Immigration Confirms The End Of Border Runs From Oct 1, 2006

[george]

The Nation update:

Thailand tightens re-entry rules for tourists

BANGKOK: -- Thailand will tighten its immigration rules for tourists who exploit visa free regulations, effective on October 1.

The move will affect tourists from 41 countries who have been enjoying privileges by being allowed to stay in Thailand without a visa for up to 30 days. Among the 41 countries are Australia, the UK, Canada, France, Germany, Japan and the US.

Tourists can extend their stay by travelling to neighbouring countries - Cambodia, Malaysia Laos and Burma - and returning with new entry stamps.

The new rules are issued as an increasing number of tourists have overstayed the period allowed.

"Under the current rules, people from these countries can stay in Thailand for as long as they want. Some even stay here for one year. Many work illegally in Thailand," an informed source said.

Instead of sightseeing, the tourists take advantage of the visa exemption by doing business here.

From October 1, tourists from the designated countries may still enter Thailand without visas and stay for up to 30 days, but their entry stamps will be renewable twice at most for a maximum stay of 90 days.

Tourists who stayed for 90 days must leave the Kingdom for at least 90 days before being permitted to reenter Thailand.

Thailand tightened immigration rules last year for South Asian tourists who were allowed to apply for visas on arrival which permitted them to stay in Thailand for 30 days. A large number of them took advantage by travelling to neighbouring countries and returning to get a new visa on arrival at the airport.

Under the new rules, they are allowed to obtain a visa on arrival only twice from neighbouring countries. They are then required to go back to their country of origin to obtain an entry visa to Thailand.

-- The Nation 2006-09-15

[bkkmadness]

P.S bkkmadness .. how come you can get away with flogging your site in your signature but they deleted mine? Is there some sort of "clique" somewhere? .. where do I join? lol

Easy. Member with 47 posts (i.e. you at time of writing) = Shut up, do what you're told, follow the forum rules (ambivalent though they may be). Member with 3,251 posts = Do what you like, no rules apply.

Actually .. bkkmadness .. sig was deleted too .. becsuse I dew attention to it as I was slightly p****ed off about it. I have since apologized to him through a PM and gave him the offer to put a link on my Thailand related site (easier going restrictions there!) .. All is cool between us .. I think!

He did indeed and yes everything is cool, and I like your site man.

It's no worries as I never done it for the traffic on here really, and not much come from here at all, just nice to show people you have a Thailand site and lets face it pretty relevant to the people on this board. I see most other sites have no such worries, and pretty unclear why TV is so paranoid about it.

[george]

Please keep your private discussion somewhere else. This topic is about Immigartion and visas!

thanks!

[bkkmadness]

Will do George!

Sorry everyone for going !

thanks!

[meom]

I bet TAT is already up in arms about this, and it probably hasn't got them anywhere.

I think TAT is more interested in getting a chunk of the 100 million chinese that have enough purchasing power to go on vacation for a couple of weeks each year.

They couldn't care less about the handful of people for whom this ruling would have a negative effect.

[steveromagnino]

I bet TAT is already up in arms about this, and it probably hasn't got them anywhere.

I think TAT is more interested in getting a chunk of the 100 million chinese that have enough purchasing power to go on vacation for a couple of weeks each year.

They couldn't care less about the handful of people for whom this ruling would have a negative effect.

Most likely you are right; however with stupid targets of quantity over quality under current governor, they want as many as they can get.

Based on looking around the dregs you can see in many parts of BKK and certainly in Pattaya, they wouldn't want to turn away a single person if they were running things.

Fortunately for us, they are not!

And yes, would agree with you; 99% of actual tourists will be totally unaffected by this move.

[pomchopkao]

I bet TAT is already up in arms about this, and it probably hasn't got them anywhere.

I think TAT is more interested in getting a chunk of the 100 million chinese that have enough purchasing power to go on vacation for a couple of weeks each year.

They couldn't care less about the handful of people for whom this ruling would have a negative effect.

