China, Taiwan presidents meet for 1st time ever, shake hands

[Jonathan Fairfield]

China, Taiwan presidents meet for 1st time ever, shake hands

CHRISTOPHER BODEEN, Associated Press

SINGAPORE (AP) — The leaders of Taiwan and China shook hands Saturday at a historic meeting marking the first top-level contact between the formerly bitter Cold War foes since they split amid civil war 66 years ago.

Chinese President Xi Jinping and Taiwanese President Ma Ying-jeou came together on neutral ground in the Southeast Asian city-state of Singapore, walking toward each other in a hotel ballroom in front of a backdrop of yellow — a traditional color of Chinese emperors — and flanked by palm trees.

The two men smiled broadly as they shook hands for more than one minute, turning slightly to the each side to accommodate a host of photo journalists in the ballroom.

In brief opening remarks in front of reporters before going into a closed-door meeting, Xi alluded to China's long-cherished goals of unification with Taiwan, saying "We are one family" and "No force can pull us apart."

Ma said, "Both sides should respect each other's values and way of life."

When they split in 1949, both sides aspired to absorb the other, and Communist Party-ruled China still demands that Taiwan eventually unify, while many citizens of democratic Taiwan increasingly prefer to simply maintain the separate status the island has carved out over six decades.

Critics of Ma in Taiwan are wary that his meeting with Xi will pave the way for Beijing to assert control over the island.

Each leader hopes to seal his legacy as one who helped bring decades of division and mistrust to a mutually acceptable end. But the meeting is more about the symbolism of coming together than about substance. Both sides have said no agreements will be signed or joint statements issued.

Three decades of hostilities followed the 1949 split, occasionally bursting into warfare in the Taiwan Strait — including over the Matsu and Kinmen island group — making dialogue all-but impossible. Tensions eased after China shifted to endorsing the option of "peaceful unification" alongside military threats in 1979, although it wasn't until 1992 that representatives of the two governments met in Singapore to establish the groundwork for future talks.

While subsequent talks achieved little, they began bearing fruit after Ma's election in 2008, resulting in 23 agreements on trade and technical matters. Although that has failed to produce Beijing's desired progress on political matters, Saturday's meeting is seen as moving the relationship into a new stage.

-- (c) Associated Press 2015-11-07

[Publicus]

Taiwan Prez Ma leaves office early next year in a totally discredited position on Taiwan.

Ma's Kuomintang party after eight years in Beijing's back pocket is strongly expected to lose big time to the pro-independence Democratic Progressive Party in the January general election. The KMT last month replaced its candidate for prez cause she had spent months buried in the polls against her female counterpart Tsai Ing-wen, each being the first woman to lead either party in a general election.

Expect a decisive DPP victory Jan 16th led by the Sunflower Revolution that last year seized control of the parliament building to stop the KMT handing Taiwan over to the CCP Boyz in Beijing. The Sunflower Revolution in Taiwan and the Umbrella Movement in Hong Kong have joined up to assure the CCP Boyz are kept as nothing more than barbarians at the gate.

After this little handholding in Singapore Ma will be lucky to be allowed back on Taiwan and Xi Jinping is about to get yet another migraine A really huge migraine. Taiwan and Hong Kong telling Beijing to buzz out.

[ggt]

This is a very interesting development...the winds of change are a blowing...not sure the opposition parties will be strong enough to weather this storm...the Chinese still view Taiwan as a break away state and will stop at nothing to bring them back into the fold...ever so gently...

The US...once again...are standing alone saying..."I did not see that coming!" "What just happened?"

[LawrenceChee]

I think the Chinese have surprised the west in this one

There are enough idiots who wish to see a full out war on Taiwan and there are also pragmatics who know that stuff is not coming and the scenario Uncle Sam will be a hero to the rescue is not materialising ...yawn

Xi describes it best ...ideology and politics aside all are Chinese by race and a family ...

Chinese needs to engage more and more in trade with Taiwan and the people of Taiwan are pragmatic enough to know you should not ignore the advantage of having the biggest trading partner in Asia right next to you ...I think the world has enough of wars and silly threats of power

Edited November 7, 2015 by LawrenceChee

[Publicus]

This is a very interesting development...the winds of change are a blowing...not sure the opposition parties will be strong enough to weather this storm...the Chinese still view Taiwan as a break away state and will stop at nothing to bring them back into the fold...ever so gently...

The US...once again...are standing alone saying..."I did not see that coming!" "What just happened?"

The US...once again...are standing alone saying..."I did not see that coming!" "What just happened?"

False fantasy compulsive story making.

In 2008 Prez Bush put out the word the incumbent Democratic Progressive Party was getting too radical for stable relations among the three of Beijing, Washington, Taipei, to include the region in general.

The US with many other countries thus welcomed the election of Ma Ying-jeou of the Kuomintang as the new young president fluent in English from his years in Boston USA. In the 2012 election the US did not express much of a view as things were stable and moving along smoothly. Ma was easily reelected.

This time around the CCP is at a different place in its economy and it had already become adamantly belligerent throughout the region, to include trying to stifle democracy development in Hong Kong.

