after both reached agreement with the military

pussies, both of 'em...

seems they agreed so they could be released

time will tell if they are "pussies"

seems they agreed so they could be released

time will tell if they are "pussies"

well, I would say that the last 20 months prove that already.

I've been more than disappointed with the leadership of the PTP and the UDD in the face of yet-another-coup-d'etat... I never expected anything from Thaksin, but Yingluck and the others had a chance to stand up and call the coup for what it was right on May 22nd.

What, seriously, could the military have done to Yingluck and the others who are incredibly well known ... and even liked by many Thais? Nothing.

The military can make a lot of people disappear. They can whisk them off to detention centers to private cells for meditation and suicide, but they can't do that to these guys, they can't do that to Yingluck. Those were the leaders on May 22nd who could have shown what they were made of, ... well, actually, I guess they did anyway. None of them were willing to stand up for the Thai people on May 22nd, now they are just show-boating.

It is now up to normal Thais like local activists, Resistant Citizen, Dao Din, and Thammasat students to expose the junta for the apes that they are, ... yet again...

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

It must be really eating you up inside that they have been released yet again

And why not? And when will the trial for the charges they one bail for, come about. On bail since 2010? Why not in the dock to stand trial by now?

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

You're not allowed to travel to a public park when out on bail?

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

I suppose there were people like you in Vichy France who cheered on the fascists and Petainists when they harassed (or worse) those who held different opinions to the party line.

Somehow that it now comes from foreigners makes it, to me at least, all the more vile and ignoble.

Threatening to burn everyone who opposed him or them and asking one million people to bring a litre of petrol each to burn Bangkok doesn't sound to me like "just having a different opinion to the party line." You sure have a strange perception of differing opinions. Do you feel the same way about the murdering terrorists in Paris who may have just had "a different opinion about democracy and morality", than the people they murdered? Don't say it is different. It is not!! One lot actually did it and one lot just wanted to do it & didn't get round to it. Note these guys are not being charged with doing it, only trying to inflame other brain-washed idiots to do it, (who it appears had more sense than that two, or the religious maniac losers from Brussels.)

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

Wish there were more like you. Most junta cheerleaders don't give a monkeys as long as supporters of the other side are the victims. These TVF posters have all had the privilege of being raised in a law abiding, democratic system yet they are willing to see that system abused here providing the abuse only travels one way. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend... regardless of the circumstances" is the mantra of a few posters on here. Why do you assume that Thais shouldn't have the same birthright as you had?

It doesn't matter what these guys did in the past, lots on both sides have gotten away with stuff which maybe they shouldn't have. A few should be in jail, but they're not. Therefore, people should be allowed, as in this case, to travel freely around their own country providing they're obeying the law, which in their case I believe they were.

I've yet to see a groupy mention the mass protest led by Issara outside the US embassy, now that clearly was a violation of the law. As plain as the nose on your face and a chance for the regime to flex it's muscles. No, they picked on a couple of guys peacefully visiting a park, committing the crime of supporting the other side.

Edited December 1, 201510 yr by jesimps

Is an MOU like an Iou, in Thailand?

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

What part of their bail terms forbids them from visiting a national park? The deputy PM today said that they aren't banned from visiting. Come back from bitter cloud cuckoo land, it's much nicer here.

And did the mad monk have to sign any agreements for breaking the law?

What would have happened if they had refused to sign the agreement? When your only way to freedom is to sign a document you do not agree with, how many posters would have the balls to refuse to sign on principle? Not many. And breach of agreement results in seizure of your and your families assets. Speak your mind and we will make you poor.

These 2 are absolute nutters but the way the army is operating in getting people to sign things they really have no choice in is despicable. All and sundry are having to sign these agreements, whether or not their activities could in fact be viewed as incitement. People are getting locked up not just for saying certain things but for their words being viewed to "infer" something. Innocent people are being locked away, through vindictiveness and as a silencing mechanism, and because of the hopelessness of appeal, pleading guilty to things they have not done in the hope of having their sentences reduced. It is all getting very sick.

It is no wonder that more and more people are whispering about how they dislike like what is "broadly" going on under the junta. Whispering because they are too scared to talk aloud.

which assets of who were ever seized?

Beside Jatuporn and Nattawut where did they get their assets and did they pay income tax for it? I guess in every other country they would have been sized. In Thailand sign of a worthless piece of paper does the trick.

I shouldn't start talking about assets if I were you, the powers that be might not take kindly to it.

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

I suppose there were people like you in Vichy France who cheered on the fascists and Petainists when they harassed (or worse) those who held different opinions to the party line.

