Owners of rented houses, rooms ordered to report foreign occupants

[sendintheclowns]

losttoday,

Are you suffering from PBBAK ?

TV Admin provides you with a ThaiVisa forum, which has been in existence for a number of years.

I looked it up and quoted it, for your edification.

Your reply ("Maybe because they are not the Thai government") doesn't make any sense at all.

Another member quoted you the Thai Immigration forms website.

That didnt seem to impress you either.

Membership here is generally about seeking and offering advice. Please show a modicum of courtesy for others' efforts to advise you

You seem to have another agenda, which is best summed up by your criticism - "that other posters want to add to the already onerous list of paperwork we have to fill out. "

I own several properties, so I am stuck with multiple decisions of whether (a) to file or not and ( liase with my tenant, for each property.

In addition, my wife and I have 90 day and annual retirement filings.

Why is your paperwork load so onerous ? anyway, it's a free world, file or do nothing.

Foreign people cannot own land in Thailand so the report is for Thai people. The article in the paper was written for Thai people not foreigners.

Answer : He/She (The owner of the residence) must notify (by the Form TM.30) to the competent official Of the Immigration Office located in the same area of that house/residence within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien.

If you are talking about a condo in your name alone I don't know. I would follow the advice of the immigration office in your area whom I would consult.

In any event there are 50 different immigration offices in Thailand all with different rules so to be sure one must ask them. I believe Phuket does not want a TM 30 but wants their own unique form to be filled out.

If you want me to answer in the future use the quote function on TV that is what it is there for.

Although Foreigners can not own land, they can own HOUSES. I have built 2 houses and I have bought 2 houses - all on land leased from Thai nationals. If you are suggesting that I don't own my houses, you are misinformed.

[lostoday]

losttoday,

Are you suffering from PBBAK ?

TV Admin provides you with a ThaiVisa forum, which has been in existence for a number of years.

I looked it up and quoted it, for your edification.

Your reply ("Maybe because they are not the Thai government") doesn't make any sense at all.

Another member quoted you the Thai Immigration forms website.

That didnt seem to impress you either.

Membership here is generally about seeking and offering advice. Please show a modicum of courtesy for others' efforts to advise you

You seem to have another agenda, which is best summed up by your criticism - "that other posters want to add to the already onerous list of paperwork we have to fill out. "

I own several properties, so I am stuck with multiple decisions of whether (a) to file or not and ( liase with my tenant, for each property.

In addition, my wife and I have 90 day and annual retirement filings.

Why is your paperwork load so onerous ? anyway, it's a free world, file or do nothing.

Foreign people cannot own land in Thailand so the report is for Thai people. The article in the paper was written for Thai people not foreigners.

Answer : He/She (The owner of the residence) must notify (by the Form TM.30) to the competent official Of the Immigration Office located in the same area of that house/residence within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien.

If you are talking about a condo in your name alone I don't know. I would follow the advice of the immigration office in your area whom I would consult.

In any event there are 50 different immigration offices in Thailand all with different rules so to be sure one must ask them. I believe Phuket does not want a TM 30 but wants their own unique form to be filled out.

If you want me to answer in the future use the quote function on TV that is what it is there for.

Although Foreigners can not own land, they can own HOUSES. I have built 2 houses and I have bought 2 houses - all on land leased from Thai nationals. If you are suggesting that I don't own my houses, you are misinformed.

Since you lease the land the houses are on. Who is the housemaster? You or the owner of the land that the houses are on?

I would imagine Foreigners who own houses are about .000001% of the total of houses owned in Thailand so I doubt if the law (TM30) above was written with them in mind. And since it is such a small percent one has to wonder why they would even bother printing in in English on an Immigration web site.

Is there any other immigration laws that Thai people have to follow that are punishable by fine?

Edited September 3, 2015 by lostoday

[sendintheclowns]

losttoday,

Are you suffering from PBBAK ?

