Thai at Heart Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Thailand is close to a tipping point. Corruption is very high in comparison with 10 years ago. There is little rule of law and little chance of justice if sought. The place can become the wild west or it can turn to at least a little more orderly place. Lest we forget, people torched the centre of Bangkok and up country town halls only a few years ago. I think its heading downhill and will get worse before it gets better. Change and reform are the only way out. I don't know where you've been but corruption has gotten much better. When I got to Thailand there were opium caravans in the main streets of Chiang Mai, pitched battles between the army and the police over drugs and at least three independent armies operating in Northern Thailand. Compared to the good old days the place is now like the Switzerland of Asia. I realize it is somehow in your interest to paint a bad picture of Thailand but it has really gotten 100% better than it was in the 1960's let alone before that when it was at war with the US and UK. Well, in the last 10 years that I was there, it yoyoed around , but having heard the level.of commission on business being demanded it has increased. The last year is I hear cosmetic. I just offer my opinion and experience. I have no vested interest in giving my opinion and what I have heard and seen first hand. In the 60s the majority of Thais were still in the village farming. Thailand is a very different place today and I think, things either make a turn for the good, or its back to street protests for the fourth time pretty rapidly. When was that war with that USA or UK by the way since the 1960s. Drugs is but one part of life in Thailand. General corruption is insidious in its presence in Thailand. Edited November 13, 2014 by Thai at Heart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemac Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 lovely weather! 5 minutes of walking outside from 8am-8pm will result in most people's clothes sticking to them with sweat. Summer in Western Europe is, for the most part, lovely weather, Thailand, not really no, unless you just need to lie still and vegetate. But greeny, if you lived in Western Europe with all it's lovely weather would you be able to afford have so many domestic staff working for you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerrysum Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I agree, Thailand was a dream destination before I retired, but it has changed so much... Thainess, it's just not the same anymore.... for now I have decided to reside here in the U.S. It is not the landscape that I once loved..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sipi Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Almost any place in the world deals with crime against tourists. ...... Nice post. Cheers. Considering the visa situation all those condos simply aren't saying "buy me". I like Thailand and Thai people, especially in the North, but if the Thai government/Junta seek to restrict visitor's freedom, and treat non-thai as 2nd class "citizens", it's hardly surprising some people (like myself) will not feel welcome. I don't agree entirely with this post, but it makes a lot more sense than your first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemac Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Almost any place in the world deals with crime against tourists. ...... Nice post. Cheers. Considering the visa situation all those condos simply aren't saying "buy me". I like Thailand and Thai people, especially in the North, but if the Thai government/Junta seek to restrict visitor's freedom, and treat non-thai as 2nd class "citizens", it's hardly surprising some people (like myself) will not feel welcome. Glad you said "some people". In the nine years I have been living in Thailand (on and off) I have never been made to feel unwelcome. Then again I went out of my way to study the language and make a point of being polite to people. Don't blame the junta, it is probably just you, and you felt like you were "unwelcome" even when the PTP were in power, didn't you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipperylobster Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Thailand is close to a tipping point. Corruption is very high in comparison with 10 years ago. There is little rule of law and little chance of justice if sought. The place can become the wild west or it can turn to at least a little more orderly place. Lest we forget, people torched the centre of Bangkok and up country town halls only a few years ago. I think its heading downhill and will get worse before it gets better. Change and reform are the only way out. Compared to the good old days the place is now like the Switzerland of Asia. We just finished a 2700 kilometer trip, from Chiang Mai, to Phitsanulok, then over to Mukdahan, down to Ubon, then to Arruthaya and back up to Chiang Mai. I had to laugh at all the places that my wife called "The Switzerland of Asia". Now I am not complaining, but I missed any similarities to the Swiss Alps. Mind you, I only climbed some of those huge, snow capped mountains,( like the Jungfrau Glacier) and rode that red train up to the top at Grinderwald. I just did not get that same feeling. I am referring to Phetchabun and Loei. There was some mountainous terrain...but it just was not the same. And nobody was blowing through those big long horns they got there, while wearing girlish shorts. Although I did hear some yodel.ay..hee..hoos echoing in the distance. Edited November 13, 2014 by slipperylobster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailiketoo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Thailand is close to a tipping point. Corruption is very high in comparison with 10 years ago. There is little rule of law and little chance of justice if sought. The place can become the wild west or it can turn to at least a little more orderly place. Lest we forget, people torched the centre of Bangkok and up country town halls only a few years ago. I think its heading downhill and will get worse before it gets better. Change and reform are the only way out. I don't know where you've been but corruption has