Motorcycle gang shootout in Waco, Texas started with parking dispute

[webfact]

Motorcycle gang shootout started with parking dispute
By EMILY SCHMALL

WACO, Texas (AP) — A deadly weekend shootout involving rival motorcycle gangs apparently began with a parking dispute and someone running over a gang member's foot, police said Tuesday.

Waco police Sgt. W. Patrick Swanton said an uninvited group appeared for Sunday's meeting of a loose confederation of biker gangs at a restaurant.

One man was injured when a vehicle rolled over his foot. That caused a dispute that continued inside the restaurant, where fighting and then shooting began, before the melee spilled back outside, Swanton said.

Authorities offered few details. It was not clear which gang was responsible for running over the biker's foot, or which gang the aggrieved biker belonged to.

When the shootout was over, nine people were dead and 18 wounded.

Police have said five biker gangs from across Texas had gathered in part to settle differences over turf.

Jimmy Graves, who described himself as an ambassador for the gang known as the Bandidos, disputed that claim, saying the groups had planned to discuss laws protecting motorcycle riders and other topics such as trademarks for club logos.

But he acknowledged that differences with other groups, such as the Cossacks, have been "simmering and brewing."

Another biker named Johnny Snyder said he was at the restaurant for a quarterly meeting to talk about legislative issues.

Snyder, a long-haul trucker, declined to describe what he saw inside the restaurant, saying he was only concerned with "not getting shot."

He is vice president of the Boozefighters Motorcycle Club in Waco, a group that Snyder says does charity events and family gatherings and is not a criminal gang.

About 50 weapons were confiscated, mostly knives and firearms, and Swanton said more than 100 weapons may be found once authorities are done analyzing the crime scene at the Twin Peaks restaurant, which is part of a national chain that features waitresses in revealing uniforms.

Preliminary autopsy results showed all nine of the dead were killed by gunshots. Many were hit in the head, neck, chest or torso. Most of the men were in their 40s, but they ranged in age from 27 to 65, according to reports released by a McLennan County justice of the peace.

Police have acknowledged firing on armed bikers, but it was unclear how many of the dead were shot by gang members and how many were shot by officers.

Of the injured, seven remain hospitalized. Swanton, who has been virtually the sole source of law enforcement information on the fight, described their conditions as stable.

He said the investigation is being hampered by witnesses who "are not being honest with us."

Police are concerned that the brawl will invite retaliation and more violence, Swanton said.

"We would encourage them to try to be a little peaceful and let the bloodshed stop," he said.

About 170 bikers have been charged with engaging in organized crime. Swanton said more arrests are likely.

Katie Rhoten, whose husband, Theron Rhoten, was taken into custody, said he told her by phone from jail that he and two other members of a motorcycle club called Vice Grip had just pulled up to the restaurant.

"They got off their bikes, and bullets were ricocheting all around them, so they ducked and ran for cover," she said in an interview.

When her husband, a mechanic from Austin, and the others went back to retrieve their motorcycles, they were detained by police.

"They were told they were being held for questioning and released, and they sat in the parking lot for three, four, five hours."

Then, she said, police "changed their mind and arrested everybody on the scene."

Officers took into custody all sorts of "nonviolent, noncriminal people. I mean they got the Bikers for Christ guys in there."

In a memo dated May 1, the Texas Department of Public Safety cautioned about increasing violence between the Bandidos and the Cossacks, Dallas TV station WFAA reported Monday.

The department's Joint Information Center bulletin said the tension could stem from Cossacks refusing to pay Bandidos dues for operating in Texas and for wearing a patch on their vest that claimed Texas as their turf without the Bandidos' approval.

"Traditionally, the Bandidos have been the dominant motorcycle club in Texas, and no other club is allowed to wear the Texas bar without their consent," the bulletin said, according to WFAA.

The bulletin said the FBI had received information that the Bandidos had discussed "going to war with Cossacks." It also outlined several recent incidents between the two groups, including one instance in March when about 10 Cossacks forced a Bandido to pull over along Interstate 35 near Waco and attacked him with "chains, batons and metal pipes before stealing his motorcycle," WFAA reported.

That same day, a group of Bandidos confronted a Cossack member fueling up at a truck stop in Palo Pinto County, west of Fort Worth, the bulletin said. When the Cossack member refused to remove the Texas patch from his vest, the Bandidos hit him in the head with a hammer and stole it.

The Department of Public Safety declined to release the bulletin to The Associated Press.

There are other documented instances of violence between the groups.

Last March, two members of the Bandidos were indicted in connection with the stabbing of two Cossacks at an Abilene steakhouse.

