Historic Iran nuclear deal reached

[mikebike]

The Iranian nuclear bogey-man... he's about 35 years old now - born from the womb of the USA's brilliant "Atoms for Peace" policy pushing the nascent power technology on their friend the Shaw. Oops - here comes 1979 and the Ayatollah...

Someone in the GOP has to decide if they they are fighting ISIS or Iran - Sunni's or Shia's... or, as it seems, any middle-eastern nation besides Israel and Saudi Arabia. With seeming no knowledge of the historical geo-politics their pundits really sound like idiots.

Now is the perfect time for the USA to extract themselves from the region entirely and let the Sunni's and Shia's sort out their own shizzle. USA is in a no win situation and no matter whom they support it will breed more hatred and therefore terrorism against themselves. Pull out. Use the saved trillions to enact a policy of strict containment of the region, developing energy self-sufficiency (multiple economic benefits), restoring the countries failing infrastructure, bringing education standards up to world levels, and solving the countries water issues.

Ahhh... but that will never happen until they realize that 'Merica would be just as safe, and well protected from the other evils in the world even if they slashed their military/defence budgets in half and spent the savings on policies geared towards nation-building.

[Steely Dan]

According to the Iranians there is no agreement and no commitments and president Obama is lying when he claims there is. I must say that is the most believable thing I've ever heard uttered by an Iranian spokesman.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security/iran-accuses-u-s-of-lying-about-new-nuke-agreement/

Says White House misleading Congress, American people with fact sheet

BY: Adam Kredo

Adam Kredo is senior writer for the Washington Free Beacon. Formerly an award-winning political reporter for the Washington Jewish Week,

Oh what a shocker....not.....It is a Israel fan site nothing more

What else would they publish

And Valerie Jarrett, who is a principle formative influence on Obama has been batting for the Iranians since the year dot, sadly if you want to police sources you should start with every utterance which comes out of the Oval Office.

[snarky66]

The Iranians are busy tweeting and it's not pretty.

[Steely Dan]

The Iranian nuclear bogey-man... he's about 35 years old now - born from the womb of the USA's brilliant "Atoms for Peace" policy pushing the nascent power technology on their friend the Shaw. Oops - here comes 1979 and the Ayatollah...

Someone in the GOP has to decide if they they are fighting ISIS or Iran - Sunni's or Shia's... or, as it seems, any middle-eastern nation besides Israel and Saudi Arabia. With seeming no knowledge of the historical geo-politics their pundits really sound like idiots.

Now is the perfect time for the USA to extract themselves from the region entirely and let the Sunni's and Shia's sort out their own shizzle. USA is in a no win situation and no matter whom they support it will breed more hatred and therefore terrorism against themselves. Pull out. Use the saved trillions to enact a policy of strict containment of the region, developing energy self-sufficiency (multiple economic benefits), restoring the countries failing infrastructure, bringing education standards up to world levels, and solving the countries water issues.

Ahhh... but that will never happen until they realize that 'Merica would be just as safe, and well protected from the other evils in the world even if they slashed their military/defence budgets in half and spent the savings on policies geared towards nation-building.

Yes, masterful strategy by Carter not supporting the Shah and by Obama doubling down by empowering Iran at every turn. As for the policy of letting Sunni and Shia scrap it out, let them do it with blunt sticks not nuclear weapons, there is not a snowballs chance in hell of the Saudis trusting this non agreement, or indeed the Iranians signing anything off in June when they suspect the Saudis are after a nuclear bomb.

[Publicus]

It's taking the extreme right media some considerable time to come up with new lunar-orbit arguments against the Framework Agreement announced by the P5+1 and Iran in Switzerland.

There isn't much to say, so in the meantime while we wait for the right wing media to put forth their new lines, we have to read some really crappy posts based on third or fourth string marginal moonbeam media.

Where's Faux when we need 'em

It didn't take John Boehner long to issue the release I posted above. The US does have a Congress which makes laws, you know, and there are enough Congress persons on both sides of the aisle to keep this thing in check.

They don't like it at all, and especially remember that Obama went around them to the 5+1 deal which was stupid.

Expect some serious pushback, even if this release saying there's a deal is a lie.

Enter Speaker of the US House John Boehner, who now doubles as the Likud-led Government's new Foreign Minister speaking directly from Tel Aviv, where he and the newest Republican Party US Senator from Israel, Bibi Netanyahu barfed lunch together.

