Expatitis in Thailand, Is Your Glass Half Empty or Half Full?

[hawker9000]

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It's easy to form negative impressions of Thais in general. The easiest thing to dislike about them is that they don't live in an authentic experience with others. They are generally deceitful in all aspects of their relationships. To the outsider, this is not understandable. The foreigner or expat also has a negative view of Thais for their lack of responsibility and commitment. They reneg on business deals and personal promises. They manipulate the facts to suit their self absorbed interests. Thais don't read, they are not interested in classical art, music or world history.

Thais generally have little or no awareness of western culture. They live in a total state of denial about their society and its reality. They have little or no intellectual curiosity or passion about much. They have little work ethic and their sense of value is most limited to material things and money. Just look at the way Thais splay out money at any event. Random acts of truthfulness and honesty are big news in the Thai press. Thais love secrecy, exclusion, and opaqueness in society, business, and life in general. Thais rarely if ever take responsibility and never say I'm sorry, I made a mistake. When expats get together, it's easy to complain about Thais because something has always just happened that has them shaking their heads about Thais. Expats who don't complain about Thais are living in the same false reality and unauthentic life experience. Expats who never complain about Thais or Thailand are being deceitful to themselves or they've become Thai thinking in a land where Thais will never accept them for who they really are.

Wow, my respect and compliments to Noitom because this comment must be the best post in this whole thread and on this subject in general.

I think this post unfortunately is 100% especially the part about lack of intellectual curiosity or the inability to be accountable for their actions

Noitom's post succeeds in giving you a certain perspective on why the defensive expats are that way. It's the "thainess" rut they actually kind of want to fall into. Some people just plain don't mind being a pin-cushion (that much).

[Bernard Flint]

When it's all said and done Thailand just isn't really that much of a cool and exotic place to live for me anymore, I guess unfortunately I am half empty...March 21st 2015 will be my last day here, I enjoyed many parts of it but honestly if I never return in my lifetime it still won't be a long enough time to be away..

yes I know there is going to be the "don't let the door"....blah blah but just being honest and giving an honest answer to a question posed.

Been hurt or ripped off, or both

[rayongchelsea]

When it's all said and done Thailand just isn't really that much of a cool and exotic place to live for me anymore, I guess unfortunately I am half empty...March 21st 2015 will be my last day here, I enjoyed many parts of it but honestly if I never return in my lifetime it still won't be a long enough time to be away..

yes I know there is going to be the "don't let the door"....blah blah but just being honest and giving an honest answer to a question posed.

Been hurt or ripped off, or both

There are many who have had one the other or both that don't leave .At least he is remedying his situation positively by leaving.

[jdinasia]

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It's easy to form negative impressions of Thais in general. The easiest thing to dislike about them is that they don't live in an authentic experience with others. They are generally deceitful in all aspects of their relationships. To the outsider, this is not understandable. The foreigner or expat also has a negative view of Thais for their lack of responsibility and commitment. They reneg on business deals and personal promises. They manipulate the facts to suit their self absorbed interests. Thais don't read, they are not interested in classical art, music or world history.

Thais generally have little or no awareness of western culture. They live in a total state of denial about their society and its reality. They have little or no intellectual curiosity or passion about much. They have little work ethic and their sense of value is most limited to material things and money. Just look at the way Thais splay out money at any event. Random acts of truthfulness and honesty are big news in the Thai press. Thais love secrecy, exclusion, and opaqueness in society, business, and life in general. Thais rarely if ever take responsibility and never say I'm sorry, I made a mistake. When expats get together, it's easy to complain about Thais because something has always just happened that has them shaking their heads about Thais. Expats who don't complain about Thais are living in the same false reality and unauthentic life experience. Expats who never complain about Thais or Thailand are being deceitful to themselves or they've become Thai thinking in a land where Thais will never accept them for who they really are.

Wow, my respect and compliments to Noitom because this comment must be the best post in this whole thread and on this subject in general.

I think this post unfortunately is 100% especially the part about lack of intellectual curiosity or the inability to be accountable for their actions

We have lived in different Thailands I think.

[DaveinAsia]

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I've got quite a simple explanation for this divide into 2 camps; non-whiners and whiners.

If you are a thoughtful, considerate, philosophical, concerned and emotional being you will have a hard time fitting in here.

However, if you are lacking empathy, are indifferent, self-conceited, fun loving and easy going you will fit in great.

Not saying that all Thailand lovers are sociopaths, not at all, but a lot of them are easy going, Leo drinking fun lovers.

Thailand doesn't attract too many expats (excl.expats who work in multinationals, government or NGO's) who think outside of the box because if you do you are stamped a whiner, trouble maker, depressed or bad sport by the fun lovers and that's exactly my point.

One of the reasons many farangs actually move here is to escape from being a responsible person back home, because Thailand is known for it's mai pen rai mentality.

Hence the comments if you don't like it here go back home. There is not much thoughtfulness or care for society by these ostriches. They just want to be left alone in their bubble with their glass half full and care about themselves. They automatically assume that if you complain about something Thai that you don't like it here. They can't think outside of their self-imposed box structure. I mean, who would want to complain when you can be sitting on the beach with a Leo and a nice female massaging your shoulders while you are talking bs with your mates? They can't imagine because their imagination doesn't go further than the basics of life sad to say.

They never get tired of that same old same old, year in, year out. That's something I can't get my head around. Perhaps they are easier satisfied and happy. Ignorance is bliss so they say.

They can't see the difference between caring and whining. Any criticism of society is seen as complaining. It's how they are wired. They just don't care and consider any intellectual thought as threatening to their existence in Utopia.

Bring up any interesting topic and they will try to ridicule you with dumbfounded comments.

Most of them are ego-maniacs who tap themselves on the shoulder all day long and love talking about themselves, how wonderful they are and how they have made it. If you haven't made it just as big as them or bigger you are a loser.

I've met 100's, if not 1000's of these expats over the years, from BKK to Samui to CM and Phuket. This is also how the rest of the world perceives expats living in Thailand. They see us as braindead, uncaring and useless barflies.

My advice to the farangs with half a brain who actually care about the world and other people; don't even try to convince these people and never argue with them! They are conservative in their thinking and doing and they know everything better. They are the same guys who say you should hang the mentally retarded Russian who killed the security guard.

They lack empathy and emotional intelligence and that's why they fit in better.

Anyone with a working brain who has been here for longer than 10 years can see that Thailand is not the country we fell in love with back then. I find it rather disturbing to see how greed, violence and ignorance are filling this once very chilled out nation more and more and by talking about these topics perhaps we can have more insight and then maybe do something about it. Has nothing to do with half full or half empty. Don't let them manipulate you into believing that you are negative, they don't know s-hit. Remember the 80's song by Bruce Hornsby? The way it is........ That's their life philosophy. They have convinced themselves that we can't change anything and things that we can't change should be left alone. Don't count on any of them for bettering the world, they simply don't care, only about themselves.

