Thai court grants Koh Tao evidence review for pair accused of Brit murders

[AleG]

Got it. The person whos garden the hoe was found in was the person who stole the hoe. A lovely clean hoe that had no blood on it or no DNA standing the the same place it was left.

So the police who got the call from the farmer desperately looking for his missing hoe, rushed to the scene of the garden and without asking either the person who owned the house or the famer decided hmmmm this lovely clean hoe that we don't know if it has been stolen or not and has no blood on it looks very much like a murder weapon.

They proceeded to match the wounds on David to the size of the blunt size of the hoe and hey presto it fitted. And so it should because if you burst a blunt hoe onto someones face it will just leave a mark the size of the blade. No chance of the mark getting any bigger after it has been crashed into a face.

Now I guess the most important question is, did the farmer get his hoe back ?

You know, if you are going to make up stuff, like the hoe not having any blood on it, it doesn't help your credibility to then post a photo of the bloody hoe.

[mcm991]

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Goldbuggy, as you are in fine form as your offensive and obnoxious style proves, let me ask you a serious question.

Do you trust the police in this country to carry out a thorough, impartial investigation and to not succumb to any levels of dishonesty or corruption ?

From the street Plod up to the highest officer ...... do you think that this investigation has been beyond reproach?

I'm assuming that you will not answer this question but I'd l be curious to know your views.

How about you JD? or AleG or JTJ?

Sure I will answer your question but who do you want me to compare these Police in Thailand to? To my home country Police? To Nigerian Police?

Do I think in this case they carried out an impartial investigation? Yes! I do! >snip<

And that Mr. Goldbuggy is where we differ in our opinions.

I do not and many here share my view.

I think the initial investigation was going well and on the right track ......... and then all of a sudden it changed. The top officer was replaced and there was no way a Thai would have done such a thing. Especially a well connected and wealthy Thai from a powerful family. Somebody else was going to take the rap. ..... as is fairly common from what I have been told by people experienced in the Thai justice system.

The thousands of posts over the many months highlighting details which seem wrong to many ........ the accusations of wrong doing and even torture ..... all for nothing because there are 3 basic groups in this debate on TVF.

The group that see a cover up, corruption and injustice on a grand scale.

The group that have vested interests / friends or sponsors on the Island who want these 2 boys found guily regardless of their guilt or innocense.

The (small) group of individuals who actually think the Bibs have done a 'perfect job' on this case as complimented by their commander.

There is no interesection between the first group and the other 2 ........ so it's best just to smile and nod. No point getting all upset about it and being insulting to the others. You are just not in group 1.

[metisdead]

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[berybert]

Got it. The person whos garden the hoe was found in was the person who stole the hoe. A lovely clean hoe that had no blood on it or no DNA standing the the same place it was left.

So the police who got the call from the farmer desperately looking for his missing hoe, rushed to the scene of the garden and without asking either the person who owned the house or the famer decided hmmmm this lovely clean hoe that we don't know if it has been stolen or not and has no blood on it looks very much like a murder weapon.

They proceeded to match the wounds on David to the size of the blunt size of the hoe and hey presto it fitted. And so it should because if you burst a blunt hoe onto someones face it will just leave a mark the size of the blade. No chance of the mark getting any bigger after it has been crashed into a face.

Now I guess the most important question is, did the farmer get his hoe back ?

You know, if you are going to make up stuff, like the hoe not having any blood on it, it doesn't help your credibility to then post a photo of the bloody hoe.

That's what happens when you take things out of context. As you do rather a lot. Gladly others who read all the comments will know I posted the bloody hoe in response to goldbuggy who claims it was clean.

Now would you like to mention why you have never mentioned the farmer who reported his hoe missing ?

[sweatalot]

I am sorry but this is my last post on this subject.

It is just my Nature to feel sorry for the Victims and their Families, and not sorry to the guys who did that. Even with a death sentence, they will live much longer than Hannah and David did.

So you implicate the B2 did it?

I will not go into detail. Those who followed the case will understand, those who have experience with Thai ploice understand.

