Ms Yingluck asks PM for fairness in the civil litigation against her over the rice scheme

[dageurreotype]

Poor baby. Best she gets on the 'phone sharpish and ask her brother for some of those billions back.

[dageurreotype]

11 February 2014

Caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra reassured farmers that they would be paid as her government’s financial status is sound enough to seek loans from financial institutions to pay farmers.

She dismissed speculation that her government was broke and was unable to pay farmers.

Instead, she said, the fiscal position of her caretaker government was sound enough to secure loans from financial institutions with pledge that all farmers who have their rice vouchers would be certainly paid.

She lied to the farmers while knowing a caretaker Government cannot borrow money, or either she was too stupid to know it was against the law as Shins have always thought that they are above the law. eg illegal land deals, bribing judges, buying votes, not returning to face trial, illegal share trading, the list is endless.

Sorry but I would like the source and the full article, not a cut an paste. It helps to put it into context.

I did read what you posed but dont see she promised to pay them back in a week nor any mention of her telling them they should go home. Maybe its in another article.

G o o g l e, try that, let us know what you find.

Or could use the search function here. Many articles about it at the time.

[springheeled jack]

I quite agree she should be given the opportunity to present evidence to clear her name in reference to the rice pledging scheme.

[pedro01]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Maybe never - but it's a great idea - can you imagine how much better the world would be?

[darren84310]

So who picked up the bill for this one?

800px-Hopewell_pillars_2,_Bangkok,_2009-01-21.jpg

Exactly.... and as much as I'm not a great fan of the Shinawatra clan, this can only be a good thing if they pursue other corrupt politicians on both sides of the house and seize their assets too.

[Eric Loh]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Hello All the Experts here.

This is not a case of whether YL made any money out of it. It is that she was negligent in her duty as a Prime Minister overseeing the scheme to let it deteriorate to such a big loss for the State.

There was already a precedent where a senior government official was held negligent and made to compensate the State for losses to the State.

Go read the case by the government of Thailand of Prime Minister Thaksin Sinawatra against Roengchai Marakanon, former head of the Bank of Thailand during the economic crisis of 1997, in a negligence liabilities of officials case where Roengchai was made to compensate the State.

Was Roengchai a elected minister or in this case a Prime Minister? Wissanu in his desperation to nail the Shin will state irrelevant comparison. Think we are smarter to see that the example is rather weak. Dont you?

[skildpadden]

Fairness, I would believe means something along the line, that all are treated equally and have same opportunities in the court of law (or before a case reaches the court) no matter your financial status or who you are.

You of all should remember a couple of cases while you were in charge, where fairness could be questioned (e.g. mushroom pickers sentenced 15 years vs an infamous Ferrari cop killer).

[mikemac]

That's like the chicken asking the wolf not to eat you. I'm afraid, YL, there will be no relief coming from Mr. P. This government wants blood, red blood and you are the best and only RICH target they have to take out their anger on. Your brother needs to get you out of this country.

Sorry to contradict you, because you are obviously a very learned man who only defends the Shins because you like a challenge, but should that not be "blue" blood ?

[peteregion]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Hello All the Experts here.

This is not a case of whether YL made any money out of it. It is that she was negligent in her duty as a Prime Minister overseeing the scheme to let it deteriorate to such a big loss for the State.

There was already a precedent where a senior government official was held negligent and made to compensate the State for losses to the State.

Go read the case by the government of Thailand of Prime Minister Thaksin Sinawatra against Roengchai Marakanon, former head of the Bank of Thailand during the economic crisis of 1997, in a negligence liabilities of officials case where Roengchai was made to compensate the State.

Was Roengchai a elected minister or in this case a Prime Minister? Wissanu in his desperation to nail the Shin will state irrelevant comparison. Think we are smarter to see that the example is rather weak. Dont you?

As the elected PM, he should be collectively responsible for the performance of his government the people he appointed and not selective performance of his Government.

[Baerboxer]

Yes, and what of the 13 rice farms who hung themselves

after repeatedly begging to be paid for a year old crop her pledging scheme took from them,

while the loans to buy the rice seed were still 100% coming due and the strong arm boys are

on the way back to collect via broken bones or worse:

Yeah, no doubt those lost souls support her getting FAIRNESS, while looking up from hell.