What a condesending, arrogant, xenophobic post. So Sigmund I guess every expat and immigrant in Thailand is in one of two categories....well let's have a look

Thoughtful and considerate- I used to be a police officer in my own community, I worked with the NAAFI in Afghanistan for 2 years serving the troops on an abysmal salary, I regularly carry out charity events and at work will take time to help where I can.

Philiosophical- no expert but I'd certainly consider myself middle-left in political issues and try to always step back and review before taking action (I read your nonsense post 5 times before I started to write this reply)

Concerned and emotional- too many incidents but one recent was taking a new born street cat with a dislocated shoulder (while I was on a night out with friends) to a 24 hr VET, paying 25,000thb to fix it up and have now taken it in...so I'd say that was pretty thoughful especially considering I'm allergic to their dander.

Now for camp 2

Lack empathy- see cat story above and I still cry like a little girl at the end of "The champ" when Jon Voight dies...hence the reason I never watch it with company.

Self conceited- you'll probably say this message is a little conceited, but I'm the first to point out my mistakes and take advice, while admittedly often the first to point out others mistakes and give advice.

Fun Loving- yeah, I'm laid back and look forward to the Friday night out with the boys as much as I did 10 years ago in the UK.

So which one am I DAVE?? I do at one time or another tick all your little self contained boxes.

I have my standpoint on this, I am one of the many who say "don't like it, then go back home" and the reason for me saying that is simple. Why come out here and stay if it's not to your liking? why would you leave your nation of birth to come to a nation in which all you see is "thainess", "corruption" or "backwards"?? The days of colonization and the crusades are over.....you either accept each nation and it's values for what they are or you don't, I mean it's not like we're living in Syria is it?- if you want to change a society so much then stay in your own "clearly not perfect" nation of birth and try to make that better. BUT NO, instead the whingers come to Thailand for the positives it offers all the while expecting Thialand to pander to what they liked from the nation they just CHOSE TO LEAVE.....it's the very definition of hypocrisy and arrogant beyond comprehension.

I was a cynic, miserable individual in the UK (My nation of birth), I hated my job, I hated the weather, I hated the fact two thirds of my salary went on tax/rent/bills, I hated the fact I was expected to work 46-50hrs a week despite being on a 39 hr contract just because I was a manager......so I did something about it....I left.

Thailand is far from perfect but we all CHOOSE to live here, why don't we all go back to our nations of birth and demand that those in power try the Bush and Blair administrations for an illegal invasion and genocide? why don't we all go back and demand bankers are held accountable when they lose money, why don't we all go back and demand that our home borders are better manned and that illegals are turned away like we would be here in Thailand, why don't we all go back and demand that politicians keep the promises that they made when campaigning, why don't we all go back and make our nations of birth the perfect level we expect in Thailand? You tell me DAVE, after all you have all the black and white views.

I guess you are the ex-cop with a large ego who likes to pat himself on the shoulder hence the self promotion part in the beginning about how great you are, lol

Great biography! A bit off topic but thanks for sharing that Lux. You answered most of your other questions already, so I will leave you to it.

[bim]

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I've got quite a simple explanation for this divide into 2 camps; non-whiners and whiners.

If you are a thoughtful, considerate, philosophical, concerned and emotional being you will have a hard time fitting in here.

However, if you are lacking empathy, are indifferent, self-conceited, fun loving and easy going you will fit in great.

Not saying that all Thailand lovers are sociopaths, not at all, but a lot of them are easy going, Leo drinking fun lovers.

Thailand doesn't attract too many expats (excl.expats who work in multinationals, government or NGO's) who think outside of the box because if you do you are stamped a whiner, trouble maker, depressed or bad sport by the fun lovers and that's exactly my point.

One of the reasons many farangs actually move here is to escape from being a responsible person back home, because Thailand is known for it's mai pen rai mentality.

Hence the comments if you don't like it here go back home. There is not much thoughtfulness or care for society by these ostriches. They just want to be left alone in their bubble with their glass half full and care about themselves. They automatically assume that if you complain about something Thai that you don't like it here. They can't think outside of their self-imposed box structure. I mean, who would want to complain when you can be sitting on the beach with a Leo and a nice female massaging your shoulders while you are talking bs with your mates? They can't imagine because their imagination doesn't go further than the basics of life sad to say.

They never get tired of that same old same old, year in, year out. That's something I can't get my head around. Perhaps they are easier satisfied and happy. Ignorance is bliss so they say.

They can't see the difference between caring and whining. Any criticism of society is seen as complaining. It's how they are wired. They just don't care and consider any intellectual thought as threatening to their existence in Utopia.

Bring up any interesting topic and they will try to ridicule you with dumbfounded comments.

Most of them are ego-maniacs who tap themselves on the shoulder all day long and love talking about themselves, how wonderful they are and how they have made it. If you haven't made it just as big as them or bigger you are a loser.

I've met 100's, if not 1000's of these expats over the years, from BKK to Samui to CM and Phuket. This is also how the rest of the world perceives expats living in Thailand. They see us as braindead, uncaring and useless barflies.

My advice to the farangs with half a brain who actually care about the world and other people; don't even try to convince these people and never argue with them! They are conservative in their thinking and doing and they know everything better. They are the same guys who say you should hang the mentally retarded Russian who killed the security guard.

They lack empathy and emotional intelligence and that's why they fit in better.

Anyone with a working brain who has been here for longer than 10 years can see that Thailand is not the country we fell in love with back then. I find it rather disturbing to see how greed, violence and ignorance are filling this once very chilled out nation more and more and by talking about these topics perhaps we can have more insight and then maybe do something about it. Has nothing to do with half full or half empty. Don't let them manipulate you into believing that you are negative, they don't know s-hit. Remember the 80's song by Bruce Hornsby? The way it is........ That's their life philosophy. They have convinced themselves that we can't change anything and things that we can't change should be left alone. Don't count on any of them for bettering the world, they simply don't care, only about themselves.

What a condesending, arrogant, xenophobic post. So Sigmund I guess every expat and immigrant in Thailand is in one of two categories....well let's have a look

Thoughtful and considerate- I used to be a police officer in my own community, I worked with the NAAFI in Afghanistan for 2 years serving the troops on an abysmal salary, I regularly carry out charity events and at work will take time to help where I can.

Philiosophical- no expert but I'd certainly consider myself middle-left in political issues and try to always step back and review before taking action (I read your nonsense post 5 times before I started to write this reply)

Concerned and emotional- too many incidents but one recent was taking a new born street cat with a dislocated shoulder (while I was on a night out with friends) to a 24 hr VET, paying 25,000thb to fix it up and have now taken it in...so I'd say that was pretty thoughful especially considering I'm allergic to their dander.

