Father faces deportation to Thailand after 27 years in Britain for two 'stupid crimes'

[Thaidream]

The last poster no doubt makes some very good points. As someone who has been in and out of Thailand for 50 years I know many of your points are based upon your personal experience. Once I learned to speak and understand Thai, I was even more shocked at some of the unfairness that surrounds my existence here. I can't change it and while I do not agree with it I have to sit in silence or risk a confrontation which I am bound to lose. It is one of the downsides to life in Thailand and at times very frustrating. We have no real status in Thailand and there is no organization or government entity that will take up our plight. Help from our Embassy is nil. Another government entity that does little for its citizens and charges huge fees for the little bit of service it purports to give. However, the argument is about fairness. I would hope that all of us want to be treated with dignity, respect and fairness. The problem is that we are not all being treated that way, whether in Thailand; the UK or America.

[h90]

As an American and having lived in California a long time, I have seen much the same thing happen there. People who commit minor crimes ( sentence of 12 months or less) and have lived their whole lives in America , have children and lived a relatively good and decent life except a few misdeeds are deported back to their country of birth to a system and language they are completely incapable of handling. Normally, what happens is they then appeal to attempt to return to the United State but the appeal takes so long they eventually lose the rights to their minor children as they can't support them and the State puts the children in a foster home, supported by the taxpayer. I am not familiar with English law but it sure sounds similar to what happens in America. The politicians beat their chests saying look at how tough we are on immigration but in essence these kind of laws obscure the fact that those with an agenda or a politically correct affinity find ways to skirt the law while the others such as this man do not have the means or connections to fight back wil be sent back to a country he does not know. This is not due process. I grew believing that English law was fair and sacrosanct and American law must be the same as it is based on English common law. Where is the fairness in this situation? How does it serve the British people or American people to use these kind of draconian laws to exile people and break up families. Please don't confuse our situation in Thailand as expats with little rights to what we as Englishmen or Americans know or should know is fairness and equality. Many of our forefathers died for it.

There might be crimes you make accidentally, you are too late, speed with the car and have an accident.....you speed, someone got hurt and you are complete wrong...but still you didn't intend to do harm.

When stealing money, you are planning in full knowledge that you are doing a crime. It is not that he stole a bar of chocolate because his children were hungry. He stole money.....There is no excuse for doing that.

[Shawn0001]

Yeah right, these desperate refugees that get to Indonesia, and decide that isn't good enough because nothings free.

You know what you can do with your piece of paper. When it was signed those signing it didn't know what would come of it. ANY muslim has only to claim he wants to be a christian (however temporarily) to qualify as persecuted. I only need look at the UK and France to see what that leads to, not that we don't already have our own problems.

Australia has a front door, you want to come in, you knock on it. Anybody trying sneaking in the back way gets treated like the criminal they are.

BTW you forgot to mention how common sexual assault on children is in these camps. Just the sort of people we should welcome.

Under the Geneva Conventions a refugee can choose not to stop in one country but continue on to a country of their choice, which is their legal right. A lot of people seem to believe that they must stop in the first safe country they reach, of course those countries bordering Syria and Iraq etc are full to bursting already and the camps in those places provide easy pickings for the very people they are escaping and thus provide little safety.

When it was signed those signing it didn't know what would come of it? Really? All the way back in 1991 when Australia signed protocol I (which is the protocol in question) they just didn't know what was coming hey? Don't make me laugh. Back in 1957 when they signed the first one they knew what could happen, that's why they made the convention, they had just seen huge amounts of displaced people and no laws in order to enforce countries to accept them, and that is what got us into the mess in Israel. Unsurprisingly people were not ignorant of the effects of war in the years shortly after WWII.

Australia’s or any countries front door is not open to refugees, it is quite simple how the law works, they must get there first, and it is then the responsibility of the signature party to accept them if they are eiligable

As for your nasty little comment about sexual assault, do you realize that those assaults have been committed by the so called guards? Sickening that someone would attempt to use that against the very people seeing their children assaulted. No one wants to welcome sexually perverted guards to pretend to be taking care of people while actually sexually abusing their children, except Abbott and a few Australians that is.