TV Admin provides you with a ThaiVisa forum, which has been in existence for a number of years.

I looked it up and quoted it, for your edification.

Your reply ("Maybe because they are not the Thai government") doesn't make any sense at all.

Another member quoted you the Thai Immigration forms website.

That didnt seem to impress you either.

Membership here is generally about seeking and offering advice. Please show a modicum of courtesy for others' efforts to advise you

You seem to have another agenda, which is best summed up by your criticism - "that other posters want to add to the already onerous list of paperwork we have to fill out. "

I own several properties, so I am stuck with multiple decisions of whether (a) to file or not and ( liase with my tenant, for each property.

In addition, my wife and I have 90 day and annual retirement filings.

Why is your paperwork load so onerous ? anyway, it's a free world, file or do nothing.

Foreign people cannot own land in Thailand so the report is for Thai people. The article in the paper was written for Thai people not foreigners.

Answer : He/She (The owner of the residence) must notify (by the Form TM.30) to the competent official Of the Immigration Office located in the same area of that house/residence within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien.

If you are talking about a condo in your name alone I don't know. I would follow the advice of the immigration office in your area whom I would consult.

In any event there are 50 different immigration offices in Thailand all with different rules so to be sure one must ask them. I believe Phuket does not want a TM 30 but wants their own unique form to be filled out.

If you want me to answer in the future use the quote function on TV that is what it is there for.

Although Foreigners can not own land, they can own HOUSES. I have built 2 houses and I have bought 2 houses - all on land leased from Thai nationals. If you are suggesting that I don't own my houses, you are misinformed.

Since you lease the land the houses are on. Who is the housemaster? You or the owner of the land that the houses are on?

I would imagine Foreigners who own houses are about .000001% of the total of houses owned in Thailand so I doubt if the law (TM30) above was written with them in mind. And since it is such a small percent one has to wonder why they would even bother printing in in English on an Immigration web site.

Is there any other immigration laws that Thai people have to follow that are punishable by fine?

If you are not a troll, then you should do your own research. I am not going to educate you on the intricacies of house ownership in Thaland, yellow books and how the Land Dept Registeries work. Which is where you need to go to define " house master". In any event, your post is going off-topic, if you want to start a discussion as to what % of houses are owned by Farang, start a new topic, please.

[Bellacissa]

Separate but related question:

My husband and I rent a condo in Pattaya. One year lease and both of our names are on it. I live here full time (ED extensions) and he is here about twice a year for vacation. He lives and works in another part of the world. Does my landlord have to report his presence each time he shows up or are we covered because he's listed on the lease?

[lostoday]

Foreign people cannot own land in Thailand so the report is for Thai people. The article in the paper was written for Thai people not foreigners.

Answer : He/She (The owner of the residence) must notify (by the Form TM.30) to the competent official Of the Immigration Office located in the same area of that house/residence within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien.

If you are talking about a condo in your name alone I don't know. I would follow the advice of the immigration office in your area whom I would consult.

In any event there are 50 different immigration offices in Thailand all with different rules so to be sure one must ask them. I believe Phuket does not want a TM 30 but wants their own unique form to be filled out.

If you want me to answer in the future use the quote function on TV that is what it is there for.

Although Foreigners can not own land, they can own HOUSES. I have built 2 houses and I have bought 2 houses - all on land leased from Thai nationals. If you are suggesting that I don't own my houses, you are misinformed.

Since you lease the land the houses are on. Who is the housemaster? You or the owner of the land that the houses are on?

I would imagine Foreigners who own houses are about .000001% of the total of houses owned in Thailand so I doubt if the law (TM30) above was written with them in mind. And since it is such a small percent one has to wonder why they would even bother printing in in English on an Immigration web site.

Is there any other immigration laws that Thai people have to follow that are punishable by fine?