Now for camp 2

Lack empathy- see cat story above and I still cry like a little girl at the end of "The champ" when Jon Voight dies...hence the reason I never watch it with company.

Self conceited- you'll probably say this message is a little conceited, but I'm the first to point out my mistakes and take advice, while admittedly often the first to point out others mistakes and give advice.

Fun Loving- yeah, I'm laid back and look forward to the Friday night out with the boys as much as I did 10 years ago in the UK.

So which one am I DAVE?? I do at one time or another tick all your little self contained boxes.

I have my standpoint on this, I am one of the many who say "don't like it, then go back home" and the reason for me saying that is simple. Why come out here and stay if it's not to your liking? why would you leave your nation of birth to come to a nation in which all you see is "thainess", "corruption" or "backwards"?? The days of colonization and the crusades are over.....you either accept each nation and it's values for what they are or you don't, I mean it's not like we're living in Syria is it?- if you want to change a society so much then stay in your own "clearly not perfect" nation of birth and try to make that better. BUT NO, instead the whingers come to Thailand for the positives it offers all the while expecting Thialand to pander to what they liked from the nation they just CHOSE TO LEAVE.....it's the very definition of hypocrisy and arrogant beyond comprehension.

I was a cynic, miserable individual in the UK (My nation of birth), I hated my job, I hated the weather, I hated the fact two thirds of my salary went on tax/rent/bills, I hated the fact I was expected to work 46-50hrs a week despite being on a 39 hr contract just because I was a manager......so I did something about it....I left.

Thailand is far from perfect but we all CHOOSE to live here, why don't we all go back to our nations of birth and demand that those in power try the Bush and Blair administrations for an illegal invasion and genocide? why don't we all go back and demand bankers are held accountable when they lose money, why don't we all go back and demand that our home borders are better manned and that illegals are turned away like we would be here in Thailand, why don't we all go back and demand that politicians keep the promises that they made when campaigning, why don't we all go back and make our nations of birth the perfect level we expect in Thailand? You tell me DAVE, after all you have all the black and white views.

I guess you are the ex-cop with a large ego who likes to pat himself on the shoulder hence the self promotion part in the beginning about how great you are, lol

Great biography! A bit off topic but thanks for sharing that Lux. You answered most of your other questions already, so I will leave you to it.

Well I could guess you met some bargirl. You built her a house and she kicked you out keeping the house and sent you packing for being an a****le. So while we could all judge people we never meet putting them in little pigeon holes that only exsist in your mind most of us wont. Because we all came to this country for so many different reasons and some it will work out for and some have the good sense to go back home. So which are you Daveinasia? So many like myself love it here. So I wonder why you find that so difficult to accept. Maybe because your life aint so great and cant stand it when others find happiness. And that doesnt exsist because of where you live. It exsists in yourself. Thailand is not the west. I hated the UK. Thats why I made the move. So how about you?

[rayongchelsea]

^^ surely moving to another country should be because you like the place, have studied it culture, studied the language before you came etc.. to come because hated the uk doesn't really make you credible in asking someone else why they came...

[Luxfare]

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I've got quite a simple explanation for this divide into 2 camps; non-whiners and whiners.

If you are a thoughtful, considerate, philosophical, concerned and emotional being you will have a hard time fitting in here.

However, if you are lacking empathy, are indifferent, self-conceited, fun loving and easy going you will fit in great.

Not saying that all Thailand lovers are sociopaths, not at all, but a lot of them are easy going, Leo drinking fun lovers.

Thailand doesn't attract too many expats (excl.expats who work in multinationals, government or NGO's) who think outside of the box because if you do you are stamped a whiner, trouble maker, depressed or bad sport by the fun lovers and that's exactly my point.

One of the reasons many farangs actually move here is to escape from being a responsible person back home, because Thailand is known for it's mai pen rai mentality.

Hence the comments if you don't like it here go back home. There is not much thoughtfulness or care for society by these ostriches. They just want to be left alone in their bubble with their glass half full and care about themselves. They automatically assume that if you complain about something Thai that you don't like it here. They can't think outside of their self-imposed box structure. I mean, who would want to complain when you can be sitting on the beach with a Leo and a nice female massaging your shoulders while you are talking bs with your mates? They can't imagine because their imagination doesn't go further than the basics of life sad to say.

They never get tired of that same old same old, year in, year out. That's something I can't get my head around. Perhaps they are easier satisfied and happy. Ignorance is bliss so they say.

They can't see the difference between caring and whining. Any criticism of society is seen as complaining. It's how they are wired. They just don't care and consider any intellectual thought as threatening to their existence in Utopia.

Bring up any interesting topic and they will try to ridicule you with dumbfounded comments.

Most of them are ego-maniacs who tap themselves on the shoulder all day long and love talking about themselves, how wonderful they are and how they have made it. If you haven't made it just as big as them or bigger you are a loser.

I've met 100's, if not 1000's of these expats over the years, from BKK to Samui to CM and Phuket. This is also how the rest of the world perceives expats living in Thailand. They see us as braindead, uncaring and useless barflies.

My advice to the farangs with half a brain who actually care about the world and other people; don't even try to convince these people and never argue with them! They are conservative in their thinking and doing and they know everything better. They are the same guys who say you should hang the mentally retarded Russian who killed the security guard.

They lack empathy and emotional intelligence and that's why they fit in better.

Anyone with a working brain who has been here for longer than 10 years can see that Thailand is not the country we fell in love with back then. I find it rather disturbing to see how greed, violence and ignorance are filling this once very chilled out nation more and more and by talking about these topics perhaps we can have more insight and then maybe do something about it. Has nothing to do with half full or half empty. Don't let them manipulate you into believing that you are negative, they don't know s-hit. Remember the 80's song by Bruce Hornsby? The way it is........ That's their life philosophy. They have convinced themselves that we can't change anything and things that we can't change should be left alone. Don't count on any of them for bettering the world, they simply don't care, only about themselves.

What a condesending, arrogant, xenophobic post. So Sigmund I guess every expat and immigrant in Thailand is in one of two categories....well let's have a look

Thoughtful and considerate- I used to be a police officer in my own community, I worked with the NAAFI in Afghanistan for 2 years serving the troops on an abysmal salary, I regularly carry out charity events and at work will take time to help where I can.

Philiosophical- no expert but I'd certainly consider myself middle-left in political issues and try to always step back and review before taking action (I read your nonsense post 5 times before I started to write this reply)

Concerned and emotional- too many incidents but one recent was taking a new born street cat with a dislocated shoulder (while I was on a night out with friends) to a 24 hr VET, paying 25,000thb to fix it up and have now taken it in...so I'd say that was pretty thoughful especially considering I'm allergic to their dander.

Now for camp 2

Lack empathy- see cat story above and I still cry like a little girl at the end of "The champ" when Jon Voight dies...hence the reason I never watch it with company.