^ would these be the zero dollar tours? TAT seemed not too impressed with these chinese ... Link

Edited September 15, 2006 by pomchopkao

[george]

Update:

Foreigners create social problems and poses internal security treats

Thailand tightens visa regulation

BANGKOK: -- Thailand on Friday announced new visa regulations for tourists limiting visitors to a maximum stay of 90 days every six months, in an effort to put prevent foreigners from remaining in the kingdom on a long-term basis.

Immigration Police Chief Lieutenant General Suwat Thamrongsrisakul said the new regulations were aimed at blocking foreigners who created social problems and posed internal security treats from living in the country indefinitely.

"Some people were using the loopholes in the old regulations to work in Thailand, while others were staying here to engage in criminal activities," said Suwat.

Under the old regulations, foreigners from 41 countries that have good relations with Thailand, were granted 30-day tourist visas that could be extended twice within the country.

With a quick trip abroad, one could pick up another tourist visa and thereby live in Thailand on an annual basis.

There is a heavy flow of foreigners living in Thailand to neighbouring countries such as Cambodia, Laos and Malaysia on cheap "visa runs."

Under new regulations, going into effect on October 1, nationals from the same 41 countries will be allowed 30-day tourist visas which may be extended twice, after which the tourists will have to stay out of Thailand for at least 90 days before returning again.

The 41 favoured countries include most European nations, China, Japan, Canada, USA and the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) among others.

"Tourists (from the 41 countries) will not be allowed to stay in Thailand more than 90 days every six months," said a statement issued by the Immigration Department.

Nationals from other countries are only allowed 30-day tourist visas, non-extendable in the country.

The new regulation will likely affect hundreds of English-language teachers who work semi-legally in Thailand, and other foreigners working in Thailand without the requisite working papers.

--DPA 2006-05-15

[meom]

I bet TAT is already up in arms about this, and it probably hasn't got them anywhere.

I think TAT is more interested in getting a chunk of the 100 million chinese that have enough purchasing power to go on vacation for a couple of weeks each year.

They couldn't care less about the handful of people for whom this ruling would have a negative effect.

^ would these be the zero dollar tours? TAT seemed not too impressed with these chinese ... Link

TAT is not impressed with the way some chinese tourists get ripped off so that's why they try to do something about.

All things aside there's a huge market out there and obviously TAT want to get a slice of the pie.

[p_brownstone]

The Nation update:

Thailand tightens re-entry rules for tourists

Tourists who stayed for 90 days must leave the Kingdom for at least 90 days before being permitted to reenter Thailand.

Thailand tightened immigration rules last year for South Asian tourists who were allowed to apply for visas on arrival which permitted them to stay in Thailand for 30 days. A large number of them took advantage by travelling to neighbouring countries and returning to get a new visa on arrival at the airport.

Under the new rules, they are allowed to obtain a visa on arrival only twice from neighbouring countries. They are then required to go back to their country of origin to obtain an entry visa to Thailand.

-- The Nation 2006-09-15

Just noticed this new, possible further complication.

If this is the case then everyone will have to get a Tourist Visa from their own Country of origin, so you can't simply use VOA's for a total of 90 days then pop down to Penang or anywhere else close by.

Patrick.

[John K]

Update:

Foreigners create social problems and poses internal security treats

Thailand tightens visa regulation

There is a heavy flow of foreigners living in Thailand to neighbouring countries such as Cambodia, Laos and Malaysia on cheap "visa runs."

Under new regulations, going into effect on October 1, nationals from the same 41 countries will be allowed 30-day tourist visas which may be extended twice, after which the tourists will have to stay out of Thailand for at least 90 days before returning again.

The new regulation will likely affect hundreds of English-language teachers who work semi-legally in Thailand, and other foreigners working in Thailand without the requisite working papers.

--DPA 2006-05-15

Well at least they identified in so many words that teacher pay will be going up big time. Also It seems to say tourist visas (the paper ones not stamps) you get at consulates are now also included. It seems to keep changing.

Keywords: heavy flow of foreigners living in Thailand. Translation: money money money

hundreds of English teachers... Thousands is more accurate.

Requested papers by teachers “yes”, do the schools want to give them “no” because it cost money and they can get away with it.