Somehow that it now comes from foreigners makes it, to me at least, all the more vile and ignoble.

Threatening to burn everyone who opposed him or them and asking one million people to bring a litre of petrol each to burn Bangkok doesn't sound to me like "just having a different opinion to the party line." You sure have a strange perception of differing opinions. Do you feel the same way about the murdering terrorists in Paris who may have just had "a different opinion about democracy and morality", than the people they murdered? Don't say it is different. It is not!! One lot actually did it and one lot just wanted to do it & didn't get round to it. Note these guys are not being charged with doing it, only trying to inflame other brain-washed idiots to do it, (who it appears had more sense than that two, or the religious maniac losers from Brussels.)

I think you are ignorant or have become confused about who have been generally been the murderers and who have generally been the victims.I remember a lot of histrionic and reckless talk from the redshirt leadership but I also remember the murderous record of the Thai Army, and the cynical selfishness of their powerful backers.

If the redshirts had really wanted to put fire to Bangkok there would have been a great deal more damage than was the case.

And did the mad monk have to sign any agreements for breaking the law?

What would have happened if they had refused to sign the agreement? When your only way to freedom is to sign a document you do not agree with, how many posters would have the balls to refuse to sign on principle? Not many. And breach of agreement results in seizure of your and your families assets. Speak your mind and we will make you poor.

These 2 are absolute nutters but the way the army is operating in getting people to sign things they really have no choice in is despicable. All and sundry are having to sign these agreements, whether or not their activities could in fact be viewed as incitement. People are getting locked up not just for saying certain things but for their words being viewed to "infer" something. Innocent people are being locked away, through vindictiveness and as a silencing mechanism, and because of the hopelessness of appeal, pleading guilty to things they have not done in the hope of having their sentences reduced. It is all getting very sick.

It is no wonder that more and more people are whispering about how they dislike like what is "broadly" going on under the junta. Whispering because they are too scared to talk aloud.

which assets of who were ever seized?

Beside Jatuporn and Nattawut where did they get their assets and did they pay income tax for it? I guess in every other country they would have been sized. In Thailand sign of a worthless piece of paper does the trick.

I shouldn't start talking about assets if I were you, the powers that be might not take kindly to it.

yes maybe I am the first one....but I can live with that risk, I am not paranoid.

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

I suppose there were people like you in Vichy France who cheered on the fascists and Petainists when they harassed (or worse) those who held different opinions to the party line.

Somehow that it now comes from foreigners makes it, to me at least, all the more vile and ignoble.

Threatening to burn everyone who opposed him or them and asking one million people to bring a litre of petrol each to burn Bangkok doesn't sound to me like "just having a different opinion to the party line." You sure have a strange perception of differing opinions. Do you feel the same way about the murdering terrorists in Paris who may have just had "a different opinion about democracy and morality", than the people they murdered? Don't say it is different. It is not!! One lot actually did it and one lot just wanted to do it & didn't get round to it. Note these guys are not being charged with doing it, only trying to inflame other brain-washed idiots to do it, (who it appears had more sense than that two, or the religious maniac losers from Brussels.)

"but but but the redshirts threatened to burn down Bangkok". All wind and p..s. Now, the damage caused by the the anti-Yingluck protests was really something to shout about. Not to mention the occupation of the airport a few years back.

However, lets get back to the subject in hand as to why these guys were arrested for visiting a park. The deputy PM said today that it didn't violate their bail terms. Smacks of payback to me and completely against the spirit of reconciliation.

It must be really eating you up inside that they have been released yet again

It doesn't, nor do I give a rats as5e because I am not Thai and my opinion rates for nothing to the Thai people.

Incidentally your opinion rate the same as mine to the Thai people.

Sorry about that.

your opinions are not rated highly here either, we are due a holiday from your wiki links, how to spell Thai names (<deleted>) and your tube vids. Retire gracefully to your allotment - now.

Are you a moderator and is this an official warning?

If you are not and my posts upset you put me on your ignore list. I promise that I won't get upset or throw my toys out of the pram. You can even click on the button that says report this post which will go to a REAL moderator who will make a decision that I will respect.

Until that point comes I have little interest in what you think of me and my posts.

IIRC I have the same rights as you do when posting.

If you don't like what I have written here please find somebody who cares (if you can) and tell them.

Edited December 1, 201510 yr by billd766

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

I suppose there were people like you in Vichy France who cheered on the fascists and Petainists when they harassed (or worse) those who held different opinions to the party line.

Somehow that it now comes from foreigners makes it, to me at least, all the more vile and ignoble.

It doesn't really matter to the Thai people what I, you or anybody else posts on this forum.