gotten much better. When I got to Thailand there were opium caravans in the main streets of Chiang Mai, pitched battles between the army and the police over drugs and at least three independent armies operating in Northern Thailand. Compared to the good old days the place is now like the Switzerland of Asia. I realize it is somehow in your interest to paint a bad picture of Thailand but it has really gotten 100% better than it was in the 1960's let alone before that when it was at war with the US and UK. Well, in the last 10 years that I was there, it yoyoed around , but having heard the level.of commission on business being demanded it has increased.The last year is I hear cosmetic. I just offer my opinion and experience. I have no vested interest in giving my opinion and what I have heard and seen first hand. In the 60s the majority of Thais were still in the village farming. Thailand is a very different place today and I think, things either make a turn for the good, or its back to street protests for the fourth time pretty rapidly. When was that war with that USA or UK by the way since the 1960s. Drugs is but one part of life in Thailand. General corruption is insidious in its presence in Thailand. I have found that Thailand has been advancing steadily in almost every area since I first came here in the 1960's. If you broaden your view and look for 100 years even more so. If you limit your view to 10 years you see almost nothing. I have found in talking to people those with views of Thailand as extremely corrupt have had a bad personal experience rather than experiences with Thailand in general. Ask a successful business person and they will tell you there is good and bad but overall it's not difficult to do business here. Ask a failed business person and they will go on about problems and corruption. But that's just my experience. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSand Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) I have found that Thailand has been advancing steadily in almost every area since I first came here in the 1960's. If you broaden your view and look for 100 years even more so. If you limit your view to 10 years you see almost nothing. I have found in talking to people those with views of Thailand as extremely corrupt have had a bad personal experience rather than experiences with Thailand in general. Ask a successful business person and they will tell you there is good and bad but overall it's not difficult to do business here. Ask a failed business person and they will go on about problems and corruption. But that's just my experience. The accomplishments of corruption could be the pinion by which some businesses are racked towards success whilst some others towards failure. Therefore your "experience", taken to mean your own experience with Thailand in general; would just seem to concur with my own view of Thailand's inherent corruption. Of course, The man who says about himself "I am without corruption" knows this not. Edited November 13, 2014 by RandomSand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayongchelsea Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 The longer I lived here the less and less I had with (non-overseas educated) Thais and Thai society. We live in a private village, the only Thais there are decent overseas educated Thais. Our social scene is mainly Western expats and Western educated Asians. We have very little in common with Thai raised and 'educated' people. Really the only Thais (raised and educated here) we have contact with are employed to serve us. We take advantage of the good things, and have very little time or want for participating in Thai culture or society, or being around Thai raised and 'educated' people. Works for us. mightn't work for others. That's the beauty of the World, we're all different, learn what works best for you and run with it. You really come off as a snob! If I lived next door to greeny I would ask him to leave. He does not live up to my high standards. .................."Really the only Thais (raised and educated here) we have contact with are employed to serve us."................................ Did he really say that ??? Why can't he says that , the rich Thais think that's the norm..Infact they probably think less of the Thais that work for them than foreigners.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailiketoo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I have found that Thailand has been advancing steadily in almost every area since I first came here in the 1960's. If you broaden your view and look for 100 years even more so. If you limit your view to 10 years you see almost nothing. I have found in talking to people those with views of Thailand as extremely corrupt have had a bad personal experience rather than experiences with Thailand in general. Ask a successful business person and they will tell you there is good and bad but overall it's not difficult to do business here. Ask a failed business person and they will go on about problems and corruption. But that's just my experience. The accomplishments of corruption could be the pinion by which some businesses are racked towards success whilst some others towards failure. Therefore your "experience", taken to mean your own experience with Thailand in general; would just seem to concur with my own view of Thailand's inherent corruption. Of course, The man who says about himself "I am without corruption" knows this not. You wrote, "could be the pinion by which some businesses are racked towards success whilst some others towards failure." I didn't say that nor do I agree with it. It does not concur with your experience. I think you have an ax to grind like all the other Thai bashers on here. Somebody or some organization did you wrong and now you, not living in Thailand come on Thai Visa and try to convince others not to come to Thailand. You wrote, "about all the crime and injustice, I feel apprehensive about ever returning to Thailand. For me "Thainess" is now too much and I doubt I'll ever return" trying to equate Thainess with something negative. That seems to me like anti Thai astroturfing. So why not tell us the truth. What happened to you to form your opinions? I have worked in many