Edited September 15, 2006 by John K

[steveromagnino]

hundreds of English teachers... Thousands is more accurate.

Requested papers by teachers “yes”, do the schools want to give them “no” because it cost money and they can get away with it.

Well, good news then, because if the schools want them then they will have to get the correct paperwork.

I would have thought teachers who have the qualifications to teach (which excludes Khao San road fake degrees) would be happy! More chances to go legal!

I assume the english teaching fraternity are happy with this new development then?

[A_Traveller]

The Nation update:

Thailand tightens re-entry rules for tourists

Tourists who stayed for 90 days must leave the Kingdom for at least 90 days before being permitted to reenter Thailand.

Thailand tightened immigration rules last year for South Asian tourists who were allowed to apply for visas on arrival which permitted them to stay in Thailand for 30 days. A large number of them took advantage by travelling to neighbouring countries and returning to get a new visa on arrival at the airport.

Under the new rules, they are allowed to obtain a visa on arrival only twice from neighbouring countries. They are then required to go back to their country of origin to obtain an entry visa to Thailand.

-- The Nation 2006-09-15

Just noticed this new, possible further complication.

If this is the case then everyone will have to get a Tourist Visa from their own Country of origin, so you can't simply use VOA's for a total of 90 days then pop down to Penang or anywhere else close by.

Patrick.

This refers to changes made for South Asian tourists, however, the 'return to origin' {of passport} lurkes in most immigration acts world-wide. There's no evidence that Thailand intends to use this as a further restriction tool but it is there.

Regards

[A_Traveller]

hundreds of English teachers... Thousands is more accurate.

Requested papers by teachers “yes”, do the schools want to give them “no” because it cost money and they can get away with it.

Well, good news then, because if the schools want them then they will have to get the correct paperwork. and they will have tp pay them correctly, and cover the administraion costs required to provide the individuals with Work Permits taxation certificates etc. However, to date, most owners, more often than not Thai citizens, of such 'institutions' have prefered the benefit to the profit margin of not doing so.

I would have thought teachers who have the qualifications to teach (which excludes Khao San road fake degrees) would be happy! More chances to go legal!

I assume the english teaching fraternity are happy with this new development then?

By the by, if I had a chip the size of yours on my shoulder, I'd have eaten it a long time ago.

Regards

PS No I have no connexion to the teaching fraternity and no wish to enter into a sterile debate.

[John K]

hundreds of English teachers... Thousands is more accurate.

Requested papers by teachers “yes”, do the schools want to give them “no” because it cost money and they can get away with it.

Well, good news then, because if the schools want them then they will have to get the correct paperwork.

I would have thought teachers who have the qualifications to teach (which excludes Khao San road fake degrees) would be happy! More chances to go legal!

I assume the english teaching fraternity are happy with this new development then?

I know several teachers at several schools in and around Bangkok. Most of them have expressed that if this goes through, they would ask for at least 50000 for next semester. If not paid that then they would find another school and simply transfer there under a new contract. I suspect the third week in October will be panic time for many schools.

One point there is money for the proper paperwork, however from what I have been told by teachers and Thais in the schools, is some of the allocated money disappears (corruption). So essentially if that is the case the Thais are going about this all the wrong way. Also the money allocated for teachers pay is more than what they are paid. It seems like just another twist in corruption, punish the victim and not the ........

Edited September 15, 2006 by John K

[cclub75]

Well, good news then, because if the schools want them then they will have to get the correct paperwork.

I would have thought teachers who have the qualifications to teach (which excludes Khao San road fake degrees) would be happy! More chances to go legal!

I assume the english teaching fraternity are happy with this new development then?

You assume that schools, or authorities, really want or care about western english teachers (native english speakers)...

Look at the report about performances of children at school :

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2006/09/15...es_30013680.php

"At each level, the students' academic performance was on average about half of what the Education Ministry expected"

My guess is : they don't give a dime. Native english teachers or not, the results are awfull.

So better to hire thais.

The Thai elite will always find "good" and "real" english teachers : by sending their children abroad.