And yes, it is good that this is your last post.

[JLCrab]

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Goldbuggy, as you are in fine form as your offensive and obnoxious style proves, let me ask you a serious question.

Do you trust the police in this country to carry out a thorough, impartial investigation and to not succumb to any levels of dishonesty or corruption ?

From the street Plod up to the highest officer ...... do you think that this investigation has been beyond reproach?

I'm assuming that you will not answer this question but I'd l be curious to know your views.

How about you JD? or AleG or JTJ?

Sure I will answer your question but who do you want me to compare these Police in Thailand to? To my home country Police? To Nigerian Police?

Do I think in this case they carried out an impartial investigation? Yes! I do! >snip<

And that Mr. Goldbuggy is where we differ in our opinions.

I do not and many here share my view.

I think the initial investigation was going well and on the right track ......... and then all of a sudden it changed. The top officer was replaced and there was no way a Thai would have done such a thing. Especially a well connected and wealthy Thai from a powerful family. Somebody else was going to take the rap. ..... as is fairly common from what I have been told by people experienced in the Thai justice system.

The thousands of posts over the many months highlighting details which seem wrong to many ........ the accusations of wrong doing and even torture ..... all for nothing because there are 3 basic groups in this debate on TVF.

The group that see a cover up, corruption and injustice on a grand scale.

The group that have vested interests / friends or sponsors on the Island who want these 2 boys found guily regardless of their guilt or innocense.

The (small) group of individuals who actually think the Bibs have done a 'perfect job' on this case as complimented by their commander.

There is no interesection between the first group and the other 2 ........ so it's best just to smile and nod. No point getting all upset about it and being insulting to the others. You are just not in group 1.

... or to maybe re-state Group 1: A group that see a cover up, corruption, and injustice on a grand scale although it may turn out that there was not a cover up, corruption, and injustice on a grand scale.

[balo]

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Goldbuggy

Your response contains a number of errors , and ommissions that I am left to arrive at a conclusion that you are not really interested in the crime and posting with an intent of being vexatious

Oh?

Well I stand to be corrected.

Prove it!

Goldbuggy, as you are in fine form as your offensive and obnoxious style proves, let me ask you a serious question.

Do you trust the police in this country to carry out a thorough, impartial investigation and to not succumb to any levels of dishonesty or corruption ?

From the street Plod up to the highest officer ...... do you think that this investigation has been beyond reproach?

I'm assuming that you will not answer this question but I'd l be curious to know your views.

How about you JD? or AleG or JTJ?

The RTP in many places do a fine job in solving crimes and murders. All you read about is negative stories in the media. Even if we have a high level of corruption here things are getting slowly better. Here in Pattaya I am surprised how many cases they actually solve . On a small island like this with the whole attention from the media I am sure they will not try to cover up something like DNA tests,which some of you think is not real.

Please do not always think everything in Thailand is corrupted .

You need to look at this from both sides of the coin instead of listening to gossip on facebook.

[mcm991]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Goldbuggy, as you are in fine form as your offensive and obnoxious style proves, let me ask you a serious question.

Do you trust the police in this country to carry out a thorough, impartial investigation and to not succumb to any levels of dishonesty or corruption ?

From the street Plod up to the highest officer ...... do you think that this investigation has been beyond reproach?

I'm assuming that you will not answer this question but I'd l be curious to know your views.

How about you JD? or AleG or JTJ?

Sure I will answer your question but who do you want me to compare these Police in Thailand to? To my home country Police? To Nigerian Police?

Do I think in this case they carried out an impartial investigation? Yes! I do! >snip<

And that Mr. Goldbuggy is where we differ in our opinions.

I do not and many here share my view.

I think the initial investigation was going well and on the right track ......... and then all of a sudden it changed. The top officer was replaced and there was no way a Thai would have done such a thing. Especially a well connected and wealthy Thai from a powerful family. Somebody else was going to take the rap. ..... as is fairly common from what I have been told by people experienced in the Thai justice system.

The thousands of posts over the many months highlighting details which seem wrong to many ........ the accusations of wrong doing and even torture ..... all for nothing because there are 3 basic groups in this debate on TVF.

