Government concerned with foreigners being ripped off by Thai hospitals

[NoshowJones]

Listen up folks, NO hospital requires that you use their services. You have no reason to bitch. Your not forced into anything.

You can't be forced into anything if your unconscious which is often the case.

[Pimay1]

one very common practice is to vastly overcharge for medicine at the pharmacy. Every hospital I have been to does the same thing, ... the doctor prescribes some medication and you go to the cashier and pay, then receive the medicine from the pharmacy. I have stopped getting mecication at hospital pharmacies and request a prescription from the doctor then buy the medication at an outside pharmacy. One medication I got cost 1,800 baht for 60 days worth. The second time, I got a prescription and bought the same medication for the same length of time for 180 baht!!!

Like a lot of us old farts I have benign prostatic hyperplasia (BPH) or enlarged prostate. I've had it for years. I take finasteride 5mg daily which keeps it under control. The cheapest I could find at any pharmacy is 1,000 Baht for a thirty day supply. Last month I checked at the local government hospital pharmacy and it is 435 Baht for one month supply. Of course I had to wait an hour to see a doctor for a prescription but it was well worth it.The doctor agreed to write a one year renewable prescription.

[SKguy]

I think not only are they over charging but they are in some cases advising people towards treatments that may not be required and expensive hospital stays that are also not generally required, unfortunately everybody knows full well that Thailand has a tendency for ripping foreigners off and medical treatment is also included

and don't go quoting prices from your home countries - this is Thailand not the US or UK, it is a 3rd world country were "Rip Off" is the primary objective

I was treated negligently and given totally inappropriate, dangerous treatment in Chiang Mai, the awful side effects for which I am currently undergoing tests and needing treatment in the UK. When I returned to the hospital in question to show them the results of a canular being literally shoved right through a vein in my hand, I was prescribed some cream which I was asked to pay for and which was totally ineffective anyway. The cost of the "treatment" was exorbitant by Thai standards.

[lujanit]

If you are an expat living in Thailand you damn well know there is a two tier pricing structure targeting foreigners. So stop bitching about it! Get your Thai wife, girlfriend or significant other to negotiate the finance side of your treatment.

[easybullet3]

In and out of the hospital within forty-five minutes and all for 1300 baht, which included consultation and antibiotics. ...... a reasonable amount.

If we want to talk about expensive private treatment in the UK then we can talk all day. Thailand comes no where near.

Should this not be done while also looking at what costs are to locals as well as underlying costs to hospitals. Since the data is so similar and would give a better picture of costs if public health if correlated with numbers of each type of visit or stay.

The title should read Tourists, not foreigners. There are many foreigners living here that are never ripped off by hospitals.

The only one ever to rip me off was Bamrungrad, but they rip off Thais and foreigners.

From my experience:

i have TWICE come across a situation where i was given a FOREIGN PRICE (as supposed to the THAI PRICE).

Samitivej Hospital (Sukhumvit) and Piyavate Hospital (Rama 9) DEFINITELY charged me a Foreign price which was exactly Double of the Thai Price. In BOTH cases I complained and they reduced my bill to the Thai Price.

I had my thai friend check the prices by phone BEFORE going to the hospital... so that is how I realized I was given a Foreign Price by Samitivej and Piyavate.

I am sure that this is done by MANY hospitals all over Thailand.

i THINK that Bumrungrad and Bangkok Hospital DO NOT do this. They will charge the SAME price to Thais and Foreigners.

Lower Class Thai people dont go to Bumrungrad or Bangkok Hospital. (on the middle-class and wealthy Thais will go there)

By the way: while we are here talking about hospitals in Bangkok: DONT EVER GO TO "MISSION HOSPITAL" (Bangkok Adventist Hospital) - its right at the bottom of Petchaburi road (on the way to KhaoSarn). i had TWO wrong diagnosis there.. and my Australian friend had a SERIOUS wrong diagnosis there... AND a German friend told me about a wrong diagnosis he had there!!!! (i can safely say that the doctors at Mission Hospital are shocking!!) just out of grad-school.. (and most likely the worst grad schools in the country). However,, if you get a foreign doctor there, then its ok. - just dont accept any thai doctor at Mission Hospital.

