Pheu Thai issues statement in defence of Ms Yingluck over rice pledging scheme

[FritsSikkink]

Good statement as nothing illegal has occurred and it's perfectly normal to subsidize farmers. It's NOT about rice!

nothing illegal has occured, dream on

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

[Thaidream]

The whole purpose behind the rice scheme was to withhold huge amounts of rice from the market in the hope that the lack of supply would force the price to increase dramatically. The Thai government promised a certain amount above the World price in the hopes that the 'government' would be able to pocket the difference. In any other country that I have been in this is called price manipulation and it is illegal, unethical and doomed to failure. The people who tried to do this are lucky they are not in a prison . The Hunt brothers in Texas USA tried to do this with Silver at one time and lost a fortune and were prosecuted. Ethical governments do not ever attempt this kind of nonsense.

[Thai at Heart]

Well, the accusation is that by not making provision, the scheme was illegal. A hell of a stretch I reckon. By the end of it, they will have to come up with some compromise judgement, otherwise there will be so many cases in retribution it will be carnage.

I suppose this will be the start of cleaning stuff up. Just imagine what will be dug up in every army procurement for the last 10 years.

This may end up being the start of the clean up in the Thai civil service.

[Thai at Heart]

Good statement as nothing illegal has occurred and it's perfectly normal to subsidize farmers. It's NOT about rice!

nothing illegal has occured, dream on

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

[FritsSikkink]

Good statement as nothing illegal has occurred and it's perfectly normal to subsidize farmers. It's NOT about rice!

nothing illegal has occured, dream on

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

what about the sale to china which was a hoax

[Thai at Heart]

Good statement as nothing illegal has occurred and it's perfectly normal to subsidize farmers. It's NOT about rice!

nothing illegal has occured, dream on

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

what about the sale to china which was a hoax

She isn't accused as part of that. As I understand people are accused and it is in court. The volume represents a tiny amount of the scheme on a percentage.

No system of this size is ever going to be 100% free of corruption. It happens every where. There have been arrests and prosecutions for various cases.

The accusation is that she was herself negligent not that she got rich personally.

[LannaGuy]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

[LannaGuy]

Good statement as nothing illegal has occurred and it's perfectly normal to subsidize farmers. It's NOT about rice!

nothing illegal has occured, dream on

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

so NO links? NO evidence? NO sources?

just "you only believe what the red leaders (whoever they are) tell"? I never listen to "red leaders" and don't consider myself a Shin supporter but I DO have a brain and an ability to reason, judge and balance. She's being hunted plain and simple and Uncle Ben's has nothing to do with it.

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

Well, they have the problem that a govt officer can't knowingly lose money on a policy.

Which of course now could be turned on the current junta for flogging the stuff at a loss. Anyone can always say, if only they had waited, they would have got a better price....

[robblok]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

[Srikcir]

If the farmers got all this money why are they still in debt,

If she ever goes to court,I think she will use the Manuel

off Fawlty Towers defense, "I know nothing,"repeted over

and over

regards worgeordie

If a PM is responsible for how people spend their subsidies, then let Prayut be the first to be held responsible.

Although Prayut paid out 80% of the rice pledge program subsidy committed to by Yingluck to the rice farmers, their household debt has since increased 30% in the last 14 months during Prayut's regime.

[robblok]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Edited October 22, 2015 by robblok

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Actually, they didn't hide it all. The required financing was provided through the parliamentary approval until it was prevented by the election and then it was provided by the junta.

They know exactly how much they have spent. What they don't know is exactly how much they will earn from sales because that is subject to the market price.

[LannaGuy]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

Well, they have the problem that a govt officer can't knowingly lose money on a policy.

Which of course now could be turned on the current junta for flogging the stuff at a loss. Anyone can always say, if only they had waited, they would have got a better price....

As you know I have never said it was well managed or a sensible policy just that it is not 'illegal'. I sincerely believe they felt it was the right thing to do just like the Junta thinks it's the 'right thing' to buy subs! I think it's stupid... but it's not 'illegal'.

Well one could argue as they seized power it could be 'illegal'. Anyway it was not managed well but this bullying and harassment has no place in a civilized society she was photographed going to the toilet by the Army yesterday. It's a disgrace and nothing to do with RICE.

[robblok]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Actually, they didn't hide it all. The required financing was provided through the parliamentary approval until it was prevented by the election and then it was provided by the junta.

