Tottenham Thread

[bkkjames]

Abby are you really bored or trying to become the bangkok correspondent for goal.com or something?

[alfieconn]

Well I mean I didnt need you to tell me that Joe Lewis owns 70% of ENIC, did I?

However, to me Joe Lewis bears far more resemblance to an offshore nominee of Levy, than he does to a 3billion quid majority shareholder and owner of Spurs. I cannot see how Joe Lewis would have set up the ENIC structure to own Spurs while it makes perfect sense for Levy to set up the ENIC structure to control Spurs. But that is business.

Obviously Lewis could just be a massive fan and it is a relative modest investment. Clearly it is great to go to games regularly and be the owner and all. The problem is that we dont know the shareholder agreement between the two.

It is also quite possible (but I feel unlikely) that Lewis owns Levy's stake.

Why comment on something you obviously know nothing about or do you just like to bore us with all your waffle.

[alfieconn]

The Daily Mail is reporting that Sandro could be in contention for a start on sunday! Surely this is rubbish with no foundation. How can a grade 3 tear become a minor calf strain? They are also saying Ledley is back which is also reported alsewhere and altogether more plausible.

Big oppotunity for Defoe on sunday Could be very interesting if he continues in his current form. Personally i think he should have been rotated more rather than just been left on the bench recently.

Carms this was on a well known Tottenham forum 3 days ago :

Who: dragon1

When: 15/01/11

Where: COYS

Quote: leds and sandro will be fit for city gallas still 2 weeks away

Edited January 18, 2012 by alfieconn

[Abrak]

Well I mean I didnt need you to tell me that Joe Lewis owns 70% of ENIC, did I?

However, to me Joe Lewis bears far more resemblance to an offshore nominee of Levy, than he does to a 3billion quid majority shareholder and owner of Spurs. I cannot see how Joe Lewis would have set up the ENIC structure to own Spurs while it makes perfect sense for Levy to set up the ENIC structure to control Spurs. But that is business.

Obviously Lewis could just be a massive fan and it is a relative modest investment. Clearly it is great to go to games regularly and be the owner and all. The problem is that we dont know the shareholder agreement between the two.

It is also quite possible (but I feel unlikely) that Lewis owns Levy's stake.

Why comment on something you obviously know nothing about or do you just like to bore us with all your waffle.

I suggest you first ask that question to the clubs bankers.

[carmine]

The Daily Mail is reporting that Sandro could be in contention for a start on sunday! Surely this is rubbish with no foundation. How can a grade 3 tear become a minor calf strain? They are also saying Ledley is back which is also reported alsewhere and altogether more plausible.

Big oppotunity for Defoe on sunday Could be very interesting if he continues in his current form. Personally i think he should have been rotated more rather than just been left on the bench recently.

Carms this was on a well known Tottenham forum 3 days ago :

Who: dragon1

When: 15/01/11

Where: COYS

Quote: leds and sandro will be fit for city gallas still 2 weeks away

Thats fantastic news if true. We'll be nearly up to full strength for sunday.

What set up would you go for? 4-3-3?

[Abrak]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

[smokie36]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

You're asking the wrong people here Abrak. Ask us about team tactics or which striker we'd like to see at the club.

For this kind of thing get along to the AGM and bring a loudhailer.

[carmine]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

So Abrak, do you think we should be set up in a 4-3-3 on sunday?

[Abrak]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

You're asking the wrong people here Abrak. Ask us about team tactics or which striker we'd like to see at the club.

For this kind of thing get along to the AGM and bring a loudhailer.

Yeah ok I understand that you are being kind etc. But Spurs are in a similar position to Liverpool in that we need a new stadium. Most supporters dont really understand stadium financing - they might compare it to getting a mortgage on a house. So for instance if Spurs finance their new stadium by a revenue backed debt security they will be able to spend less on their squad over the next ten years than over the last ten years. Arsenal havent spent so little because they wanted to. And the benefits would flow through after that. Roughly speaking (with a huge number of assumptions) the first 20m of incremental revenue for the first 7 years 'after' completion of the stadium would go to payback the loan. (Assuming securitisation of sponsorship revenues and additional bank debt financing.)

