There was no crackdown in 2010, says Abhisit witness

[Docno]

"the troops had been instructed not to use live ammunition against the protesters"

Abhisit testified before the court: "As the CRES chief, Mr. Suthep was in charge of the army officers and he outlined how the officers should use their weapons....Troops were told to shoot below a person’s knee without intent to kill and not to fire a weapon when protesters were mingling with innocent people, Mr. Abhisit said."

Obviously, innocent people became collateral damage, whether the military intended so or not.

You give them too much credit. Intentionally shooting into a temple compound (probably with scoped guns) where unarmed people have taken refuge cannot be considered collateral damage, unless others want to use the term very cynically. .

[Lorn]

Not sure what the guy in Abu Dabhi expected as an outcome using the MIB to provoke a response from the soldiers. MIB and disguised MIB in red was sneaking in and out of the red shirt crowds shooting live rounds at the soldiers. I guess the gloves was off and everything went, as his party had been subjected to yet another coup, although this time by using the judiciary and anti corruption institutions.

Not sure what the guy in Abu Dabhi expected as an outcome using the MIB to provoke a response from the soldiers.

It is because all Thai governments that have caused the death of 'peaceful' protesters have resigned in the past. Thaksin was counting on Abhisit to resign and when he didn't, Thaksin escalated by having the protest leaders move the protest from Pan Fa Bridge to Ratchaprasong and Lumpini Park and build barricades which made the Abhisit government look powerless/weak in the face of organized opposition. Abhisit, still the gentleman held discussions with the UDD leaders and agreed to move elections ahead by six months. Still, that wasn't enough for Thaksin who escalated again by bringing in Seh Daeng (renegade General Khattiya Sawasdipol) and his 'Ronin Warriors' to escalate further including grenade attacks on Army headquarters, raiding a hospital, firing grenades at oil storage tanks, firing M-79 grenades at BTS statioons causing civilian deaths, etc.; all making Abhisit look weak and ineffective. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khattiya_Sawasdipol

as his party had been subjected to yet another coup, although this time by using the judiciary and anti corruption institutions.

Seriously, are you trying to sell that old UDD chestnut? If your are referring to the way Abhisit came to power, that was two years before the Thaksin financed mob descended on Bangkok in 2010 so it doesn't have any bearing on the Red Shirt gatherings of 2010. It was a self-serving/selfish act of Thaksin, though, because the Abhisit government had just seized some of Thaksin's ill-gotten billions just weeks before the 2010 demonstrations. Thaksin didn't organize that attempted 'soft coup' until his assets were seized. Get your time-lines straight if you want credibility. Some of us are not to lazy to go to the internet to confirm dates and time and call you out on your Red Shirt propaganda.

And what you're saying shouldn't be seen as yellow propaganda?

Have you forgotten all about the April 2009 protests. And don't you think that maybe the protests being the exact time the next year might have been to do with the timing of the farming seasons and not just a court ruling?

And why are you saying the Abhisit government government seized the assets? His assets were frozen in June 2007 by the Assets Examination committee under the previous Junta- I mean Council for National security. Are you alluding to there being a long standing unhealthy alliance between the military, courts and the elites? That's the kind of thing that would explain why certain parties are dissolved when others that are equally corrupt and involved in electoral fraud escape sanctions.

why are you saying the Abhisit government government seized the assets? His assets were frozen in June 2007

Nice Straw Man you knocked over as I said 'siezed' and not 'frozen'. If you change my argument, you can win every time.