The group that see a cover up, corruption and injustice on a grand scale.

The group that have vested interests / friends or sponsors on the Island who want these 2 boys found guily regardless of their guilt or innocense.

The (small) group of individuals who actually think the Bibs have done a 'perfect job' on this case as complimented by their commander.

There is no interesection between the first group and the other 2 ........ so it's best just to smile and nod. No point getting all upset about it and being insulting to the others. You are just not in group 1.

... or to maybe re-state Group 1: A group that see a cover up, corruption, and injustice on a grand scale although it may turn out that there was not a cover up, corruption, and injustice on a grand scale.

Check: JLCrab not group 1. Got it.

[JLCrab]

Not 2 or 3 either.

[boomerangutang]

I'd like to see the photos again, of the crime scene (perhaps someone could post 'em). From recollection, David's shorts were laid out flat on the sand, and they were not near Hannah (her body's final position). According to the RTP scenario, the two went to the rocky area, took their clothes off to have sex. Few observers believe that, but let's play along with what the RTP want us to believe. If a man is taking his clothes off to commence to have sex (as an aside: most men would not take all their clothes off on a public beach in that scenario, but that's a side issue) ....the man would very unlikely take his shorts and lay them flat on the sand, several meters from where the woman is. If a man took off his shorts, he would either drop them on the ground in a lump or put them up on the rock. It's just one more, of the hundreds of details which the RTP got wrong. Whether by stupidity or by scheming, we may never know.

Miller's shorts were not laid flat on the sand, you continue to make things up in order to create fanciful and fictitious scenarios; like the idea that someone took the time to was his clothes and return them to the crime scene, utterly ridiculous.

Ridiculous if you want it to be. However, if you study crime scenarios, you'll find that many things happen which you would call 'ridiculous.' People getting stuck in chimneys when robbing a house, a guy jumps in a cess pool in order to avoid capture, two guys with just body-armor standing in the open and having a shoot-out with 30 armed policemen - ....crime brings out weird behavior in desperate people. Try not to be so self-limiting in your perspective.

How else to you explain a man's clothing being spotless, after being brutally attacked and cut all over his torso, and bashed on the head? .....ok, unless he was nude to begin with, but that's not necessarily so, unless you choose to believe, hook-line-and-sinker the reenactment orchestrated by the RTP.

[boomerangutang]

Yes! And a couple days later they were released because their DNA Samples did not match.

And unlike the Accused!

http://www.chiangraitimes.com/police-release-suspects-in-murder-of-two-brits-in-koh-tao.html

Wrong. Nomsod was in the clear days before his DNA was taken, typed (very quickly!) , and found not to match DNA found in/on Hannah. Indeed, Nomsod was cleared on the bases of two still 'grabs' (waved around by his lawyer) taken from questionable CCTV footage taken in Bkk, nearly 5 hours after the crime. I don't think the RTP themselves ever declared it was not Nomsod on the island CCTV minutes after the crime. Though RTP did claim they were sure it was him earlier. If anyone can source a quote where RTP claim it WAS NOT him on the island CCTV, please let us know.

[berybert]

I hope these have been resized properly.

Blood everywhere but none on the shirt.

For goldbuggy here is a picture of the hoe he claims was washed and had no blood on it

Finally the police made the lads wear helmets to save them from being attacked by people throwing rocks. But knew no one thought they guilty so were not worried about people throwing rocks and didn't bother wearing helmets themselves.

Edited May 6, 2015 by berybert

[jdinasia]

Again - you have no idea how much investigation went into clearing suspects. You are deliberately leaving out the University documents etc.

Why? Obsession

[boomerangutang]

"the initial DNA samples held in the Headman's fridge until forensics arrived"

Even if that is true, and there's only Boomerangutang's fertile imagination to back it up, the forensic examinations were not done in Koh Tao, so it's a moot point.

"It is not beyond reason that scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image. It's happened before"

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated.