The Thai people will do what they want to do irrespective of what we want, would like, care about or anything we say.

Have you not learned yet that Thais not only don't care what farangs write but in a lot of cases they don't actually LIKE what we write.

That is why we are tolerated but totally ignored with any advice that we give.

I suppose that you prefer a government run and owned by a convicted criminal who doesn't even live in Thailand and would not be allowed to stand for parliament or even vote if he was here.

It must be really eating you up inside that they have been released yet again

It doesn't, nor do I give a rats as5e because I am not Thai and my opinion rates for nothing to the Thai people.

Incidentally your opinion rate the same as mine to the Thai people.

Sorry about that.

I realise that, you don't that's why you posted what you did because it's eating you up and consuming you you just don't realise it. Build a bridge my friend

To repeat myself it is not eating me up and AFAIR we are not friends.

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

What illegal detention is that?

You DO know that they were out on bail, don't you?

They broke the terms and conditions of their bail and they should be in jail for that alone.

However they have promised to be good and therefore the bail was renewed, yet again.

It remains to be seen if they will break this latest term.

If they do then simply toss them in jail.

I suppose there were people like you in Vichy France who cheered on the fascists and Petainists when they harassed (or worse) those who held different opinions to the party line.

Somehow that it now comes from foreigners makes it, to me at least, all the more vile and ignoble.

It doesn't really matter to the Thai people what I, you or anybody else posts on this forum.

The Thai people will do what they want to do irrespective of what we want, would like, care about or anything we say.

Have you not learned yet that Thais not only don't care what farangs write but in a lot of cases they don't actually LIKE what we write.

That is why we are tolerated but totally ignored with any advice that we give.

I suppose that you prefer a government run and owned by a convicted criminal who doesn't even live in Thailand and would not be allowed to stand for parliament or even vote if he was here.

You are under a false impression that I believe what we say here is of the slightest interest to Thais.They neither like it not dislike it.They don't care and I am very sympathetic to their indifference.

Do you really need a response to your embarrassingly simplistic final paragraph?

the government has been too kind to these two criminals

The Thai people have been too kind to this government/ junta.

Just wait till the tide turns as they have already outstayed their welcome.

Outside of the alternative universe of the current "government" Jatuporn and Nattawut are leaders of the largest political party in Thailand. It would appear, however, that the PM would simply like this political party to disappear. Alternatively, the strategy is to construct a complex and confusing set of NEW rules of political discourse effective that removes the party by administrative fiat. The political reality is that underlying "reconciliation" is negotiation and to think that an "adjustment of attitudes" is the new definition of negotiation will lead nowhere.

seems they agreed so they could be released

time will tell if they are "pussies"

well, I would say that the last 20 months prove that already.

I've been more than disappointed with the leadership of the PTP and the UDD in the face of yet-another-coup-d'etat... I never expected anything from Thaksin, but Yingluck and the others had a chance to stand up and call the coup for what it was right on May 22nd.

What, seriously, could the military have done to Yingluck and the others who are incredibly well known ... and even liked by many Thais? Nothing.

The military can make a lot of people disappear. They can whisk them off to detention centers to private cells for meditation and suicide, but they can't do that to these guys, they can't do that to Yingluck. Those were the leaders on May 22nd who could have shown what they were made of, ... well, actually, I guess they did anyway. None of them were willing to stand up for the Thai people on May 22nd, now they are just show-boating.

It is now up to normal Thais like local activists, Resistant Citizen, Dao Din, and Thammasat students to expose the junta for the apes that they are, ... yet again...

Common trait here, talk big and lead from the rear.

Didn't their lord and master once say if the shooting started he'd join those on the barricades but unfortunately the only flight available went to Paris.

And did the mad monk have to sign any agreements for breaking the law?

What would have happened if they had refused to sign the agreement? When your only way to freedom is to sign a document you do not agree with, how many posters would have the balls to refuse to sign on principle? Not many. And breach of agreement results in seizure of your and your families assets. Speak your mind and we will make you poor.

These 2 are absolute nutters but the way the army is operating in getting people to sign things they really have no choice in is despicable. All and sundry are having to sign these agreements, whether or not their activities could in fact be viewed as incitement. People are getting locked up not just for saying certain things but for their words being viewed to "infer" something. Innocent people are being locked away, through vindictiveness and as a silencing mechanism, and because of the hopelessness of appeal, pleading guilty to things they have not done in the hope of having their sentences reduced. It is all getting very sick.

It is no wonder that more and more people are whispering about how they dislike like what is "broadly" going on under the junta. Whispering because they are too scared to talk aloud.