When you run a Ponzi Scheme, whether in office or on the street,

don't expect leniency when it INEVITABLY collapses.

I am shocked! I remember Ms. Yingluck vowed to the protesting farmers that they would be paid within 1 week and that they should go home.

You mean she didn't fulfill her vow, and lied and they didn't get paid.

Shocked. And now she wants to be treated fair.

Perhaps someone should vow not to seize her assets and not to jail her - and lie.

I would be interested in reading your supporting articles and material about what you said she said. Could I get you to post them? Thanks.

Plenty of coverage on Yingluck vowing to pay farmers when they drove their (some very new) tractors down. TVF covered it as well as the usual news sources.

Look them up yourself if you are interested to read them- easy to find.

As often you will find she made promises that weren't kept and then never mentioned the subject again.

[waldroj]

There are going to be no winners here unless some middle ground is found!

Regardless of whether you agree that Yingluck should pay on not, I believe one has to look at the bigger picture.

No logical person should dispute that (in the past), both sides of politics in Thailand have committed grave acts for which they deserve to be punished.

It’s also hard to deny that Yingluck and Thaksin still have support from many Thais.

That said, Thailand will remain fractured whilst the junta continues to pursue Yingluck for decisions she allegedly made as a democratically-elected PM.

If she is being pursued for corruption then there is no question she should be jailed if found guilty, and the State may also be entitled to financial compensation from her.

However, if she is being hounded because of economic damage to the country due to bad government decisions, then the key point here is that she was a member of the legally-elected government of the day! Accordingly, (as is the case in many other countries), it should be the responsibility of the government to make good any damage caused by its servants in the performance of their duties (extracted from the Treaty Establishing the European Community Article 215).

Even the previous Thai Constitution inferred this in Section 60:

A person shall have the right to sue a government agency, State agency, State enterprise, local government, or any other State organ which is a juristic person, for act or omission of act by a civil servant, or staff member or person(s) in their employ.

Unfortunately, there is no such section in the current “interim” document, so it would appear that her fate now does rest with the PM.

If the junta is truly serious about reform and reconciliation (as it continuously tells us it is), then it needs to make a significant gesture to demonstrate its sincerity. Prayut and his pandering unctuous lackeys need to shift their focus from “Argumentum ad Hominem” to trying to heal past wounds and mend relationships so the country can move forward "stronger together".

If Yingluck's alleged crime is one of mismanagement (and not corruption) then the best way to kick-start the reconciliation process would be to show some leniency towards her (for the good of the country), so all involved can be seen to have saved face! A conditional amnesty would not be unreasonable under the circumstances.

[Baerboxer]

Perhaps the General should ask Yingluck for a little fairness and bring back the millions in tax payers money she bunged into her Brothers bank account while she was in charge of the country's funds. Fair deal i would say !

The ridiculous gets more ridiculous. Get a grip. Exaggeration going wild.

Eric, it is a fact, according to Thaksin himself and supported by Forbes, that the Shin clan family fortune increased by a staggering 450% during the PTP administration. Bumped them up on the Forbes rich list.

Now, do you think that was just a coincidence?

That the Shins are so astute that they can grow the family pot by billions but loose billions of tax payers money?

What is ridiculous is why some expats keep defending a criminal family that has milked billions and billions off the Thai people one way or another.

[louse1953]

And just what is wrong with asking for fairness. That should be expected.

Or are people saying the junta isnt a tually better than the ptp?

Seems a quite reasonable request. And she can park her shoes under my bed any time. Hottest PM the world has ever seen.

You can visit the hottest jailbird in Thailand in prison if you want,she will be wearing thongs by then.

[than]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Since the coup and article 44.

and in compliance with the 1996 Act on Liability for Wrongful Acts of Officials.

[speedtripler]

I think fai would be to see her net worth when she came to office and her net worth when kicked out of office and take the difference

Take it all... She probably has hidden most of it already anyway

[Eric Loh]

Perhaps the General should ask Yingluck for a little fairness and bring back the millions in tax payers money she bunged into her Brothers bank account while she was in charge of the country's funds. Fair deal i would say !