They know exactly how much they have spent. What they don't know is exactly how much they will earn from sales because that is subject to the market price.

Just hot air and tricks from you, they should have taken it up into the national budget or cut it they did not do that. epic fail. That is why she is getting in trouble gross negligence.. but it was actually on purpose makes it only worse.

They should have calculated with the current market price.. guess you never heard of those rules either.

You value stock at market price or lower purchase value (most secure principle) you don't value it at a pie in the sky price.

Come back when you know anything about accounting and budgeting.

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

Well, they have the problem that a govt officer can't knowingly lose money on a policy.

Which of course now could be turned on the current junta for flogging the stuff at a loss. Anyone can always say, if only they had waited, they would have got a better price....

As you know I have never said it was well managed or a sensible policy just that it is not 'illegal'. I sincerely believe they felt it was the right thing to do just like the Junta thinks it's the 'right thing' to buy subs! I think it's stupid... but it's not 'illegal'.

Well one could argue as they seized power it could be 'illegal'. Anyway it was not managed well but this bullying and harassment has no place in a civilized society she was photographed going to the toilet by the Army yesterday. It's a disgrace and nothing to do with RICE.

I agree. It wasn't illegal. Parliament approved it.

Everyone on here screaming Yingluk took money, she is corrupt, the system was corrupt are all barking up the wrong tree.

She isn't accused of corruption herself, the system isn't being accused of corrupt or illegal itself.

She is accused of not trying hard enough to prevent the loss. In my opinion a very hard and dangerous case to prove for the future of Thailand.

It can open up many many cases for the future. Very dangerous politically motivated precedent.

3rd parties will never be able to legislate away bad or wasteful policy.

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Actually, they didn't hide it all. The required financing was provided through the parliamentary approval until it was prevented by the election and then it was provided by the junta.

They know exactly how much they have spent. What they don't know is exactly how much they will earn from sales because that is subject to the market price.

Just hot air and tricks from you, they should have taken it up into the national budget or cut it they did not do that. epic fail. That is why she is getting in trouble gross negligence.. but it was actually on purpose makes it only worse.

They should have calculated with the current market price.. guess you never heard of those rules either.

You value stock at market price or lower purchase value (most secure principle) you don't value it at a pie in the sky price.

Come back when you know anything about accounting and budgeting.

It's not may accounting or my budget that matters. They do know how much has been spent.

They have an estimate for the sale value, with an estimate of 500bn. I don't see why you need to rail on me. As yet, I don't think anyone has given a categorical specified breakdown of the loss, other than a ballpark 500bn.

This has been carried forward in the media as written in stone.

As for what I don't know about accounting. Accusing me of a trick for what was spent, as though I am tricking anyone is nonsense.

Just go, get on Google and you can find how much was put into the system. It's not hidden at all. They had to refinance it 4 or 5 times. As though I am tricking anyone......

Go off and do a little reading. The figures are easy to find.

[robblok]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Actually, they didn't hide it all. The required financing was provided through the parliamentary approval until it was prevented by the election and then it was provided by the junta.

They know exactly how much they have spent. What they don't know is exactly how much they will earn from sales because that is subject to the market price.

Just hot air and tricks from you, they should have taken it up into the national budget or cut it they did not do that. epic fail. That is why she is getting in trouble gross negligence.. but it was actually on purpose makes it only worse.

They should have calculated with the current market price.. guess you never heard of those rules either.

You value stock at market price or lower purchase value (most secure principle) you don't value it at a pie in the sky price.

Come back when you know anything about accounting and budgeting.

It's not may accounting or my budget that matters. They do know how much has been spent.

They have an estimate for the sale value, with an estimate of 500bn. I don't see why you need to rail on me. As yet, I don't think anyone has given a categorical specified breakdown of the loss, other than a ballpark 500bn.

This has been carried forward in the media as written in stone.

As for what I don't know about accounting. Accusing me of a trick for what was spent, as though I am tricking anyone is nonsense.

Just go, get on Google and you can find how much was put into the system. It's not hidden at all. They had to refinance it 4 or 5 times. As though I am tricking anyone......

Go off and do a little reading. The figures are easy to find.

Again hot air.. you have no idea again.

