The general does not like criticism or thoughts counter to his own.

Pathetic, oversensitive children

Surely Russel - 'the most senior (diplomatic) US official to visit Thailand since the coup ' should have had the common courtesy to include the PM in his visits. Regardless of peoples personal views and thoughts, it was clearly a deliberate snub. Russel could still have said what he did say, but was there a real need to be so disrespectful ?,

Courtesy - "polite behavior that shows respect for other people."

Negative. When there are disagreements, the back channels are the diplomatic norm.

Being an american that lives here. I will have to say I am happy with the situation at present. Bangkok is not burning, No rioting.

I can get from point A to point B with out a detour. I drive around daily, and the military have been very helpful and friendly.

Politic's aside, because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand. Things seem NORMAL....

If things would get better in the south. Perfect.

So, I could care less what an american politician says. If it gets crazy again I may go back to America and find another retirement home..

"...because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand..."

Then why comment at all? All you have done now is make yourself look like a exploiting fool in the eyes of other Americans like myself ("find another retirement home").

You are happy Thais have now been stripped of a basic right that most in America hold dear? The right to publicly say "I don't like our leader".

But of course as long as you are comfortable who cares what happens to the natives, eh Gary?

Personally after retiring and traveling extensively, I have to say. I think we should keep our political views to ourselves. Unless it is a direct threat to the well being of American's.

People in Thailand are not stupid and there basic rights are not being threatened IMO.

Actually what I have seen in my travels is? Interfering with other country's political systems is very costly and unhealthy for there economy and people. As well as our economy in America.

Things will right them self's in time. Without major conflict in Thailand.

Personally I find your thinking extremely narrow minded and embarrassing. A frame of mind that has bankrupt the great American way of life. With wars, and loss of life.

My way or the highway thinking is thankfully fading. The Global economy has taken care of that kind of thinking.

Reguards, Gary

Edited January 29, 201511 yr by ubonjoe
moved reply from quoted text

Thailand have only rice not petrol

"When an elected leader is deposed, impeached by the authorities that implemented the coup, and then targeted with criminal charges while basic democratic processes and institutions are interrupted.."

So this statement is untrue then?? This has not happened??

storm in a tea-cup?

how did George W get elected?

how do all of them get elected?

democracy ... what a crock

who believes anything that comes out of America? I certainly don't

are all Aussies rabid, hateful sociopaths like the elected political party and its whacko leader?

both sides are funded by corporations, so policy always favours the corporations (the 1%) ...

duopoly not democracy ...

Looks like USA State Dept, WH, and CIA community have differing ideas about Thailand. Likely the Russel fellow was paid by the Thaksins.

If Russel isn't sacked then his words were sanctioned

Surely Russel - 'the most senior (diplomatic) US official to visit Thailand since the coup ' should have had the common courtesy to include the PM in his visits. Regardless of peoples personal views and thoughts, it was clearly a deliberate snub. Russel could still have said what he did say, but was there a real need to be so disrespectful ?,

Courtesy - "polite behavior that shows respect for other people."

The 'snub' was ok'd by the leader before the senior official ever step foot in the country. This is all 'theater', not to be confused with real life. The USA and Thailand have a long history of 'getting along together'. This short bump in the road to democracy will not impede the natural long term relationship of these two loving countries.

Truthiness meets Thainess ... film at 11!

120405truthiness.jpg

TRUTHINESS????? Another Naive American. So sad.....

Thailand have only rice not petrol

True...but it is located on very strategic position in case of confrontation with China or North Korea....that's why the US is doing everything its can to get into Burma...and its upset about Thailand dealing with China. Unfortunately Burma Government may be easy to buy for the right money...billions in military "help" plus official's corruption.

There is no doubt that the US gent accepted Yinglucks side of everything without attempting to get a balanced view of what had happened to lead to her impeachment.

That being the case the statements that were made at the university were completely one sided.

Furthermore the fact they Yingluck met with the US envoy and gave what could only have been a one sided version of events was a deliberate attempt to sway international opinion against Thailand and a direct attack on the country and the Thai people.

These comments will have been reported internationally and coming from a US envoy will be accepted as the truth, while they are only half truths at best.