If you are not a troll, then you should do your own research. I am not going to educate you on the intricacies of house ownership in Thaland, yellow books and how the Land Dept Registeries work. Which is where you need to go to define " house master". In any event, your post is going off-topic, if you want to start a discussion as to what % of houses are owned by Farang, start a new topic, please.

Not at all. I asked if the owner of the property was liable to report you as a Farang living on his property since you rent the land from him.

[connda]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

[impulse]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

If you think their rules are stupid and inane, try going with a Thai national to even get a visa to visit your home country.

[LannaGuy]

It's the same forms it has always been.

I wonder why Admin is not referring the uninformed to

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/files/category/6-thai-immigration-application-forms/

There ya go.

yes but where is the form for the condo OWNER to report? T28 is for the 'alien' to report where they are

[brewsterbudgen]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

Why?

[Furryman]

It's the same forms it has always been.

I wonder why Admin is not referring the uninformed to

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/files/category/6-thai-immigration-application-forms/

There ya go.

yes but where is the form for the condo OWNER to report? T28 is for the 'alien' to report where they are

It's been mentioned several times, it's the TM30.

[sendintheclowns]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

Why?

Hey Brewmaster, did you forget to add " go home if you don't like it" ?

[Jon Wetherall]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

Why?

Hey Brewmaster, did you forget to add " go home if you don't like it" ?

Ah yes, the line so much favoured by the inarticulate and usually partially inebriated Homer Simpsons of this world. Never a thought giving credit one of the most positive contributions to Thais coming of age - non-exploitative foreigners who actually have a brain and give a damn.

"If you don't like it, go home - I like it fine, sunshine, cheap beer, cheap women. cheap cleaners, what's not to like? Doh!"

[brewsterbudgen]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

Why?

Hey Brewmaster, did you forget to add " go home if you don't like it" ?

No. I just can't see the connection between ASEAN and the Thai "house of cards tumbling down".

[Jon Wetherall]

Why?

Hey Brewmaster, did you forget to add " go home if you don't like it" ?

No. I just can't see the connection between ASEAN and the Thai "house of cards tumbling down".

Free trade zone. Special economic zone. Lots of nearby countries despising Thais. Lots of connections.

[sendintheclowns]

Latest news is more progress by military govt of Thailand in developing ASEAN trade, than the previous democratically elected, incompetent, corruption riddled govt was able to achieve

Examples:

The just opened Mynamar-Thailand Friednship bridge, which will form a link on proposed 2,700 km trade route;

The Dawai Port project has been re activated, with Japanese investment.

At best, it's premature to call the PM a boffoon. At worst, I' d like to see you phone him and give him your expert opinion.

[Tomtomtom69]

I thought that law was already in existence?

Yes but this has been decreed from on high, just to give it more oomph, make 'foreigners' feel that much more unwelcome. Unless they're zero baht Chinese hoards on a pre determined length of short stay.

I don't think Chinese feel any more welcome in Thailand than any other group of foreigners. They are getting bad press every week with everything from proposals to build separate toilets for them to Chinese tourists throwing hot water at Air Asia flight attendants to tourists allowing their children to take a dump just outside the Grand Palace in full view of everyone else.

Hardly very welcoming if you ask me.

[Tomtomtom69]

Latest news is more progress by military govt of Thailand in developing ASEAN trade, than the previous democratically elected, incompetent, corruption riddled govt was able to achieve

Examples:

The just opened Mynamar-Thailand Friednship bridge, which will form a link on proposed 2,700 km trade route;

The Dawai Port project has been re activated, with Japanese investment.

At best, it's premature to call the PM a boffoon. At worst, I' d like to see you phone him and give him your expert opinion.

That second friendship bridge won't mean much if Myanmar doesn't allow Thai vehicles in and can't get security on the new asia highway under control. Just last week insurgents again tried to undermine the Burmese government by firing shots at the road on the eve of it's official opening. Since then we've heard nothing about whether the opening ceremony could actually go ahead or not.