Self conceited- you'll probably say this message is a little conceited, but I'm the first to point out my mistakes and take advice, while admittedly often the first to point out others mistakes and give advice.

Fun Loving- yeah, I'm laid back and look forward to the Friday night out with the boys as much as I did 10 years ago in the UK.

So which one am I DAVE?? I do at one time or another tick all your little self contained boxes.

I have my standpoint on this, I am one of the many who say "don't like it, then go back home" and the reason for me saying that is simple. Why come out here and stay if it's not to your liking? why would you leave your nation of birth to come to a nation in which all you see is "thainess", "corruption" or "backwards"?? The days of colonization and the crusades are over.....you either accept each nation and it's values for what they are or you don't, I mean it's not like we're living in Syria is it?- if you want to change a society so much then stay in your own "clearly not perfect" nation of birth and try to make that better. BUT NO, instead the whingers come to Thailand for the positives it offers all the while expecting Thialand to pander to what they liked from the nation they just CHOSE TO LEAVE.....it's the very definition of hypocrisy and arrogant beyond comprehension.

I was a cynic, miserable individual in the UK (My nation of birth), I hated my job, I hated the weather, I hated the fact two thirds of my salary went on tax/rent/bills, I hated the fact I was expected to work 46-50hrs a week despite being on a 39 hr contract just because I was a manager......so I did something about it....I left.

Thailand is far from perfect but we all CHOOSE to live here, why don't we all go back to our nations of birth and demand that those in power try the Bush and Blair administrations for an illegal invasion and genocide? why don't we all go back and demand bankers are held accountable when they lose money, why don't we all go back and demand that our home borders are better manned and that illegals are turned away like we would be here in Thailand, why don't we all go back and demand that politicians keep the promises that they made when campaigning, why don't we all go back and make our nations of birth the perfect level we expect in Thailand? You tell me DAVE, after all you have all the black and white views.

I guess you are the ex-cop with a large ego who likes to pat himself on the shoulder hence the self promotion part in the beginning about how great you are, lol

Great biography! A bit off topic but thanks for sharing that Lux. You answered most of your other questions already, so I will leave you to it.

I wasn't giving myself a pat on the back I was merely proving your one or the other classification wrong. As for saying I have a large ego...I wasn't the poster giving a faux sociology class to everyone.

I assume the reason you won't answer my question about why not stay in your own nation is because you don't have an answer?

[1BADDAT]

A lot of the ranters love to attack "the Thai Chinese" and/or "hi-so" and attribute their wealth to being corrupt scammers, etc.

Yet these same ranters have been scammed by their in-laws from Isaan, etc. who are not the "hi-so" Thai Chinese.

Not just ranters but envious ranters, if you ask me...

Not only that but their skins were so white that whitening creams actually made them darker.

That's is one of the funniest things I've seen someone write one here.

[BB24]

What a great post ! I have hit a record high for my ignore list and it keeps on climbing - this Post just keeps on giving.

[1BADDAT]

For me thailand fills my glass overflowing most of the time and sometimes the glass is completely empty. It's a roller coaster ride that many have trouble coping with.

People that claim thailand is a utopia and spend so much time defending it are not realists. Everyplace has positive and negative aspects. It's easy to point out the positive or negative aspects depending one ones state of mind at a given moment.

Right now I'm in Bali and I can't wait to be back home to thailand.

[KarenBravo]

What a great post ! I have hit a record high for my ignore list and it keeps on climbing - this Post just keeps on giving.

Having an ignore list only proves that you are easily bruised and a bit of a pussy.

[KarenBravo]

..........or, you don't know how to use a Scroll Bar.

[Plutojames88]

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

[Luxfare]

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Complaining about poor service is totally acceptable.....however read most of the negative posts. Those posts are not describing a certain incident or moment of bad service, they're often generalizing, prejudiced or sarcastic.....that's not complaining...that's Thai bashing and there's a big difference.

[bim]

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Your of course correct. Any scams can happen anywhere in the world. I was the victim of many in the UK. And all consumer protection laws they have couldnt protect my mother and father being scamed by builders and insurance companies alike back in the UK. But complaining about an injustice is different to the constant Thai bashing we hear from some who have nothing positive to say about Thailand. Then when they have been ripped off then painting all Thais and there culture the same. Ill give you an example. One of our puppies was recently attacked by another dog. 6am in the morning we banged on the vets door. We woke him and he attended to her for the next hour or so but she died. I offered him 2000 bhts. He refused saying he knows we do good things for dogs. As much as I tried he refused the money. Later that week we offered to buy an oxygen tank, he refused, then a new operating table. He said give the money to the lady down the street who goes out everyday with food to feed the street dogs. Are all people like this? Of course not. But neither are they all selfish nor think about money as some have suggested on here. These types of moaning expats are like this which ever country they live in. Nothing to do with Thailand. The best of this story is our vets we know is not a rich guy. Nor is the electrician who came to our home for three hours to repair our garden fountain and securty lights and would not accept any money. All part of the service he said. I would do the same for Thais. We later found out he has cancer and cannot afford the treatment. Live your life in honesty and truth sprinkled with a little love and its amazing how your life transforms. This is not burying my head in the sand as some have suggested on here. This is my experience of Thailand. Does my neighbour piss me off when she burns plastic. Of course. Selfish. But by no means are all Thais like this. Someone complained to the Police she got a visit and told not to do it again or she gets 1000 bht fine. And shes stopped. So there you go. I love it here and compared to the UK? No contest.

[DaveinAsia]

@Luxfare and Bim; I'm actually happily married to a middle class 'normal' Thai woman(don't go near bar girls) and we have a wonderful little boy, so you are both wrong with your assumptions, 555.

I wasn't putting every single expat/immigrant/retiree in TH in one of the 2 boxes, it proves the lack of intelligence on your side for not reading in between the lines.

I was giving a 16 year long observation to why some farangs love it here and others don't. Very plain and simple.

I can imagine this got up some people's noses(incl you two) if you were in the losing category

The two of you asked why I am still here and why don't I bugger off home (the typical statement the farangs who don't want to be confronted with reality give the farangs who 'whine' too much and wake them up out of their dream)

First of all; I like it here, can you understand that? I like it here, just like I liked living in India, S- Korea, South Africa, NL's, Taiwan, Oz among others, but my eyes are wide open mate. Do you understand that?

Someone can be happy, like it somewhere but still be wide awake and see what's going on. We call it consciousness and that usually goes together with a healthy dose of emotional intelligence.

Secondly; I am highly qualified so I don't have to go back to my 'beloved' UK, I can work anywhere. I find it funny how you don't mind belittling your home country which has an impressive history and very long record of achievements but on the other hand adore a nation that has never done anything for you at all besides from sucking the money out of your pocket. In some places we call that treason. If you hate Britain so much why don't you give up your citizenship and apply for Thai citizenship, 555, yeah, the Thais love us so much we can't even become one of them. How many Thai's hold a British passport? Right. Discussion closed.