The Shins care not that they will hurt the country and the people. It shows just how far these people are prepared to go in their own self interest.

You have left all semblance of reality and critical thinking far behind. The envoy met with Yingluk AND Abhisit, the only political leaders in the country at the moment, and both marginalized by military policy. Further, the statement Russel made is carefully correct -- he stated that the rest of the world "may" think that Yingluk being deposed and impeached by a military government "could be" perceived as being politically motivated (especially since the riots of 2010 resulted in many more deaths and extensive property damage, yet did not spark a coup). Of course ASEAN is silent on this, they do not want the fallout from criticizing their next-door neighbors, while China has an interest in gaining ground in Thailand for so many reasons they cannot be counted in a forum post. Russel is also plainly correct in saying that the US wants a lifting of martial law, as do most international citizens and Thais. A ban on protests and violence (both seem to happen at the same time with alarming frequency) is perfectly understandable to most people, whereas martial law shifts corruption from the police to the military (and there have been more than a half dozen reports in Thai news about such corruption since the coup -- all denied and all never followed up in subsequent news articles). No thinking person will ever buy into the the idea that Thai politics and culture is ineffable (cannot be understood). Never. Saying something is 'Thainess' to avoid clarification explains nothing except xenophobia.

Further, declaring the criticisms from outside nations are negated by hypocritical US and European foreign policy (a matter of misplaced truth) is also a logical fallacy and blatantly incorrect. If a murderer sees a plane crash and reports it, the plane crash obviously occurred no mater how credible the testimony of the witness.

Edited January 29, 201511 yr by FangFerang

Being an american that lives here. I will have to say I am happy with the situation at present. Bangkok is not burning, No rioting.

I can get from point A to point B with out a detour. I drive around daily, and the military have been very helpful and friendly.

Politic's aside, because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand. Things seem NORMAL....

If things would get better in the south. Perfect.

So, I could care less what an american politician says. If it gets crazy again I may go back to America and find another retirement home..

"...because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand..."

Then why comment at all? All you have done now is make yourself look like a exploiting fool in the eyes of other Americans like myself ("find another retirement home").

You are happy Thais have now been stripped of a basic right that most in America hold dear? The right to publicly say "I don't like our leader".

But of course as long as you are comfortable who cares what happens to the natives, eh Gary?

Yap...Looks like you are living in the wrong place. Have a good time coming back home KBlaze.

Edited January 29, 201511 yr by umbanda

just switch off the money tap(Cobra gold)and statements w e will see what hurts...

sure China would like to have some Cobra Red Star exercises. Maybe training in taking over islands. And surely they would spend some money for it.

Or joint with Russia.

Or close the spy stations in Thailand....

Or bring the torture things in Thailand into the media.

USA has more to loose than Thailand.

just switch off the money tap(Cobra gold)and statements w e will see what hurts...

sure China would like to have some Cobra Red Star exercises. Maybe training in taking over islands. And surely they would spend some money for it.

Or joint with Russia.

Or close the spy stations in Thailand....

Or bring the torture things in Thailand into the media.

USA has more to loose than Thailand.

Yes, the Americans are very worried. They're going to cancel the Super Bowl over this.

just switch off the money tap(Cobra gold)and statements w e will see what hurts...

sure China would like to have some Cobra Red Star exercises. Maybe training in taking over islands. And surely they would spend some money for it.

Or joint with Russia.

Or close the spy stations in Thailand....

Or bring the torture things in Thailand into the media.

USA has more to loose than Thailand.

Your statement is motivated by your anti American sentiments and nothing else. Thailand plays China against the USA, and the USA against China. It's a decades old game.

In respect to the USA losing more than Thailand, I suggest you have a good look at the trade figures. Do you really think China can replace Thailand's no. 1 trade partner? In case you missed it, the Chinese trade relationship is built on exporting goods to Thailand, whereas the Thai trade relationship with the USA is one of exporting goods to the USA. What do you think Thailand values more? Chinese imports that undercut the Thai manufacturing, agricultural and textile sectors, or exports to the USA which keep those sectors afloat?