What is spend was not claimed as the cost as they valued the stock at a pie in the sky price (not like it should market price or lower purchase price)

Cost is what is spend minus the value of the stock and add storage cost..That was never clear and was well hidden.

She never took that amount up in the national budget.

Its always funny to see amateurs like you talk about things they don't understand.

[Artisi]

Links please? evidence please? sources please? that's it's "illegal"

anything? at all??? or do you just believe everything you read?

you only believe what the red leaders tell you anyhow.

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

Correct, negligent in not controlling all the scams and rip-off's being played out by "those" in the know, knowing that while ever the country was controlled by Thaksin and his ilk they were free to milk the system for every baht they could get their grubby little fingers on.

That's what she and her co-conspirators are guilty of - covering up all the criminal activities going on behind the scenes with the "governments" blessing.

[Thai at Heart]

The accusation is that she was negligent, not that the scheme was illegal.

yes that's the charge which is absurd... look at Bush and WMD, Blair and Afghanistan, Thatcher and the Poll Tax... need I go on? what about Merkel and the banking collapse? it's a witch hunt for political reasons NOT about rice.

They did not hide cost the same size as the national health budget and say there were not costs. That fraud can you imagine hiding so much money that it could finance the whole health budget for a year.

Wow no politician on earth would get away with such a thing. So stop acting like it was all legal. Someone invents a policy says it does not cost anything and spend as much as the countries health budget and hides all those costs. That would be criminal the world over.

Off balance sheet debts are very common in many countries. Quantifying the actual liabilities is incredibly complicated.

No country in the world hides the cost like this its criminal, if you budget something and see the costs are different (and the difference between 0 and 5% of the total countries budget is quite a lot) you have to amend it. Its general accounting law.

Just keep denying no civilized country in the world would allow it. its funny how red supporters like to bend facts.

Actually, they didn't hide it all. The required financing was provided through the parliamentary approval until it was prevented by the election and then it was provided by the junta.

They know exactly how much they have spent. What they don't know is exactly how much they will earn from sales because that is subject to the market price.

Just hot air and tricks from you, they should have taken it up into the national budget or cut it they did not do that. epic fail. That is why she is getting in trouble gross negligence.. but it was actually on purpose makes it only worse.

They should have calculated with the current market price.. guess you never heard of those rules either.

You value stock at market price or lower purchase value (most secure principle) you don't value it at a pie in the sky price.

Come back when you know anything about accounting and budgeting.

It's not may accounting or my budget that matters. They do know how much has been spent.

They have an estimate for the sale value, with an estimate of 500bn. I don't see why you need to rail on me. As yet, I don't think anyone has given a categorical specified breakdown of the loss, other than a ballpark 500bn.

This has been carried forward in the media as written in stone.

As for what I don't know about accounting. Accusing me of a trick for what was spent, as though I am tricking anyone is nonsense.

Just go, get on Google and you can find how much was put into the system. It's not hidden at all. They had to refinance it 4 or 5 times. As though I am tricking anyone......

Go off and do a little reading. The figures are easy to find.

Again hot air.. you have no idea again.

What is spend was not claimed as the cost as they valued the stock at a pie in the sky price (not like it should market price or lower purchase price)

Cost is what is spend minus the value of the stock and add storage cost..That was never clear and was well hidden.

She never took that amount up in the national budget.

Its always funny to see amateurs like you talk about things they don't understand.

They haven't valued the stock at anything. The loss is against an estimated value.. If they had managed to sell it in the current crop year, little loss, today, very large loss.

The estimate today is 500bn. If the costs are so well hidden, how is anyone able to predict a loss?

They know what has been spent.

[marinediscoking]

Anyone who knows anything about Thailand and Thais....

Lanna Guy's continual and arrogant refrain.

Of course, none of the rest of us know anything about Thailand or Thais, and as usual his nonsensical and unsubstantiated opinions will set us all right.

If he doesn't know anything about about Thais then their vote means nothing to you. This is why there will be no elections anytime soon. I'm not a fan of Thaksin but I do respect their vote regardless of who is elected. Seems you need a history lesson from the last 3 elections.

I still frequently notice many of my thai staff visiting her facebook page when they're not busy.

[dru2]

Anyone who knows anything about Thailand and Thais....

Lanna Guy's continual and arrogant refrain.

Of course, none of the rest of us know anything about Thailand or Thais, and as usual his nonsensical and unsubstantiated opinions will set us all right.

