Hate coups? Then Don't spoil politicians

[webfact]

EDITORIAL
Hate coups? Then Don't spoil politicians
The Nation

Clean politics is the only way we can pre-empt military intervention

BANGKOK: -- There is absolutely no such thing as a "perfect relationship" between soldiers and politicians. Thailand is among the "Exhibit A's" for obvious reasons.

The countless coups and controversial appointments made by politicians in power to the Armed Forces demonstrate a vicious circle of mistrust and attempts by both sides to control each other. No law, no Constitution, no executive order can prevent interference, explicit or otherwise.

Thailand saw a glimpse of hope during the big flood disaster a few years ago, when soldiers and politicians worked closely together in rescue and relief efforts. Unfortunately, that was an exception, not the rule. When a natural emergency fades and "politicians" returns, it's business as usual. Soldiers are not "in the barracks" and the reason why depends on one's political leaning.

Make no mistake, Thailand is not the only "cursed" nation. In Indonesia, the military dominated that country's politics for so long. Myanmar, which has just held its "freest" election in decades, has a Constitution that favours a strong military presence in politics and is not easy to change parliamentarily. Past or present generals are controlling politics in Indochina. And it's believed that even in the most democratic societies, military interference exists, albeit subtly and not in the "conventional" form.

To say that politically ambitious soldiers should drop their uniforms and run in elections is pointless. In Thailand, military people do that all the time, only to allow the politically ambitious ones unwilling to drop their uniforms and run in elections to come out of the shadows and assert themselves.

The best solution is getting rid of the reasons or "pretexts" for a coup. Prescribing strong punishment for coup-makers won't work, obviously, because a successful coup can cancel out any legal means intended to penalise the perpetrators. Social boycotts won't stop coups either. An anti-military popular uprising in 1992 was hailed as a concerted social effort to teach coup-makers a lesson. No coup would ever happen again, it was said at the time. As it turned out, the next coup overthrew one of the most popular civilian governments in history.

Attacking "coup apologists" also misses the point, a desperate act at best. Coup-makers will rule no matter what. With some support, their jobs may be a bit easier. Without support, they will just clamp down harder. In other words, coup-makers don't care if they are loved or criticised, and to make that a justification why coups are bad won't help. The bottom line is coups can happen no matter how the act is condemned or criticised. Some things may "deter" a coup, but if it has to happen, it will.

To break the vicious circle, therefore, it's not up to the generals. It's up to the politicians. The former don't need to prove themselves, but the latter do. If we keep attacking coup-makers, we are spoiling the politicians, encouraging them to do what invites the soldiers to come out of their barracks in the first place. Some may say that if we keep attacking the politicians, we may also encourage the soldiers, too. But if our politicians give the soldiers fewer and fewer reasons or pretexts for staging a coup, wouldn't that be nice?

This is not a chicken and egg situation. Clean, honest politics will give birth to a coup-free society. Coups may or may not make politicians behave, but if politicians behave, democracy will thrive. It's as simple as that.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/opinion/Hate-coups-Then-Dont-spoil-politicians-30273493.html


-- The Nation 2015-11-23

[Laughing Gravy]

Not a bad article in my opinion. At least it compares itself realistically to other countries of similar problems, Indonesia and Burma. The writer is a realist and sprouting that Thailand is the hub of something.

Now djjamie, what drivel you write.

[LannaGuy]

More drivel from the Nation

[EnglishJohn]

Not a bad article in my opinion. At least it compares itself realistically to other countries of similar problems, Indonesia and Burma. The writer is a realist and sprouting that Thailand is the hub of something.

Now djjamie, what drivel you write.

Why not go through each point and explain us why it is drivel instead of responding like a 6 year old with no argument ?.

[apetley]

"If Turnbull gave me 40% pay rise to vote for him though, I may turn a blind eye!"

Sounds like a potential Red Shirt to me.

[TheCruncher]

There is absolutely no such thing as a "perfect relationship" between soldiers and politicians.

Where I come from there is NO relationship between soldiers and politicians other then the one with the minister of defence.

[FangFerang]

Not a bad article in my opinion. At least it compares itself realistically to other countries of similar problems, Indonesia and Burma. The writer is a realist and sprouting that Thailand is the hub of something.

Now djjamie, what drivel you write.

Why not go through each point and explain us why it is drivel instead of responding like a 6 year old with no argument ?.

Well, because djjamie has a very selective memory, and countering that much drivel is too time consuming for thinking adults. No level headed person thinks that one side was ever worse than the other, the current government is just cozy with the power brokers behind the scenes.

[trogers]

The worship of money and power ingrained in the Thai psychic is the main cause in accepting corruption and spoiling their politicians.

[tomross46]

Honest politician is an OXYMORON. It makes no difference. which party or which country. All they do is lie cheat and rob the tax payers and the country. I have come to the opinion that the only trustworthy news agency is Al Jazera.

[jaywalker]

There is absolutely no such thing as a "perfect relationship" between soldiers and politicians.

Where I come from there is NO relationship between soldiers and politicians other then the one with the minister of defence.

Where I come from the military very muchly influences politics.

They just do it by means of what are benignly called "lobbyists".

[metisdead]

A nonsense baiting post with off topic deflection comments has been removed as well as the replies.