You forget that China backs Cambodia, Burma and Laos, arch rivals to Thailand. Who do you think has encouraged the people of Surin to get closer to their Khmer cousins, or those in Ubon to meet their Laotian cousins? Hint: It's not the USA which has strongly supported the concept of keeping Thailand whole.

There is no doubt that the US gent accepted Yinglucks side of everything without attempting to get a balanced view of what had happened to lead to her impeachment.

That being the case the statements that were made at the university were completely one sided.

Furthermore the fact they Yingluck met with the US envoy and gave what could only have been a one sided version of events was a deliberate attempt to sway international opinion against Thailand and a direct attack on the country and the Thai people.

These comments will have been reported internationally and coming from a US envoy will be accepted as the truth, while they are only half truths at best.

The Shins care not that they will hurt the country and the people. It shows just how far these people are prepared to go in their own self interest.

Huh? Ying talked and he listened of course normal conversation. BUT, just because she talked doesnt mean he took everything as truth.

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see what has happened here. Military over through a democratically elected government, ie coup. The country is under martial law. Many problems are surfacing regarding foreigners and police crackdowns. The government is passing communication laws to limit freedoms. I could go on and on about all the crap that has happened and is reported in the media.

I think we should round up all,the junta lovers and send them to the moon. What a bunch of morons....

I sometimes wonder how the PT supporters can call the 26 appointed caretaker cabinet ministers (all appointed by Thaksin) who were in place when the military took over an elected Govt.

Yes there has been crackdowns on corrupt police, govt officials and politicians and these are only a small part of the 25,000 plus who would have been pardoned and allowed to keep their corruptly gained money under the amnesty bill which sparked the protests.

And now politicians are being brought to account for their part in corruption and negligence something that would never have happened under PT.

Let the crackdowns, as you choose to call them, continue till corruption is eliminated, but of course as a PT supporter you wouldn't want that as those you support are among the most corrupt.

Please tell us how martial law has affected you personally, restricted your freedoms, stopped you from going where yu want to go doing what you want to do. I know it hasn't affected me at all.

You don't have to love anyone to see the truth, but when you have been conned by hateful lies into believing the crap you post then there does have to be questions about your intelligence.

before anybody takes anything too seriously keep in mind one thing

the only outside military that has clear an unfettered use of Thailand's airspace is the United States

and the only warships permitted to dock in the Thailand, is the US Navy.

I'm not making any particular comment regarding any body's ruffled feathers.

but those are the facts.

keep in mind the US president just spent a couple of days in India in Saudi Arabia,

and this is a relatively low level person making those comments

Being an american that lives here. I will have to say I am happy with the situation at present. Bangkok is not burning, No rioting.

I can get from point A to point B with out a detour. I drive around daily, and the military have been very helpful and friendly.

Politic's aside, because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand. Things seem NORMAL....

If things would get better in the south. Perfect.

So, I could care less what an american politician says. If it gets crazy again I may go back to America and find another retirement home..

"...because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand..."

Then why comment at all? All you have done now is make yourself look like a exploiting fool in the eyes of other Americans like myself ("find another retirement home").

You are happy Thais have now been stripped of a basic right that most in America hold dear? The right to publicly say "I don't like our leader".

But of course as long as you are comfortable who cares what happens to the natives, eh Gary?

Personally after retiring and traveling extensively, I have to say. I think we should keep our political views to ourselves. Unless it is a direct threat to the well being of American's.

People in Thailand are not stupid and there basic rights are not being threatened IMO.

Actually what I have seen in my travels is? Interfering with other country's political systems is very costly and unhealthy for there economy and people. As well as our economy in America.

Things will right them self's in time. Without major conflict in Thailand.

Personally I find your thinking extremely narrow minded and embarrassing. A frame of mind that has bankrupt the great American way of life. With wars, and loss of life.

My way or the highway thinking is thankfully fading. The Global economy has taken care of that kind of thinking.

Reguards, Gary

We aren't interfering with Thailand's political system. Russell simply expressed the US's opinion of how things are going here in Thailand. Thats it. That's par for the course. Your allies do something you don't like, you say so. Same with statements the US has made towards actions of Saudi Arabia, Israel, Iraq, Italy...its a long list.