First off, AleG, you're wrong again. I didn't broach the claim; DNA samples or bodily fluids were stored in the H's fridge. I heard about it from other posters in prior posts. Be careful who you attribute quotes to.

Secondly, AleG asks;

"when and where scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image."[/i]

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated."

Look up Kirsty Jones, year 2000, Chiang Mai. RTP tried desperately to get a hill tribe man to be a scapegoat. Thankfully, it backfired, when the hilltriber was able to get a lawyer in the nick of time. Every keen observer of that case can see there are two Thai men (one a cop) who should be prime suspects. Did Chiang Mai cops do a good investigative job. Emphatic NO!

[mcm991]

Again - you have no idea how much investigation went into clearing suspects. You are deliberately leaving out the University documents etc.

Why? Obsession

It is a Group 1 thing, JD.

We've been over it all 1000 times ....... you believe the official version ... others not.

You believe that Nomsod was not on the island but others don't. You believe the Bibs are credible - others not.

I'm not sure there is any value left in going over it all again but obviously there is enough there to keep the doubters posting.

Permit me to have a little chuckle at your calling Boomer 'obsessive' - coming from you with more than 21,000 posts .......

[boomerangutang]

Again - you have no idea how much investigation went into clearing suspects. You are deliberately leaving out the University documents etc.

Why? Obsession

Nomsod could have gotten off with a street vendor saying she saw him buy some fried crickets at 8 am that morning. Come on, JD, do you think he and his lawyer needed any solid evidence to get him off the hook? And what about his g.f. who couldn't contact him for the entire night on Sunday? People they know say they're nearly inseparable, and always know where the other is. There are probably more proofs which put doubt on his flimsy alibi, but special interests are doing all they can to keep them from the light of day. He's as free as a bird and can never be further investigated. Aren't you happy about that? Rejoice.

[jdinasia]

Again - you have no idea how much investigation went into clearing suspects. You are deliberately leaving out the University documents etc.

Why? Obsession

Nomsod could have gotten off with a street vendor saying she saw him buy some fried crickets at 8 am that morning. Come on, JD, do you think he and his lawyer needed any solid evidence to get him off the hook? And what about his g.f. who couldn't contact him for the entire night on Sunday? People they know say they're nearly inseparable, and always know where the other is. There are probably more proofs which put doubt on his flimsy alibi, but special interests are doing all they can to keep them from the light of day. He's as free as a bird and can never be further investigated. Aren't you happy about that? Rejoice.

Relying on FB assertions again.

How many times did you say that the police theory changed after Panya was promoted?

You have no idea what was investigated, Nor do you know what exculpatory evidence was given to the police. What you do know is what his lawyer presented to the press.

You simply don't have the right to the private details of someone's life.

Edited May 6, 2015 by jdinasia

[berybert]

Again - you have no idea how much investigation went into clearing suspects. You are deliberately leaving out the University documents etc.

Why? Obsession

For every post Boomer makes about Nomsod you make one defending him.

Why ? Obsession

[boomerangutang]

I got to thinking about the tragic death and near-as-tragic fumbling/cover-up of the Kirsty Jones case (Chiang Mai, 2000). Here's the lead in to an article published in 2013 about it. It doesn't take a genius to see the similarities with this KT case, and how these sorts of lamentations (from victims' family members) should be expected as the months roll by, and Brit authorities continue to sit on their hands. Excerpt below. . . .

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

CHIANG MAI – The mother of a murdered backpacker has urged the Foreign and Commonwealth Office to do more to help families whose relatives are killed abroad. Kirsty Jones, 23, from Tredomen, near Brecon, Powys was raped and strangled in Thailand in 2000.

She was travelling around the world, when she was murdered in Chiang Mai Thailand. Sue Jones is annoyed she has had no response to a Freedom of Information request to have murder investigation files released. The FCO said it would meet any family concerned about a death overseas. Mrs Jones supported a protest by about 20 families, in a similar situation to her, outside the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in London on Wednesday.

‘Ridiculous’ She said. She had been trying to persuade the Foreign Office to release documents relating to her daughter’s murder for six months, but UK government officials had claimed the information could harm diplomatic relations or prejudice a future court case.