[PeaceBlondie]

I doubt that most English teachers who are less than 100.00% legal in Thailand are happy. THE LAW OF SUPPLY AND DEMAND DOESN'T WORK HERE, except that Thais will buy cheaper "goods" and services at the same old price of 25,000 or 33,000 baht per month. The married farang teachers have already voted with their small head, and must remain here. Those without partner or children can leave.

Oh, somebody mentioned the income tax. A century-old respected Thai government school deducted 941 baht from my paycheck every month, and could hardly have forwarded it to the treasury, since they refused to get me a work permit or a tax number (or help with my visa). Does it surprise you that Thai school directors drive Benzes? Or, that the next year they hired through an agency that probably gave a kickback to the Director? I'm just guessing, of course.

It is EXTREMELY difficult for many honest, suitably qualified teachers of English to get legal. These changes would help if school Directors are willing to get off their carcass and do something they don't know how to do yet.

Please pardon my anger; I don't even teach anymore. Today is about 6 weeks before the new semester starts at govt. schools, and I predict that 90% of the honest but illegal aliens who beg their school for paperwork will be teaching illegaly, yet again.

[mnbk-admin]

Is anyone able/willing to sell rights for Work Permit and 1 year Visa?

[John K]

Well, good news then, because if the schools want them then they will have to get the correct paperwork.

I would have thought teachers who have the qualifications to teach (which excludes Khao San road fake degrees) would be happy! More chances to go legal!

I assume the english teaching fraternity are happy with this new development then?

You assume that schools, or authorities, really want or care about western english teachers (native english speakers)...

Look at the report about performances of children at school :

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2006/09/15...es_30013680.php

"At each level, the students' academic performance was on average about half of what the Education Ministry expected"

My guess is : they don't give a dime. Native english teachers or not, the results are awfull.

So better to hire thais.

The Thai elite will always find "good" and "real" english teachers : by sending their children abroad.

There is a mandate on having native speaking teachers. Also Please don’t confuse the no fail policy with the efforts of teachers. In my opinion the no fail policy is just a face. It helps to make the uneducated who should fail think they have a valid education. February is a very disheartening time for teacher as they watch student that they failed get their grades padded and moved up to the next grade.

Fallout from that turns up in certain less than though out decisions (non in particular (thread related)mentioned)

[Netfan]

IToday is about 6 weeks before the new semester starts at govt. schools, and I predict that 90% of the honest but illegal aliens who beg their school for paperwork will be teaching illegaly, yet again.

Not sure about that. How will they be able to work if they can't stay in the country? Where I live there are 2 government schools who employ 15 - 20 foreign teachers between them - NONE have WP's. Possibly some are on retirement visas, but most are on tourist visas. It will sure be interesting to see what happens next month......

[Kwai Yai]

I have never read so much uneducated, ill-informed garbage as in the first six pages posted on this subject. So, us visa-runners are all no good criminals eh! We should wake up, smell the coffee and get a legal visa. Yeah, right.

I have been teaching English here for over one year, making monthly visa runs after my six monthly expired. Why don’t I just get a Non-imm. B? Because the lazy Thais can’t be “assed” to provide me with the correct documents. I require a letter from my school director and a letter from the director of education in my district. The new laws have caused a wave of panic in the schools here because the Thais now realise they have got to provide their teachers with the correct docs. - or loose them, and they have to do it pronto. Oh! horror, the directors have to write a letter when they could be watching TV in their offices or enjoying long boozy lunches.

I am sure that if I knew who was the director of education for my district I could pop round to his house with a bottle of Black Label and an envelope with a thousand baht and I might get my documents next week.

Nobody has spotted the main point, in a country which has had no elected government or working parliament since April, exactly who changed the Laws of The Kingdom of Thailand and how? Answers on a 1000 baht note to the Khao Lak Rehabilitation Center for tsunami victims, which is closing through lack of funds.

The ONLY official statement from the head of immigration, Gen. Suwat, was published in Forbes magazine. There has been no official announcement in the Thai press, though The Bangkok Post featured the story. No Thais at my school were aware of the new rules until I made them aware. Incidentally, Gen Suwat said that we (filthy illegal foreigners) are working in bars in Pattya. Err, come to Thailand and work in a bar for 100B a day, not me, dear General.

