Help...My House water is dirty and sometimes black color!

[sunoco27]

My house is in Chiang Mai outside the city. The water from my well is good for showering but sometimes gets black color.

Does anyone know an inexpensive way and (little future maintenance cost way ) that I can fix this problem?

The water is now pumped from the well into a large plastic holding tank (apx. 100 gallons) (which gets a very dirty and black coating on the inside).

The water is then pumped from this tank into the house.

We only use this water for shower and laundry but I want it to be clean of dirt all the time.

Thank You Kindly...

[Ace of Pop]

This can happen when it nears minimum.We just left it alone and used mains.

[Lazybones]

You may want to try raising the level that the pipe is in the well as it is probably too low and is picking up the sediment from the bottom. Sometimes it also helps to get someone in to clean out the sediment from the well. We also run the water through two large filters before it goes into the holding tank which helps as well.

Edited December 10, 2014 by Lazybones

[henksteeghsth]

I had the same need to drill a new well now its ok but need to go 54 meters to get good water

we can drink it

[maidee]

water filter? reverse osmosis ?

[Albertnobgammer]

Build two concrete storage tanks (mine are 2 metres high and hold about 4000 litres in total).

In the bottom of the 1st tank fit sealed 2" pipe drilled with small 1/2" holes about 30 cm from the bottom of the tank, the pipe should go directly into the 2nd tank at the same height.

Fill both tanks with layer of fine gravel covering the two pipes.

Next top up both tanks with clean sand to about 1-1.5M deep.

From the 2nd tank you need an outlet about 20cm above the sand layer, this is clean water (this 2nd tank needs a good fitting lid)

Now pump your well water into tank 1, as it seeps through the sand it will filter, then it will flow into tank 2 and filter again.

The levels of the two tanks will settle roughly the same.

There is more to it than this, like putting in drains, back flushing etc. But this method will even remove the orange "iron" discolouration from your water.

Depending on usage you will need to clean (mainly tank 1) about every 3 months.

I have attached a rough sketch it should give you an idea (We can drink the water from ours - but DON'T)

[Strangebrew]

Sounds like you may have dead animal in well. Drill new well a bit deep on pickup pipe install filter then just before storage tank install two inline filters in clear bowls so you can monitor the filters if first looks like it is getting dirty replace before second filter gets the same.so in all you have three filter system once a year replace filter in well on pickup pipe. the others as needed.

[Gandtee]

When I used well water I used to put bags of charcoal around the extraction pipe, but the water was still slightly discoloured when the level got low and when we had heavy rain.

[goltec]

Might be Manganese (in combination with Iron).

To solve the problem you need to be sure what it is that causes the problem so you can know what type of filter you need.

it starts always with water testing.

And to Henk Steegh,

drinking from a well without filtering is really not a good idea.

especially not from a shallow well of 54 meters..... Only deepwells (100m) don't contain bacteria.

Edited December 10, 2014 by goltec

[Strangebrew]

Oh if you go the new well route make sure it is deep enough to add at least 3 feet of gravel topped with clean sand and at least three below bottom of filter.

Edited December 10, 2014 by Strangebrew

[Eric Loh]

Agree with Goltec, ground water has iron and manganese bacteria. Iron bacteria will render orange to reddish stain while manganese cause dark blue to black stain and slime. A good filter and treatment with chlorine are the standard treatment method. These bacteria are not harmful though.

[ICECOOL]

This is what I would do with the well if you can. Clean out as much black muck as possible. Get a large concrete pipe about the size of the well in diameter. You may need to stack the pipes depending on you depth. Put about a foot of river sand in the well as a filter. Insert the pipes and fill the outside of the pipe with river sand. The well should fill from the bottom with clean water.

[perconrad]

#Albertnobgammer,

This sounds interesting.

Could You please fill in the missing parts in the drawing like: like backkwash piping and size of pump, skimmer for backwash water and its location and pipe sizes and of course more I might have forgotten?

Kindly

Edited December 10, 2014 by perconrad

[julemanden]

Clean the tank and your problems are over!