“As far as I’m concerned communication is their (the Foreign Office’s) biggest problem,” said Mrs Jones.

“They can only do as much as they’re allowed to do but claiming that these documents could damage diplomatic relations is ridiculous." source

[boomerangutang]

Relying on FB assertions again.

For those of us seeking truth and justice, thank Bob for FB. Without FB we wouldn't have known so quickly that the RTP was trying to 'plant' false evidence hear the B's room. Without FB we wouldn't have seen those photos of H's people (M and 'Stingray Man') proudly sporting shark tooth rings - the type of weapon which fits with David's wounds.

How many times did you say that the police theory changed after Panya was promoted?

I had initially mentioned it, yes. Then was corrected and realized I was off by a couple of days. I admitted it and have posted a slightly more accurate assessment since then, a number of times. It's interesting that you admit 'the police theory changed', at least we can agree on that. Anyone who knows anything about Thailand knows that most, if not all serious political matters stem from Bangkok. Top players in Bkk had taken a keen interest in this case from the get-go (the PM himself had made public comments often). The top cop in Bkk also let his opinions be known. Much pressure from Bangkok on poor Panya to alter the course of his investigation:

'Don't focus on the H's people. Find others to nail, and do it quick! Because the longer this drags out (no indictments) the worse it is for Ko Toa's and Thailand's tourist image!' (or words to that effect).

Panya complied, but days later, his superior officer appointed himself anyway. Panya was ushered to a desk job, never to heard of again in regard to this case. Smiles all around.

If I was leading the defense team, the first person I'd call would be Panya. I don't think he was doing a great job in his 10 days or so at the helm of the investigation, but he wasn't orchestrating a cover-up - as his replacements appear to be doing.

[jdinasia]

LOL

[boomerangutang]

CHIANG MAI – The mother of a murdered backpacker has urged the Foreign and Commonwealth Office to do more to help families whose relatives are killed abroad. Kirsty Jones, 23, from Tredomen, near Brecon, Powys was raped and strangled in Thailand in 2000.

She was travelling around the world, when she was murdered in Chiang Mai Thailand. Sue Jones is annoyed she has had no response to a Freedom of Information request to have murder investigation files released. The FCO said it would meet any family concerned about a death overseas. Mrs Jones supported a protest by about 20 families, in a similar situation to her, outside the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in London on Wednesday.

‘Ridiculous’ She said. She had been trying to persuade the Foreign Office to release documents relating to her daughter’s murder for six months, but UK government officials had claimed the information could harm diplomatic relations or prejudice a future court case.

“As far as I’m concerned communication is their (the Foreign Office’s) biggest problem,” said Mrs Jones.

“They can only do as much as they’re allowed to do but claiming that these documents could damage diplomatic relations is ridiculous." source

Sorry to harp on a prior case, but each time I read the article above, I see clearer how it relates to this KT case. No official has yet said that the Brit FCO is playing diplomatic ping pong with the KT case (by withholding evidence), but it could digress to that. Already the PMs from both countries have met face to face to discuss the KT case. How many other discussions in diplomatic circles have there been? We don't know. But indications are as follows:

Diplomatic relations between UK and Thailand trump a thorough investigation in to the deaths of two young Britons. In other words, if there are indications of a cover-up or foul-play by Thai authorities, the Brits would rather not expose it - which would result in diplomatic unease. Thai officials have made it crystal clear how important it is to them to not lose face and not have their desired result (guilt for the B2) blown-out-of-the-water by anyone. Brits have made it clear they don't want to rock any Thai boats.

[boomerangutang]

LOL

Glad I could get you to laugh out loud.

[AleG]

Yes! And a couple days later they were released because their DNA Samples did not match.