[PeaceBlondie]

IToday is about 6 weeks before the new semester starts at govt. schools, and I predict that 90% of the honest but illegal aliens who beg their school for paperwork will be teaching illegaly, yet again.

Not sure about that. How will they be able to work if they can't stay in the country? Where I live there are 2 government schools who employ 15 - 20 foreign teachers between them - NONE have WP's. Possibly some are on retirement visas, but most are on tourist visas. It will sure be interesting to see what happens next month......

Maybe you're right; maybe 4,388 farang teachers will leave the Kingdom. But this is a hard place to leave, once smitten, even when you're twice bitten.

[A_Traveller]

IToday is about 6 weeks before the new semester starts at govt. schools, and I predict that 90% of the honest but illegal aliens who beg their school for paperwork will be teaching illegaly, yet again.

Not sure about that. How will they be able to work if they can't stay in the country? Where I live there are 2 government schools who employ 15 - 20 foreign teachers between them - NONE have WP's. Possibly some are on retirement visas, but most are on tourist visas. It will sure be interesting to see what happens next month......

Not that it would ever happen, but what if an 'institution' found a helpful 'Decentralized' Immigration Officer, who was able to execise 'judgement' and who understood these things.

Heaven Forfend....

Regards

[Kwai Yai]

And possibly a fossil

[PeaceBlondie]

Not that it would ever happen, but what if an 'institution' found a helpful 'Decentralized' Immigration Officer, who was able to execise 'judgement' and who understood these things.

Heaven Forfend....

Regards

Yes, but do immigration officers understand "decentralized" any better than Thai teachers understand "student centered learning"? I though Thai culture was hierarchal.

[Kwai Yai]

My guess is : they don't give a dime. Native english teachers or not, the results are awfull.

So better to hire thais.

The Thai elite will always find "good" and "real" english teachers : by sending their children abroad.

Your last sentence is spot on, where did our "caretaker prime minister" study?

In my school the few Thai teachers who can speak some English (not the Director of course, his is limited to "Good Morning") are going out of their way to find a solution to the visa problem. One of them told me "You are part of our team, we must try to help you." So, maybe there are a few who do give a dime. I'm still keeping my fingers crossed. The Thai 'English' teachers come to me all the time with questions about the English language, "how do you say that", etc. In Chiang Mai I taught a 15 year old who could read most of the Bangkok Post. There is a small spark, it could make a big fire. Don't give up.

[BlissfullyIgnorant]

They also made some interesting changes to the Married visa

Oh really? Please tell what changes have been made to the supporting spouse visa. Or, are you just adding more dry dung to the fire?

[lannarebirth]

I bet TAT is already up in arms about this, and it probably hasn't got them anywhere.

I think TAT is more interested in getting a chunk of the 100 million chinese that have enough purchasing power to go on vacation for a couple of weeks each year.

They couldn't care less about the handful of people for whom this ruling would have a negative effect.

BINGO! Beginning in 2008 comes the first wave of post WW II Baby Boom retirees. Couple that with the coming surge in Chinese tourism and investment and you can see why Thailand is getting things in order. There will be untold billions to be made from legitimate retirees and investors soon IMO.

[baboon]

O.K, boys and girls. What about this one? I was talking to a Thai wife of a mate of mine who said the new [alright, enforcement of the old] regulations is a bloody good idea because of all the farangs nicking jobs from Thais. I asked her for an example. "Loads of them," I was told. I asked again for a single case. The answer came there none. It is really starting to get worrying. Good luck to you all.

[opebo]

O.K, boys and girls. What about this one? I was talking to a Thai wife of a mate of mine who said the new [alright, enforcement of the old] regulations is a bloody good idea because of all the farangs nicking jobs from Thais. I asked her for an example. "Loads of them," I was told. I asked again for a single case. The answer came there none. It is really starting to get worrying. Good luck to you all.

These poor simple people apparently believe we are eager to work for a few hundred dollars a month, and yet their whole association with us is based on our ability to access what they imagine to be an endless supply of money from the ATM.