Edited January 19, 2012 by Abrak

[smokie36]

I would suggest some allowances for this type of spending should be permitted under FFP. Ground improvements like we need to make are going to cripple both of our clubs financially, we are all aware of the reason behind Levy chasing the Olympic stadium.

Unless the playing field is levelled we will drift down the table in the same way as Arsenal have done. Or a rich benefactor of course.

[smokie36]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

So Abrak, do you think we should be set up in a 4-3-3 on sunday?

You'd leave VDV on the bench then and play Sandro Parker and Modders?

[carmine]

I think we have to play with Parker alongside Sandro and i want him to set us up same as Milan away last season. If we can go in at halftime a goal up i hope we shut up shop and use the speed of Bale, Walker and Lennon to keep hitting them on the break.

If Ledley does play it will be interesting whether Redknapp chooses Kaboul or Dawson. For me it would be Kaboul.

[smokie36]

I'd go with Kaboul as well..he's been solid this season. I just wonder where the goals come from with Defoe up there on his own?

Maybe Bale coming inside along with Modric can conjure something...? Wait and see I guess.

[Abrak]

BTW do any of you guys know who owns Spurs.

I understand the ENIC shareholding. And also Levy's 27% share of ENIC but at that point it stops at a deadend without making an effort.

Joe Lewis.

The reason I question Joe lewis's ownership is because in the Lazard's debt weekly they Spurs are 'hoping' to issue a 100m 10 yr revenue backed debt security later in the year to finance the new stadium. This would seem to explicitly imply that the debt was not going to be guaranteed by Lewis. It is also expensive and cashflow intensive.

So Abrak, do you think we should be set up in a 4-3-3 on sunday?

Obviously I have no clue.

However, I can promise you from your posts you have a fundamental misunderstanding how the impact of a new stadium will affect your cashflow and squad investment over the next ten years.

[Abrak]

I would suggest some allowances for this type of spending should be permitted under FFP. Ground improvements like we need to make are going to cripple both of our clubs financially, we are all aware of the reason behind Levy chasing the Olympic stadium.

Unless the playing field is levelled we will drift down the table in the same way as Arsenal have done. Or a rich benefactor of course.

Building a new ground is 'explicitly' exempted from calculations of FFP. So you or Chelsea can build a new ground without any worries. The only worry Spurs is that while 400m doesnt count for a new ground for both Chelsea and Spurs, 400m counts as 'real' money to Spurs and maybe not Chelsea.Lewis can take advantage of being incredibly rich by simply guaranteeing your debt but he wont. Obviously Spurs has done incredibly well without a penny from its owner. Everton are protesting because they dont get money. You guys basically have an incredibly rich owner pretending he has no money at all (which is actually worst than him actually having no money at all). On the basis that you cant get government subsidy on the back of of a 3 billionaire.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Abrak

[Abrak]

The Daily Mail is reporting that Sandro could be in contention for a start on sunday! Surely this is rubbish with no foundation. How can a grade 3 tear become a minor calf strain? They are also saying Ledley is back which is also reported alsewhere and altogether more plausible.

Big oppotunity for Defoe on sunday Could be very interesting if he continues in his current form. Personally i think he should have been rotated more rather than just been left on the bench recently.

Carms this was on a well known Tottenham forum 3 days ago :

Who: dragon1

When: 15/01/11

Where: COYS

Quote: leds and sandro will be fit for city gallas still 2 weeks away

Thats fantastic news if true. We'll be nearly up to full strength for sunday.

What set up would you go for? 4-3-3?

Boy this bugs me.

It reminds me of going to Cambridge and being asked the color of cheese on a red day.

What could I possibly say that wasnt incredibly stupid.

[Abrak]

Actually now Smokie has reminded me of something else.