places in Thailand and was treated fairly by my employers and the government and it has gotten much less corrupt in the time I have been here. What happened to you to make you take the time while sitting in Farang land to come on Thai Visa and try and convince others not to come to Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSand Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) @thailiketoo - What I wrote before stands by itself. I find your demands for the "truth" impertinent. You presume this, that and the other thinking I'll write thai-life story for your entertainment. Think again. I've said I feel uncomfortable with Thailand. You've said you feel otherwise. For me that's fine. I appreciate your contribution, Thank you. I don't need to argue with you about this. Edited November 13, 2014 by RandomSand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailiketoo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 What I wrote before stands by itself. I find your demands for the "truth" impertinent. If it's not just enough for you then, please, consider your local Royal Thai Police station is there for you. Not that I believe it but I've heard that Farang have a cultural reputation for playing fair. I've told you why I feel Thailand is progressing at getting less corrupt and that in fact for me and my dealings with Thai people and government offices it has not been corrupt. Specifically, my business, and marriage and medical and visa dealings. You come on Thai Visa from another country and write, "However; when reading Thailand's news headlines, about all the crime and injustice, I feel apprehensive about ever returning to Thailand. For me "Thainess" is now too much and I doubt I'll ever return." Are you really, and do you expect me to believe that you have made a decision of where to live for the rest of your life based on Thailand's new headlines? If that is the case OK. I've no problem with that however I think it's rather odd. A person who has been coming to Thailand for years has all of a sudden changed from trusting personal experience to the vagaries of newspaper headlines to determine his actions. Tell me if you don't mind what headline in particular or group of headlines made the decision for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolandRat Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Given your very limited input to a thread you started, your failure or reluctance to give an account of what actually happened for you to be so "sour" coupled with your demeanor it wouldn't surprise me if you had trouble wherever you chose to live. I would suggest you look to yourself, and not apportion blame to all and sundry for your woes and for your own poor choices and inadequacies. If you can't handle life in an adult manner and make the necessary adjustments, perhaps a retirement home with constant supervision and protection would be more appropriate for such a sensitive soul. Edited November 13, 2014 by RolandRat 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSand Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Guess and Imply about me all you like, "poor choices and inadequacies", but that doesn't actually boost your status in Thai society, as much as you might wish it did. A falang is inherently inadequate in los by his lower legal status as alien. Weather this is set in law or just an aspect of society; it's real and unavoidable for 99% of falang in the Kingdom. Edited November 13, 2014 by RandomSand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolandRat Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Just better you stay in your "nanny" state and let them take care of you. Although I gather you may well be a minority there before too long. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailiketoo Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Guess and Imply about me all you like, "poor choices and inadequacies", but that doesn't actually boost your status in Thai society, as much as you might wish it did. A falang is inherently inadequate in los by his lower legal status as alien. Your OP, "However; when reading Thailand's news headlines, about all the crime and injustice, I feel apprehensive about ever returning to Thailand." What did you read that convinced you to alter your life plans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canarysun Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Now don't waste too much time thinking about it all viewers - I am off to the beach now to " bask in the glorious sunshine " and cool tunes from " Pink Floyd " it's another lovely day viewers in " The Land Of Smiles "........ x 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomSand Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Guess and Imply about me all you like, "poor choices and inadequacies", but that doesn't actually boost your status in Thai society, as much as you might wish it did. A falang is inherently inadequate in los by his lower legal status as alien. Your OP, "However; when reading Thailand's news headlines, about all the crime and injustice, I feel apprehensive about ever returning to Thailand." What did you read that convinced you to alter your life plans? This forum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemac Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Guess and Imply about me all you like, "poor choices and inadequacies", but that doesn't actually boost your status in Thai society, as much as you might wish it did. A falang is inherently inadequate in los by his lower legal status as alien. Your OP, "However; when reading Thailand's news headlines, about all the crime and injustice, I feel apprehensive about ever returning to Thailand." What did you read that convinced you to alter your life plans? This forum! This forum ? You probably made the mistake of reading your own comments ! I know they depressed me to say the least. Or, if the op was a setup to garnish as many attacking replies as possible, mission accomplished ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieH Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I think this has now run its course. CLOSED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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