[Tomtomtom69]

Another knee-jerk reaction - brought to you by.....

It's not a knee-jerk reaction. It's just a reminder of the existing law which some landlords either don't know about or ignore.

It used to be the landlords responsibility but the onus was put on the foreigner renting the property some time ago now.

It must depend on which office you use but the immigration where I live are very strict on it.I even have to re- register my address even if I leave the country for a few days.Pain in the a--- as the landlord lives a long distance away.It's starting to pee him off also, keep filling in forms and copies of this and that.

Why would you have to re register the same address after being out of the country for a short period especially if you're coming back on the same visa? It's one thing being asked to register the first time but as long as you don't change your address you're done I think. Re register every time you come back from a one day shopping trip to Vientiane or Myawady? Nah...I don't think that's enforceable not to mention how would they know? Unless of course the Gestapo has arrived in Thailand and we're all having our movements recorded. Nazi Germany or it's more modern counterpart North Korea eat your heart out.

[Tomtomtom69]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

If you think their rules are stupid and inane, try going with a Thai national to even get a visa to visit your home country.

What's your point? Thais who are gainfully employed can easily get tourist visas for western countries. The reason we ask for more documents from Thais is that if we let them in too easily they would all overstay work illegally in Thai restaurants and never return home. Our quality of life is too good. Our countries are more attractive for Thais to come and live in compared to how Thailand is for us. Thailand is also much more dependant on tourism than most western countries.

Sticking to the topic of this thread, in my country at least, there is no law that I am aware of that harrasses foreigners and as such there is no requirement to show a passport at check-in or use it to register foreigners including Thais. Some more upmarket hotels might request a passport from a Thai for check-in or to show proof of age to purchase alcoholic beverages in the absence of a local ID but no there is no registration of foreigners made with immigration not only because it reeks of police state but also because it does nothing to prevent crime. Not to mention the guy caught in eastern Bangkok was carrying a fake passport.

[Tomtomtom69]

deja vu about this time last year 2014. nothing became of it then, probably nothing will this time either

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/746547-condoapt-owners-now-must-register-foreign-tenants/

You're right I remember the scare mongering about this last year but nothing much came of it. To this day only one hotel in Mae Sot insisted on a passport (or copy) back in late 2014 but even they only ever want one passport for all the guests staying. Last year there were us 4 foreigners 3 Vietnamese friends and me I asked for one friends passport and we were done but since then every other hotel in town has been perfectly happy with a copy of my Thai driver's license.

Since registration of guests does nothing to prevent crime this whole thing will probably fall by the wayside in a few weeks once people start to forget about the bombing.

As it stands now it's mostly in tourist areas especially in Bangkok (for example in khao san road) where they claim to be most strict and yet the guy caught rented an apartment in Nong Chok a suburb of Bangkok many Thais haven't even heard of the guy was probably the only foreigner in the whole neighborhood clearly there was a reason he/they chose to live in a non descript suburban area opposite a University where there are no tourists and very few expats yet the Thai response is to strictly monitor backpackers staying on khao san road. Yeah that's going to go down well.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Tomtomtom69

[impulse]

You're right I remember the scare mongering about this last year but nothing much came of it. To this day only one hotel in Mae Sot insisted on a passport (or copy) back in late 2014 but even they only ever want one passport for all the guests staying. Last year there were us 4 foreigners 3 Vietnamese friends and me I asked for one friends passport and we were done but since then every other hotel in town has been perfectly happy with a copy of my Thai driver's license.

Since registration of guests does nothing to prevent crime this whole thing will probably fall by the wayside in a few weeks once people start to forget about the bombing.

I'm suspecting this will eventually become more about tax collection from the guest facilities than preventing crime.

Still, if 24 hotels all register the same Slobovian passport number on the same night, it could prove beneficial in fighting crime- passport forging for example...