Immediately following the verdict (on February 26, 2010) to partially seize Thaksin’s asset amounting to 46.37 billion baht (approx. US$ 1.54 bn.) by the supreme court for the political office holders, Thaksin Shinawatra (a fugitive abroad escaping a two-year-jail term on corruption), his political party (Pheu Thai), and the vanguards of the red-shirt mob, started organizing a mass movement aiming at overthrowing the Abhisit government. Their strategies were obvious:

1.1 Although the real motive for their attempt to overthrow the government was to restore the Thaksin’s regime, the Thaksinists justified their action by putting the blames on the unjust verdict of the supreme court for political office holders for delivering a verdict confiscating Thaksin’s asset, the illegal military coup against Thaksin in September 2006 and the subsequent loss of power through legal and parliamentary means of Thaksin’s proxies, and the illegitimate coalition government of Abhisit allegedly formed with the support of the military and the president of the privy council, General Prem Tinsulanonda. By trying to restore the Thaksin’s regime, the Thaksinists aspired to whitewash all criminal charges (about 10 cases) against Thaksin still pending in the judicial processes, including his two-year jail sentence on corruption. They thought that their wishes could be realized through a new general election, so that they vehemently demanded for a dissolution of the House of Representatives – which the red-shirt movement nicely called “returning the power to the people.” These tactics, using fabricated information of past events to cover up their unjust interests and demands, seemed to have worked in their image-building... (the article continues)

http://www.thaiworld.org/enn/thailand_monitor/answera.php?question_id=1029

You can create and knock down Straw Men all day and all night but the truth remains.

Have you forgotten all about the April 2009 protests

No, as I mentioned in post #9, that is why Col. Romklao was murdered. Do you even bother to read/comprehend before posting?

Urban-terrorism tactics alienating the public

By Thanong Khanthong

The Nation Published on April 14, 2009

His (Thaksin's) strategy is simple. After torpedoing the Asean Summit in Pattaya, the red-shirt anti-government protesters stage urban-style terrorism around key points in Bangkok so that Abhisit is forced to declare a state of emergency. Then the military has to be brought in to quash the red-shirt protesters. When the military suppresses the protests, there will be bloodshed and the situation will spill out of control, creating a state of anarchy. Finally, the strategy goes, Thaksin's supporters petition His Majesty the King for a royal intervention to end the crisis.

Under this plan, Thaksin is seeking to hold Thailand hostage as he bargains for his amnesty. When the worst came to the worst, a military coup would be launched to bring down the Abhisit Vejjajiva government.

But Thaksin's game plan is not working. First, the red-shirt protesters' urban-terrorism tactics have spiraled out of control to create an effective state of civil war inside the capital. Second, they have failed to mobilise enough critical mass support. Third, the Thai public - appalled by the violence and the protesters' clashes with the security forces - does not support the red shirts.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/04/14/politics/politics_30100468.php

I noticed you don't include ANY links to web-sites to refute any of my statements. Why is that?

You are refuting them yourself. The constitutional court seized his assets. The previous administration froze them. Therefore Abhasit's government played no part. Also you have agreed that the 2009 protests happened so don't see why I need to post links to it. And very easy to post pro-military articles/websites. Even if I was dumb enough to post articles which are contradictory, they are sure to be taken down quickly.

Actually seen as you seem to see wikipedia as a credible source. Here is one

"According to the Erawan Bangkok Emergency Medical Service Center, 25 people were killed in the clashes. The dead included Japanese cameraman Hiro Muramoto, 10 protesters, nine civilians and five uniformed soldiers.^[67][68] The Center noted more than 800 people injured.^[69] Autopsies revealed that 9 out of the 10 dead protesters died due to gunshot wounds.^[70] The military noted that the uniformed soldiers killed died from cerebral edema (swelling of the brain) after being hit on the head by thrown rocks.^[71]Following the clashes government troops withdrew.^[66]"

So if the MiB were so intent on escalating things, so well armed, so numerous, how is it that none of the soldiers died from gunshot wounds? And you can follow the wiki link back to find that this means of death was stated in the Bangkokpost, by Col Sansern Kaewkamnerd, former spokesperson for the Centre for the Resolution of the Emergency Situation not some red propaganda. Although statements from certain individuals now continue to talk about the soldiers being shot by MiB.

Are you seriously arguing that the military was justified in killing those civilians and that they did nothing wrong? If they did why all the constant lies for example also about not having authorising or using snipers in the "non-crackdown".