The ridiculous gets more ridiculous. Get a grip. Exaggeration going wild.

Eric, it is a fact, according to Thaksin himself and supported by Forbes, that the Shin clan family fortune increased by a staggering 450% during the PTP administration. Bumped them up on the Forbes rich list.

Now, do you think that was just a coincidence?

That the Shins are so astute that they can grow the family pot by billions but loose billions of tax payers money?

What is ridiculous is why some expats keep defending a criminal family that has milked billions and billions off the Thai people one way or another.

Impressive 450% increase but you forgotten some small details. Thaksin and his family wealth as reported by Forbes was 1.6B and a big portion of 1B was returned back by order of the Supreme Court verdict that was from the seized assets. Add that with his major controlling stand at SC Assets and the 100% increase of SET, the increase now seem rather modest. Don't you think so?

I don't defend anyone that "milked" their citizens "blind" especially from much exaggeration from people like you. The junta is hyper keen to nail the Shins and will delighted to obtain your evidence that's if you not making all these up.

[MockingJay]

The ripped-off rice farmers will ask nothing of the judges but fairness - thus nothing to worry about mylady, no? Thank you three times!

Edited October 13, 2015 by MockingJay

[mikemac]

I am not an advocate of this pathway being created, it sets a precedent , Ms Yingluck was a Prime Minister in a Government elected by the people , the executive passed the motion to introduce the rice pledging scheme, it was an act of Parliament, not an individual decision , I liken this to taking LBJ estate to court for the costs of the Vietnam war, if persons cannot make decisions when in the senior executive position in the land , why make any at all, if this is the end result , making a decision to buy submarines by the Junta and they are a failure , can the court's charge Prayut - O - Cha, If the high speed train network is a failure and incurring massive costs, can we take the junta to court, blatant victimisation at its worse. I rest my case.

................."I liken this to taking LBJ estate to court for the costs of the Vietnam war".......................

You might be on to something there ! It may make future Governments/Presidents/Prime Ministers etc think twice before starting/entering into stupid wars that cost lots of innocent lives and lots of taxpayers' money.

[louse1953]

I am not an advocate of this pathway being created, it sets a precedent , Ms Yingluck was a Prime Minister in a Government elected by the people , the executive passed the motion to introduce the rice pledging scheme, it was an act of Parliament, not an individual decision , I liken this to taking LBJ estate to court for the costs of the Vietnam war, if persons cannot make decisions when in the senior executive position in the land , why make any at all, if this is the end result , making a decision to buy submarines by the Junta and they are a failure , can the court's charge Prayut - O - Cha, If the high speed train network is a failure and incurring massive costs, can we take the junta to court, blatant victimisation at its worse. I rest my case.

If you haven't realized it that is the aim.to break the Shins so they never can be in politics again.The Army will not step down until this is done.They will not waste this opportunity,it is now or never.

[Thai at Heart]

she never once sat in on any meetings yet she had nominated herself as the chairperson of it, every decision they made was meant to be approved by her yet she simply refused to give up her precious shopping time to attend them. When the corruption was raised she strenuously denied there was any involved so that it could continue on,she did the same with parliament, how many sittings did she actually attend, it was all one big game for her, she played pm while she refused to do any of the required duties of her office. All because she found her shopping trips overseas were more important than making sure the country was running properly. We can only hope that she has all he assets seized and sends many years in jail, she needs to realize that being a total dip sh*t isnt an excuse, she has to accept she stuffed up big time and her brother and family name are not going to get her out of it as they have all of her life, she has at last hit the brick wall

Everything that you say is true, but her real crime was going along knowingly with what big brother was ordering her to do, all for personal gain, as if the wretched family didn,t have enough ill gotten gains already She deserves time and a huge fine, and then we will see the true colours of big brother !

Of course if she did so unknowingly, as we see in the thread about stars advertising beer, ignorance is apparently a defence.

How did she know the price of rice wouldn't go up?

Suing politicians for failing to meet their stated policy objectives would lead to some wonderful convictions.