You find MY thinking narrow-minded?? I'm not the one saying "I don't care that Thailand is in a state of martial law because things seem normal to me". THAT is the definition of narrow-mindedness.

There is no doubt that the US gent accepted Yinglucks side of everything without attempting to get a balanced view of what had happened to lead to her impeachment.

That being the case the statements that were made at the university were completely one sided.

Furthermore the fact they Yingluck met with the US envoy and gave what could only have been a one sided version of events was a deliberate attempt to sway international opinion against Thailand and a direct attack on the country and the Thai people.

These comments will have been reported internationally and coming from a US envoy will be accepted as the truth, while they are only half truths at best.

The Shins care not that they will hurt the country and the people. It shows just how far these people are prepared to go in their own self interest.

Huh? Ying talked and he listened of course normal conversation. BUT, just because she talked doesnt mean he took everything as truth.

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to see what has happened here. Military over through a democratically elected government, ie coup. The country is under martial law. Many problems are surfacing regarding foreigners and police crackdowns. The government is passing communication laws to limit freedoms. I could go on and on about all the crap that has happened and is reported in the media.

I think we should round up all,the junta lovers and send them to the moon. What a bunch of morons....

I sometimes wonder how the PT supporters can call the 26 appointed caretaker cabinet ministers (all appointed by Thaksin) who were in place when the military took over an elected Govt.

Yes there has been crackdowns on corrupt police, govt officials and politicians and these are only a small part of the 25,000 plus who would have been pardoned and allowed to keep their corruptly gained money under the amnesty bill which sparked the protests.

And now politicians are being brought to account for their part in corruption and negligence something that would never have happened under PT.

Let the crackdowns, as you choose to call them, continue till corruption is eliminated, but of course as a PT supporter you wouldn't want that as those you support are among the most corrupt.

Please tell us how martial law has affected you personally, restricted your freedoms, stopped you from going where yu want to go doing what you want to do. I know it hasn't affected me at all.

You don't have to love anyone to see the truth, but when you have been conned by hateful lies into believing the crap you post then there does have to be questions about your intelligence.

Fact it is a military government and under military law.

Fact over half of the government council is made up of military officers.

Fact the military stole the country from Thai citizens.

Fact the military stood on the sidelines while Suthep held the country hostage.

Fact the military allowed the protesters to stop a country-wide legal election.

Fact the military has allowed Suthep to escape any responsibility for driving this country into chaos.

Fact immediately after the coup the military threw out the country's constitution in order to rule with its own free will and impunity.

Fact the head coup general is in charge of the country APPOINTED AND NOT ELECTED.

FACT of these are truths and absolutely not crap or lies.

FACT you need to be the leader of the moon crew....

Being an american that lives here. I will have to say I am happy with the situation at present. Bangkok is not burning, No rioting.

I can get from point A to point B with out a detour. I drive around daily, and the military have been very helpful and friendly.

Politic's aside, because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand. Things seem NORMAL....

If things would get better in the south. Perfect.

So, I could care less what an american politician says. If it gets crazy again I may go back to America and find another retirement home..

"...because I know nothing about politic's in Thailand..."

Then why comment at all? All you have done now is make yourself look like a exploiting fool in the eyes of other Americans like myself ("find another retirement home").

You are happy Thais have now been stripped of a basic right that most in America hold dear? The right to publicly say "I don't like our leader".

But of course as long as you are comfortable who cares what happens to the natives, eh Gary?

Yap...Looks like you are living in the wrong place. Have a good time coming back home KBlaze.

Thanks, I do have great times when I go back to the US for a visit every year.

Thailand have only rice not petrol

True...but it is located on very strategic position in case of confrontation with China or North Korea....that's why the US is doing everything its can to get into Burma...and its upset about Thailand dealing with China. Unfortunately Burma Government may be easy to buy for the right money...billions in military "help" plus official's corruption.

Thailand is no longer strategically needed; as of Jan 10, 2015 the US signed a 10 year lease with the Phillippines to use Subic Bay and the airbase across from it. Took 8 months of negotiations----hhmmmmm I think that was 8 months after the coup.