And unlike the Accused!

http://www.chiangraitimes.com/police-release-suspects-in-murder-of-two-brits-in-koh-tao.html

Wrong. Nomsod was in the clear days before his DNA was taken, typed (very quickly!) , and found not to match DNA found in/on Hannah. Indeed, Nomsod was cleared on the bases of two still 'grabs' (waved around by his lawyer) taken from questionable CCTV footage taken in Bkk, nearly 5 hours after the crime. I don't think the RTP themselves ever declared it was not Nomsod on the island CCTV minutes after the crime. Though RTP did claim they were sure it was him earlier. If anyone can source a quote where RTP claim it WAS NOT him on the island CCTV, please let us know.

You know this not to be true:

"Nomsod was cleared on the bases of two still 'grabs' (waved around by his lawyer) taken from questionable CCTV footage"

Therefore you are deliberately lying with an intention to deceive.

The police had the full footage from many different cameras in Nomsod's dormitory to prove he was not in Koh Tao at the time of the murder, also statements and documents from the University placing him there at that time.

Here's the full footage I referred to, as examined in full by journalists:

[AleG]

"the initial DNA samples held in the Headman's fridge until forensics arrived"

Even if that is true, and there's only Boomerangutang's fertile imagination to back it up, the forensic examinations were not done in Koh Tao, so it's a moot point.

"It is not beyond reason that scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image. It's happened before"

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated.

First off, AleG, you're wrong again. I didn't broach the claim; DNA samples or bodily fluids were stored in the H's fridge. I heard about it from other posters in prior posts. Be careful who you attribute quotes to.

Secondly, AleG asks;

"when and where scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image."[/i]

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated."

Look up Kirsty Jones, year 2000, Chiang Mai. RTP tried desperately to get a hill tribe man to be a scapegoat. Thankfully, it backfired, when the hilltriber was able to get a lawyer in the nick of time. Every keen observer of that case can see there are two Thai men (one a cop) who should be prime suspects. Did Chiang Mai cops do a good investigative job. Emphatic NO!

And the source of your "factoid" about the headman's fridge is what? Someone somewhere said it on a forum so you just take it as true and run with it? Pathetic.

So, the "it happened before" is a single example of it not happening before. Great work.

[jdinasia]

LOL

Glad I could get you to laugh out loud.

Your willingness to commit defamation really did make me laugh out loud.

[AleG]

I'd like to see the photos again, of the crime scene (perhaps someone could post 'em). From recollection, David's shorts were laid out flat on the sand, and they were not near Hannah (her body's final position). According to the RTP scenario, the two went to the rocky area, took their clothes off to have sex. Few observers believe that, but let's play along with what the RTP want us to believe. If a man is taking his clothes off to commence to have sex (as an aside: most men would not take all their clothes off on a public beach in that scenario, but that's a side issue) ....the man would very unlikely take his shorts and lay them flat on the sand, several meters from where the woman is. If a man took off his shorts, he would either drop them on the ground in a lump or put them up on the rock. It's just one more, of the hundreds of details which the RTP got wrong. Whether by stupidity or by scheming, we may never know.

Miller's shorts were not laid flat on the sand, you continue to make things up in order to create fanciful and fictitious scenarios; like the idea that someone took the time to was his clothes and return them to the crime scene, utterly ridiculous.

Ridiculous if you want it to be. However, if you study crime scenarios, you'll find that many things happen which you would call 'ridiculous.' People getting stuck in chimneys when robbing a house, a guy jumps in a cess pool in order to avoid capture, two guys with just body-armor standing in the open and having a shoot-out with 30 armed policemen - ....crime brings out weird behavior in desperate people. Try not to be so self-limiting in your perspective.

How else to you explain a man's clothing being spotless, after being brutally attacked and cut all over his torso, and bashed on the head? .....ok, unless he was nude to begin with, but that's not necessarily so, unless you choose to believe, hook-line-and-sinker the reenactment orchestrated by the RTP.

Taking the shirt of the dead body, washing it up until there is absolutely no incriminating evidence, drying it up, bringing it back to the crime scene and laying in there in the space of two or three hours without leaving a trace or being seen by anyone all for... reasons, is not weird beheaviour, it's baseless, absurd nonsense.

"How else to you explain a man's clothing being spotless, after being brutally attacked and cut all over his torso, and bashed on the head?"