So you welcome this treatment of people then? You would fit right in with ISIS mate.

A few casual lies? Refugee status can be claimed from anywhere, it's just more convenient to be on the government tit when you are doing so, with "human rights" leeches clamouring to take your case, and get paid from federal funds.

Proof the guards are sexually assaulting those in camps? Any suggestion would see them suspended or fired.

And yes, I like ISIS, they can have as many of our radical would-be terrorists as they can handle. We should be paying for their airfares.

Well, you can't claim asylum from outside my country, you have to get there first. I have had a look and you can apply for a refugee visa (subclass 200) for Australia, most countries do not have such a thing, certainly not a lie just ignorant of the specifics of aslum claims for Australia.

But you said "a few casual lies" and just what may these other lies be?

The proof of the sexual assauts by the guards comes from the guards themselves. They are the whistle blowers, having reported it to the Australian authorities some 17 months earlier it would seem your assumption that they would be fired is entirely wrong and it is actually more likely that the backwards Australians would instead just try to sweep it under the carpet.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/australia.failed.to.act.over.child.abuse.at.controversial.refugee.camp/51569.htm

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/australasia/asylumseekers-tortured-and-raped-at-australian-detention-centre-8730727.html

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-31979729

http://www.news24.com/World/News/Australia-knew-of-sex-abuse-at-asylum-camp-workers-20150408

You're not very good at this, are you? A quick Google search would save you some embarassment.

[h90]

The last poster no doubt makes some very good points. As someone who has been in and out of Thailand for 50 years I know many of your points are based upon your personal experience. Once I learned to speak and understand Thai, I was even more shocked at some of the unfairness that surrounds my existence here. I can't change it and while I do not agree with it I have to sit in silence or risk a confrontation which I am bound to lose. It is one of the downsides to life in Thailand and at times very frustrating. We have no real status in Thailand and there is no organization or government entity that will take up our plight. Help from our Embassy is nil. Another government entity that does little for its citizens and charges huge fees for the little bit of service it purports to give. However, the argument is about fairness. I would hope that all of us want to be treated with dignity, respect and fairness. The problem is that we are not all being treated that way, whether in Thailand; the UK or America.

And how many times did you steal something in Thailand?

I guess zero times, so you didn't get deported.

Some for him....no stealing no deportation, that is a pretty fair offer.

[MockingJay]

We will also be charged and deported if we would have to faces charges for assault and stealing in that story disguised as "pilfering" in Thailand, so why is this news? He's a small time crook, he knew that he was hanging in mid air with his visa and all and should have considered the consequences BEFORE he pilfered and assaulted and not afterwards! No sympathy from my side, sorry

Edited July 6, 2015 by MockingJay

[Thaidream]

You make good points- he did steal and was caught- however, he is doing the time. He is paying his debt to society. Had his crime been more serious and I saw him as a threat to society- I would not have the same opinion. At least, he should have the right to appeal the decision while still in the country. That is what I mean by fairness. Who in the UK will be harmed, if he is allowed to file his appeal and remain with his child? What ever happened to rehabilitation and forgiveness?

[h90]

You make good points- he did steal and was caught- however, he is doing the time. He is paying his debt to society. Had his crime been more serious and I saw him as a threat to society- I would not have the same opinion. At least, he should have the right to appeal the decision while still in the country. That is what I mean by fairness. Who in the UK will be harmed, if he is allowed to file his appeal and remain with his child? What ever happened to rehabilitation and forgiveness?

How does he pay his debt to society? Staying in the jail is a punishment that costs the society money. Pay his debt would be if he works for free for the society....like bringing old people food......protect small children on the way to school or whatever community work is common in UK.

[cnx355]

He is Thai so he may be one of the few "farang" educated guys that can work, buy land and teach with no work permit....

He should check his possibilities...

It's rather ignorant to assume that Thais do not need to be qualified in order to teach in Thailand. They need to have a teaching degree, they need to be higher qualified than the farangs.

