House in name of foreigner, does mortgage matter?

[Guitar God]

In the ask a lawyer section (that doesn't allow replies) I saw:

Q. If a foreigner paid for and built a house on land owned by his girlfriend.....and when they broke off can the foreigner makes any claim to the house he paid for..thanks

A. The house must have been registered in the foreigner's name and lodged with the land office. That should have been done at the outset. Without such a transfer document the property is immovable property and remains with the land owner.

This implies a foreigner can have a house in his name (or in his and his wife's name) and have it registered at the land office. I don't know what transfer document the lawyer refers to (the registration of the house going from developer/former owner to him?) but my question is,

In order for a foreigner to have his name (also) listed as registered owner, does the house have to be paid for 100%, or can the foreigner still be listed if a mortage for half the house price has been taken out by his Thai wife?

What about after the mortgage is paid off, can the foreigner still register at the land office or is it too late because it can only be done when the house is initally bought?

[beachproperty]

I believe the answer to your question is ...Yes a foreigner can own the house (buy it and have it transfered) after being built.

Sale and transfer of ownership of an existing building separate from the land requires the current owner and purchaser of the house to:

• sign a standard land office Thai script sale of a structure document (signed at the land office in front of the competent land official)
• followed by a 30 day public announcement/ posting of the house sale at specific locations
• after the announcement period the parties return to the land office to complete the transfer (the Thai script sale of a structure agreement will stamped and issued by the land office and can be used as proof of ownership of the building).

http://www.samuiforsale.com/knowledge/owning-a-house-in-thailand.html

You will just have to pay another transfer fee based on the value of the house ....

Alternatively you can also buy a house on the land and lease the land for 30 years if you are looking for more control.

As for there being a mortgage on the property....good luck ....owner is limited by such as to what they can do with the land until said mortgage is paid off!

Edited December 1, 2014 by beachproperty

[chris2004]

I am thinking of buying a house with my girlfriend (yes i know) and wanted some means of securing my interest in the property. One new house we looked at shows the price of the house and land seperately. Does this mean i could buy and own the house in my name but buy the land and put it in my girlfriend's name?

[Mario2008]

You mentio that the mortgage is in the GF's name. If the land was use to get the mortgage and that is mentioned at the back of the chanote, you will need permission from the bank to get the house in your name. (And they will probably say no, as it weakens their position). So you might have to wait till the house is paid off.

Get advise from a competent lawyer and see what is possible in your situation.

[beachproperty]

I am thinking of buying a house with my girlfriend (yes i know) and wanted some means of securing my interest in the property. One new house we looked at shows the price of the house and land seperately. Does this mean i could buy and own the house in my name but buy the land and put it in my girlfriend's name?

Yes...I believe so.

Why not go to "ask the lawyer" and pose your same question.

many builders show the duel pricing so when they transfer the property they only pay the transfer fee on the value of the land (excludes the house so its as though you bought raw land and contracted separately to build the house)

Edited December 1, 2014 by beachproperty

[Mario2008]

I am thinking of buying a house with my girlfriend (yes i know) and wanted some means of securing my interest in the property. One new house we looked at shows the price of the house and land seperately. Does this mean i could buy and own the house in my name but buy the land and put it in my girlfriend's name?

Yes, you can do that. But would need a lease/usefruct for the land the house is on and register it at the land office.

[SOTIRIOS]

....I knew someone who built a house on his 'friend's' land....

....he was shortly denied access to the land.....last I heard...after a 3 year legal battle he had yet to recover anything..

...but lost a bundle in legal fees....

[bangkoklawyer24]

The wide spread misconceptions are

1. that there is a legal connection between the questions who paid for the house and who owns the house and

2. that there is a legal connection between house ownership issues and foreign property restrictions and

3. that the term ownership in the context of house ownership always has the same meaning as ownership as understood in foreign jurisdictions.

[beachproperty]

The wide spread misconceptions are

1. that there is a legal connection between the questions who paid for the house and who owns the house and

2. that there is a legal connection between house ownership issues and foreign property restrictions and

3. that the term ownership in the context of house ownership always has the same meaning as ownership as understood in foreign jurisdictions.

Nice that you post that misconceptions exist.