[glenmohr]

There is absolutely no such thing as a "perfect relationship" between soldiers and politicians.

Where I come from there is NO relationship between soldiers and politicians other then the one with the minister of defence.

Where I come from, as is with a number of countries, the military has NO say in politics, zero.

Otherwise the article makes good valid sense.

Problem with much of S E Asia is that the citizens must be subservient to the military instead of the military protecting the country and serving the population. It is all the wrong way round.

However Indonesia has broken the mould and the military there accepted a non military President showing Thailand it can be done in an Asian society.

[thelonius]

Hate Coups?. Do not accept a constitution with a blanket amnesty for military "intervention" written in.

[The Deerhunter]

My only immediate thought is that it has to be done slowly and by degrees. Politicians apparently maneuvering against potentially "political" soldiers will only bring on the next coup to save the nation from "corrupt politicians." Remember which one has the guns.

[jcsmith]

There is no justification for a coup. Everyone involved would be lined up and shot in most countries.

[heybruce]

Article summary: The military is above the law and nothing can be done about this, so politicians must make the military happy.

In the US officers are taught that they report to a civilian commander in chief and that it is illegal to obey an illegal order. This hasn't eliminated all problems, but it has prevented coups.

[phoenixdoglover]

Power abhors a vacuum.

That's about all I can say without getting in trouble here.

This Editorial is overly simplistic.

For every country that has had recurrent coups, there are two or more countries that have not had coups; and many of those have a history of political conflict and misbehavior. By definition, politicians are not to be trusted. They are to be constrained by their constitutional roles and their term limits. They are to be impeached for gross misdeeds while in office, and prosecuted for non-political crimes at any time.

In Thailand, the coup factors are many:

- a history of coups (the wife is well beaten)

- a Constitution that places the military separate from and above the civilian government

- endemic corruption in major institutions

- an unpredictable and inconsistent justice system

- the primacy of political parties' interests over constituency interests

Now, if the politicians would just behave better, all of these problems would be solved.

[metisdead]

An off topic post has been removed as well as the replies.

[tbthailand]

The Nation are either (1) clueless, or (2) obedient junta lapdogs.

Given that they drummed out Pravit on cue, I bet on the latter.

- This is yet another article that blames politicians for coups. In a Thailand where politicians are seemingly held personally accountable for failed government policies, it should be embarrassing to The Nation's editorial staff to not blame coups on Generals.

Dear The Nation - food for thought ...

Edited November 23, 2015 by tbthailand

[Gonsalviz]

Hate Coups?. Do not accept a constitution with a blanket amnesty for military "intervention" written in.

I hate them too but Thailand's military has saved this country from destruction, several times.

[jayboy]

There is no justification for a coup. Everyone involved would be lined up and shot in most countries.

It happens in Thailand eg General Chalard's ill fated attempt in the 1970's when those attempting the coup haven't signed off in advance with......prudence dictates the need to be rather vague at this point.

[thelonius]

Hate Coups?. Do not accept a constitution with a blanket amnesty for military "intervention" written in.

I hate them too but Thailand's military has saved this country from destruction, several times.

Thailand has had 20 constitutions (coded constitutions that is) since the first in 1932. By logical extension my reference was to "recent" constitutional history, 83 years worth. Please let me know the number of times the military has saved Thailand from "destruction" in that timescale.

[halloween]

There is no justification for a coup. Everyone involved would be lined up and shot in most countries.

Really? By whom? Perhaps the corrupt politicians being usurped might make for better targets.

[heybruce]

There is no justification for a coup. Everyone involved would be lined up and shot in most countries.

Really? By whom? Perhaps the corrupt politicians being usurped might make for better targets.

Once again halloween ignores the obvious, that the military is as corrupt as any institution in Thailand. http://government.defenceindex.org/countries/thailand/

Probably more so, since they are forever above the law in Thailand. In the past the military has deposed the monarchy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Thailand_%281932%E2%80%9373%29 Has any monarchy ever deposed the military in Thailand? Does anyone doubt that certain ambitious people don't have that in mind?

Democracy is an annoying distraction in the power play(s) to come, The players clearly prefer to eliminate that distraction.

Edited November 25, 2015 by heybruce

[Solomon]

The military and the politicians are not equals!

Politicians are the peoples representatives, they are ELECTED to work on behalf of the people and are answerable for their actions (or inactions) at regular intervals via elections (and throughout their term in office by the opposition, the media, international bodies and various interest groups).

The military are a publicly funded entity whose sole reason for existence is to defend the nation from EXTERNAL threats.

Politicians are meant to be in charge of the military - there is no confusion.

Lack of civilian authority over the armed forces is mother of ALL Thailand's troubles!

[Laughing Gravy]

Not a bad article in my opinion. At least it compares itself realistically to other countries of similar problems, Indonesia and Burma. The writer is a realist and sprouting that Thailand is the hub of something.

Now djjamie, what drivel you write.

Why not go through each point and explain us why it is drivel instead of responding like a 6 year old with no argument ?.

Well because I don't have to or want too. I find your writing tedious. If you don't like my writings move on and get over yourself. If you are English then I will eat my hat. Are you and djjamie the same person. You both sound the same.