As an ignorant person, I think ( If you permit me) that with his Thai ID card, basic college and fluency in English language, he would be eventually able to secure a job in the tourist industry He can choose to be a Thai and not a foreigner that necessitate complicated work permit to work and he not need limit himself to teach English to survive. He will do what he has to do to survive here.

I don't doubt that he would find a job, and I didn't critise you for that remark, just that he cannot teach legally, at least not in a government school, I'm sure the tourist industry would have him somewhere.

Not sure what you mean by, "he can choose to be a Thai and not a foreigner", pretty sure he doesn't get to choose his nationality, that's the whole point of him being deported, he is a Thai citizen and only a Thai citizen.

You are correct, he is only a Thai citizen !

[thousandpercent]

Good riddance to bad rubbish

Glad to see Britain can get rid of some of the bad immigrants,wish they could get rid of a lot more criimal inclined ones.

How does it feel to be so bitter, judgemental, and vindictive that you get exited about abusing a baby by making him fatherless for a petty crime? Do you also want to abuse the children of British fathers by permanently exiling British men who commit petty crimes, or do you propose unequal punishments for the children of good and wholesome white babies and ugly, filthy brown babies? How does it feel to define humans as "rubbish" based on a moment in their lives without even hearing the facts and circumstances, the defense, or the mitigating factors? I assume that on the same basis you consider Churchill, Gandhi, and MLK to be rubbish. They committed crimes. And you have committed thousands of crimes, even if you were not prosecuted. Yes you have. Are you rubbish? Should you be exiled? You think your children should be similarly abused, don't you?

Does it make you feel powerful to condemn?

[Thaidream]

Normally, restitution or some type of community services is also part of the sentence. There s also such a thing as cruel and unusual punishment which is banned in most civilised Societies,

[Jimlove]

Why doesn't he have British citizenship yet after all those years?

Cause he is not British nor did he want to be ... He is a criminal with 2 offenses that are not minor as someone says ...

If he had not been deported he would probably had continued his criminal carreer in UK

BTW Is is stated that he can appeal the sentence of deportation so why the whinning, I wish all criminals would be deported from my homecountry - just like Thailand them self would do if I was a criminal

They will become very busy kicking out all these muslims that do nothing in Europe but commit crimes ...

[ukrules]

I wish the U.S. would pass a law like this.

Of course they already have laws just like this in the US and families have been torn apart (children forced to stay in US) after one parent was deported.

It only affects immigrants who go down the legal route though, illegals are unaffected.

[connda]

I wish the U.S. would pass a law like this.

Of course they already have laws just like this in the US and families have been torn apart (children forced to stay in US) after one parent was deported.

It only affects immigrants who go down the legal route though, illegals are unaffected.

It only affects immigrants who go down the legal route though, illegals are unaffected.

Yep! That nails it on the head. At least in the US. Do things legally, best of luck. Come in illegally and your afforded more rights and protections than US Citizens, and definitely more than those who are attempting to enter via proper legal channels.

[mathias67]

Thailand does the same. Break the law and you are in prison until you can fund your own deportation. We all know this and understand the consequences of breaking the law.

It is time that immigrants to "Western" countries with all the benefits they are awarded, said "thanks" and behaved.

I don't agree with his crimes but 1) Does he have a Thai passport 2) Will the Thais recognise him as a citizen of Thailand or in both cases send him straight back to the UK

[phrodan]

There should be more character testing of men that want to take Thai women ( any woman for that matter ) to live in the UK.

A criminal record of note, or issues such as alcoholism ( if known to the NHS ), drug use etc should be an immediate bar.

This six year old boy was a victim.

Now that he is a man - as far as I'm concerned he's British. Any fair person can see that to all intents and purposes that's the case. Removing him to a foreign land is excessive. It will just act as a punishment for his son - and the vicious circle continues.