The Sunflower Revolution begun last year on Taiwan marked the redefined relationship between the island and the mainland. US has consequently made clear it has no objection to the DPP returning to office again as openly hostile to the CCP Coyz in Beijing gaining any political control or influence in Taiwan. That would also mean killing some awfully unequal trade deals Ma sold out on and not making many more of 'em, if any.

The Boyz in Beijing and the PLA and Navy have set the year 2020 as the point in time they would finally at long last be able to mount a cross strait invasion. I didn't say that is what they will do. I emphasise instead the timetable and the mindset to finally become capable to do it. Whether the Boyz turn out to be on schedule or not, they still have 800 missiles on the mainland across from Taiwan pointed at it.

People shouldn't be surprised if Taiwan might get a couple of hundred missiles of its own to permanently position and point back across the Strait.

Edited November 7, 2015 by Publicus

[Srikcir]

China's reapproachment with Taiwan is just another move to secure the China Sea as sovereign Chinese terrority. The concept of "one China, two systems" has died and Xi can't revive it unless the Taiwanese give up their own sovereignty. That's not going to happen peacefully, no matter how many trade agreements are made between the two peoples.

It's time the UN dissolve General Assembly Resolution 2758, which states "Recognizing that the representatives of the Government of the People's Republic of China are the only lawful representatives of China to the United Nations" and let Taiwan become a member in its own right.

[LawrenceChee]

The positive news is the two leaders met in what they consider neutral grounds

Western powers have been talking and in years not managed a visit or a meeting or handshake

Xi believes in hand shaking and talks but the west rightly in their own views continue to view this with suspicion...sending war crafts and acts of wars are probably the most common act of foreign diplomacy some countries will remember of the USA

Rather sad as it has produced no real positive results in any recent memory

By the time Taiwan integrates with China many would have scratched the heads and wonder what happen there

There are vocal Taiwanese that want a state of their own there are also Taiwanese who have traveled to China and traded with China in recent years and realised beyond the media and politics

They are all Chinese ...they celebrate Chinese new year and they believe in families , believe in the heritage of respecting elders and all are crazy about phones

So in reality the normal man on the street has already accepted integration ...the leaders just need to do their political shows and as Long as it does not interfere with trade the normal person on the street is not concerned about CNN OR FOX

Take a cruise on Costa and Royal Caribbean departing from Shanghai or Hong Kong heading to Taiwanese ports you see thousands of normal Chinese going to Taiwan and visiting the country , buying souvenirs and sitting there with a cup of tea with the normal Taiwanese Traders ....I don't see any politics discussed ...just Chinese speaking in their dialects and having a laugh

Edited November 8, 2015 by LawrenceChee

[Publicus]

There's a telling old joke about the US, Russia, China that applies to a poster who consistently trivialises major fundamental and serious systemic contradictions between free countries and those that are historically authoritarian.

It's goes something like this: If each of the three governments secretly decided to invade a beach in some place here's how they would scout the beach. The US would send in advance recon personnel in suits sunglasses and earpieces who talk into their shinny rolodex watches. The Russians would send in bulldozers and other heavy digging machinery to fill a dozen of four ton trucks. Chinese would send a hundred tourist families in swimsuits each of 'em to pick up a single grain of sand.

The point being if anyone on the mainland or who is among the CCP diaspora thinks the Chinese are or ever were 'inscrutable' would be deluding himself. It's a cliche, a classic one at that.

We're in the 21st century global village where everybody knows everybody else. We know peoples' genealogical history deeply and right up to who the present town drunk is and who the rapists are. We know who the typical working family is and who are the violent gangs of the neighborhood and in the whole of the community, and we know who are the peacemakers. We know who makes the rules, who follows the rules and who makes his own rules, as concerns Taiwan, the South China Sea, to name two seriously risky places and issues.

The blah blah blah posts about tomorrow tomorrow creeps in this petty place from day to day is trivia and always has been mundane and meaningless in the face of the great issues of the time and the times and of their scope, stakes. Taiwan is exactly such an issue. Taiwan is in fact the number one World War iII issue.

Deng Xiaoping was a tomorrow and creep guy but that was a different time, 25 years ago. The CCP Boyz in Beijing have become rich, fat, powerful. Impatient is the key word. Whereas Deng had the natural Chinese instinct of patience, the present heady CCP Boyz have thoroughly discarded incrementalism for the big stick and a loud voice, stridently hollering at everyone who they see as defying the reclamation by the CCP of China's self-imagined Middle Kingdom status.

The CCP Boyz have based everything on the theories of Marx, Engels, Lenin, Mao and Deng, integrated with remnants of Confucius, Mencius and a few others from the Chinese past. This is yet another failed formula among a long list of failed thinking that extends the Chinese autocrats losing streak from circa 1500 into the present time and going forward.

There's just no mystery to it. The consequence is that the old thinking is retrogressive and futile.