If he doesn't know anything about about Thais then their vote means nothing to you. This is why there will be no elections anytime soon. I'm not a fan of Thaksin but I do respect their vote regardless of who is elected. Seems you need a history lesson from the last 3 elections.

I still frequently notice many of my thai staff visiting her facebook page when they're not busy.

Well that's a mark of intelligence in Thailand.

[scorecard]

Congrats to LannaGuy, mission accomplished ! You jumped right on this topic, made the first comment which was sure to attract attention, and received no less than 7 responses to it so far, all of them shooting it/you down or criticizing it/you. Well done !

We know you're a Junta fan but i prefer to seek out the truth and not blindly believe the Army propaganda. You spin a nice story about the Junta but care not for the light of truth. One day it will all come out and you will look a complete fool for falling for it hook, line and sinker.

More diversion to avoid structured discussion of the actual topic.

Congratulations, you win, most diversions for the year!

[scorecard]

I was not suggesting the scheme was not mis-managed but the statement is based on facts and if every PM was hounded as Yingluck is (yesterday photographed by the Army going to the toilet for example) there would be uproar. The governments scheme was NOT illegal and no corruption by the cabinet has been proved or even suggested. She would win any election held today hands down which is why it cannot be allowed by the Junta.

Anyone who knows anything about Thailand and Thais knows this is NOT about rice! purely politics

How do you possibly figure that she/PTP would win an election hands down.

They only managed a 16 seat majority when she was new, popular and the rice scheme a huge carrot. She/they let down many of the people that supported her as well as the floating voters that gave her the benefit of the doubt, the rice scheme is now bust and the Red vote shaky. So as they can't possibly be more popular there is no way they'd win hands down!

red vote 'shaky' how do you know this? elections are banned by the MILITARY are you proud to support the Junta? keep dreaming but they would win

'red vote shaky...'

Well you want tit for tat, how do you know she would win'

Now folks stand by for the diversions...

[dru2]

No, but you don't understand - due to his wealth of experience and familiarity with all things Thai (and presumably Lan Na), Lanna Guy KNOWS intuitively. Best not to question, just accept...

[musiclover]

No, but you don't understand - due to his wealth of experience and familiarity with all things Thai (and presumably Lan Na), Lanna Guy KNOWS intuitively. Best not to question, just accept...

But actually he IS absolutely correct in his conclusions,in spite of your facile sarcasm !!!!

[Thai at Heart]

No, but you don't understand - due to his wealth of experience and familiarity with all things Thai (and presumably Lan Na), Lanna Guy KNOWS intuitively. Best not to question, just accept...

But actually he IS absolutely correct in his conclusions,in spite of your facile sarcasm !!!!

Until anyone provides any concrete evidence to otherwise, PTP will win.

The farmers have been given nothing by this govt that goes beyond the norm. I don't see any reason to reckon that the vote will be any different than last time.

Hell they have drafted in Somkid to save the economy. Does anyone need to realise which type of policies will work to get the economy moving?

[FritsSikkink]

No, but you don't understand - due to his wealth of experience and familiarity with all things Thai (and presumably Lan Na), Lanna Guy KNOWS intuitively. Best not to question, just accept...

But actually he IS absolutely correct in his conclusions,in spite of your facile sarcasm !!!!

Until anyone provides any concrete evidence to otherwise, PTP will win.

The farmers have been given nothing by this govt that goes beyond the norm. I don't see any reason to reckon that the vote will be any different than last time.

Hell they have drafted in Somkid to save the economy. Does anyone need to realise which type of policies will work to get the economy moving?

this government paid the farmers , which the former government failed to do for a year (so far before they couldn't get a loan anymore)

[mikemac]

The party claimed in the statement that 870,018 million baht have been paid directly into the pockets of rice farmers “without any leaks or without any other people benefiting from the scheme.”

Apart from the spin that it wasn't a populist scheme, the above is a blatant lie.

I'm not against subsidising agricultural products to benefit farmers when prices are low, but this scheme was a pack of lies from start to end.

Self funding? No it wasn't. Off budget? yes. Percentage that actually reached farmers? About 15%. No corruption? BS

I hope for Yingluck's sake that her defence doesn't use this rubbish.

........................."I hope for Yingluck's sake that her defence doesn't use this rubbish."..........................

I hope for Thailand's sake they do !