JockPieandBeans]

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Yes! you have it bang on the button,the manipulaters of the truth have now had something near comuppance time, but a long way to go yet!

Yes the same ones were forever talking about Thailand and other excluded countries ,and at the same time the EU Countries were flooding the UK with Migrants whose sole purpose was seeking Benefits and any thing freebee (like free medical care )

The lying politicians will tell the desperate, to be elect them,and plead that the people from EU countries that come to the UK and are enriching the UK, when in reality the Black Market money is shipped back home tax free to support their own bankrupt country which they escaped from! and will use our country to do the same,given enough chance!

Let's talk about getting out of Europe as I believe most of the Electorate of England want, vote for UKIP,who are in the fast lane to regain our Country back,lets vote with our hearts at the next Election,close down our borders and reclaim our Country back!

Yes indeed. The rise of Western Union in the UK over the last 20 years has been staggering.

[Liquorice]

Lissos, on 13 Nov 2014 - 03:47, said:

Faz, on 12 Nov 2014 - 16:10, said:

That said the British youth of today has no motivation to work. Can't work.......or don't want to work!

Pleeeease, spare us such Daily Mail smearing of today's youth.

Sir, I would never quote the smearing of the Daily Mail, it's banned in Thailand.

I speak from personal experience, having spent 45 years working in, around, and with families.

The youth of today either can't work.....or don't want to work.

A classic example, a few years ago a family friend came home from work one day and announced some good news to his 19 year old son.

A position had opened for a junior worker at his place of employment.

Speaking to his son, he said "you start after the holiday break in January, how's that for a Xmas present"

The son replied "I'd rather have a new X-Box".

Unfortunately, that's the attitude of to many of today's youth in the UK.

[Liquorice]

MAJIC, on 13 Nov 2014 - 05:54, said:

JockPieandBeans, on 12 Nov 2014 - 08:54, said:

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Yes! you have it bang on the button,the manipulaters of the truth have now had something near comuppance time, but a long way to go yet!

Yes the same ones were forever talking about Thailand and other excluded countries ,and at the same time the EU Countries were flooding the UK with Migrants whose sole purpose was seeking Benefits and any thing freebee (like free medical care )

The lying politicians will tell the desperate, to be elect them,and plead that the people from EU countries that come to the UK and are enriching the UK, when in reality the Black Market money is shipped back home tax free to support their own bankrupt country which they escaped from! and will use our country to do the same,given enough chance!

Let's talk about getting out of Europe as I believe most of the Electorate of England want, vote for UKIP,who are in the fast lane to regain our Country back,lets vote with our hearts at the next Election,close down our borders and reclaim our Country back!

OMG! Do you break into a chorus of 'Rule Britannia' next?

"Our Country".............which 'Our' would that be. Remember, that most of us, are descended from immigrants and revolutionists.”

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

[JockPieandBeans]

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

We were discussing a ruling by the EU Court that concerned EU migration and claiming benefits.

Not the colour of skin or language spoken.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the EU Court, it was them that made the ruling.

[Liquorice]

JockPieandBeans, on 13 Nov 2014 - 13:22, said:

Quote

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

We were discussing a ruling by the EU Court that concerned EU migration and claiming benefits.

Not the colour of skin or language spoken.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the EU Court, it was them that made the ruling.

And I agree with that ruling.

The ruling was about claiming 'benefit tourists' brought to the EU Court by Germany, not the UK.

The ruling wasn't about migrants as you and Majic both mention, it was about EU Citizens using there rights of free movements just to claim benefits from another EU Country without seeking work.

You and Majic expanded the topic to include migrants, I replied accordingly.

[JockPieandBeans]

JockPieandBeans, on 13 Nov 2014 - 13:22, said:

Quote

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

We were discussing a ruling by the EU Court that concerned EU migration and claiming benefits.

Not the colour of skin or language spoken.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the EU Court, it was them that made the ruling.

And I agree with that ruling.

The ruling was about claiming 'benefit tourists' brought to the EU Court by Germany, not the UK.

The ruling wasn't about migrants as you and Majic both mention, it was about EU Citizens using there rights of free movements just to claim benefits from another EU Country without seeking work.

You and Majic expanded the topic to include migrants, I replied accordingly.

Also known as " Economic Migrants "

Hope that helps.

[Liquorice]

JockPieandBeans, on 13 Nov 2014 - 15:12, said:

Faz, on 13 Nov 2014 - 14:15, said:

JockPieandBeans, on 13 Nov 2014 - 13:22, said:JockPieandBeans, on 13 Nov 2014 - 13:22, said:

QuoteQuote

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

We were discussing a ruling by the EU Court that concerned EU migration and claiming benefits.

Not the colour of skin or language spoken.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the EU Court, it was them that made the ruling.

And I agree with that ruling.

The ruling was about claiming 'benefit tourists' brought to the EU Court by Germany, not the UK.

The ruling wasn't about migrants as you and Majic both mention, it was about EU Citizens using there rights of free movements just to claim benefits from another EU Country without seeking work.

You and Majic expanded the topic to include migrants, I replied accordingly.

Also known as " Economic Migrants "

Hope that helps.

Nearly, but not quite:

I suggest you read the full article.