The fringe right needs better lines than a bunch of politicians are lying....or whatever.

I mean, I still dunno what's wrong with the Preliminary Agreement announced by the EU and Iran in Switzerland overnight. All I know is political leaders none of whom is a statesmen are lying in all 24 time zones.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Publicus

[NeverSure]

Can you count to 67?

If so, post a list of the 67 US Senators who have publicly stated they will "keep this thing in check".

Will Senate Democrats really help kill an Obama nuclear deal with Iran?

March 30

"The negotiations over the future of Iran’s nuclear program are coming down to the wire, with last-minute snags developing around the question of whether Iran will agree to allow its atomic fuel to be shipped out of the country. Other unresolved issues include the pace at which sanctions would be lifted, how many centrifuges Iran could continue operating, what research and development would be allowed on more advanced centrifuges, and what monitoring would look like.

But even if the framework of a deal is reached in the short term — the immediate goal of the talks — there is a real possibility, the White House believes, that Congress could kill a final deal even before it is agreed upon, with the willing participation of Senate Democrats.

Emphasis mine more - Washington Post/Reuters

[SABloke]

I don't know why everyone's so worried about Iran having nuclear weapons. Think about it: 70 years ago, before the digital age, people managed to build nukes. Since then countless nations have constructed nuclear weapons. Iran, however, with all the modern technology at its fingertips can still, after decades of trying, NOT produce one. Conclussion: Iranian scientists are idiots

Yes the sanctions have made it much more difficult but they do have ICBM's and have been testing them. The CIA sneaks out scientist that go under ground and escape. The rest are threatened to comply.

You also forget that they have called for the death of all non Muslim's

So I have to conclude you are either living in a cave or you are drunk all the time.

I miss the good old days when a bit of jest was welcomed in the world

[Naam]

I don't know why everyone's so worried about Iran having nuclear weapons. Think about it: 70 years ago, before the digital age, people managed to build nukes. Since then countless nations have constructed nuclear weapons. Iran, however, with all the modern technology at its fingertips can still, after decades of trying, NOT produce one. Conclussion: Iranian scientists are idiots

i can't help it but conclude... you are a genius!

[NeverSure]

What I think a lot of people are missing is that Obama doesn't have to run again for reelection and he see this as part of his legacy.

People in Congress do have to run again and again and their info says the American people don't want it. Many of them including Democrats don't want it either, but the fence sitters and those who win elections by small margins are going with the people.

[Publicus]

World wide praise for the agreement, but of course anything accomplished by the Obama administration needs to be shat upon. It's so predictable. In the tin foil hat, koolaid sipping world of the marginal moonbeam media (I like that phrase) the lemmings immediately fall in lock step.

Meanwhile back at the ranch, Scott Walker says, "I will pull back on that (agreement) on January 20, 2017 (the day he takes office as POTUS...as if), because the last thing — not just for the region but for this world — we need is a nuclear-armed Iran. It leaves not only problems for Israel, because they want to annihilate Israel, it leaves the problems in the sense that the Saudis, the Jordanians and others are gonna want to have access to their own nuclear weapons…"

In that great void that is the mind of Scott Walker and the rest of the marginal moonbeam media, shutting down enrichment facilities in an accountable and transparent way is somehow a way to accelerate their weapon development and an arms race in the Middle East.

That's where we're at with Republican logic these days. The lunacy is breathtaking.

Some people are living in a fairy tale land of their own making. It's a presidential campaign kickoff year. Obama doesn't have to run again. Do you think the politicians who do have to run again don't know what they are doing?

On Iran, Obama Is Ignoring Public Opinion at His Own Peril

The president's pursuit of a nuclear deal with Iran underscores the lengths to which he is willing to bypass public resistance.

March 19, 2015 Throughout the contentious debate between the White House and Congress over the Iran nuclear negotiations, one important piece of the equation has been largely overlooked: American public opinion. If voters were confident that President Obama was striking a good deal with Iran that would prevent Tehran from getting nuclear weapons, he'd have little trouble getting support from the legislative branch.

But the reason the president is facing such bipartisan backlash is that an overwhelming number of voters are deeply worried about the direction of the negotiations. Think about how rare, in these polarized times, mobilizing a veto-proof majority of congressional Republicans and Democrats is for any significant legislation. Yet despite all the distractions, Congress is close to achieving that goal: requiring the administration to go to Congress for approval of any deal.