[micmichd]

For me it's oK to hate my native country and love Thailand.

For sure I'm treated better here than in Germany, couldn't be treated worse in fact.

What country is this where neighbours call police and denunciate you for terrorism - just because they don't like your music?

What country is this where people call you a lunatic dreamer just because you have a Thai gf?

It is my right to hate a country like that.

[DaveinAsia]

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Your of course correct. Any scams can happen anywhere in the world. I was the victim of many in the UK. And all consumer protection laws they have couldnt protect my mother and father being scamed by builders and insurance companies alike back in the UK. But complaining about an injustice is different to the constant Thai bashing we hear from some who have nothing positive to say about Thailand. Then when they have been ripped off then painting all Thais and there culture the same. Ill give you an example. One of our puppies was recently attacked by another dog. 6am in the morning we banged on the vets door. We woke him and he attended to her for the next hour or so but she died. I offered him 2000 bhts. He refused saying he knows we do good things for dogs. As much as I tried he refused the money. Later that week we offered to buy an oxygen tank, he refused, then a new operating table. He said give the money to the lady down the street who goes out everyday with food to feed the street dogs. Are all people like this? Of course not. But neither are they all selfish nor think about money as some have suggested on here. These types of moaning expats are like this which ever country they live in. Nothing to do with Thailand. The best of this story is our vets we know is not a rich guy. Nor is the electrician who came to our home for three hours to repair our garden fountain and securty lights and would not accept any money. All part of the service he said. I would do the same for Thais. We later found out he has cancer and cannot afford the treatment. Live your life in honesty and truth sprinkled with a little love and its amazing how your life transforms. This is not burying my head in the sand as some have suggested on here. This is my experience of Thailand. Does my neighbour piss me off when she burns plastic. Of course. Selfish. But by no means are all Thais like this. Someone complained to the Police she got a visit and told not to do it again or she gets 1000 bht fine. And shes stopped. So there you go. I love it here and compared to the UK? No contest.

Sorry Bim mate, but your stories brought a few tears to my eyes. Very moving stories, thx, but they are far and in between. Not enough to convince the 'whiners' I'm afraid. Have you got any more heartwarming stories like this? Perhaps it's even worth contacting TAT with your stories, make it into a video to attract more tourists. That's no joke btw. Or the insurance companies. They love this stuff. The one with the noodle shop/cancer had me shattered.

Perhaps where we live in TH has a large influence on how some people perceive the place. From reading your story it seems you live in the countryside or maybe one of the islands. Thais are different there. If one lives in BKK or CM it's very different mate. A lot of ugliness combined with greed and violence. Perhaps the real 'haters'(I don't consider myself one of them, I just like to wind people up) should move down to Phangan or other places in TH where life is a lot slower and perhaps more kind.

[micmichd]

What country where they treat you like a madman because you resist US invasion to Vietnam?

What country where they are still after you when you've already escaped to Thailand long ago?

What country where the only freedom of choice you have is obedience to authority?

What country where you get expropriated and ripped off if you want to marry in Thailand?

A: Germany (EU)

[micmichd]

What country where the ultimate goal of medicine is to squeeze money out of their patients?

Where they try to force you into needless surgery just to make money out of you?

Where doctors can lock you up because you were in Thailand and might have tropical diseases?

Where doctors even define that it is your "free will" to get locked up so they can even make more money out of you?

Where you're treated as a criminal and a public menace if you say "No" to authorities?

I've lost my last illusion about "Free Europe" and its lovely institutions.

Certainly not everything in Thailand is 100 pct perfect, but the direction in which it is heading is worth a trial.

That's why I'm here.

[Luxfare]

DAVEASIA-

Where to start, I can only assume you're a troll as there are so many holes in your story and reasoning I cannot believe anyone is that intellectually challenged and as hypocritical.

1/ You were putting everyone into 2 categories...you know the sentence where you wrote " I've got quite a simple explaination for this divide into 2 camps, non-whiners and whiners" THOSE ARE YOUR WORDS. If you meant to put more detail in then you should have, you cannot blame people for not "reading between the lines" just because your literacy skills are poor.

2/ You meantion emotional intelligence......10 lines after insulting us with our "lack of intelligence" because we challenged you...do you require me to explain hypocrisy and irony to you? or can you look those definitions up yourself?

3/ The definitions of treason you say....that's your best yet. The definition of treason has nothing to do with criticism of a home nation being imperfect, if you think it does then I'll add wannabe international lawyer to wannabe Sociologist and wannabe psychologist which I have you pegged as.

4/ Belittling my home country despite it's long list of achievements you say...would those be the slave trade? the colonization and genocide or the recent illegal invasion of Iraq?

5/ What has Thailand done for me? erm, it's given me employment as a senior manager in one of it's biggest companies....so yes it does empty my pockets (It's called living expenses) but it fills them up first, I'd say that's something.

6/ And I'm currently learning Thai both written and language and when I've completed that I will be able to apply for citizenship, it may take a few years but I'm patient......maybe if you had more intelligence you could apply but hey ho...it's not for everyone.

Honestly, proving you wrong is like shooting fish in a barrel.

[Luxfare]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?


And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?
Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?
Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .
And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .
He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .
Cars crashing into ours and not paying.
Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .
One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.
Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?
For police to eventually act ?
For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .
Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Your of course correct. Any scams can happen anywhere in the world. I was the victim of many in the UK. And all consumer protection laws they have couldnt protect my mother and father being scamed by builders and insurance companies alike back in the UK. But complaining about an injustice is different to the constant Thai bashing we hear from some who have nothing positive to say about Thailand. Then when they have been ripped off then painting all Thais and there culture the same. Ill give you an example. One of our puppies was recently attacked by another dog. 6am in the morning we banged on the vets door. We woke him and he attended to her for the next hour or so but she died. I offered him 2000 bhts. He refused saying he knows we do good things for dogs. As much as I tried he refused the money. Later that week we offered to buy an oxygen tank, he refused, then a new operating table. He said give the money to the lady down the street who goes out everyday with food to feed the street dogs. Are all people like this? Of course not. But neither are they all selfish nor think about money as some have suggested on here. These types of moaning expats are like this which ever country they live in. Nothing to do with Thailand. The best of this story is our vets we know is not a rich guy. Nor is the electrician who came to our home for three hours to repair our garden fountain and securty lights and would not accept any money. All part of the service he said. I would do the same for Thais. We later found out he has cancer and cannot afford the treatment. Live your life in honesty and truth sprinkled with a little love and its amazing how your life transforms. This is not burying my head in the sand as some have suggested on here. This is my experience of Thailand. Does my neighbour piss me off when she burns plastic. Of course. Selfish. But by no means are all Thais like this. Someone complained to the Police she got a visit and told not to do it again or she gets 1000 bht fine. And shes stopped. So there you go. I love it here and compared to the UK? No contest.