[connda]

As an American and having lived in California a long time, I have seen much the same thing happen there. People who commit minor crimes ( sentence of 12 months or less) and have lived their whole lives in America , have children and lived a relatively good and decent life except a few misdeeds are deported back to their country of birth to a system and language they are completely incapable of handling. Normally, what happens is they then appeal to attempt to return to the United State but the appeal takes so long they eventually lose the rights to their minor children as they can't support them and the State puts the children in a foster home, supported by the taxpayer. I am not familiar with English law but it sure sounds similar to what happens in America. The politicians beat their chests saying look at how tough we are on immigration but in essence these kind of laws obscure the fact that those with an agenda or a politically correct affinity find ways to skirt the law while the others such as this man do not have the means or connections to fight back wil be sent back to a country he does not know. This is not due process. I grew believing that English law was fair and sacrosanct and American law must be the same as it is based on English common law. Where is the fairness in this situation? How does it serve the British people or American people to use these kind of draconian laws to exile people and break up families. Please don't confuse our situation in Thailand as expats with little rights to what we as Englishmen or Americans know or should know is fairness and equality. Many of our forefathers died for it.

But it's OK for Thailand to exile people and break up families under the same circumstances.

To progressive liberals it seems to be just fine to:

Talk about Western immigration laws and it's "Oh how heartless the government is."

Talk about Thai immigration laws and its <silence.........shhhhh...........not a word............>

For example, if I go start a business right now to support my Thai family, and get caught, it's a criminal offense which will lead to deportation. Working and conducting a business without the proper authorization. That is a criminal act. Jail time, fine, and deportation. Would there be 7 pages on Thai Visa by liberals crying about the callousness of the Thai government, racism, and the break-up of my family? What do you think? Do you think my story would be plastered on the front of one of the major expat newspapers deploring the break-up of my family and the human rights issues. What do you think?

Non-US person goes to the US, works without a Green Card, then get deported, its all over the news, soooo tragic, breaking up families, human-rights violation not to allow everyone who wants to work the right to work, blah, blah, blah. Exactly the same. Same crimes (working without authorization), same punishment (deportation), but completely different reaction from liberals.

I'll keep repeating it: Hypocrisy. The 'one-way' thinking is Hypocrisy. Perhaps that word doesn't exist in the dictionaries used in centrally planned, liberally oriented public schools in the West. It wouldn't surprise me.

Edited July 6, 2015 by connda

[chrisinth]

Ahhhh. How heart wrenching! Like, we never, ever hear this story the other way around here in the Land of Smiles.

My best friend, who has a Thai son living here in Thailand, just got deported back to England two weeks ago.

If other counties applied Thai immigration standards to Thai Natives in their own countries, there would be a lot of Thais being deported back to Thailand.

If we have a wife, extended family, even a child, do we get: 'indefinite leave to remain' here in Thailand stamped on our passports??? No. Were made to fill out reports every 90 days showing our location, re-apply for visa extensions every year.

Cry me a river all you pathetic liberals. We're treated like dogs here in Thailand, but some Thai commits a crime and gets deported and it's front page news. OK. Why isn't it front page news that my English friend who got deported back to England, even though he has a child here in Thailand, isn't "front page news".

Hypocrisy knows no bounds!

I hear you, I hear you.

But was your best friend brought to Thailand at the age of 6? Did he get thrown into a welfare system (OK, that wouldn't happen!) at the age of 11, no support from parents?

This was my point from earlier. If in a case like this, as a minor in the welfare system, how does he still not have British citizenship?

I state again that I agree in principle at these rules, but surely there must be some exceptions. It is a pretty heavy handed step to deport someone to a country they probably never even remember from their childhood.

[oldsailor35]

Of course the "lily white " characters in TV will want his head. But he's a hell of a lot different to the Muslim guy that preaches hatred, ripping 50,000 pounds per year in benifits, to support his wife and 5 kids in the luxury of a 100,000 pound house. Apparently the UK govt cannot get rid of him, so it looks like they are going after "easy" targets. Bloody disgusting !

[MaeJoMTB]

There should be more character testing of men that want to take Thai women ( any woman for that matter ) to live in the UK.