Edited April 30, 2015 by Lorn

[AlQaholic]

@ Rametindallas and Lorn, I am not shirt of any kind of color, I am completely neutral. I am not for or against either the elites or the red shirts.

What I do notice is that there during the whole 21st century has been a continuous battle between Thaksin and his followers and the elite.

I also note that the only elected governments in the 21st century is the governments led by Thaksin or his proxies, now what does that say about the voters?

There is no real evidence anywhere that vote buying has ever actually had a real effect on an election. Other factors are more important such as local strong-men influencing voters.

The red shirts was let down by Thaksin in the 2010 crackdown, I doubt that the Red shirt leadership had much knowledge or control of what was going on with the MIB (not the red shirt guards controlled by UDD) but the other party camped at Lumpini. The UDD leadership was pulled into a fight for their lives. Although there is a clear link between the Red shirt movement and Thaksin, I think his control over this movement is sometimes exaggerated or thought to be complete when it is not.

[rubl]

@ Rametindallas and Lorn, I am not shirt of any kind of color, I am completely neutral. I am not for or against either the elites or the red shirts.

What I do notice is that there during the whole 21st century has been a continuous battle between Thaksin and his followers and the elite.

I also note that the only elected governments in the 21st century is the governments led by Thaksin or his proxies, now what does that say about the voters?

There is no real evidence anywhere that vote buying has ever actually had a real effect on an election. Other factors are more important such as local strong-men influencing voters.

The red shirts was let down by Thaksin in the 2010 crackdown, I doubt that the Red shirt leadership had much knowledge or control of what was going on with the MIB (not the red shirt guards controlled by UDD) but the other party camped at Lumpini. The UDD leadership was pulled into a fight for their lives. Although there is a clear link between the Red shirt movement and Thaksin, I think his control over this movement is sometimes exaggerated or thought to be complete when it is not.

Even a month ago Thaksin was still described as 'de facto' leader of the UDD. Of course, that was in KhaoSod newspaper

[Denim]

Lots of confusion about what amounts to a crackdown. Surprising really given recent events.

When the Somchai government asked the police to disperse the yellow shirt protesters and two were killed by rubber bullets ......THAT was a crackdown. We know this because Abhisit said so. In fact he said that Somchai was not a Thai to order this and questioned if Somchai was a human being at all. He also demanded Somchai take responsibility for the deaths and step down as premier. There was a big state funeral for the two protesters but unfortunately nothing for the policeman deliberately run down by a pick up truck driven by a yellow shirt protester.

Now , the same Abhisit authorizes a free fire policy using live rounds and scores of people, some not even protesters , are killed , and it's not a crackdown. No , they were all going home quiety of their own accord when the man in Dubai ordered his paid men in black to kill his own supporters ( and Sae Deng for good measure ) to make the innocent army look bad.

We know this is true because many lobotomised TV contributers have repeatedly told us so.

[rubl]

Lots of confusion about what amounts to a crackdown. Surprising really given recent events.

When the Somchai government asked the police to disperse the yellow shirt protesters and two were killed by rubber bullets ......THAT was a crackdown. We know this because Abhisit said so. In fact he said that Somchai was not a Thai to order this and questioned if Somchai was a human being at all. He also demanded Somchai take responsibility for the deaths and step down as premier. There was a big state funeral for the two protesters but unfortunately nothing for the policeman deliberately run down by a pick up truck driven by a yellow shirt protester.

Now , the same Abhisit authorizes a free fire policy using live rounds and scores of people, some not even protesters , are killed , and it's not a crackdown. No , they were all going home quiety of their own accord when the man in Dubai ordered his paid men in black to kill his own supporters ( and Sae Deng for good measure ) to make the innocent army look bad.

We know this is true because many lobotomised TV contributers have repeatedly told us so.

The freedictionary gives

"An act or example of forceful regulation, repression, or restraint: a crackdown on crime."

Whether regulation, repression or restraint seems to depend on ones views.

[AlQaholic]

@ Rametindallas and Lorn, I am not shirt of any kind of color, I am completely neutral. I am not for or against either the elites or the red shirts.