And in December, three Bandidos were arrested for a shooting at a Fort Worth motorcycle bar that left one dead and two others wounded. Fort Worth police said the victims were known members of a criminal motorcycle gang.

The Bandidos "constitute a growing criminal threat," the Justice Department said in a report on outlaw motorcycle gangs. The report said the Bandidos are involved in transporting and distributing cocaine and marijuana and in the production and distribution of methamphetamine.
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Associated Press writers David Warren in Dallas and Don Babwin in Chicago contributed to this report.

-- (c) Associated Press 2015-05-20

[NickJ]

I knew it was all just one big misunderstanding..........

[granuaile]

Seems like the police overreacted to some degree... I mean they were there and essentially joined the shootout. Charging everyone with engaging in organized crime? A gathering purportedly to discuss legal issues such as laws affecting bikers and individuals in clubs with names like Boozefighters (which sounds a bit like the Peacemakers in Ohio and Kentucky) hardly sounds like organized crime. A fight happened, escalated, but that is a barroom brawl gone awry and hardly organized crime. Additionally it seems they arrested everyone without regard as to whether they were involved in anything criminal or involved in the fight. Sounds like Deputy Bernie Fife got his gun in Waco.... Just being a biker doesn't make someone a criminal, being an outlaw biker doesn't make someone a criminal, drug dealer, or weapons marketeer...

[Ulic]

I thought Texas had a stand your ground law. That would make everyone innocent

as I understand it. If you are scared for you life you can draw and shoot. Obviously

I don't understand the law that well. Oh well. Lots of time for Johnny Law to straighten

things out.

[Bignose]

A shoot out like this every day of the week (and twice on Sunday's) would be just what the doctor ordered, with every single one of them killed by their opponents that is one less for the authorities to deal with.

They are the 1% of society who do do not wish to be part of that society, they contribute nothing and take what they can without remorse or conscience.

Free needles for junkies and free ammo for biker gangs, lets commandeer some paint ball ranges and pay these thugs to use them (only if we can substitute the paint balls for live rounds)

[lucky11]

I thought Texas had a stand your ground law. That would make everyone innocent

as I understand it. If you are scared for you life you can draw and shoot. Obviously

I don't understand the law that well. Oh well. Lots of time for Johnny Law to straighten

things out.

They were just playing cowboys and cowboys!!!

What is it with Waco - it should be pronounced Wacko!

[neverdie]

Seems like the police overreacted to some degree... I mean they were there and essentially joined the shootout. Charging everyone with engaging in organized crime? A gathering purportedly to discuss legal issues such as laws affecting bikers and individuals in clubs with names like Boozefighters (which sounds a bit like the Peacemakers in Ohio and Kentucky) hardly sounds like organized crime. A fight happened, escalated, but that is a barroom brawl gone awry and hardly organized crime. Additionally it seems they arrested everyone without regard as to whether they were involved in anything criminal or involved in the fight. Sounds like Deputy Bernie Fife got his gun in Waco.... Just being a biker doesn't make someone a criminal, being an outlaw biker doesn't make someone a criminal, drug dealer, or weapons marketeer...

You sound like a grubs apologist.

There's no excuse for a shootouts in a public place or anywhere for that matter.

Why don't you stick to nitting or whatever it is you do as your Policework is atrocious

[MaxYakov]

Seems like the police overreacted to some degree... I mean they were there and essentially joined the shootout. Charging everyone with engaging in organized crime? A gathering purportedly to discuss legal issues such as laws affecting bikers and individuals in clubs with names like Boozefighters (which sounds a bit like the Peacemakers in Ohio and Kentucky) hardly sounds like organized crime. A fight happened, escalated, but that is a barroom brawl gone awry and hardly organized crime. Additionally it seems they arrested everyone without regard as to whether they were involved in anything criminal or involved in the fight. Sounds like Deputy Bernie Fife got his gun in Waco.... Just being a biker doesn't make someone a criminal, being an outlaw biker doesn't make someone a criminal, drug dealer, or weapons marketeer...

And the weapons just magically appeared out of think air? I think you should do a tad more research.

You could start here.

Now the ones that survived have some serious "legal issues" to discuss, with their lawyers.

[jollyhangmon]

Hohoho, Bandidos & Cossacks, well apparently an IQ lower than a broomsticks is mandatory for membership ...

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.

This thread isn't about the NRA. Probably doesn't even have a great deal to do with gun control, since there is a good chance that some of these guys were felons and shouldn't have been in possession of a gun. Quite a few have been arrested and they will lose their right to have a gun if they are convicted of a serious enough offense.

I also note that knives and chains were used as weapons.

Please try to stay on topic.