[pkspeaker]

since we seem to have water experts on the thread, i have under my sink a 'reverse osmoses' or whatever filter, it has 3 big filters verticle and 2 smaller ones on top laying horizontal, recently learned a lesson to change the filters more than once 'a year or so' as I found brown pondscum inside the 3rd verticle filter, so after the water was filtered twice, some brown stuff still managed to grow in the filter because we would often drink bottled water and the water inside the filter was stagnating too much, with the new filter i am running more water through it, even to wash the dishes so the water doesn't sit in the filter too much as it's about 3 litre in there.. are these home filters even useless? it costs more than 1000baht to change the filters and now i understand that i gotta change them at least every 6 months and the water from it doesn't taste as good as the 'Aura' brand water i usually buy from the store, but lugging that much water to a high floor from the familymart or waterfilter machine in the lobby is tiresome, the water filter machine doesn't seem much better that the home filter, or is it?

[Albertnobgammer]

#Albertnobgammer,

This sounds interesting.

Could You please fill in the missing parts in the drawing like: like backkwash piping and size of pump, skimmer for backwash water and its location and pipe sizes and of course more I might have forgotten?

Kindly

I will have a look and see if I can sketch it out - I fitted the backflush because I got fed up of the original cleaning method. Basically you just attached a flexible 2" hose to the 2" pipe at the top of the tank from the pump inlet, then connect the other end of the flexi hose to a 11/2" plastic pipe, long enough to get way down into the sand gravel filter then using a ladder manually force water through the sand and gravel with the drain valve open - If you have that rusty iron water like I have, it takes maybe 3 hours of hard slog to break up the crust and flush the sand reasonably clear, it also takes 24 hours for the water to become really clean after flushing. If you use a valve system to divert the pumped water back into the sand filter you can do this every month or so, it is just a matter of getting the valves set correctly to balance backflush and drainage to get an nice steady flush, no hard work.

You also need to buy one of those pump switches that float in the tank and cut the pump at your preset level. My pumps (I have 2 one for back up) are just ordinary 240V, that push 400 litres per minute - My well is shallow (groundwater) about 8 metres deep.

All pipes valves and pumps are 2", all pipes and valves are the Thai Pipe 2" plastic apart from the backflushing pipes which are 3/4 inch fitted to a 2" to 3/4" reduction.

It is a pretty basic system but the only one that I have had that actually works to remove all traces of the iron rust in the water. When I first tried, we used all of the fancy stuff that are in filters, with a top of tank basket containing charcoal, various size of grits and sand and some chemical (might be manganese or similar) cost over 10K Baht for the two tanks, did not work, samples of the filtered water turned orange in bottles after 5 days.

I have samples from the sand filter still in bottles from 8 years ago when we put it in and they are still clear to this day.

Edited December 10, 2014 by Albertnobgammer

[perconrad]

Albertnobgammer,

Thank's for the outlining. Good to have some dimensions so you do not have to try them out yourself.

I'm perhaps soon moving to Isaan where my Wife has a house with a well about 10 meter deep and it never runs dry at least she say that and when I have seen the water it looks clean, and I would like to make something similar to what You have made.

For many years I worked in Greenland in electricity and water production and supply and we took the water from lakes and ran it through big concrete filters, constructied almost like Your filters. After the filters the water passsed through UV lamp/filters and lastly we dosed clorine if there should be some contamination in the delivery system.

In the filters were first gravel and then sand of different sizes. In the spring time when the snow and ice melted the water could become very dirty from leaves and especially from silt/very fine clay, but the filters sorted every thing out also the smaal fish. In that period we had to backwash often.

[khunPer]

I have a well also, and have experienced sometimes the water can get ”black”. That happens when the water is very low in the well during dry season. I use to buy a truck of water, some cubic meters, and pour into the well, which will press/push the dirt back.

Cleaning the well will help, both pumping up all water until it’s clean – meaning pumping dry, wait for the water to refill, pumping again and check if water is clear, if not then pump dry again and repeat until the water is clean – and cleaning of the button; i.e. a man crawls down, so that will not work for a deep-well drilling, and refill with a layer of small stones (about 1” to 2” in average size).