What I do notice is that there during the whole 21st century has been a continuous battle between Thaksin and his followers and the elite.

I also note that the only elected governments in the 21st century is the governments led by Thaksin or his proxies, now what does that say about the voters?

There is no real evidence anywhere that vote buying has ever actually had a real effect on an election. Other factors are more important such as local strong-men influencing voters.

The red shirts was let down by Thaksin in the 2010 crackdown, I doubt that the Red shirt leadership had much knowledge or control of what was going on with the MIB (not the red shirt guards controlled by UDD) but the other party camped at Lumpini. The UDD leadership was pulled into a fight for their lives. Although there is a clear link between the Red shirt movement and Thaksin, I think his control over this movement is sometimes exaggerated or thought to be complete when it is not.

Even a month ago Thaksin was still described as 'de facto' leader of the UDD. Of course, that was in KhaoSod newspaper

uhm I just said there is a clear link, would you be a puppet of you employer or would you seek better opportunities if you cold, being a greedy little shit head that you where??

[kimamey]

OK so if this guy doesn't like the words "crack down", or "use of force", then how about open fire? or fire at will? but I'm sure they wont be ok either.

We asked them to leave, they left on their own, it was just a security tightening.

Strange considering that some think the term "crack down" is not strong enough rather than launch an assault on the protesters?

How about the words, White wash, Sanitized, Deluded, and strait up lies?

Hers an option, find the documents that ordered the (operation, Offensive, Strike, or ones the Americans like is Prosecute) and use them as term of reference? I wonder if they'll ever see the light of day? or they also went conveniently floating off in floods like all the other incriminating evidence?

Waiting for the usual suspects to come in and defend this SPIN, or one could use the word Insult to the dead and injured and their family's.

.

I don't think the documents regarding the ROE have been lost. I've seen an English translation of them some time ago. Robert Amsterdam has an expert witness who said the army weren't following their ROE so they must be available.

From memory the first version wouldn't have given the army permission to act as they appear to have done. The second which I think I'm right in saying Abhisit didn't sign may have been a bit vague and may be found to endorse some of the army's actions. It wouldn't justify the shooting in the back of one of the journalists allegedly carried out by the military.

The problem here of course is that to be fair there would need to be an investigation of the then government and the army since in many cases they were accused by the courts of firing most of the shots. There might also be issues with the Emergency Decree under which this all occurred. That was counter signed by Thaksin.

I'm not sure all this discussion about whether or not it was a crackdown is all that important on this forum as I'm assuming it's a translation from Thai. The deaths occurred and the victims and their families need to see justice which they haven't under the last 2 governments.

Edited April 30, 2015 by kimamey

[kimamey]

Where else have I heard that Thawil Pliensri name recently?

Thawil Pliensri, who served as director of the National Security Council under Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva, was called by Thailands national anti-graft agency to testify in Abhisit's defense today.

So the NACC charges Abhisit, then calls a witness in his defense?

Wouldn't it be a bit biased if they didn't hear any defence witnesses. Mind you I'm not sure if I was in Abhisit's shoes this is the short of defence I'd want

[rubl]

@ Rametindallas and Lorn, I am not shirt of any kind of color, I am completely neutral. I am not for or against either the elites or the red shirts.

What I do notice is that there during the whole 21st century has been a continuous battle between Thaksin and his followers and the elite.

I also note that the only elected governments in the 21st century is the governments led by Thaksin or his proxies, now what does that say about the voters?

There is no real evidence anywhere that vote buying has ever actually had a real effect on an election. Other factors are more important such as local strong-men influencing voters.

The red shirts was let down by Thaksin in the 2010 crackdown, I doubt that the Red shirt leadership had much knowledge or control of what was going on with the MIB (not the red shirt guards controlled by UDD) but the other party camped at Lumpini. The UDD leadership was pulled into a fight for their lives. Although there is a clear link between the Red shirt movement and Thaksin, I think his control over this movement is sometimes exaggerated or thought to be complete when it is not.