[superal]

Important information

You can have the best medical insurance going and if you have a medical problem your insurance company will normally elect one of their preferred private hospitals . However , I had a severe abdominal/chest pain that turned into an emergency. I live in a north east Thai province that has only one government hospital . On admission I was given morphine and then ultrasonics as a gall bladder stone was suspected but not found . Doctor said tomorrow we go for a CT Scan 34 km away . Transport by one of those people mover type ambulances which was a nightmare as I felt every bump in the road . On return to the first hospital I struggled but managed to contact my UK insurers ( no other person capable of conversing in English ) who in turn contacted their Thai agent who phoned me . He said the hospital admin were not interested in speaking to him , would not divulge any medical information or the scan results . He wanted me to be transferred to Bangkok , a 5 or 6 hour journey and had transport arranged .I said not a chance in my condition . Stayed 2 nights VIP at the Government hospital who gave me continuous morphine , antibiotics, antiinflammatory plus saline drip . Doctor unable to diagnose problem but miraculously the symptoms subsided to almost zero in the small hours of day 3 to the extent that I was able to discharge myself that day . Have a follow up appointment in 3 days time . I have received 3 further calls from the UK insurers medical team for updates on my condition and the invitation for the Bangkok hospital remains open if needed. Total cost so far 15,000bht .

I certainly would not call it a rip off bill with all the care and investigations that were given . However what does concern me is the location that I stay at . Food for thought

[Pimay1]

In January I was in the Queen Sirikit Heart Hospital in Khon Khan for nine days. Angioplasty was performed and two stents were placed in my arteries. All state of the art equipment and total professional service. I was awake during the entire procedure. They even gave me a DVD of the procedure which was split between four large monitors. I was well satisfied with everything including the total cost which was approximately USD 6,800.

I'm glad you're satisfied. That's a nice confirmation of something called "the placebo effect".

UNFORTUNATELY, there is no clinical evidence that shows any survival benefit of elective angioplasty as compared with medication.

http://harvardmagazine.com/2013/03/a-cardiac-conundrum

And I doubt there is any clinical evidence that shows medication is superior to lifestyle changes (diet, exercise, meditation).

But the average heart patient doesn't want to give up smoking and exercise for hours everyday and eat raw salads and do yoga.

Because they don't "want to".

So, there you have it folks. Many people with angioplasty go back for seconds, thirds, fourths, 5555. Why? Because they haven't solved the root cause of their CVD=genetics+lifestyle.

I'm quite sure my lifestyle was the major cause of my issue and if I had been following proper diet and excercise I would have probably not had any issues. But the morning I went to the hospital my heart rate was 175 and totally unstable. My bp was 60/42 and I was literally gasping for breath. Both main arteries had an 80% blockage. It was simply too late for lifestyle changes. Since then I am on a strict diet and excercise program plus medication to control cholesterol and other things. No cigarettes or beer. Hopefully this is the correct solution and no more angioplasty for me.

By the way, that is a great article. Thanks for posting the link.

[lee b]

Never happened to me, so i can't really say, but I could belive its not just foreigners if this happens it would be everyone.

[TheWizardofRnR]

Every time I have been in a Hospital in Thailand which is 4 or 5 Stays over 29 years, I have caught stuff on the Bill that was never given to me , usually it was ordered already but never given to me, Charging me but not taking it off my Bill when not used , and I am sure it either disappeared except that I noticed , and it had to be returned by whatever Person had helped themselves to my un-used Medication. If you don't need Oxygen ,its not free , it will be on your Bill , so pass on it if your not insured , if you don't need it !

[Jonmarleesco]

The largest chunk is in medications which are typically more than twice what one would pay in a good Thai pharmacy. But when you're an in-patient, it's a little difficult to tell the staff you'll buy from an external pharmacy.

[SABloke]

Why is it OK to overcharge foreigners 10 times at national parks while hospitals can't overcharge us?

Is that pure Thainess?