Sorry Bim mate, but your stories brought a few tears to my eyes. Very moving stories, thx, but they are far and in between. Not enough to convince the 'whiners' I'm afraid. Have you got any more heartwarming stories like this? Perhaps it's even worth contacting TAT with your stories, make it into a video to attract more tourists. That's no joke btw. Or the insurance companies. They love this stuff. The one with the noodle shop/cancer had me shattered.

Perhaps where we live in TH has a large influence on how some people perceive the place. From reading your story it seems you live in the countryside or maybe one of the islands. Thais are different there. If one lives in BKK or CM it's very different mate. A lot of ugliness combined with greed and violence. Perhaps the real 'haters'(I don't consider myself one of them, I just like to wind people up) should move down to Phangan or other places in TH where life is a lot slower and perhaps more kind.

Bangkok is not anymore violent or greedy than any major city on Earth, if you think it is then you probably live in the slum areas- try Thong lo it's better. As for saying you enjoy winding people up.....face to face? or just over the NET which is far easier?

[BB24]

Complaining about poor service is totally acceptable.....however read most of the negative posts. Those posts are not describing a certain incident or moment of bad service, they're often generalizing, prejudiced or sarcastic.....that's not complaining...that's Thai bashing and there's a big difference.

That just about sums up my views too - well said - there IS a difference between complaining about something and prejudiced whinging at every opportunity.

Yep and 90% of these moaners are on here daily Thai bashing and bashing those who love it here. Moving to Thailand is the best move I ever made with the most wonderful people and great weather and my glass is full to the brim everyday. I feel sorry for those maybe who didnt work out for but hey you always have a home country to go back to. And leave the rest of us to enjoy our adopted country.

And that is very good summary of why some people like it here and some dont - and what those who dont can do (up to you).

Personally, I find the 'head in the sand' brigade more annoying than the whiners. There is nothing wrong in seeing a place for what it is, to walk around with blinkers on makes people appear none too clever and somewhat in denial. The author of the article sounds like a bitter person himself, and etiquette is a word usually associated with politeness, so completely misused in the context that he chose for it.

Like this one - there are many TC members who have said things that I do not agree with - but they are not on my 'ignore' list.

The ones on my list and that I am not interested in 'listening' to, are the prejudiced sarcastic and stupid people (IMO) who jump into the Thais and Thailand at every opportunity.

Especially those who have actually left Thailand and are still on TV pushing their ignorant and prejudiced views - what the.... ???

And that is what the ignore app in TV is for - so members can choose not to listen to ignorant prejudiced stupid people (ITO).

Add me to yours by all means - see my earlier post on how - I wont get offended or whinge like a pussy about it

[DaveinAsia]

DAVEASIA-

Where to start, I can only assume you're a troll as there are so many holes in your story and reasoning I cannot believe anyone is that intellectually challenged and as hypocritical.

1/ You were putting everyone into 2 categories...you know the sentence where you wrote " I've got quite a simple explaination for this divide into 2 camps, non-whiners and whiners" THOSE ARE YOUR WORDS. If you meant to put more detail in then you should have, you cannot blame people for not "reading between the lines" just because your literacy skills are poor.

2/ You meantion emotional intelligence......10 lines after insulting us with our "lack of intelligence" because we challenged you...do you require me to explain hypocrisy and irony to you? or can you look those definitions up yourself?

3/ The definitions of treason you say....that's your best yet. The definition of treason has nothing to do with criticism of a home nation being imperfect, if you think it does then I'll add wannabe international lawyer to wannabe Sociologist and wannabe psychologist which I have you pegged as.

4/ Belittling my home country despite it's long list of achievements you say...would those be the slave trade? the colonization and genocide or the recent illegal invasion of Iraq?

5/ What has Thailand done for me? erm, it's given me employment as a senior manager in one of it's biggest companies....so yes it does empty my pockets (It's called living expenses) but it fills them up first, I'd say that's something.

6/ And I'm currently learning Thai both written and language and when I've completed that I will be able to apply for citizenship, it may take a few years but I'm patient......maybe if you had more intelligence you could apply but hey ho...it's not for everyone.

Honestly, proving you wrong is like shooting fish in a barrel.

555, couldn't help promoting yourself again in 5 and 6. Please explain to the readers of this very off topic reply how you proved me wrong. My literacy skills are poor? Lol. Says the ex-copper who made a tonne of mistakes in every reply so far(yet he says he is a senior manager these days)

Let me promote myself for a wee bit here, sure to trigger another reply from you, he who has too much time on his hands these days and trolls TVF looking for other posters to attack. I do have a degree in Law besides a PhD in Science and Philosophy, not in Sociology, but did a course in Psychology back in the day. I have worked all over the world and love living in Thailand. Even have a half Thai son. Sorry I don't fit your profile Lux. Obviously you find it so hard to understand how someone can love it somewhere and still complain about it. Oh yeah, that was the topic of this wonderful thread; expats who complain should bugger off. Good luck with your Thai citizenship!! You fit in well Lux

And yes, I like winding people up face to face too, especially in TH, where it's so easy, ex-coppers love to take the bait, 555

[DaveinAsia]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Your of course correct. Any scams can happen anywhere in the world. I was the victim of many in the UK. And all consumer protection laws they have couldnt protect my mother and father being scamed by builders and insurance companies alike back in the UK. But complaining about an injustice is different to the constant Thai bashing we hear from some who have nothing positive to say about Thailand. Then when they have been ripped off then painting all Thais and there culture the same. Ill give you an example. One of our puppies was recently attacked by another dog. 6am in the morning we banged on the vets door. We woke him and he attended to her for the next hour or so but she died. I offered him 2000 bhts. He refused saying he knows we do good things for dogs. As much as I tried he refused the money. Later that week we offered to buy an oxygen tank, he refused, then a new operating table. He said give the money to the lady down the street who goes out everyday with food to feed the street dogs. Are all people like this? Of course not. But neither are they all selfish nor think about money as some have suggested on here. These types of moaning expats are like this which ever country they live in. Nothing to do with Thailand. The best of this story is our vets we know is not a rich guy. Nor is the electrician who came to our home for three hours to repair our garden fountain and securty lights and would not accept any money. All part of the service he said. I would do the same for Thais. We later found out he has cancer and cannot afford the treatment. Live your life in honesty and truth sprinkled with a little love and its amazing how your life transforms. This is not burying my head in the sand as some have suggested on here. This is my experience of Thailand. Does my neighbour piss me off when she burns plastic. Of course. Selfish. But by no means are all Thais like this. Someone complained to the Police she got a visit and told not to do it again or she gets 1000 bht fine. And shes stopped. So there you go. I love it here and compared to the UK? No contest.