Even a month ago Thaksin was still described as 'de facto' leader of the UDD. Of course, that was in KhaoSod newspaper

uhm I just said there is a clear link, would you be a puppet of you employer or would you seek better opportunities if you cold, being a greedy little shit head that you where??

You also said 'i think his control is sometimes exaggerated'. Now of course if you think those UDD leaders would seek better opportunities being greedy little shit heads (your words, not mine), you seem to think that such opportunities might be available. Would that be in Thailand and if so where and which whom, do you think?

Also the UDD is still greatly concerned with the proper, democratic treatment of Shinawatras. That would suggest that the 'de facto' leadership is not too shaky.

[mango66]

any democratic country would have stopped this red bandidts much earlier,

and even more than 100 would have been killed,

and hundreds arrested and courted for burning down a complete district,

100ds would have benn sentecd for 10s of years behind bars;

Here the peace keeper which returned Bangkok to order should be courted ??

[Fat Haggis]

How many rioters were shot dead by the authorities during the last London riots?

How many rioters were shot dead at the last G8 summit in the UK?

How many rioters against austerity in the EU countries were shot dead by authorities ?

Yes democratic countries tend to shoot dead lots of protesters, where about are you from mango ?

How many rioters has your country shot dead recently?

[Ricardo]

How many rioters were shot dead by the authorities during the last London riots?

How many rioters were shot dead at the last G8 summit in the UK?

How many rioters against austerity in the EU countries were shot dead by authorities ?

Yes democratic countries tend to shoot dead lots of protesters, where about are you from mango ?

How many rioters has your country shot dead recently?

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

[djjamie]

Thawil and a few kool aid drinkers obviously didn't look up the definitions of the word crackdown,

Noun 1. crackdown - severely repressive actions

crushing, quelling, stifling, suppression - forceful prevention; putting down by power or authority; "the suppression of heresy"; "the quelling of the rebellion"; "the stifling of all dissent"

Whilst the Reds were out of control, the setting up of live fire zones isn't a normal practice and the comment about if western Military had done this there would have been more deaths is completely false.

I have personally stood on a riot line in Londonderry, Northern Ireland back in the 1980's and faces 10,000 rioting republicans throwing everything they could at us. And we used baton rounds and sound tactics to disperse them, not a single protestor was left dead, but lots of squaddies were injured!!

Typically western militaries DONT get involved in internal security issues so it's a moot point, the military in most western countries are rarely involved in such issues.

Crackdown is quite apt, if it wasn't one, what else would you call it ? A domestic disturbance? If it wasn't a crackdown then it coup easily be said it wasn't a riot but hey, what's in a name? 90 people mostly civilians were left dead, due to actions on both sides.

You truly have no idea or simply ignore every response presented to you.

I cannot believe you are a self confessed DEM supporter. You said it, not me. That shows the confusion in the rank and file of the UDD supporters and explains your confusion in your above comment.

Apparently the red where not out of control…They were peaceful protestors? That has changed now heay?

Stood in front of a line heay? Throwing everything they could heay? Grenades, M79's, stolen military weapons? B8llsh*t. If they threw that at you you would not stand there and take the injuries.

Typical military don't get involved……Well they do when the police are aligned with a criminal element of the opposition and when commanded to not let anyone through official government lines continue to do so then they are not worthy of overseeing security lest more innocent people be killed.

A crackdown? You bet ya….6 weeks of anarchy on the streets with soldiers dead, police kidnapped, hospitals stormed, grande attacks on banks and government building with the govt doing nothing in return. You bet there was a crackdown…It came to late though. ˇoo many died due to the red terrorists emboldened confidence due to the govt's lethargy.

When do you reckon a crackdown should occur…After Jatuporn's terrorists set fire to Central Plaza!!!

But being a self confessed DEM supporter you agree with me right….

Edited April 30, 2015 by djjamie

[tbthailand]

How many rioters were shot dead by the authorities during the last London riots?

How many rioters were shot dead at the last G8 summit in the UK?