Why not explain....as to clear up such misconceptions

Better yet ....why not answer some of the questions asked herein regarding property ownership (ie...land vs building)

Or are you waiting for payment for such advice?

Edited December 1, 2014 by beachproperty

[zeekgarcia]

From what I read, it seems like he is doom for disaster like many others have experienced but there are other ways to do this.

1. You need to find out usually for the amount of money that you want to spend on a house, how many years the loan repayment will be, then you need to find out how likely it is that you will live longer than the repayment of the loan.

If you are likely to live longer than the loan repayment then forget your current plan.

If you are not likely to outlive the loan repayment then you need to adjust your plan by telling your wife that you will split the cost 50/50 meaning that you will pay 50% of the deposit, then each month you will pay 50% of the monthly loan payment, so do not pay anything up front other than only 50% of the deposit, if you want some form of security in this!

But even then you must keep in mind that you are only renting! And you must not spend more than you can walk away from like if you were renting!

But also remember that this is still no guarantee that she will not cheat on you behind your back in the future.

2. IF you want your OWN house then do not involve your wife in the deal and do not find any land around her family.

You need to find someone else that is not related to your wife or even a long term friend, that can either buy the land you want in cash or can get a loan and buy some empty vacant land.

Then once all the paperwork is done and the deed/title is in their name.

Then you need to find out if it is possible to get a usufruct "see the ask the lawyer section for the thai wording for usufruct" for this land and in the usufruct agreement you will pay the monthly loan payments until the loan is paid off then you will not pay any more for the life of the usufruct.

Then after you have the usufruct, then get a builder to build a house on the land

Then you have to make an announcement in the newspaper as above for 30 days to see if anyone objects or makes claims to the land. Then you go back to land office and get a title for the house which will prove that you own the house but not the land. But you have the usufruct giving you the right to use the land.

If you involve your wife or any of her relatives or close friends in the land deal and everything goes wrong in the future then you may have papers saying that you own the house but her relatives/friends/etc could persuade you to leave town or you could die unexpectedly.

So either go 50/50 ONLY if you can walk away from what you are paying or find someone else that is not her relatives, friends, etc and do not get land near her relatives and you should be ok, IF you have a valid long term visa plan in place.

Report how everything goes!

Edited December 1, 2014 by zeekgarcia

[Scouse123]

If you are already viewing the prospect of a worst case scenario where there will be a possible breakdown in your relationship in the future,.............. don't do it!!

If you really must do it,save all the messing around and take a lease over the land for 30 years plus an option.

Then build what you want within a set budget knowing that and the risks involved.

I cannot see your girlfriend/wife contributing 50% or anything towards building costs or monthly mortgages so it will, if the normal pattern of these ventures takes place, all fall to you.

Remember, when these people speak to their " friends/relatives " it is USUALLY all about them and never about you as the person who has paid for everything.

The advice from their friends/relatives will always be as to how to cheat you out of your investment.As fast as you are looking at ways to protect your investment, they are looking at ways to get out of it.

I certainly agree with another posters suggestion (zeekgarcia) in buying a piece of land completely unconnected from your lady or her family and buying the land, probably through a company, and building as suggested.

If it is in any way connected to their land or their former land, they consider it as you are the intruder trying to take what is theirs and that is the mentality.

However, the question then is, would you honestly want to be in that locality if there was a break in the relationship and is there enough around there to occupy you and keep you in the lifestyle that you desire as a single person?

Edited December 1, 2014 by Scouse123

[Expat Brad]

Remember, when these people speak to their " friends/relatives " it is USUALLY all about them and never about you as the person who has paid for everything.

The advice from their friends/relatives will always be as to how to cheat you out of your investment.As fast as you are looking at ways to protect your investment, they are looking at ways to get out of it.

I certainly agree with another posters suggestion (zeekgarcia) in buying a piece of land completely unconnected from your lady or her family and buying the land, probably through a company, and building as suggested.

If it is in any way connected to their land or their former land, they consider it as you are the intruder trying to take what is theirs and that is the mentality.

However, the question then is, would you honestly want to be in that locality if there was a break in the relationship and is there enough around there to occupy you and keep you in the lifestyle that you desire as a single person?

I completely agree, If the land is family land......it is their land, never yours even if you build the house. In Thailand it is usually the GF/Wife's family that destroys the relationship.