Sand filter, as suggested above, is a good way to clean. If you don’t want to invest in building a double-filter, you can buy a “small” fiber-plastic/fiberglass filter at a reasonable price for that purpose – they are similar to the ones used for cleaning pools and you can use the same sand; the smallest model will do the job. Sand filters needs to be backwashed now-and-then, depending of the amount of “dirt”, and that function is build-in when buying/using a ready-made filter. A ceramic filter in front preserves the sand for longer lasting – otherwise it may need to be changed every 3rd or 5th year – that can just be a small plastic filter container/house and a standard ceramic tube-filter; if choosing a clear plastic-house you can see when the filter gets dirty and need to be cleaned (very easy to wash it clear). Filters come in after the well pump.

Using aluminum sulfate – alum – the clear fairly large crystal Thais use to dump in the well, will cause micro-particles in the water (black or red color) clumping, so that they more easily can be reduced by the filters. A bag of perhaps 1-kilo costs around 20 baht, can be used regularly by dumping a crystal once or twice a week into the well. The crystal is harmless; it’s also used in swimming pools and is the same you buy for a smaller fortune as magic mineral deodorant.

A little trick to remove bad smell and keep water fresh in the tank is air (oxygen), by letting a small aquarium pump mix air into the water – very cheap, costs a few hundred baht – works the same way as the “water stair” in waterworks.

[goltec]

I have a well also, and have experienced sometimes the water can get ”black”. That happens when the water is very low in the well during dry season. I use to buy a truck of water, some cubic meters, and pour into the well, which will press/push the dirt back.

Cleaning the well will help, both pumping up all water until it’s clean – meaning pumping dry, wait for the water to refill, pumping again and check if water is clear, if not then pump dry again and repeat until the water is clean – and cleaning of the button; i.e. a man crawls down, so that will not work for a deep-well drilling, and refill with a layer of small stones (about 1” to 2” in average size).

Sand filter, as suggested above, is a good way to clean. If you don’t want to invest in building a double-filter, you can buy a “small” fiber-plastic/fiberglass filter at a reasonable price for that purpose – they are similar to the ones used for cleaning pools and you can use the same sand; the smallest model will do the job. Sand filters needs to be backwashed now-and-then, depending of the amount of “dirt”, and that function is build-in when buying/using a ready-made filter. A ceramic filter in front preserves the sand for longer lasting – otherwise it may need to be changed every 3rd or 5th year – that can just be a small plastic filter container/house and a standard ceramic tube-filter; if choosing a clear plastic-house you can see when the filter gets dirty and need to be cleaned (very easy to wash it clear). Filters come in after the well pump.

wIMG_8276_ceramic-filter.jpg

Using aluminum sulfate – alum – the clear fairly large crystal Thais use to dump in the well, will cause micro-particles in the water (black or red color) clumping, so that they more easily can be reduced by the filters. A bag of perhaps 1-kilo costs around 20 baht, can be used regularly by dumping a crystal once or twice a week into the well. The crystal is harmless; it’s also used in swimming pools and is the same you buy for a smaller fortune as magic mineral deodorant.

A little trick to remove bad smell and keep water fresh in the tank is air (oxygen), by letting a small aquarium pump mix air into the water – very cheap, costs a few hundred baht – works the same way as the “water stair” in waterworks.

if you place a ceramic filter before your sandfilter you don't need to install a sand filter at all.

a sandfilter removes particles of 5 micron....if you use zeolite (zelbrite).

A ceramic filter removes particles of 0.1 micron.

so allways your sand filter first,

Make sure that it is regualry backwashed.....bacteria may develop.

We allways install an Ultra violet unit just before the point of entree (where the pipe enters the house).

[khunPer]

I have a well also, and have experienced sometimes the water can get ”black”. That happens when the water is very low in the well during dry season. I use to buy a truck of water, some cubic meters, and pour into the well, which will press/push the dirt back.