Because he was not wearing it at the time he was in a secluded spot with an attractive woman... oh wait, what was I thinking that is implausible according to you.

[catsanddogs]

LOL

Glad I could get you to laugh out loud.

Or is the message Lots of Love?

[boomerangutang]

"the initial DNA samples held in the Headman's fridge until forensics arrived"

Even if that is true, and there's only Boomerangutang's fertile imagination to back it up, the forensic examinations were not done in Koh Tao, so it's a moot point.

"It is not beyond reason that scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image. It's happened before"

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated.

First off, AleG, you're wrong again. I didn't broach the claim; DNA samples or bodily fluids were stored in the H's fridge. I heard about it from other posters in prior posts. Be careful who you attribute quotes to.

Secondly, AleG asks;

"when and where scapegoats had to be found to protect its tourist image."[/i]

Yes, when and where? I heard that argument repeated often, never heard it substantiated."

Look up Kirsty Jones, year 2000, Chiang Mai. RTP tried desperately to get a hill tribe man to be a scapegoat. Thankfully, it backfired, when the hilltriber was able to get a lawyer in the nick of time. Every keen observer of that case can see there are two Thai men (one a cop) who should be prime suspects. Did Chiang Mai cops do a good investigative job. Emphatic NO!

And the source of your "factoid" about the headman's fridge is what? Someone somewhere said it on a forum so you just take it as true and run with it? Pathetic.

So, the "it happened before" is a single example of it not happening before. Great work.

A few posters mentioned it. I subsequently mentioned it. Make of it what you want. It's obvious you don't like the assertion, Mr. rolleyes. Everything everyone mentions on this topic, are things we heard or saw from somewhere, unless any of us were at the scene of the crime on that fateful night. We could play a little game, and pretend that no one died, no CCTV was ever taken or shown, no police were involved, no Burmese were involved, and it's all a giant ruse, like the people who believe the moon landings were all faked in a studio.

If someone wants to only believe the things which dovetail with the scenario he wants to see, that's his choice. In contrast, I look at all the data, and decide from there what's plausible and what's not.

[boomerangutang]

Taking the shirt of the dead body, washing it up until there is absolutely no incriminating evidence, drying it up, bringing it back to the crime scene and laying in there in the space of two or three hours without leaving a trace or being seen by anyone all for... reasons, is not weird beheaviour, it's baseless, absurd nonsense.

"How else to you explain a man's clothing being spotless, after being brutally attacked and cut all over his torso, and bashed on the head?"

Because he was not wearing it at the time he was in a secluded spot with an attractive woman... oh wait, what was I thinking that is implausible according to you.

words added by AleG, attributed to Bmrgtang: "....until there is absolutely no incriminating evidence,"

Please don't add words to my quote, and then proceed to comment.

It is not weird behavior for a criminal to try and clean or destroy incriminating evidence.

Again, AleG adds his own embellishments to what someone else wrote: "....and laying in there in the space of two or three hours without leaving a trace or being seen by anyone all for..."

I believe the cops cordoned off the site (except for Mon traipsing in and out) close to noon (11 a.m?). That's 6+ hours after the crime, and several hours after the sun came up. Washing by hand was all that was needed (8 minutes?), no drying machine. No one but yourself said such a person (cleaning and returning evidence) was not seen by anyone. Do you want to embellish my proposed scenario further? Mon is show walking over the crime scene, sometimes in a hurry, and pointing things out to others on the scene. Mon, by his own admission was one of the first to see the crime scene after the crime, if we're to believe his claim of him being 'running man'. I don't believe he's 'running man' (readers know who I think that person is), but it's possible he was at the crime scene just after the crime. If so, it could have been just before sun-up. If you want to contradict Mon, go ahead.

Maybe I'm all wrong on the washing evidence idea. It's a proposed scenario by a poster on T.Visa. AleG asks "reasons?". Simple answer: if a person commits a murder, that person will not want incriminating evidence at the site - such evidence as blood, fingerprints, hair, dandruff, spittle, on victim's clothing which could incriminate. Any more questions?