The European Court of Justice has said member states can deny certain payments to unemployed EU citizens who move to that country just to claim benefits.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30011512

The term economic migrant refers to someone who has emigrated from one region to another region for the purposes of seeking greater employment or improved financial position. Economic migrants usually migrate to large countries in need of great employees because they are most likely to find a better economic job there

Many countries have immigration and visa restrictions that prohibit a person entering the country for the purposes of gaining work without a valid work visa. Persons who are declared an economic migrant can be refused entry into a Country. Thus, the migrant's presence is deemed illegal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_migrant

Only a person requiring a Visa for another Country would be classed as an Economic Migrant and could be refused entry. Under the EU freedom of movement directive she didn't need a Visa to reside in Germany from Rumania, so couldn't be refused entry, therefore as the article quite rightly states is classed as an EU Citizen.

In the case of any member states of the EU, an Economic Migrant would be classed as someone from Overseas who required a Visa.

More generally the term 'migrant' is used to describe such a person.

So would you like to debate what effect this ruling has on EU citizens, or migrants. I'm happy to discuss either.

Well let's not give a choice, because in all fairness a migrant or economic migrant would need a Visa to enter an EU Country and they don't have rights to claim any benefits, so let's all stick to EU citizens.

[JockPieandBeans]

The European Court of Justice has said member states can deny certain payments to unemployed EU citizenswho move to that country just to claim benefits.

Yes, that is correct. They are also called economic migrants as well as EU Citizens. They are migrating from one area to another for economic reasons. The fact that they are EU Citizens is immaterial.

Economic migrants / Immigrants / Illegal Immigrants, whatever label you want to give them. Who are from outside the EU are a different kettle of fish and are nothing to do with the EU Courts ruling.

[MAJIC]

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

We were discussing a ruling by the EU Court that concerned EU migration and claiming benefits.

Not the colour of skin or language spoken.

If you have a problem with that, take it up with the EU Court, it was them that made the ruling.

Exactly!

[samran]

Economic migrants moving to a place for improved financial position.... Hold on....

[MAJIC]

MAJIC, on 13 Nov 2014 - 05:54, said:

JockPieandBeans, on 12 Nov 2014 - 08:54, said:

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Yes! you have it bang on the button,the manipulaters of the truth have now had something near comuppance time, but a long way to go yet!

Yes the same ones were forever talking about Thailand and other excluded countries ,and at the same time the EU Countries were flooding the UK with Migrants whose sole purpose was seeking Benefits and any thing freebee (like free medical care )

The lying politicians will tell the desperate, to be elect them,and plead that the people from EU countries that come to the UK and are enriching the UK, when in reality the Black Market money is shipped back home tax free to support their own bankrupt country which they escaped from! and will use our country to do the same,given enough chance!

Let's talk about getting out of Europe as I believe most of the Electorate of England want, vote for UKIP,who are in the fast lane to regain our Country back,lets vote with our hearts at the next Election,close down our borders and reclaim our Country back!

OMG! Do you break into a chorus of 'Rule Britannia' next?

"Our Country".............which 'Our' would that be. Remember, that most of us, are descended from immigrants and revolutionists.”

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

There is nothing Racist in this ruling by the EU Court,but i'm sure you know that!

[samran]

Economic migrants moving to a place for improved financial position.... Hold on....

Is there a point to that statement ? Or are you just opening your mouth and letting your belly rumble ?

Someone with your superior intellectual capacity should be able to work that one out....you are an immigrant after all... Edited November 13, 2014 by samran

[Liquorice]

MAJIC, on 13 Nov 2014 - 17:34, said:

Faz, on 13 Nov 2014 - 12:47, said:

MAJIC, on 13 Nov 2014 - 05:54, said:MAJIC, on 13 Nov 2014 - 05:54, said:

JockPieandBeans, on 12 Nov 2014 - 08:54, said:JockPieandBeans, on 12 Nov 2014 - 08:54, said:

How bizarre. EU Court makes its ruling yesterday.

And yet certain posters on this forum have been ranting endlessly, that benefit tourism by EU migrants was a myth and did not happen in the UK.

Well done the EU Court. I wonder what the ruling would have been had it been the UK that brought the case and not Germany ?

Yes! you have it bang on the button,the manipulaters of the truth have now had something near comuppance time, but a long way to go yet!

Yes the same ones were forever talking about Thailand and other excluded countries ,and at the same time the EU Countries were flooding the UK with Migrants whose sole purpose was seeking Benefits and any thing freebee (like free medical care )

The lying politicians will tell the desperate, to be elect them,and plead that the people from EU countries that come to the UK and are enriching the UK, when in reality the Black Market money is shipped back home tax free to support their own bankrupt country which they escaped from! and will use our country to do the same,given enough chance!

Let's talk about getting out of Europe as I believe most of the Electorate of England want, vote for UKIP,who are in the fast lane to regain our Country back,lets vote with our hearts at the next Election,close down our borders and reclaim our Country back!

OMG! Do you break into a chorus of 'Rule Britannia' next?

"Our Country".............which 'Our' would that be. Remember, that most of us, are descended from immigrants and revolutionists.”

UKIP are not much better than the BNP..............racist and it will come out in the wash. You don't think Nigel Farage is different from any other politician with his lies.

I for one was raised to judge people as people, and not by the colour of their skin or the language they speak.

There is nothing Racist in this ruling by the EU Court,but i'm sure you know that!

Never said it was a racist ruling......far from it.

I said UKIP is racist, just my opinion.

If he gets his way, EU citizens will once again become migrants to each other.

I also think the people of the UK would vote to remain in the EU for a number of reasons, but that's not the topic.