Cleaning the well will help, both pumping up all water until it’s clean – meaning pumping dry, wait for the water to refill, pumping again and check if water is clear, if not then pump dry again and repeat until the water is clean – and cleaning of the button; i.e. a man crawls down, so that will not work for a deep-well drilling, and refill with a layer of small stones (about 1” to 2” in average size).

Sand filter, as suggested above, is a good way to clean. If you don’t want to invest in building a double-filter, you can buy a “small” fiber-plastic/fiberglass filter at a reasonable price for that purpose – they are similar to the ones used for cleaning pools and you can use the same sand; the smallest model will do the job. Sand filters needs to be backwashed now-and-then, depending of the amount of “dirt”, and that function is build-in when buying/using a ready-made filter. A ceramic filter in front preserves the sand for longer lasting – otherwise it may need to be changed every 3rd or 5th year – that can just be a small plastic filter container/house and a standard ceramic tube-filter; if choosing a clear plastic-house you can see when the filter gets dirty and need to be cleaned (very easy to wash it clear). Filters come in after the well pump.

wIMG_8276_ceramic-filter.jpg

Using aluminum sulfate – alum – the clear fairly large crystal Thais use to dump in the well, will cause micro-particles in the water (black or red color) clumping, so that they more easily can be reduced by the filters. A bag of perhaps 1-kilo costs around 20 baht, can be used regularly by dumping a crystal once or twice a week into the well. The crystal is harmless; it’s also used in swimming pools and is the same you buy for a smaller fortune as magic mineral deodorant.

A little trick to remove bad smell and keep water fresh in the tank is air (oxygen), by letting a small aquarium pump mix air into the water – very cheap, costs a few hundred baht – works the same way as the “water stair” in waterworks.

if you place a ceramic filter before your sandfilter you don't need to install a sand filter at all.

a sandfilter removes particles of 5 micron....if you use zeolite (zelbrite).

A ceramic filter removes particles of 0.1 micron.

so allways your sand filter first,

Make sure that it is regualry backwashed.....bacteria may develop.

We allways install an Ultra violet unit just before the point of entree (where the pipe enters the house).

Thanks for correcting me about filter size.

In theory, yes, very correct…!

I have a ceramic both before and after the sand-filter. The filter before was initially based on a 10-micron fiber-paper-filter based on the sand being about 5 micron, but that let too much dirt pass to the sand, and the fiber-paper-filters are so difficult to clean and quite expensive to change. Then I changed to a 5 micron fiber only filter, that worked better and could be cleaned a couple of times before it needed to be disposed, and the cost was 50 baht each filter. Finally I tested the ceramic filter, and that worked even better, easy to clean and last for long time – if taken good care of it can last for years…

If the water suffers from red color then the sand filter gets extremely dirty if nothing in front. You can check the backwash water and you can see the filter before (and after). Even with a ceramic in front – that in theory is too fine – there will be red dirt in the backwash water; however the second ceramic stays clean for very long time (6 to 12 month). The ceramic filter alone, even two I serial, with no sand after, cannot make the water acceptable clear. It probably also has something to do with how fast the water pass through the filter and the filter-mass; the ceramic filter is thin, however takes the worst dirt, whilst the amount of sand do a nice job being quite a massive amount (I use 50 liter filers). Furthermore the ceramic filter is so easy to check and clean, whilst it’s difficult to check the sand, and backwash cleaning use a lot of water – the backwash water is also better (cleaner) with a filter in front.

Theory is one thing – a Bumblebee cannot fly – practice sometimes works little different. I care about the end product – the water coming out of the tap (or rather into the storage tank) – if that is better in spite of theory, I don’t mind the “fine calculations and principles”...

Ultra violet light is also (very) good to reduce bacteria and algae – I use that in the storage tank together with a small circulation pump, that is controlled by a timer to extend the life-time of the UV-lamp.

[goltec]

I have a well also, and have experienced sometimes the water can get ”black”. That happens when the water is very low in the well during dry season. I use to buy a truck of water, some cubic meters, and pour into the well, which will press/push the dirt back.