I invested a resaonable sum 200k in Spurs about a year ago. Your Chairman decided to delist the shares because the business was worth 4 times its quoted price and its value was not reflected in the market. I have absolutely no idea why he would think I would buy his shares other than they were undervalued and their price was not reflected in the market. But as I cant sell them after he has decided I cant sell them I have to put up with it. But it does bug me that obviously I only wish to buy his shares because they are undervalued and he now says that because they are undervalued nobody can buy or sell them (apart from him).

He at least should have given us a clue like Alan Sugar.

[MrRed]

So you have 2 hundred english in spurs and cannot do anything to get your money out?

you cannot sell them to anyone only him? lets hope you can afford to have the money tied up and that Spurs don't go on a downward spiral,lets face it they won't be getting much better than they are will they?

[Abrak]

So you have 2 hundred english in spurs and cannot do anything to get your money out?

you cannot sell them to anyone only him? lets hope you can afford to have the money tied up and that Spurs don't go on a downward spiral,lets face it they won't be getting much better than they are will they?

Not quite.

I sold them and took the loss.

Well actually the price of things often has very little to do with their inherent value. 5 years ago when Spurs were 3rd from bottom and generally pretty crap, their share price was 150p. I paid 48p a year ago and sold a couple of months ago at 38p at a sizable loss. At 38p the business is worth 76m quid so you pretty much might as well buy the entire club as buy Modric but that is beside the point. Utd is worth 2bn supposedly. Given that Levy decided to delist the shares because they were undervalued (and of course I bought them because they were undervalued) I didnt think there was much point in holding them as a private business on the basis that the owners might give me more when they were properly valued. If I followed Levy's logic he would offer me nothing.

I suspect the ownership issue and the new stadium will get resolved at the same time.

Also, Red, I am not a total lunatic, I am not going to invest into equity something that I cant afford to lose.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Abrak

[carmine]

The Daily Mail is reporting that Sandro could be in contention for a start on sunday! Surely this is rubbish with no foundation. How can a grade 3 tear become a minor calf strain? They are also saying Ledley is back which is also reported alsewhere and altogether more plausible.

Big oppotunity for Defoe on sunday Could be very interesting if he continues in his current form. Personally i think he should have been rotated more rather than just been left on the bench recently.

Carms this was on a well known Tottenham forum 3 days ago :

Who: dragon1

When: 15/01/11

Where: COYS

Quote: leds and sandro will be fit for city gallas still 2 weeks away

Thats fantastic news if true. We'll be nearly up to full strength for sunday.

What set up would you go for? 4-3-3?

Boy this bugs me.

It reminds me of going to Cambridge and being asked the color of cheese on a red day.

What could I possibly say that wasnt incredibly stupid.

[carmine]

Should we be starting a Tottenham Business Discussion Thread?

I'm beginning to feel guilty posting on "FOOTBALL" related issues.

[trevorg]

Should we be starting a Tottenham Business Discussion Thread?

I'm beginning to feel guilty posting on "FOOTBALL" related issues.

When I sold my 350k House in order to fund Crawley Towns wage bill for a week or two!

Abrak - you've had a thread set up for you - go and use it!

This is a football thread, about Tottenham, the game and not the money! (I'll admit that I'm a bit 'pissed off' that you invested 200k in a football club (that you don't support) -lost some of your money, but I'm glad you came out smiling!)

(The Crawley Town thing was a joke!)

Edited January 20, 2012 by trevorg

[smokie36]

Yes mrboj can you have a word with the disgruntled member please?

Edit: £200k is bugger all anyway. We spend more on our barristers <deleted>.

Edited January 20, 2012 by smokie36

[MrRed]

Yes mrboj can you have a word with the disgruntled member please?

Edit: £200k is bugger all anyway. We spend more on our barristers <deleted>.

You mean Harry will be doing

[carmine]

Looks like we'll be going into this one without Sandro and King. So much misinformation flying around!

Redknapps said we'll be going all out attack so it should be great for the neutrals.