LINK

Public opinion and the congress, together on anything?

And this is when the public approval rating of the congress maximus is vanishing rapidly and altogether.

Why, I'd just been reading earlier in the week that several polling firms have said they no longer have the technology to measure the miniscule approval of the congress maximus by Americans.

Polling firms were always able to measure even very low public national approval ratings in the single digits. However, now that public approval has gone negative, polling firms can no longer measure it.

Even the biggest and the best scientific survey research firms remain unable to read such data as 0.001011 of the sample approves the job being done by the congress maximus.

Links later.

[CMNightRider]

Lets think about this for a minute. Obama just made a deal with Iran, who is the "worlds leading state sponsor of terrorism and he thinks this is a good deal, OMG! This deal is even worst and far most serous than the Bergdahl deal.

who made Iran, the 'world's leading sponsor of terrorism'? USA . in a recent Gallop poll , the world voted USA as the biggest threat to peace, by a wide margin.

What, lol? Iran made themselves the worlds leading sponsor of terrorism by their actions. Blaming the USA for Iran's threat to world peace, is like the fat guy blaming spoons because he is fat.

[up-country_sinclair]

Can you count to 67?

If so, post a list of the 67 US Senators who have publicly stated they will "keep this thing in check".

Will Senate Democrats really help kill an Obama nuclear deal with Iran?

March 30

"The negotiations over the future of Iran’s nuclear program are coming down to the wire, with last-minute snags developing around the question of whether Iran will agree to allow its atomic fuel to be shipped out of the country. Other unresolved issues include the pace at which sanctions would be lifted, how many centrifuges Iran could continue operating, what research and development would be allowed on more advanced centrifuges, and what monitoring would look like.

But even if the framework of a deal is reached in the short term — the immediate goal of the talks — there is a real possibility, the White House believes, that Congress could kill a final deal even before it is agreed upon, with the willing participation of Senate Democrats.

Emphasis mine

What a surprise.

You can't provide a list of the required 67 Senators, but you do put up plenty of

But even if the framework of a deal is reached in the short term — the immediate goal of the talks — there is a real possibility, the White House believes, that Congress could kill a final deal even before it is agreed upon, with the willing participation of Senate Democrats.

Emphasis mine more - Washington Post/Reuters

Emphasis mine.

Edited April 3, 2015 by up-country_sinclair

[wileycoyote]

I think we have to look for the positives here.

There is mutual distrust and it will not be easy convincing "hardliners" in both sides.

However much good work has been accomplished.

[Linky]

From Speaker of the House John Boehner's website:

WASHINGTON, DC - House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH) issued the following statement in response to the presidents remarks on the Iran nuclear talks:

The president says negotiators have cleared the basic threshold needed to continue talks, but the parameters for a final deal represent an alarming departure from the White Houses initial goals. My longtime concerns about the parameters of this potential agreement remain, but my immediate concern is the administration signaling it will provide near-term sanctions relief. Congress must be allowed to fully review the details of any agreement before any sanctions are lifted.

MORE

So if i understand this correctly.

Congress is against the deal, which it doesnt understand because they havent fully reviewed it. Yep that makes a lot of sense.

Perhaps they should fully review it to see what the deal is before they jump up and down.

Just proves it wants to bash Obama, it doesnt care about details.

[arjunadawn]

Remember, you read it hear on TV first:

The context of any fallacious agreement is taking place against the backdrop of unprecedented shia aggression and expansion. Many of us have been noting for weeks that we are on the verge of a considerable shia sunni war. IMO, this permission by the US to Iran is an unmitigated disaster. All this arrangement will do is further escalate all sides in a now inevitable conflict.

The great oddity is the US has seemingly switched sides. However, when viewed in the train of US foreign policy context, this should be no surprise at all. The US administration has facilitated, conducted, and made permissive war throughout the region, if not the world.

So, the sunni religious leader of the holiest muslim site on earth declared war on shia. Egyptian and Iranian naval vessels exchanged fire. The ridiculous paper drill in futility meets the real world in near comic fashion. Obama has pursued his bipolar middle east dream at the cost of untold lives, suffering, and war- its a "dream in the air (pipe dream)" but nightmare on the ground.

http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/2015/04/02/Muslim-Cleric-Calls-All-Out-War

Regarding Obama: fewer humans have so insidiously enabled war under a banner of peace

[Jingthing]

The people are dancing in the streets in Tehran.