Edited November 8, 2015 by Publicus

[LawrenceChee]

There is an old joke about housewives of the USA , the Russians and the Chinese

It goes something like this ...there were some small ants found in the rice bin and 3 housewives were present

The Russian starting dividing it in equal piles wondering how to distribute it fairly and look good and flicking the ants away as they were a necessary nuisance ....the Chinese were thinking of a markup if they can deliver it and save the customer 2 cents worth of fuel and wondering if the ants were good protein

The American housewife stared at the ants ...started calling in her Lawyers to sue the rice mill and supermarkets for a USPH violation and brought in the blow torch and blew the whole pile of rice away ..satisfied she told her kids she made fried rice and everyone was safe in the house

Smug indeed

[Publicus]

Xi gave his pet Ma Ying-jeou his great final political reward with a golden handshake and a free dinner as each called the other simply as 'mister', although Ma's pronunciation often sounded like 'master'.

There are Chinese who continue to support dictatorship, censorship, authoritarianism; however, there are increasingly significant numbers of Chinese on the mainland and throughout the region and the world who support democracy, a parliamentary system, freedom of thought, speech, and of sustainable wealth creating economics.

If as expected the fiercely anti-CCP Democratic Progressive Party sweeps the Taiwan general election January 16th, and Tsai Ing-wen is elected president, Xi and the rest of the Dictators in Beijing are in for a very bad time over the next four to eight years.

The realism school of international relations is well expressed in this instance by John Mearsheimer, of the University of Chicago....

Given Taiwan’s strategic importance for controlling the sea lanes in East Asia, it is hard to imagine the United States, as well as Japan, allowing China to control that large island. In fact, Taiwan is likely to be an important player in the anti-China balancing coalition, which is sure to infuriate China and fuel the security competition between Beijing and Washington.

The fact is that international politics is a nasty and dangerous business and no amount of good will can ameliorate the intense security competition that sets in when an aspiring hegemon appears in Eurasia. That is the tragedy of great power politics

http://mearsheimer.uchicago.edu/pdfs/A0034b.pdf

[LawrenceChee]

This master thing sounds strangely like Blair giving Bush the wag of the tail

Let's not pretend that free economies or democracies equals the best interests of Asian countries

There is strategic business and commercial interests involved and there are some unicorns out there thinking it's all noble and all

[LawrenceChee]

This master thing sounds strangely like Blair giving Bush the wag of the tail

Let's not pretend that free economies or democracies equals the best interests of Asian countries

There is strategic business and commercial interests involved and there are some unicorns out there thinking it's all noble and all

Anyone hoping that some fanatics will win the elections in Taiwan just so that cross straits relations will deteriorate is an idiot and anti peace ...we should be asking for pragmatic leaders that want to make a difference to the people of China / Taiwan lives instead of those who want to score cherry political points

[Publicus]

This master thing sounds strangely like Blair giving Bush the wag of the tail

Let's not pretend that free economies or democracies equals the best interests of Asian countries

There is strategic business and commercial interests involved and there are some unicorns out there thinking it's all noble and all

Anyone hoping that some fanatics will win the elections in Taiwan just so that cross straits relations will deteriorate is an idiot and anti peace ...we should be asking for pragmatic leaders that want to make a difference to the people of China / Taiwan lives instead of those who want to score cherry political points

There will be no political union of the CCP China and Taiwan unless and until the mainland has democracy. This is the conviction of the vast majority on Taiwan, always has been, always will be.

Outgoing and thoroughly discredited Prez Ma Ying-jeou has demonstrated that a substantial economic connection between the mainland and the island is insufficient as a significant step toward the CCP finally swallowing Taiwan. It's not happening. Ma's approval rating in Taiwan makes the approval rating of the US Congress in Washington look good. In the recent local and regional elections which in Taiwan are held on the one same day Ma's KMT party got blown away to include out of its historic stronghold of Taipei.

The general election coming January 16 will be the statement by the vast majority of the Republic of China (Taiwan) voters that there is not any political integration what so ever between Taipei and the CCP Dictators in Beijing.

No one can dismiss the reality that what looked good about the mainland in the Taiwan 2008 election and again in the 2012 election now looks like what is always was going to be, an economic disaster and a financial crumbling if not a collapse.

Global Imports to the mainland are way off for the twelfth consecutive month. Last year the CCP Boyz set import expansion this year at 6% but imports are down yoy by 8%. The CCP Boyz in Beijing just don't know what they're doing....but then they never did know what they were doing. They too are just now finding that out.

The Sunflower Revolution begun last year on Taiwan and the Umbrella Movement in Hong Kong are leading each place and its people to a sharp political separation from the Communist Party Dictators in Beijing. The two movements are working together on it.

Edited November 9, 2015 by Publicus

[LawrenceChee]

I don't believe anyone would think there would be a political union between the 2

Like cousins , they are tied by race and all are Chinese by race ever if the political ideology is different

Unlike the west , Chinese are extremely patient and willing to wait ...talk a little ...wait ...and talk a little ...takes a while to get to 5000 year heritage and history ...I know there the countries which are envious of that

After all there are some countries which believe in political bravado and talking on TV shows and self fulfilment....the Chinese style is distinctly unlike that ...boring and waiting is good

Edited November 10, 2015 by LawrenceChee