Hasn't the current UK govt claimed they will balance the budget by 2020? I await Osborne and Cameron in the dock for the financial damage caused to the country by increased interest on govt debt.

Whilst it sounds enticing to sue in this situation, it truly is absurd.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Thai at Heart

[sawadee1947]

the whole thing is a "farce". It's a political trial, no justice being expected

[ianf]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Perhaps because the scheme was also meant to provide yet more funds to the Shins? Just suggesting!

But by any measure this scheme was so irresponsible that it really beggars belief.

[Thai at Heart]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Perhaps because the scheme was also meant to provide yet more funds to the Shins? Just suggesting!

But by any measure this scheme was so irresponsible that it really beggars belief.

There is no accusation nor proof they made anything directly from this scheme.

[than]

the whole thing is a "farce". It's a political trial, no justice being expected

All corruption trials are a political trials because were the politicians who sins.

YL was aware of the consequence to support corruption : she played, she loose.

Now the only thing she must do close her mouth and accept the consequence of her act.

In all western countries a corruption politicians are always punish.... Only in the Red world corrupt a erect like an hero

[Eric Loh]

the whole thing is a "farce". It's a political trial, no justice being expected

All corruption trials are a political trials because were the politicians who sins.

YL was aware of the consequence to support corruption : she played, she loose.

Now the only thing she must do close her mouth and accept the consequence of her act.

In all western countries a corruption politicians are always punish.... Only in the Red world corrupt a erect like an hero

In all Western countries, coup is high treason. Only in Bangkok, coup leaders are treated like hero.

[halloween]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Perhaps because the scheme was also meant to provide yet more funds to the Shins? Just suggesting!

But by any measure this scheme was so irresponsible that it really beggars belief.

There is no accusation nor proof they made anything directly from this scheme.

They got elected with this blatant vote buy. Is that not a direct benefit?

Then she did nothing to reduce the mounting losses, despite being directly responsible, and lied about the extent of the losses. No culpability for that?

[halloween]

In all Western countries, coup is high treason. Only in Bangkok, coup leaders are treated like hero.

I guess that is because of the level of corruption and criminality of those forced out of office. That, and the cessation of violence from the government's supporters against those who legitimately protest against corruption and criminality.

[Thai at Heart]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Perhaps because the scheme was also meant to provide yet more funds to the Shins? Just suggesting!

But by any measure this scheme was so irresponsible that it really beggars belief.

There is no accusation nor proof they made anything directly from this scheme.

They got elected with this blatant vote buy. Is that not a direct benefit?

Then she did nothing to reduce the mounting losses, despite being directly responsible, and lied about the extent of the losses. No culpability for that?

The statement was "provided more money to the Shins". I am not sure how u interpret that, but I take that as meaning they personally got money.

Maybe you can put a different spin on it for me.

[waitforusalso]

since when are PM's financially liable for failed policy

let alone collective responsibility

Perhaps because the scheme was also meant to provide yet more funds to the Shins? Just suggesting!

But by any measure this scheme was so irresponsible that it really beggars belief.

There is no accusation nor proof they made anything directly from this scheme.

They got elected with this blatant vote buy. Is that not a direct benefit?

Then she did nothing to reduce the mounting losses, despite being directly responsible, and lied about the extent of the losses. No culpability for that?

"Thai Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra risks a backlash from farmers who helped put her in power after cutting guaranteed rice prices following criticism that the program put the country’s finances at risk.

The Cabinet on June 19 approved a 20 percent reduction in rice-purchase prices to help stem losses from the program.."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2013-06-24/yingluck-risks-farmer-ire-to-curb-fiscal-burden-southeast-asia

[halloween]

There is no accusation nor proof they made anything directly from this scheme.

They got elected with this blatant vote buy. Is that not a direct benefit?

Then she did nothing to reduce the mounting losses, despite being directly responsible, and lied about the extent of the losses. No culpability for that?

The statement was "provided more money to the Shins". I am not sure how u interpret that, but I take that as meaning they personally got money.

Maybe you can put a different spin on it for me.

Being elected provides numerous means to make more money. Or did you think they seek power to benefit the Thai people?