Just your opinion and attempt to divide, I rather doubt you have the overall contacts etc., to be able to make such a statement.

In the company where I work (over 400 employees), people are starting to voice dissent with their workmates, myself included. They have said to me that they would not dare speak out outside the office. They trust the people they are working with not to say anything. These are the very people who strongly supported the coup in the beginning. An office full of white collar workers mostly middle to upper middle class.

BTW, I am not attempting to divide. I even supported the coup in the beginning. But I did not see the "machinations" behind the scenes then. Initially things seemed to be going really well, but things are clearly going to hell now if you can't express an opinion without the risk of being locked up. The army will not accept any dissent whatsoever.

I wouldn't trust any of the lot holding sway now and wouldn't trust red or yellow either come to that. But what you DO NOT have now is the lesser of evils. The country is being screwed for the benefit of certain parties. And neither you, nor I, nor any of the voting Thai public will have any influence on how things turn out and how it is rammed down the public's throat.

I think Prayuth is just the wrong person. I don't mean the way he talks nonsense when he is angry, I mean the times when he silent.....They try good things, don't follow up. When there is corruption in their own ranks they try to cover it up as sack a few of them would be the best propaganda possible (even if they only loose the job and come back a year later). But no nothing.....

I still think it is better to have Prayuth instead of the next Shinawatra, but what he is (not) doing now will lead to the next Shinawatra in a few years.

It is really not about Prayuth or Shinawatras but about the game of musical chairs. Who will be left standing when the music stops, as eventually it must?

seems they agreed so they could be released

time will tell if they are "pussies"

well, I would say that the last 20 months prove that already.

I've been more than disappointed with the leadership of the PTP and the UDD in the face of yet-another-coup-d'etat... I never expected anything from Thaksin, but Yingluck and the others had a chance to stand up and call the coup for what it was right on May 22nd.

What, seriously, could the military have done to Yingluck and the others who are incredibly well known ... and even liked by many Thais? Nothing.

The military can make a lot of people disappear. They can whisk them off to detention centers to private cells for meditation and suicide, but they can't do that to these guys, they can't do that to Yingluck. Those were the leaders on May 22nd who could have shown what they were made of, ... well, actually, I guess they did anyway. None of them were willing to stand up for the Thai people on May 22nd, now they are just show-boating.

It is now up to normal Thais like local activists, Resistant Citizen, Dao Din, and Thammasat students to expose the junta for the apes that they are, ... yet again...

Common trait here, talk big and lead from the rear.

Didn't their lord and master once say if the shooting started he'd join those on the barricades but unfortunately the only flight available went to Paris.

These guys lead from the heart... and the gut.

Youtube channel online 9 months, almost 1 million views... Just regular Thais...

I think you are ignorant or have become confused about who have been generally been the murderers and who have generally been the victims.I remember a lot of histrionic and reckless talk from the redshirt leadership but I also remember the murderous record of the Thai Army, and the cynical selfishness of their powerful backers.

If the redshirts had really wanted to put fire to Bangkok there would have been a great deal more damage than was the case.

Apologism reaches a new depth! They didn't REALLY mean to burn BKK, without even considering they did, but were simply incompetent, or even that there were far fewer mercenary arsonists and radicalised idiots than claimed.

I think you are ignorant or have become confused about who have been generally been the murderers and who have generally been the victims.I remember a lot of histrionic and reckless talk from the redshirt leadership but I also remember the murderous record of the Thai Army, and the cynical selfishness of their powerful backers.

If the redshirts had really wanted to put fire to Bangkok there would have been a great deal more damage than was the case.

Apologism reaches a new depth! They didn't REALLY mean to burn BKK, without even considering they did, but were simply incompetent, or even that there were far fewer mercenary arsonists and radicalised idiots than claimed.

The damage done by the red shirts wrongheaded and deplorable as it was - remained on a limited scale.It does not compare with the barbaric behaviour of the army and ruling politicians at that time.But perhaps in the minds of RWNJs murder is a lesser crime than the interruption of complacent urbanites ability to waddle around vulgar shopping malls.

I think you are ignorant or have become confused about who have been generally been the murderers and who have generally been the victims.I remember a lot of histrionic and reckless talk from the redshirt leadership but I also remember the murderous record of the Thai Army, and the cynical selfishness of their powerful backers.

If the redshirts had really wanted to put fire to Bangkok there would have been a great deal more damage than was the case.

Apologism reaches a new depth! They didn't REALLY mean to burn BKK, without even considering they did, but were simply incompetent, or even that there were far fewer mercenary arsonists and radicalised idiots than claimed.