The hotels who accept a copy of your DL also have your passport number, which pretty much meets the requirements.

[starky]

No microchips just electronic ankle braclets should do the trick.....They can monitor alcohol levels as well.....killing two birds with one stone......All the bars would be gone and the Breweries would go out of business murdering the economy.

I have always been mightily amused by the barflys and pissheads that come here and look for the cheapest bar or draught beer they can find. Have extensive debates about saving 3 baht if you buy archa instead of cheers and extoll the virtues of red horse over chang but yet have such an overinflated sense of their own worth that they believe the shitty bars they drink in are propping up the Thai economy

[Aussieroaming]

It think it would make more sense to report people who eat Turkish delight..they are bound to be Turkish terrorists ..... FMR.

[boomerangutang]

It's akin to the law which forces farang to always have a Thai name behind their address. When I meet a bureaucrat and he/she asks me where I reside, I start off by saying "under a bridge" ....just to see their reaction. What does it really matter where I stay?! ...in a hotel, in an apartment, in a house ....wherever a farang is staying, he's paying about Bt.35,000/month average for lodging and incidental expenses. That's 3 to 30 times what the average Thai pays for wherever they're staying. And near all the money farang spend in Thailand, is outside money. Even if the farang is employed in Thailand, he/she probably goes to his/her ATM every few days to pull out 5k to 20k baht from their overseas account. For Thai people (like the Chinese) who worship money above all else, they should make things as easy as possible for farang who want to reside here.

Edited September 6, 2015 by boomerangutang

[boomerangutang]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

If you think their rules are stupid and inane, try going with a Thai national to even get a visa to visit your home country.

I personally know Thais, Burmese and Laotians in my home region of California, who just showed up (legally or illegally, what does it really matter?) ....and were able to buy cars, start businesses, buy real estate. Just in California (about 1/20th of the US) there are literally millions of foreigners who are moving and grooving, making money, and doing everything else a Californian can do - with little care about legalities because US is quite easy-going about foreigners residing there, despite the rhetoric and rules from on-high.

Now look at how Thailand deals with farang. It's like night and day. Being a farang in Thailand is akin to being a black man in Apartheid S. Africa, except blacks in S.Africa could own land and start businesses without beating around the bush like quasi-criminals. Thailand's laws and attitudes toward farang are archaic and force farang to spend a lot of money and time trying to comply.

[spidermike007]

No microchips just electronic ankle braclets should do the trick.....They can monitor alcohol levels as well.....killing two birds with one stone......All the bars would be gone and the Breweries would go out of business murdering the economy.

I think the Thai population would do a fine job supporting the Breweries on their own.

[sendintheclowns]

No microchips just electronic ankle braclets should do the trick.....They can monitor alcohol levels as well.....killing two birds with one stone......All the bars would be gone and the Breweries would go out of business murdering the economy.

I have always been mightily amused by the barflys and pissheads that come here and look for the cheapest bar or draught beer they can find. Have extensive debates about saving 3 baht if you buy archa instead of cheers and extoll the virtues of red horse over chang but yet have such an overinflated sense of their own worth that they believe the shitty bars they drink in are propping up the Thai economy

This made my day! All my wife and I ever want from Thailand, is for someone is to bring a smile to our faces, every day.

"A friend of mine has a trophy wife.... apparently it wasn't first place - Steven Wright

I am addicted to placebos... I could quit but it wouldn't matter."

[Tomtomtom69]

It's akin to the law which forces farang to always have a Thai name behind their address. When I meet a bureaucrat and he/she asks me where I reside, I start off by saying "under a bridge" ....just to see their reaction. What does it really matter where I stay?! ...in a hotel, in an apartment, in a house ....wherever a farang is staying, he's paying about Bt.35,000/month average for lodging and incidental expenses. That's 3 to 30 times what the average Thai pays for wherever they're staying. And near all the money farang spend in Thailand, is outside money. Even if the farang is employed in Thailand, he/she probably goes to his/her ATM every few days to pull out 5k to 20k baht from their overseas account. For Thai people (like the Chinese) who worship money above all else, they should make things as easy as possible for farang who want to reside here.