[MrRed]

That's the way you have been playing this season isn't it? you have had success from this method except against United and City!

[carmine]

That's the way you have been playing this season isn't it? you have had success from this method except against United and City!

Well according to your red nosed bully of a manager we play the best football so i suppose you must be right. However you know full well MrRed that we could only field half a first team (as opposed to current team) for those first two games. Even Utd's bland style of play could beat that Spurs side.

City fans don't seem to have a problem differenciating between this Spurs team and the one of the first two games. Why can't you RAGS? Do you have problems reading a teamsheet?

This Utd team really is a very uninspiring, tedious side to watch, scrapping out wins recently against small team with only a tiny percentage of your finance available. You must be very proud.

And your keepers a shop lifter..............and probably a shirt lifter too.

Edited January 21, 2012 by carmine

[MrRed]

That's the way you have been playing this season isn't it? you have had success from this method except against United and City!

Well according to your red nosed bully of a manager we play the best football so i suppose you must be right. However you know full well MrRed that we could only field half a first team (as opposed to current team) for those first two games. Even Utd's bland style of play could beat that Spurs side.

City fans don't seem to have a problem differenciating between this Spurs team and the one of the first two games. Why can't you RAGS? Do you have problems reading a teamsheet?

This Utd team really is a very uninspiring, tedious side to watch, scrapping out wins recently against small team with only a tiny percentage of your finance available. You must be very proud.

And your keepers a shop lifter..............and probably a shirt lifter too.

Have a look at your record against us in the Premier league home and away and then come back to me unlike you lot of one season wonders/dreamers we tend to take the long term view of things still i hope you stuff city tomorrow and justify your team at the moment ....or.....will you complain that you had dead leg King and Sandro out when you get bitched again by the real big boys?

[carmine]

That's the way you have been playing this season isn't it? you have had success from this method except against United and City!

Well according to your red nosed bully of a manager we play the best football so i suppose you must be right. However you know full well MrRed that we could only field half a first team (as opposed to current team) for those first two games. Even Utd's bland style of play could beat that Spurs side.

City fans don't seem to have a problem differenciating between this Spurs team and the one of the first two games. Why can't you RAGS? Do you have problems reading a teamsheet?

This Utd team really is a very uninspiring, tedious side to watch, scrapping out wins recently against small team with only a tiny percentage of your finance available. You must be very proud.

And your keepers a shop lifter..............and probably a shirt lifter too.

Have a look at your record against us in the Premier league home and away and then come back to me unlike you lot of one season wonders/dreamers we tend to take the long term view of things still i hope you stuff city tomorrow and justify your team at the moment ....or.....will you complain that you had dead leg King and Sandro out when you get bitched again by the real big boys?

Our points so far fully justify our position.

BTW i hate to inform you lot up at OT but...................Utd are not the real big boys.........that position in football belongs to Madrid and Barcelona.

[MrRed]

That's the way you have been playing this season isn't it? you have had success from this method except against United and City!

Well according to your red nosed bully of a manager we play the best football so i suppose you must be right. However you know full well MrRed that we could only field half a first team (as opposed to current team) for those first two games. Even Utd's bland style of play could beat that Spurs side.

City fans don't seem to have a problem differenciating between this Spurs team and the one of the first two games. Why can't you RAGS? Do you have problems reading a teamsheet?

This Utd team really is a very uninspiring, tedious side to watch, scrapping out wins recently against small team with only a tiny percentage of your finance available. You must be very proud.

And your keepers a shop lifter..............and probably a shirt lifter too.

Have a look at your record against us in the Premier league home and away and then come back to me unlike you lot of one season wonders/dreamers we tend to take the long term view of things still i hope you stuff city tomorrow and justify your team at the moment ....or.....will you complain that you had dead leg King and Sandro out when you get bitched again by the real big boys?

Our points so far fully justify our position.

BTW i hate to inform you lot up at OT but...................Utd are not the real big boys.........that position in football belongs to Madrid and Barcelona.

Madrid? what have they won lately?