But not in Washington.

Who is getting the better deal?

The problem is that Iran is not only a nuclear threat.

It's a threat threat.

They chant Death to America.

They chant Death to Israel.

Remove the sanctions and all you get is a richer Iran more powerful to make nasty in their sphere of influence and also of course they will still go for nukes, and if you believe their lies that they won't, I've got a bridge to sell you.

I'm sure other regional powers like Saudi don't believe it.

Yet Obama is right the basic choices are a deal like this or war.

It's still debatable whether in the long run a war when Iran is relatively weak is the wrong choice.

Avoiding war now doesn't mean an even worse war is avoided later. Hardly.

Also of course with a deal like this relieving domestic economic pain any INTERNAL threat to the radical Islamist Iranian regime is effectively castrated.

I fully understand why Obama wants this deal. I suppose there is a small chance it will work out OK. But I don't like the odds and I find it pretty depressing that the Iranian regime will be so much more strengthened now.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

I hear no surprise inspections allowed.

What do they have to hide?

I wouldn't believe them anyway, but there's the smoking gun.

Even in Iran's announcement of the progress of the deal, they blatantly lied.

Saying there was never an intention to weaponize.

That is known to be a lie.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Jingthing

[BadBouy]

Please...before making non sense comments criticizing Obama...look at this:

https://youtu.be/O0giXvhEWMo

https://youtu.be/Nfg1U3Z0mVMh

GE a big supporter of the Dem party was doing the same (long before Obama) My point is one side is as bad as the other. None of this matters Iran will disregard the terms of any agreement as fast as the ink dries.

Religious zealots that continue to chant death to America and hated western culture wielding nuclear weapons what possible problem could come of that.

[Pakboong]

There have always been hidden dangers in over-selling during the demonization process. The Executive branch of the American government has information we as individual citizens will never see. In fact, the congress will not see much of it. Obama's handlers and henchmen know what they can sell and go with it. There are a bunch of very smart people who are dealing with real information, not the crap we get from the Mainstream Media.

I am sure the individuals involved in the negotiations were very much aware and were faced with what the American public would buy. The blow-back is simply part of the business.

[Publicus]

Dancing in the streets of Tehran because it is the beginning of the end of the crippling sanctions that have lain low the entire economy and financial systems of Iran. The sanctions have been more insiduously devastating than anyone can imagine. Continuing the sanctions, or expanding them, would make Iran and Iranians increasingly desperate, and there's no predicting how that desperation would manifest.

Iranians Welcome Obama To Official TV With Selfies

Among the historical precedents set by Thursday’s announcement of a tentative basis for a nuclear deal with Iran, government-run television stations in the country broadcast President Barack Obama’s address from the White House in full.

The Islamic Republic of Iran News Network, whose political and international coverage is strictly controlled by government authorities, took the unusual step of showing Obama’s speech live and uncensored.

Milad Fadai Asl @miladfadai

Follow

#selfie Me & My Wife & @BarackObama Obama's speech live broadcast, IR national news network

http://dailycaller.com/2015/04/02/iranians-welcome-obama-to-official-tv-with-selfies/

[Jingthing]

I agree there is no predicting.

Maybe it would have meant revolution against the Mullahs.

Now we probably will never know.

[wabothai]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Lets think about this for a minute. Obama just made a deal with Iran, who is the "worlds leading state sponsor of terrorism and he thinks this is a good deal, OMG! This deal is even worst and far most serous than the Bergdahl deal.

who made Iran, the 'world's leading sponsor of terrorism'? USA . in a recent Gallop poll , the world voted USA as the biggest threat to peace, by a wide margin.

What, lol? Iran made themselves the worlds leading sponsor of terrorism by their actions. Blaming the USA for Iran's threat to world peace, is like the fat guy blaming spoons because he is fat.

I thought it was the saudi's? Okay, they don't count as they are supposed to be the west friends.

Strange world we live in. The Iranians are fighting ISIS. They have a semi democratic and semi pluralistic society.

The Sauidis sent most of the 9-11 terrorists. Full of nutter whahabists who don't even let women drive.