They don't, they give residents(including foreigners) discount like most countries, certainly my one, UK an America.

Not anymore. It's up to the whim of the person at the gate and officially work permit carrying foreigners DO NOT qualify for Thai price

[rijit]

Wonder if they'll also give thought to the Re-Introduction of a Thai Government Health Insurance Scheme for EXPATS, such as the one that was dumped last year?

Was it good value for money?

[gandalf12]

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It isnt always the hospitals that are ripping you off. A fw years ago in the UK a doctor gave a prescription for some medicine to a patient. The paient went to the nearest pharmacist and handed the prescription over. The pharmicist looked at it and told the customer "If i give you what is on here it will cost you £45. If you look over on thee second row of shelves you can get the same and I will charge £2.75, it is upto you". The customer obviously went and picked the items off the shelf and paid the couple of pounds. Because the pharmicist had not charged the customer the prive for the prescription he was taken to court and heavily fined.

Moral is, sometimes it is others imposing a price not always the hospital or doctor

This story is nonsense and could not possibly have happened,here is why: 90% of UK Prescriptions are free! All Prescriptions have a maximum fixed price, for the coming April 2015 the maximum price has gone up to £8.20. So the ones that pay for their prescriptions,will only ever pay a maximum of £8.20! which is also the maximum a Pharmacist can charge in the UK!

It happened in the UK. I suggest if you dont believe it try googling it. You can believe wat you want as you are not the know all of everything. Sorry to spoil your party butt get the facts before you come out with such rubbish. I agree it sounds crazy butt it happened.

[rijit]

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It isnt always the hospitals that are ripping you off. A fw years ago in the UK a doctor gave a prescription for some medicine to a patient. The paient went to the nearest pharmacist and handed the prescription over. The pharmicist looked at it and told the customer "If i give you what is on here it will cost you £45. If you look over on thee second row of shelves you can get the same and I will charge £2.75, it is upto you". The customer obviously went and picked the items off the shelf and paid the couple of pounds. Because the pharmicist had not charged the customer the prive for the prescription he was taken to court and heavily fined.

Moral is, sometimes it is others imposing a price not always the hospital or doctor

This story is nonsense and could not possibly have happened,here is why: 90% of UK Prescriptions are free! All Prescriptions have a maximum fixed price, for the coming April 2015 the maximum price has gone up to £8.20. So the ones that pay for their prescriptions,will only ever pay a maximum of £8.20! which is also the maximum a Pharmacist can charge in the UK!

It happened in the UK. I suggest if you dont believe it try googling it. You can believe wat you want as you are not the know all of everything. Sorry to spoil your party butt get the facts before you come out with such rubbish. I agree it sounds crazy butt it happened.

Yeah my doctor normally tells me if its cheaper to buy them from the shelf. But perscriptions, when u pay for them which i do/ did u pay 8 ,25 £ per item so it can amount up.

[Liquorice]

It isnt always the hospitals that are ripping you off. A fw years ago in the UK a doctor gave a prescription for some medicine to a patient. The paient went to the nearest pharmacist and handed the prescription over. The pharmicist looked at it and told the customer "If i give you what is on here it will cost you £45. If you look over on thee second row of shelves you can get the same and I will charge £2.75, it is upto you". The customer obviously went and picked the items off the shelf and paid the couple of pounds. Because the pharmicist had not charged the customer the prive for the prescription he was taken to court and heavily fined.

Moral is, sometimes it is others imposing a price not always the hospital or doctor

This story is nonsense and could not possibly have happened,here is why: 90% of UK Prescriptions are free! All Prescriptions have a maximum fixed price, for the coming April 2015 the maximum price has gone up to £8.20. So the ones that pay for their prescriptions,will only ever pay a maximum of £8.20! which is also the maximum a Pharmacist can charge in the UK!

The charge is £8.20 per item. So if a prescription has 3 items the cost would be £24.60.

Sometimes the items will be cheaper to buy of the shelf, in that case the pharmacist will usually notify you of that fact.

Only people over 60 or on benefits are exempt from paying for prescriptions so your figure of 90% free is way off target.