Everyone seems to be blaming Russel about his comments. Please keep in mind that 1) He did not right his comments; they were drafted and re-drafted by Department of State speech writers and then vetted and approved by Russel and others above him; (2) He went through several briefing before coming to Bangkok to bring him up to speed regarding the current details of Thailand politics and economy in addition to the geopolitical happenings in Asia.

Obviously, the reason for the comments is to once again be perfectly clear what the official U.S. position is. For some reason, the official positions of western countries seem to get confused with what the current government would like them to be and what is reported for Thai consumption. There may also be an attempt to make sure that Democracy (note big D) does not get re-defined, as in 'western democracy is difficult because Thai politicians and Thai politics are different.' If the government intends, as some would suggest, to change the normal meaning of democracy to limit who can run and be elected and to give the military penultimate veto power, then there will be more problems with the west. Over the past decade, Thailand has set itself up as the role model for democracy in S.E. Asia and this was well supported by western governments. Yes, there were growing issues between the traditional elites and the "new money" elites, and as it has been suggested, it was decided that the military would be the arbiter between the two factions. And now, you have true left of center politics being discussed and acted on as demonstrated by the Greek elections. Democracy means democracy, and that was Russel's message.

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Surely Russel - 'the most senior (diplomatic) US official to visit Thailand since the coup ' should have had the common courtesy to include the PM in his visits. Regardless of peoples personal views and thoughts, it was clearly a deliberate snub. Russel could still have said what he did say, but was there a real need to be so disrespectful ?,

Courtesy - "polite behavior that shows respect for other people."

It works better if it works both ways but it will never work when it is demanded.

"I am sorry that we have been friends for a long time"

Classic!!

At least the statement is half right.

I am not sure..but looks like was some kind of altercation with an US teacher and students at an university showing in Channel 3.

If that is true....ll this is not a good news for US teachers..and for any US citizen living and working in Thailand....

Edited January 29, 201511 yr by umbanda

Everyone seems to be blaming Russel about his comments. Please keep in mind that 1) He did not right his comments; they were drafted and re-drafted by Department of State speech writers and then vetted and approved by Russel and others above him; (2) He went through several briefing before coming to Bangkok to bring him up to speed regarding the current details of Thailand politics and economy in addition to the geopolitical happenings in Asia.

Obviously, the reason for the comments is to once again be perfectly clear what the official U.S. position is. For some reason, the official positions of western countries seem to get confused with what the current government would like them to be and what is reported for Thai consumption. There may also be an attempt to make sure that Democracy (note big D) does not get re-defined, as in 'western democracy is difficult because Thai politicians and Thai politics are different.' If the government intends, as some would suggest, to change the normal meaning of democracy to limit who can run and be elected and to give the military penultimate veto power, then there will be more problems with the west. Over the past decade, Thailand has set itself up as the role model for democracy in S.E. Asia and this was well supported by western governments. Yes, there were growing issues between the traditional elites and the "new money" elites, and as it has been suggested, it was decided that the military would be the arbiter between the two factions. And now, you have true left of center politics being discussed and acted on as demonstrated by the Greek elections. Democracy means democracy, and that was Russel's message.

Exactly the point...loss of face over telling locals America and Europe love the junta and what they are doing.

Thailand have only rice not petrol

True...but it is located on very strategic position in case of confrontation with China or North Korea....that's why the US is doing everything its can to get into Burma...and its upset about Thailand dealing with China. Unfortunately Burma Government may be easy to buy for the right money...billions in military "help" plus official's corruption.

Thailand is no longer strategically needed; as of Jan 10, 2015 the US signed a 10 year lease with the Phillippines to use Subic Bay and the airbase across from it. Took 8 months of negotiations----hhmmmmm I think that was 8 months after the coup.

That and the similar negotiations with Indonesia due to the strategic significance of the Malacca Strait are going to move LOS further to the back burner if on the stove at all.

The problem is that Prayut, the royal establishment and the Bangkok elite, truly believe from the bottom of their hearts that true democracy is only reserved for the rich and powerful. In their eyes the poor should have no say on who rules the country and the US is fully aware of this. The US will ramp up the pressure now, notice the timing of this high level visit?

.....Google - Feudal-System

Daniel Russel: note to self..... watch P's & Q's during diplomatic visit to the 17th century.