How many rioters against austerity in the EU countries were shot dead by authorities ?

Yes democratic countries tend to shoot dead lots of protesters, where about are you from mango ?

How many rioters has your country shot dead recently?

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

[rubl]

How many rioters were shot dead by the authorities during the last London riots?

How many rioters were shot dead at the last G8 summit in the UK?

How many rioters against austerity in the EU countries were shot dead by authorities ?

Yes democratic countries tend to shoot dead lots of protesters, where about are you from mango ?

How many rioters has your country shot dead recently?

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

One might also ask why there were deaths at all in 2013/2014 protests. How come anti-government protesters can be nightly shot at, have cowards near nightly drop grenades on them.

Anyway, the Clinton issue "please define crackdown". Whatever name you want to give the 'action', unlike Baltimore, Maryland, there is no National Guard in Thailand. So, with police failing that leaves the Army to remove 'peaceful protesters' even when that offends TVF posters.

[djjamie]

This is an absolute lie and is completely incorrect. There was a crackdown. Without a doubt a crackdown did occur and it was witnessed by the country and the world. To say there was no crackdown dismisses the fact a brutal terrorist uprising took place.

With that said, Abhisit should be held responsible somewhat for the deaths during this crackdown. He was too tolerant and showed too much patience with the terrorists thus they became more and more brazen and confident. Had he cracked down earlier the deaths would have been reduced. He warned protestors to leave the poorest sire with 24 hours notice, but they refused. A crackdown was not only necessary but a duty of care to the majority of innocent peace loving citizens.

April 9th, 2010 was the first use of force by the military and it was with rubber bullets and water cannons.

The protests began on the 12th of March. So between then and the 9th of April when the red terrorists threatened to blow up an LPG truck, grenade attacks at Thai banks, attacked Thai charity with grenades, stormed parliament, attacked NPP and TPI buildings with M16 and grenades the military did nothing. NOTHING! To reiterate. Nothing…No one can present evidence to suggest otherwise. Not even make believe UDD evidence.

In any country in the world the leader would not be able to get away with allowing the capital to be violently savaged without taking any action for 1 month.

The only saving grace is the Right Honorable Abhisit's heart was in the right place. His hesitation was because he wanted to try to settle this protest peacefully. Unfortunately the red shirts were having none of that.

In Brisbane, Australia a man with a knife enters the Queen Street Mall while everyone is trying to go about there business and THAT IS WHEN the police come in and used live fire. It took 1 hour, not 1 month to react to the violence.

In Bangkok, Thailand brutal terrorists threaten to blow up LPG truck, perform grenade attacks at Thai banks, attacked Thai charity with grenades, stormed parliament, attacked NPP and TPI buildings with M16 and grenades, (this was around the time tear gas and rubber bullets were fired by the soldiers), stormed police hospital, stormed TV station (people started questioning Ahbisits control of the soldiers after the lack of resistance they offered the terrorists on this occasion), bomb attacks on electricity pylons, 2 police taken hostage, destroyed CCTV cameras and dumped tyres on sky train tracks and THAT IS WHEN the army came in and used live fire.

​A crackdown…You bet ya there was and the majority thank the military to this day that there lives and businesses had finally stabilized and life went back to normal.

[tbthailand]

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

One might also ask why there were deaths at all in 2013/2014 protests. How come anti-government protesters can be nightly shot at, have cowards near nightly drop grenades on them.

Anyway, the Clinton issue "please define crackdown". Whatever name you want to give the 'action', unlike Baltimore, Maryland, there is no National Guard in Thailand. So, with police failing that leaves the Army to remove 'peaceful protesters' even when that offends TVF posters.

good job at completely ignoring the point that was made....

par for the course - at least par for your course...

oh yes, the thing with shooting and grenades, you know the PDRC did their fair share of both, but you can't bring yourself to admit it here, can you?

on the other hand this blatant lie of "near nightly grenade attacks" has been disproven so many times I would think that you would be ashamed to keep repeating it.

But no...