You can sometimes reduce what you pay be talking with your GP.

I used to get Nicorette gum. 2 x boxes of 140 pieces for a fortnights supply. 2 x items at prescription costs.

After speaking with my GP he changed the prescription to a months supply of 480 pieces (one item) so I only paid one charge.

[Liquorice]

Great.. the general cares at least, can't say I ever seen the previous government care about us.

He must understand that most guys that live here prefer him over the old government (except a vocal minority).

Of course hospitals rip of foreigners its common knowledge. Part of the reason why i got insurance.

If he would really care, he would reinstate the "Health Card for Foreigner" which was scrapped last year.

That scheme still runs for the people who it was aimed at, Lao, Cambodian and Myanmar workers.

Because of some poorly worded guidelines that was misinterpreted by many hospitals it was wrongly offered to ALL foreigners.

When the error was discovered the hospitals then refused to reoffer it other than for those it was meant for.

[PattayaPhom]

I can only comment on our own personal experience with private Thai hospitals and coincidentally that was today.

My wife woke up this morning and found blood in her urine on her first toilet call. We promptly visited Bangkok Hospital in PHS and the service was efficient, friendly and affordable.

In and out of the hospital within forty-five minutes and all for 1300 baht, which included consultation and antibiotics. No requirement to fall back on our travel insurance for such a reasonable amount.

If we want to talk about expensive private treatment in the UK then we can talk all day. Thailand comes no where near.

I am privately covered by my employer in the UK and no way could I afford it without their generosity.

The UK offers the International Health Service so no requirement for anyone to pay except for prescriptions which most are subsidized due to benefit claiming. The same health service is not available in Thailand so people are forced to private hospitols such as BKK. Your 1,300 is a light payment, many others are forced to pay hundreds of thousands for a short stay.

[Liquorice]

I can only comment on our own personal experience with private Thai hospitals and coincidentally that was today.

My wife woke up this morning and found blood in her urine on her first toilet call. We promptly visited Bangkok Hospital in PHS and the service was efficient, friendly and affordable.

In and out of the hospital within forty-five minutes and all for 1300 baht, which included consultation and antibiotics. No requirement to fall back on our travel insurance for such a reasonable amount.

If we want to talk about expensive private treatment in the UK then we can talk all day. Thailand comes no where near.

I am privately covered by my employer in the UK and no way could I afford it without their generosity.

The UK offers the International Health Service so no requirement for anyone to pay except for prescriptions which most are subsidized due to benefit claiming. The same health service is not available in Thailand so people are forced to private hospitols such as BKK. Your 1,300 is a light payment, many others are forced to pay hundreds of thousands for a short stay.

I'm sure it was an oversight PP, but the UK offers a National not International Health Service

[Liquorice]

If you register at a Government hospital (only passport required) you can that get consultations, treatment and medication for the same cost as Thais. 20 baht. Not saying it's right, but it works for now.

Know one expat who goes 3 times a week for physio and pain killers for a shoulder injury.

Each visit he is charged 20baht for an hour of physio and medication.

I have only used it once. 20baht for consultation and medication.

[Godders]

The title should read Tourists, not foreigners. There are many foreigners living here that are never ripped off by hospitals.

The only one ever to rip me off was Bamrungrad, but they rip off Thais and foreigners.

Hope you know a good defamation defence lawyer.

[BernieOnTour]

Just three months ago I had to have minor surgery and of course I asked at one of the International hospitals in Bangkok how much it would cost.

I was quoted 300,000 Baht for the surgery, with one night in hospital. Thinking it was a quite expensive, I asked at a well known Thai hospital how much they would charge. They quoted 90,000 Baht for the same operation.

I accepted the second hospital and a few days later the International hospital called me to ask if I was interested in the operation. I told them that I had received a better offer. The woman asked if I lived in Thailand (the whole conversation was in Thai!). When I replied that I did, her reply was Oh, then we can give you a better price. and went down to 150,000 baht.

I had the operation at the second hospital and was very pleased with everything.

No more International hospitals in Bangkok for me.