Sorry Bim mate, but your stories brought a few tears to my eyes. Very moving stories, thx, but they are far and in between. Not enough to convince the 'whiners' I'm afraid. Have you got any more heartwarming stories like this? Perhaps it's even worth contacting TAT with your stories, make it into a video to attract more tourists. That's no joke btw. Or the insurance companies. They love this stuff. The one with the noodle shop/cancer had me shattered.

Perhaps where we live in TH has a large influence on how some people perceive the place. From reading your story it seems you live in the countryside or maybe one of the islands. Thais are different there. If one lives in BKK or CM it's very different mate. A lot of ugliness combined with greed and violence. Perhaps the real 'haters'(I don't consider myself one of them, I just like to wind people up) should move down to Phangan or other places in TH where life is a lot slower and perhaps more kind.

Bangkok is not anymore violent or greedy than any major city on Earth, if you think it is then you probably live in the slum areas- try Thong lo it's better. As for saying you enjoy winding people up.....face to face? or just over the NET which is far easier?

There is Luxfare again with another great statement. Oh, really mate? Didn't know that. I've only been living here for 17 years. All over this city, not just in farang areas, in about 12 different locations. I'd say I'm a little more skilled than you Luxfare to judge how violent BKK is. .....btw; is that a challenge or threat? the face to face question?

[Luxfare]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I seem to see" curious conflicts " within a narrow definition of what constructive criticism and non constructive criticism may even look like.?

And regards the expat are we to judge?

Should the Expat have or be free to have opinions and complaint?

Without being questioned about his or hers attitude or need to have it adjusted?

Sounds more like Orwellian double speak to say we shouldn't complain.

I had a guy from England complain his hotels bed sheets made his wife sick .

And to top it off the hotel over charge him for a room service laundry and loose two items .

Sure it sounds like a whining Pom , but consider the fact his wife spent two days in Hospital and the cause was determined to be an agent used to kill bed bugs . Toxic sheets .

He had a different single bed ...and was fine.

Then the other trivial complaint well could happen anywhere.

Or the New Zealand guy who said Police didn't do anything when he complained about a karaoke place in Chiang Mai charging him 43,000 baht for 3 hours singing with two ladies and drinks......and they had also beaten him until he handed over the credit card to pay.

Is he being wrong?

Of course you see both examples are of travellers not like us Expats ....

We are maybe more learned and so it goes ""in the know"" therefore meant to hush up anti Thai stories like above.

Or worse complain about builders or kitchen renovators ripping us off .

Cars crashing into ours and not paying.

Bad food poisoning from a restaurant ?

Etc

Well I don't think so ....could happen anywhere in world but complaining is a process and often a justifiable response that serves a few purposes .

One it warns others of a particular tradesman or eatery , or service industry.

Helps relieve the frustration of bottling it up.

No one expects things to change , but it's silly to say to someone "go home if you don't like it."

Why ?

It happens there too.

Maybe it's a mechanism to also make the hotel or person at fault try and improve or change.?

For police to eventually act ?

For other westerners to learn to steer clear of scams.

I mean we all have heard about scams that are entrenched in Places .

Pattaya jet ski operations come fast to mind ...

Is it so unjust to hear an expat warn a group of newbies about the possibility the port side of the ski may already have damage before they leave shore and that when they return they will be accused?

What kind of Expats do Thais want?

Quality mutes ?

Your of course correct. Any scams can happen anywhere in the world. I was the victim of many in the UK. And all consumer protection laws they have couldnt protect my mother and father being scamed by builders and insurance companies alike back in the UK. But complaining about an injustice is different to the constant Thai bashing we hear from some who have nothing positive to say about Thailand. Then when they have been ripped off then painting all Thais and there culture the same. Ill give you an example. One of our puppies was recently attacked by another dog. 6am in the morning we banged on the vets door. We woke him and he attended to her for the next hour or so but she died. I offered him 2000 bhts. He refused saying he knows we do good things for dogs. As much as I tried he refused the money. Later that week we offered to buy an oxygen tank, he refused, then a new operating table. He said give the money to the lady down the street who goes out everyday with food to feed the street dogs. Are all people like this? Of course not. But neither are they all selfish nor think about money as some have suggested on here. These types of moaning expats are like this which ever country they live in. Nothing to do with Thailand. The best of this story is our vets we know is not a rich guy. Nor is the electrician who came to our home for three hours to repair our garden fountain and securty lights and would not accept any money. All part of the service he said. I would do the same for Thais. We later found out he has cancer and cannot afford the treatment. Live your life in honesty and truth sprinkled with a little love and its amazing how your life transforms. This is not burying my head in the sand as some have suggested on here. This is my experience of Thailand. Does my neighbour piss me off when she burns plastic. Of course. Selfish. But by no means are all Thais like this. Someone complained to the Police she got a visit and told not to do it again or she gets 1000 bht fine. And shes stopped. So there you go. I love it here and compared to the UK? No contest.

Sorry Bim mate, but your stories brought a few tears to my eyes. Very moving stories, thx, but they are far and in between. Not enough to convince the 'whiners' I'm afraid. Have you got any more heartwarming stories like this? Perhaps it's even worth contacting TAT with your stories, make it into a video to attract more tourists. That's no joke btw. Or the insurance companies. They love this stuff. The one with the noodle shop/cancer had me shattered.

Perhaps where we live in TH has a large influence on how some people perceive the place. From reading your story it seems you live in the countryside or maybe one of the islands. Thais are different there. If one lives in BKK or CM it's very different mate. A lot of ugliness combined with greed and violence. Perhaps the real 'haters'(I don't consider myself one of them, I just like to wind people up) should move down to Phangan or other places in TH where life is a lot slower and perhaps more kind.

Bangkok is not anymore violent or greedy than any major city on Earth, if you think it is then you probably live in the slum areas- try Thong lo it's better. As for saying you enjoy winding people up.....face to face? or just over the NET which is far easier?

There is Luxfare again with another great statement. Oh, really mate? Didn't know that. I've only been living here for 17 years. All over this city, not just in farang areas, in about 12 different locations. I'd say I'm a little more skilled than you Luxfare to judge how violent BKK is. .....btw; is that a challenge or threat? the face to face question?

It's funny, you've lived in about 7 different countries, and in BKK over a 16 year period you've moved 12 times. Anyone would think you often outstay your welcome. Reading your posts I can well believe you being regularly moved on when you patronize the locals.

At which point did I make a threat or challenge? Reading between the lines for something that isn't there, haha and you claim to have a PhD....don't make me laugh.

[Luxfare]

DAVEASIA-

Where to start, I can only assume you're a troll as there are so many holes in your story and reasoning I cannot believe anyone is that intellectually challenged and as hypocritical.