What am I missing here?

Brain cells come to mind. Have you ever heard the term "Axis of Evil." Iran earned that distinction along with others in 2002.

Iran+Iraq+North Korea got labeled the "Axis of Evil" in 2002 by Bush Jr.

What was the reason to bunch these three countries together in 2002 and label them as the "Axis of Evil"?

9/11 had nothing to do with these three countries.

"Axis of Evil" were spin for the US domestic masses.

"axis of evil" words invented and uttered by a nit wit.

Any believers of these words may become part of the nit wit club.

[arjunadawn]

There have always been hidden dangers in over-selling during the demonization process. The Executive branch of the American government has information we as individual citizens will never see. In fact, the congress will not see much of it. Obama's handlers and henchmen know what they can sell and go with it. There are a bunch of very smart people who are dealing with real information, not the crap we get from the Mainstream Media.

I am sure the individuals involved in the negotiations were very much aware and were faced with what the American public would buy. The blow-back is simply part of the business.

There is no measurement by which to suggest that this "bunch" of people are "very smart." Perhaps you could provide some examples of where the President's team's brilliance has resulted in a better world? Can you point to any successes internationally? Can you point to any successes nationally? The Obama team are, however, keenly aware that Americans will eat a crap sandwich if given one bite at a time. Since Obama's sound thumping in 2014 he and his team have abused the notion that they care what the American people will buy- they are hoisting it upon America, and the world. Blow-back? If you realized what he was aiming for intermittent "blow-back" along the way would appear trivial.

I would take a cross section of pro and con opposite posters from Thai Visa and stack them up with the Kerry Team any day. For Obama, the negotiations are not an end in themselves but one more crown in inflicting his good upon the region. There is a reason Obama is seen as Iblis.

Edit: What is "the demonization process" and what are the "hidden dangers?"

Edited April 3, 2015 by arjunadawn

[mania]

The people are dancing in the streets in Tehran.

But not in Washington.

Who is getting the better deal?

The problem is that Iran is not only a nuclear threat.

It's a threat threat.

They chant Death to America.

They chant Death to Israel.

And yet while folks "Say" they said this or they dance the dance/chant of death 555

"Others" have nukes through dubious means & still refuse any form of civilized agreements nuclear or otherwise

"Others" not only threaten but often do bomb/invade others/steal lands from others

"Others" do bad deeds inflicting death & injury on thousands of civilians yet....no problem right? Only matters what they say when they dance???

As always I will judge by deeds not words...Not to say the US & Israel dont have a ton of yada,yada,yada words to offer

But it is their deeds especially Israels that makes their words nothing more than yada,yada,yada

[Jingthing]

For better or worse I think most Americans don't want war with Iran and in the short term Obama is giving them no war. In the long term he'll be golfing in Hawaii.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[mania]

I hear no surprise inspections allowed.

What do they have to hide?

You asking about Israel or Iran?

Oh wait Israel allows NO inspections period...ever....surprise or otherwise...

Because you know they never agreed to anything ....ever 555

[VillageIdiot]

For better or worse I think most Americans don't want war with Iran and in the short term Obama is giving them no war. In the long term he'll be golfing in Hawaii.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Yes, he probably will... and the Sunnis and the Shiias and the Israelis will still be killing each other.

All of them doing what they like to do best.

[Jingthing]

I hear no surprise inspections allowed.

What do they have to hide?

You asking about Israel or Iran?

Oh wait Israel allows NO inspections period...ever....surprise or otherwise...

Because you know they never agreed to anything ....ever 555

Wait for an Israel topic.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[BKKBobby]

Some will live to see if this was a major positive achievement by P5+1 or a mistake. My guess is that this deal will be considered good in the future and Obama will have a positive legacy in the history books. We have to wait and see, that part of the history isnt made yet. Some people that are so sure of themselves, thinking that they are Nostradamus might look like fools in the future.

Edited April 3, 2015 by BKKBobby

[mania]

I hear no surprise inspections allowed.

What do they have to hide?

You asking about Israel or Iran?

Oh wait Israel allows NO inspections period...ever....surprise or otherwise...

Because you know they never agreed to anything ....ever 555

Wait for an Israel topic.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Given all the news leading up to this agreement & how intertwined Israel/Netanyahu's campaign against any agreements what so ever

I would say they are very much a part of this topic