The damage done by the red shirts wrongheaded and deplorable as it was - remained on a limited scale.It does not compare with the barbaric behaviour of the army and ruling politicians at that time.But perhaps in the minds of RWNJs murder is a lesser crime than the interruption of complacent urbanites ability to waddle around vulgar shopping malls.

"wrongheaded and deplorable" but they didn't REALLY mean it? And inciting fools to do it wasn't REALLY a crime, because restoring law and order in the capital was far worse? Even though the agitation and incitation took place well before any attempt to restore order?

I think you are ignorant or have become confused about who have been generally been the murderers and who have generally been the victims.I remember a lot of histrionic and reckless talk from the redshirt leadership but I also remember the murderous record of the Thai Army, and the cynical selfishness of their powerful backers.

If the redshirts had really wanted to put fire to Bangkok there would have been a great deal more damage than was the case.

Apologism reaches a new depth! They didn't REALLY mean to burn BKK, without even considering they did, but were simply incompetent, or even that there were far fewer mercenary arsonists and radicalised idiots than claimed.

The damage done by the red shirts wrongheaded and deplorable as it was - remained on a limited scale.It does not compare with the barbaric behaviour of the army and ruling politicians at that time.But perhaps in the minds of RWNJs murder is a lesser crime than the interruption of complacent urbanites ability to waddle around vulgar shopping malls.

"wrongheaded and deplorable" but they didn't REALLY mean it? And inciting fools to do it wasn't REALLY a crime, because restoring law and order in the capital was far worse? Even though the agitation and incitation took place well before any attempt to restore order?

Who said they didn't mean it? I'm sure it was intentional.But the damage was limited and no doubt it was irritating for the Sino Thai nouveaux riches to have to go to some other ritzy shopping malls for a few months.

But the crime doesn't even begin to compare with that of the regime's murder of civilians.Naturally neither the politicians nor generals involved have ever been made accountable.

Outside of the alternative universe of the current "government" Jatuporn and Nattawut are leaders of the largest political party in Thailand. It would appear, however, that the PM would simply like this political party to disappear. Alternatively, the strategy is to construct a complex and confusing set of NEW rules of political discourse effective that removes the party by administrative fiat. The political reality is that underlying "reconciliation" is negotiation and to think that an "adjustment of attitudes" is the new definition of negotiation will lead nowhere.

As far as I am aware the UDD is not actually a political party registered with the Thai State.

It has no MPs of its own nor has it sent any of its members to stand for any election.

Also I don't think it has any formal structure and the leaders seem to be "elected" by the committee rather than by the rank and file of the members though I could be wrong about that.

The leader of the UDD is now Jatuporn Prompan as of 16th March 2014 replacing the then leader Thida Tavornseth.

I did have to go to Google to get the correct spelling of the names.

To keep some tender ears and eyes happy I have deliberately not put in any links or references to Wikipedia, youtube or anywhere else.

Hate these guys but hate illegal detention more.

Wish there were more like you. Most junta cheerleaders don't give a monkeys as long as supporters of the other side are the victims. These TVF posters have all had the privilege of being raised in a law abiding, democratic system yet they are willing to see that system abused here providing the abuse only travels one way. "The enemy of my enemy is my friend... regardless of the circumstances" is the mantra of a few posters on here. Why do you assume that Thais shouldn't have the same birthright as you had?

It doesn't matter what these guys did in the past, lots on both sides have gotten away with stuff which maybe they shouldn't have. A few should be in jail, but they're not. Therefore, people should be allowed, as in this case, to travel freely around their own country providing they're obeying the law, which in their case I believe they were.

I've yet to see a groupy mention the mass protest led by Issara outside the US embassy, now that clearly was a violation of the law. As plain as the nose on your face and a chance for the regime to flex it's muscles. No, they picked on a couple of guys peacefully visiting a park, committing the crime of supporting the other side.

Was it perhaps against the conditions of their bail of your " couple of guys" to be peacefully visiting THAT park on THAT day? Don't even think that that visit was not politically motivated and they are barred I believe of doing anything political. And one report said they were holding a press conference of some sort when apprehended. A couple of real nice guys, I don't think!!!!!!!!! Invite them to your home any time you like. Enjoy the company. The conversation will likely be limited to a narrow range of topics, mostly political. BTW I deeply disapprove of Issara's US Embassy stunt and the poster the nice lady was holding up. Disgraceful stuff.

Edited December 2, 201510 yr by The Deerhunter

I thought, they were arrested???......oh hey,... JUUUUUST KIDDING..... zZ

Time for soomtan..