1/ You were putting everyone into 2 categories...you know the sentence where you wrote " I've got quite a simple explaination for this divide into 2 camps, non-whiners and whiners" THOSE ARE YOUR WORDS. If you meant to put more detail in then you should have, you cannot blame people for not "reading between the lines" just because your literacy skills are poor.

2/ You meantion emotional intelligence......10 lines after insulting us with our "lack of intelligence" because we challenged you...do you require me to explain hypocrisy and irony to you? or can you look those definitions up yourself?

3/ The definitions of treason you say....that's your best yet. The definition of treason has nothing to do with criticism of a home nation being imperfect, if you think it does then I'll add wannabe international lawyer to wannabe Sociologist and wannabe psychologist which I have you pegged as.

4/ Belittling my home country despite it's long list of achievements you say...would those be the slave trade? the colonization and genocide or the recent illegal invasion of Iraq?

5/ What has Thailand done for me? erm, it's given me employment as a senior manager in one of it's biggest companies....so yes it does empty my pockets (It's called living expenses) but it fills them up first, I'd say that's something.

6/ And I'm currently learning Thai both written and language and when I've completed that I will be able to apply for citizenship, it may take a few years but I'm patient......maybe if you had more intelligence you could apply but hey ho...it's not for everyone.

Honestly, proving you wrong is like shooting fish in a barrel.

555, couldn't help promoting yourself again in 5 and 6. Please explain to the readers of this very off topic reply how you proved me wrong. My literacy skills are poor? Lol. Says the ex-copper who made a tonne of mistakes in every reply so far(yet he says he is a senior manager these days)

Let me promote myself for a wee bit here, sure to trigger another reply from you, he who has too much time on his hands these days and trolls TVF looking for other posters to attack. I do have a degree in Law besides a PhD in Science and Philosophy, not in Sociology, but did a course in Psychology back in the day. I have worked all over the world and love living in Thailand. Even have a half Thai son. Sorry I don't fit your profile Lux. Obviously you find it so hard to understand how someone can love it somewhere and still complain about it. Oh yeah, that was the topic of this wonderful thread; expats who complain should bugger off. Good luck with your Thai citizenship!! You fit in well Lux

And yes, I like winding people up face to face too, especially in TH, where it's so easy, ex-coppers love to take the bait, 555

You've more tall tales than Enid Blyton. You want to meet face to face then I'm game. Just don't go crying to mother when it turns pear shaped for you.

[bim]

Im not surprised the bait has been taken and gone a little off topic. Farrangs hey. Never had that from a Thai. Yet thank you Daveinasia for being honest in that he enjoys winding people up. Not many on here would admit to it. Action reaction and all that. I dont think anyone suggested we cant complain about things here. God knows things still wind me up a little but thats the difference in culture and nothing else. Dave your right I do maybe live a little sheltered life here. I went to Pattaya once and hated it. BKK I maybe do for shopping once in a while and the only violence I witnessed involved Farrangs. I hate the big city. I hated London for the same reason. But come on guys show a little love and respect and at least stick to the topic.

[DaveinAsia]

DAVEASIA-

Where to start, I can only assume you're a troll as there are so many holes in your story and reasoning I cannot believe anyone is that intellectually challenged and as hypocritical.

1/ You were putting everyone into 2 categories...you know the sentence where you wrote " I've got quite a simple explaination for this divide into 2 camps, non-whiners and whiners" THOSE ARE YOUR WORDS. If you meant to put more detail in then you should have, you cannot blame people for not "reading between the lines" just because your literacy skills are poor.

2/ You meantion emotional intelligence......10 lines after insulting us with our "lack of intelligence" because we challenged you...do you require me to explain hypocrisy and irony to you? or can you look those definitions up yourself?

3/ The definitions of treason you say....that's your best yet. The definition of treason has nothing to do with criticism of a home nation being imperfect, if you think it does then I'll add wannabe international lawyer to wannabe Sociologist and wannabe psychologist which I have you pegged as.

4/ Belittling my home country despite it's long list of achievements you say...would those be the slave trade? the colonization and genocide or the recent illegal invasion of Iraq?

5/ What has Thailand done for me? erm, it's given me employment as a senior manager in one of it's biggest companies....so yes it does empty my pockets (It's called living expenses) but it fills them up first, I'd say that's something.

6/ And I'm currently learning Thai both written and language and when I've completed that I will be able to apply for citizenship, it may take a few years but I'm patient......maybe if you had more intelligence you could apply but hey ho...it's not for everyone.

Honestly, proving you wrong is like shooting fish in a barrel.

555, couldn't help promoting yourself again in 5 and 6. Please explain to the readers of this very off topic reply how you proved me wrong. My literacy skills are poor? Lol. Says the ex-copper who made a tonne of mistakes in every reply so far(yet he says he is a senior manager these days)

Let me promote myself for a wee bit here, sure to trigger another reply from you, he who has too much time on his hands these days and trolls TVF looking for other posters to attack. I do have a degree in Law besides a PhD in Science and Philosophy, not in Sociology, but did a course in Psychology back in the day. I have worked all over the world and love living in Thailand. Even have a half Thai son. Sorry I don't fit your profile Lux. Obviously you find it so hard to understand how someone can love it somewhere and still complain about it. Oh yeah, that was the topic of this wonderful thread; expats who complain should bugger off. Good luck with your Thai citizenship!! You fit in well Lux

And yes, I like winding people up face to face too, especially in TH, where it's so easy, ex-coppers love to take the bait, 555

You've more tall tales than Enid Blyton. You want to meet face to face then I'm game. Just don't go crying to mother when it turns pear shaped for you.

There's the threat again. Did i get to you Luxfare? Lol. I'm sure you are not a full shilling mate and you spend most of your day scanning TV for people to annoy. Who else would threaten people they don't know anything about in a public forum and then challenge them to a face to face meeting? 555. Nobody in their right mind would do that, only a halfwit who is bluffing. Haven't seen your PM in my inbox yet.

Obviously we don't see eye to eye Luxfare, but still you can't accept that someone is different than you. Why do you feel so superior? You try to spin my words to suit your own agenda and make assumptions about stuff you don't have a clue about and when I don't bite you start to threaten me and challenge me for a face to face meeting. I thought coppers are always supposed to keep their calm and be a good example to everyone. I doubt your story even more now. For all you know I am a computer genius and I have your IP address now and your location. You should be really careful with making threats to people in public places. Where I am from that's a deadly sin. I recommend you to drop this challenge/argument if you know what's good for you. I'm pretty sure the other TV members are becoming very bored with your quest mate.

Just to answer your question about moving around so much because to you that sounds pretty strange doesn't it. Some people like to travel mate. Others like to stay in 1 place all their life. Simple. Nothing to do with locals chasing me down the road. I like that story though, might spin it into another short story, cheers