Sounds like Bamrungrad - thieving barstewards.

It's a pity because when it opened, Bamrungrad was an excellent hospital with affordable prices. Unfortunately, in the last ten to fifteen years it has acquired a reputation as probably the most rapacious of all Bangkok's private hospitals - and that's saying something

10-15 years ago? Is that the time, when they changed to American management, the group medical director being American?

Options, options, options. Nothing better employee stock options!

... In this special case, I tend to assume more American hospital style greed, than Thai greed.

[Godders]

If you register at a Government hospital (only passport required) you can that get consultations, treatment and medication for the same cost as Thais. 20 baht. Not saying it's right, but it works for now.

Know one expat who goes 3 times a week for physio and pain killers for a shoulder injury.

Each visit he is charged 20baht for an hour of physio and medication.

I have only used it once. 20baht for consultation and medication.

Uplifting news, if you are right, for expat retirees who are too old or impoverished for private medical insurance and ineligible for free treatment on the NHS (despite a lifetime's National Insurance contributions and still paying tax on UK pensions!).

I was under the impression that the universal healthcare scheme introduced by Thaksin Shinawatra was for Thais only and, in any cases, I am perfectly happy, as someone who has never contributed to the scheme, to continue paying the relatively modest fees at my local government hospital. The facilities are pretty basic, but the doctors and nursing staff are efficient and friendly and it is a satisfactory option for non-serious conditions.

The majority of private hospitals I have visited outside Bangkok (where anything goes!) have reasonable charges for consultations and treatment but - like the private clinics found in most small towns as well as cities - tend to dispense unnecessary medication (pain killers, vitamin drinks etc) and charge far more for drugs than local pharmacies.

Self-medication, mercifully, is an inexpensive option here that is simply not available in the UK.

I shall be interested to see what, if any, impact, the General's makes on those ritzy private hospitals in Big Mango whose prices make you feel sicker on the way out than you were on the way in!

[mango66]

correct, they got it !

we feel ripped off,

and feel now pissed off !!

[mango66]

If you register at a Government hospital (only passport required) you can that get consultations, treatment and medication for the same cost as Thais. 20 baht. Not saying it's right, but it works for now.

Know one expat who goes 3 times a week for physio and pain killers for a shoulder injury.

Each visit he is charged 20baht for an hour of physio and medication.

I have only used it once. 20baht for consultation and medication.

Uplifting news, if you are right, for expat retirees who are too old or impoverished for private medical insurance and ineligible for free treatment on the NHS (despite a lifetime's National Insurance contributions and still paying tax on UK pensions!).

I was under the impression that the universal healthcare scheme introduced by Thaksin Shinawatra was for Thais only and, in any cases, I am perfectly happy, as someone who has never contributed to the scheme, to continue paying the relatively modest fees at my local government hospital. The facilities are pretty basic, but the doctors and nursing staff are efficient and friendly and it is a satisfactory option for non-serious conditions.

The majority of private hospitals I have visited outside Bangkok (where anything goes!) have reasonable charges for consultations and treatment but - like the private clinics found in most small towns as well as cities - tend to dispense unnecessary medication (pain killers, vitamin drinks etc) and charge far more for drugs than local pharmacies.

Self-medication, mercifully, is an inexpensive option here that is simply not available in the UK.

I shall be interested to see what, if any, impact, the General's makes on those ritzy private hospitals in Big Mango whose prices make you feel sicker on the way out than you were on the way in!

he will set up a commision which will look into the case !!

nothing else !!

Farongs are here to be milked !!

[harryfrompattaya]

Just three months ago I had to have minor surgery and of course I asked at one of the International hospitals in Bangkok how much it would cost.

I was quoted 300,000 Baht for the surgery, with one night in hospital. Thinking it was a quite expensive, I asked at a well known Thai hospital how much they would charge. They quoted 90,000 Baht for the same operation.

I accepted the second hospital and a few days later the International hospital called me to ask if I was interested in the operation. I told them that I had received a better offer. The woman asked if I lived in Thailand (the whole conversation was in Thai!). When I replied that I did, her reply was Oh, then we can give you a better price. and went down to 150,000 baht.