Testing the English men, or the Thai women.

Because I'm thinking a lot of the women were probably prostitutes, and therefore 'undesirables'.

[h90]

There should be more character testing of men that want to take Thai women ( any woman for that matter ) to live in the UK.

Testing the English men, or the Thai women.

Because I'm thinking a lot of the women were probably prostitutes, and therefore 'undesirables'.

prostitutes at least work for the money and don't steal.....When you look at the average British woman it would be very good for the gene pool to mix some Thais in...

[Fullstop]

How will he suffer? He can teach English!

With a Lancashire accent ... poor students.

...and with a Thai passport....he'll probably only pull in around 18,000 a month. Same as Filipinos.

Edited July 6, 2015 by Fullstop

[Ulic]

I doubt this is the full story. Canada has a similar law but it seems to be applied inconsistently.

Some who should definitely be deported are not, some who came to Canada as children and

like this guy fell afoul of the law are deported. While it is popular to get rid of these low life's

(usually Jamaican drug dealers, in Canada's case, but not always) I can't help feel that

someone who has had there entire education, and learnt there criminal behaviour in there

adopted country should not be sloughed of to there birth country to deal with. The biggest

mistake this guy made was not getting his British citizenship when he turned 18.

I don't for an instant condone his behaviour but he is a product of an English upbringing.

[connda]

Ahhhh. How heart wrenching! Like, we never, ever hear this story the other way around here in the Land of Smiles.

My best friend, who has a Thai son living here in Thailand, just got deported back to England two weeks ago.

If other counties applied Thai immigration standards to Thai Natives in their own countries, there would be a lot of Thais being deported back to Thailand.

If we have a wife, extended family, even a child, do we get: 'indefinite leave to remain' here in Thailand stamped on our passports??? No. Were made to fill out reports every 90 days showing our location, re-apply for visa extensions every year.

Cry me a river all you pathetic liberals. We're treated like dogs here in Thailand, but some Thai commits a crime and gets deported and it's front page news. OK. Why isn't it front page news that my English friend who got deported back to England, even though he has a child here in Thailand, isn't "front page news".

Hypocrisy knows no bounds!

I hear you, I hear you.

But was your best friend brought to Thailand at the age of 6? Did he get thrown into a welfare system (OK, that wouldn't happen!) at the age of 11, no support from parents?

This was my point from earlier. If in a case like this, as a minor in the welfare system, how does he still not have British citizenship?

I state again that I agree in principle at these rules, but surely there must be some exceptions. It is a pretty heavy handed step to deport someone to a country they probably never even remember from their childhood.

So if I'm a younger man, marry a Thai women, bring my US child over who then lives here until the age of majority, gets a job, works for years, and then commits a crime - what's the outcome? Absolutely the same as what just happened to Mr Thai Criminal living in England.

I'm not disagreeing with you that it's a problem (break up of families, etc); I'm just pointing out that all you folks crying about this 'poor man' don't stand on the same ground when it comes to Thailand doing the exact same thing to a 'farang'. Not a word.

[h90]

How will he suffer? He can teach English!

With a Lancashire accent ... poor students.

...and with a Thai passport....he'll probably only pull in around 18,000 a month. Same as Filipinos.

18000 is a good salary.....lot of Thai people who aren't criminals earn less

[cdnvic]

Please avoid racist language. (removed)

[MaeJoMTB]

There should be more character testing of men that want to take Thai women ( any woman for that matter ) to live in the UK.

Testing the English men, or the Thai women.

Because I'm thinking a lot of the women were probably prostitutes, and therefore 'undesirables'.

prostitutes at least work for the money and don't steal.....When you look at the average British woman it would be very good for the gene pool to mix some Thais in...

All the hookers I know are also into drinking, drugs and gambling.

You may know some that don't steal ....... but given the chance, I'm sure they would.