[halloween]

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

Well for starters the protesters were protesting, not committing acts of violence with military weapons. And almost all the deaths that occurred during 2014 were of protesters killed not by security forces, but by somebody's militia "protecting" the government, who turn out to be the same people committing violence in 2010. Funny that.

[rubl]

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

One might also ask why there were deaths at all in 2013/2014 protests. How come anti-government protesters can be nightly shot at, have cowards near nightly drop grenades on them.

Anyway, the Clinton issue "please define crackdown". Whatever name you want to give the 'action', unlike Baltimore, Maryland, there is no National Guard in Thailand. So, with police failing that leaves the Army to remove 'peaceful protesters' even when that offends TVF posters.

good job at completely ignoring the point that was made....

par for the course - at least par for your course...

oh yes, the thing with shooting and grenades, you know the PDRC did their fair share of both, but you can't bring yourself to admit it here, can you?

on the other hand this blatant lie of "near nightly grenade attacks" has been disproven so many times I would think that you would be ashamed to keep repeating it.

But no...

The point being made was that when the anti-government protesters do not have help from Men-in-Black who appear mostly at night to shot at non-protesters or drop grenades on them, they will be less likely to be forcefully expelled?

As for 'near nightly', does 100 grenades in three months time sound better to you? Fair share, maybe to those who cannot or don't want to count. Those who take aim at children and rejoice in success?

Anyway, 2010, to crackdown or not to crackdown, that's the question.

[halloween]

One might similarly ask, how many soldiers were shot dead, or killed by rocks, in the last London riots or in the EU ?

And which of those riots went on for over two months ?

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

One might also ask why there were deaths at all in 2013/2014 protests. How come anti-government protesters can be nightly shot at, have cowards near nightly drop grenades on them.

Anyway, the Clinton issue "please define crackdown". Whatever name you want to give the 'action', unlike Baltimore, Maryland, there is no National Guard in Thailand. So, with police failing that leaves the Army to remove 'peaceful protesters' even when that offends TVF posters.

good job at completely ignoring the point that was made....

par for the course - at least par for your course...

oh yes, the thing with shooting and grenades, you know the PDRC did their fair share of both, but you can't bring yourself to admit it here, can you?

on the other hand this blatant lie of "near nightly grenade attacks" has been disproven so many times I would think that you would be ashamed to keep repeating it.

But no...

Is historical revisionism a profession or hobby?

[tbthailand]

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

Well for starters the protesters were protesting, not committing acts of violence with military weapons. And almost all the deaths that occurred during 2014 were of protesters killed not by security forces, but by somebody's militia "protecting" the government, who turn out to be the same people committing violence in 2010. Funny that.

what an amazingly stupid and false post. You have no fr!cking idea what you are talking about.

[tbthailand]

or one might ask why there were less than a third fewer deaths during protests which lasted 3 times longer in 2013/14?

One might also ask why there were deaths at all in 2013/2014 protests. How come anti-government protesters can be nightly shot at, have cowards near nightly drop grenades on them.

Anyway, the Clinton issue "please define crackdown". Whatever name you want to give the 'action', unlike Baltimore, Maryland, there is no National Guard in Thailand. So, with police failing that leaves the Army to remove 'peaceful protesters' even when that offends TVF posters.

good job at completely ignoring the point that was made....

par for the course - at least par for your course...

oh yes, the thing with shooting and grenades, you know the PDRC did their fair share of both, but you can't bring yourself to admit it here, can you?

on the other hand this blatant lie of "near nightly grenade attacks" has been disproven so many times I would think that you would be ashamed to keep repeating it.

But no...

Is historical revisionism a profession or hobby?

it's getting repetitive with you - again, you have (very clearly) no idea of what you speak. Seriously go out and get a good dose of information before you start posting such nonsense.

[aimbc]

I wonder where were the police to control the demonstrators. Ordered by their own to stand down. There is blood on the person's hands that for sure. Military are not designed to do such work. It's the role of the police force. They were sure out there during the last protest. Why were they not there during 2010.