I had the operation at the second hospital and was very pleased with everything.

No more International hospitals in Bangkok for me.

Sounds like Bamrungrad - thieving barstewards.

It's a pity because when it opened, Bamrungrad was an excellent hospital with affordable prices. Unfortunately, in the last ten to fifteen years it has acquired a reputation as probably the most rapacious of all Bangkok's private hospitals - and that's saying something

10-15 years ago? Is that the time, when they changed to American management, the group medical director being American?

Options, options, options. Nothing better employee stock options!

... In this special case, I tend to assume more American hospital style greed, than Thai greed.

How did you think this up. The Hospital is run by Thai's run pure sample

Stop blaming America

Do you blame America even for being on the winning team that won World War II?

[chiang mai]

So much misinformation here:

https://www.bumrungrad.com/en/about-us/bumrungrad-factsheet

[SKguy]

If you're a foreigner, and in Chiang Mai, and want to be seriously overcharged for anything medical, simply go to Ram Hospital. You can go to Rajavaj, or McCormick for the same - if not better - treatment, for about half the price. Trust me, I've had the experience and know all about it.

You are spot on with your observation. I was treated negligently and with a highly toxic drug in intensive care at the Ram Hospital which could have cost me my life and for which I was seriously overcharged. A few months later I was treated at the Rajavej for exactly the same allergic reaction to MSG in restaurant food and given one tablet which did the trick with no side effects whatsoever. I am still being treated in England for the after effects of my "treatment" at the Ram. The attached photo was taken after a canular was "shoved" through a vein in my hand. The Ram wanted to charge me for some cream to apply to my hand which turned out to be utterly useless! The charges for one overnight stay and tests I didn't require were unbelievable.

[cumgranosalum]

If you're a foreigner, and in Chiang Mai, and want to be seriously overcharged for anything medical, simply go to Ram Hospital. You can go to Rajavaj, or McCormick for the same - if not better - treatment, for about half the price. Trust me, I've had the experience and know all about it.

You are spot on with your observation. I was treated negligently and with a highly toxic drug in intensive care at the Ram Hospital which could have cost me my life and for which I was seriously overcharged. A few months later I was treated at the Rajavej for exactly the same allergic reaction to MSG in restaurant food and given one tablet which did the trick with no side effects whatsoever. I am still being treated in England for the after effects of my "treatment" at the Ram. The attached photo was taken after a canular was "shoved" through a vein in my hand. The Ram wanted to charge me for some cream to apply to my hand which turned out to be utterly useless! The charges for one overnight stay and tests I didn't require were unbelievable.

An interesting anecdote...but there is one problem..

"'Chinese restaurant syndrome' has been thoroughly debunked (virtually all studies since then confirm that monosodium glutamate in normal concentrations has no effect on the overwhelming majority of people)". - the Guardian.

As with so many stories by laypersons there is often a gap between the story and science.

i would also recommend that this poster gets a second opinion about his condition.....it would seem all his practitioners might be barking up the wrong tree. and he may be getting pointless treatments......all of which cost money.

[Dario]

If you register at a Government hospital (only passport required) you can that get consultations, treatment and medication for the same cost as Thais. 20 baht. Not saying it's right, but it works for now.

Know one expat who goes 3 times a week for physio and pain killers for a shoulder injury.

Each visit he is charged 20baht for an hour of physio and medication.

I have only used it once. 20baht for consultation and medication.

This sounds interesting! Please tell us more about.

In post # 226 you admit that the Health Card for Foreigner had been a misinterpretation by most Thai hospitals. That scheme (now only for nationals of Laos, Cambodia & Myanmar) was the 30 Baht scheme.

Please tell us more. I am registered at several upcountry hospitals and was never told I would pay only 20 Baht for consultation, treatment and medication. Can you substantiate your claim with whatever makes your claim credible? I am sure that almost everyone on this forum without healh insurance wants to know about this.

[chiang mai]

It's nonsense, that scheme was suspended/cancelled for anyone other than regional workers, Myanmar and the like..