Cleaning the well will help, both pumping up all water until it’s clean – meaning pumping dry, wait for the water to refill, pumping again and check if water is clear, if not then pump dry again and repeat until the water is clean – and cleaning of the button; i.e. a man crawls down, so that will not work for a deep-well drilling, and refill with a layer of small stones (about 1” to 2” in average size).

Sand filter, as suggested above, is a good way to clean. If you don’t want to invest in building a double-filter, you can buy a “small” fiber-plastic/fiberglass filter at a reasonable price for that purpose – they are similar to the ones used for cleaning pools and you can use the same sand; the smallest model will do the job. Sand filters needs to be backwashed now-and-then, depending of the amount of “dirt”, and that function is build-in when buying/using a ready-made filter. A ceramic filter in front preserves the sand for longer lasting – otherwise it may need to be changed every 3rd or 5th year – that can just be a small plastic filter container/house and a standard ceramic tube-filter; if choosing a clear plastic-house you can see when the filter gets dirty and need to be cleaned (very easy to wash it clear). Filters come in after the well pump.

wIMG_8276_ceramic-filter.jpg

Using aluminum sulfate – alum – the clear fairly large crystal Thais use to dump in the well, will cause micro-particles in the water (black or red color) clumping, so that they more easily can be reduced by the filters. A bag of perhaps 1-kilo costs around 20 baht, can be used regularly by dumping a crystal once or twice a week into the well. The crystal is harmless; it’s also used in swimming pools and is the same you buy for a smaller fortune as magic mineral deodorant.

A little trick to remove bad smell and keep water fresh in the tank is air (oxygen), by letting a small aquarium pump mix air into the water – very cheap, costs a few hundred baht – works the same way as the “water stair” in waterworks.

if you place a ceramic filter before your sandfilter you don't need to install a sand filter at all.

a sandfilter removes particles of 5 micron....if you use zeolite (zelbrite).

A ceramic filter removes particles of 0.1 micron.

so allways your sand filter first,

Make sure that it is regualry backwashed.....bacteria may develop.

We allways install an Ultra violet unit just before the point of entree (where the pipe enters the house).

Thanks for correcting me about filter size.

In theory, yes, very correct…!

I have a ceramic both before and after the sand-filter. The filter before was initially based on a 10-micron fiber-paper-filter based on the sand being about 5 micron, but that let too much dirt pass to the sand, and the fiber-paper-filters are so difficult to clean and quite expensive to change. Then I changed to a 5 micron fiber only filter, that worked better and could be cleaned a couple of times before it needed to be disposed, and the cost was 50 baht each filter. Finally I tested the ceramic filter, and that worked even better, easy to clean and last for long time – if taken good care of it can last for years…

If the water suffers from red color then the sand filter gets extremely dirty if nothing in front. You can check the backwash water and you can see the filter before (and after). Even with a ceramic in front – that in theory is too fine – there will be red dirt in the backwash water; however the second ceramic stays clean for very long time (6 to 12 month). The ceramic filter alone, even two I serial, with no sand after, cannot make the water acceptable clear. It probably also has something to do with how fast the water pass through the filter and the filter-mass; the ceramic filter is thin, however takes the worst dirt, whilst the amount of sand do a nice job being quite a massive amount (I use 50 liter filers). Furthermore the ceramic filter is so easy to check and clean, whilst it’s difficult to check the sand, and backwash cleaning use a lot of water – the backwash water is also better (cleaner) with a filter in front.

Theory is one thing – a Bumblebee cannot fly – practice sometimes works little different. I care about the end product – the water coming out of the tap (or rather into the storage tank) – if that is better in spite of theory, I don’t mind the “fine calculations and principles”...

Ultra violet light is also (very) good to reduce bacteria and algae – I use that in the storage tank together with a small circulation pump, that is controlled by a timer to extend the life-time of the UV-lamp.

An uv lamp in the storagetank is a very good thing.

Just keep in mind that every time you turn off and on the power the bulb loses 6 hours of its lifespan.

Therefor it is better to never turn off the lamp.

change it once a year.