I absolutely agree. But I see a small flaw with what you're trying to say. The only reason you don't get more "farangs" staying in 3500 Baht dumps is because who wants to live in a 15m2 prison with no kitchen and only a tiny dormitory style room as your living quarters? I have actually lived like that here in Thailand in the past as I felt I wouldn't be at home much nor did I care about making my own food. I also couldn't afford a more expensive place. Unlike in communist Vietnam and China for example, there are no restrictions on where foreigners can stay in Thailand and many foreigners do live in dingy apartments since only those on expat packages can afford the 35000 Baht condos you are talking about.

[Tomtomtom69]

Their country, their rules, how hard is that to understand?

Their country, stupid, inane rules: easy to understand, along with why this country isn't going to amount to much in the long run. Come ASEAN: and the house of cards will come crumbling down.

If you think their rules are stupid and inane, try going with a Thai national to even get a visa to visit your home country.

I personally know Thais, Burmese and Laotians in my home region of California, who just showed up (legally or illegally, what does it really matter?) ....and were able to buy cars, start businesses, buy real estate. Just in California (about 1/20th of the US) there are literally millions of foreigners who are moving and grooving, making money, and doing everything else a Californian can do - with little care about legalities because US is quite easy-going about foreigners residing there, despite the rhetoric and rules from on-high.

Now look at how Thailand deals with farang. It's like night and day. Being a farang in Thailand is akin to being a black man in Apartheid S. Africa, except blacks in S.Africa could own land and start businesses without beating around the bush like quasi-criminals. Thailand's laws and attitudes toward farang are archaic and force farang to spend a lot of money and time trying to comply.

It's also easy enough for us to buy cars in Thailand too but they're expensive. Also, if you ever felt like going on a road trip to a neighboring country only a few will let your car in whereas in North America and Europe you have freedom to drive wherever you want.

The real estate restrictions here are stupid as are the restrictive business laws all the more reason to start a business in a country like Cambodia where it's much easier. Thailand is also the only country in the region that I know, where a foreigner (except maybe a Burmese migrant worker although that may not technically be legal) is not allowed to be seen serving food or taking orders in their own restaurant. In every other neighboring country from Myanmar to Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam to China, I've had foreigners take my order serve my food chat with their guests etc. no idea why Thailand is different.

And then when you go to a Thai restaurant in Australia not a single Aussie can be found working inside. In America you do though I've had white, black and Hispanic waiters take my order cook my food etc. at thai restaurants in the US.

[Tomtomtom69]

You're right I remember the scare mongering about this last year but nothing much came of it. To this day only one hotel in Mae Sot insisted on a passport (or copy) back in late 2014 but even they only ever want one passport for all the guests staying. Last year there were us 4 foreigners 3 Vietnamese friends and me I asked for one friends passport and we were done but since then every other hotel in town has been perfectly happy with a copy of my Thai driver's license.

Since registration of guests does nothing to prevent crime this whole thing will probably fall by the wayside in a few weeks once people start to forget about the bombing.

I'm suspecting this will eventually become more about tax collection from the guest facilities than preventing crime.

Still, if 24 hotels all register the same Slobovian passport number on the same night, it could prove beneficial in fighting crime- passport forging for example...

The hotels who accept a copy of your DL also have your passport number, which pretty much meets the requirements.

Right. Last year I stayed at a guesthouse in Nong Khai located right next door to a friend's place I normally stay at but since she was away I had to stay at a hotel. This was around the time of the whole registration thingy supposedly being enforced but once the lady at that hotel received my Thai driver's license she said that was good enough. Without a Thai driver's license she would have needed a passport or in the case of Lao nationals either a passport or temporary border pass.