[Ulic]

As an American and having lived in California a long time, I have seen much the same thing happen there. People who commit minor crimes ( sentence of 12 months or less) and have lived their whole lives in America , have children and lived a relatively good and decent life except a few misdeeds are deported back to their country of birth to a system and language they are completely incapable of handling. Normally, what happens is they then appeal to attempt to return to the United State but the appeal takes so long they eventually lose the rights to their minor children as they can't support them and the State puts the children in a foster home, supported by the taxpayer. I am not familiar with English law but it sure sounds similar to what happens in America. The politicians beat their chests saying look at how tough we are on immigration but in essence these kind of laws obscure the fact that those with an agenda or a politically correct affinity find ways to skirt the law while the others such as this man do not have the means or connections to fight back wil be sent back to a country he does not know. This is not due process. I grew believing that English law was fair and sacrosanct and American law must be the same as it is based on English common law. Where is the fairness in this situation? How does it serve the British people or American people to use these kind of draconian laws to exile people and break up families. Please don't confuse our situation in Thailand as expats with little rights to what we as Englishmen or Americans know or should know is fairness and equality. Many of our forefathers died for it.

But it's OK for Thailand to exile people and break up families under the same circumstances.

To progressive liberals it seems to be just fine to:

Talk about Western immigration laws and it's "Oh how heartless the government is."

Talk about Thai immigration laws and its <silence.........shhhhh...........not a word............>

For example, if I go start a business right now to support my Thai family, and get caught, it's a criminal offense which will lead to deportation. Working and conducting a business without the proper authorization. That is a criminal act. Jail time, fine, and deportation. Would there be 7 pages on Thai Visa by liberals crying about the callousness of the Thai government, racism, and the break-up of my family? What do you think? Do you think my story would be plastered on the front of one of the major expat newspapers deploring the break-up of my family and the human rights issues. What do you think?

Non-US person goes to the US, works without a Green Card, then get deported, its all over the news, soooo tragic, breaking up families, human-rights violation not to allow everyone who wants to work the right to work, blah, blah, blah. Exactly the same. Same crimes (working without authorization), same punishment (deportation), but completely different reaction from liberals.

I'll keep repeating it: Hypocrisy. The 'one-way' thinking is Hypocrisy. Perhaps that word doesn't exist in the dictionaries used in centrally planned, liberally oriented public schools in the West. It wouldn't surprise me.

Hardly the same thing. If you were in Thailand since you were six, only spoke Thai, were married and had a Thai

child, then were caught running a business, arrested, jailed, deported. Then yes I would expect your story to be

on the front cover of an ex-pat web site. But coming to Thailand as a 50 year old, having a child with someone

half your age, opening and running a business that you know is illegal for you to do. I would not expect too much

sympathy.

[jacky54]

These people always have a hard luck story- chuck him out and the hundreds of thousands of other illegals with him

[Alwyn]

So many Muslims in UK, but they deport this guy.

Sorry for the Donald Trump blunder

What has the faith of British citizens got to do with this story?

Are you British? Quite frankly I think you should be outraged by the amount of garbage that comes to Europe with quite the obvious ties to extremists.... but it is the ignorance (and arrogance) of your politicians that keeps the streets of uk safe for them to do some beheadings. No one with any heart would deport this guy over some small time theft. Mark Whalberg has done worse and he is making millions with his stupid movies.

Lived a lot of my adult life in the UK in communities that had Muslim British citizens residing. Never had any problems that I haven't faced elsewhere. Certainly don't recall any beheadings. Think I'd remember that.

I still don't see what that has to do with this story.

However I do agree it seems harsh to deport this guy because of his circumstances.

Circumstances and nature of crimes committed should be the criteria for deporting people.

Not faith.

Things have changed BP. Drummer Rigby beheaded a year or so ago, in South London.. People like Anjem Choudary taking to the streets etc Not to mention the likes of Abu Hamza....

[nithisa78]

This is beyond absurd. The capitalist will rake in some money from the tragedy in this man's life. They are sending a message and it would surprise, not shock me if he were deported. I'm unable to travel at this time or I would go there on his behalf to speak for him.WE can all start to lobby for him, the world over. begin