Israeli teens sentenced for Palestinian boy's burning death

[webfact]

Israeli teens sentenced for Palestinian boy's burning death
By Jason Hanna and Amir Tal, CNN

(CNN)Two of three Israelis convicted of murdering a Palestinian teen in 2014 -- a death that prosecutors say was revenge for the deaths of three Israelis days earlier -- were sentenced to prison Thursday.

A Jerusalem district court sentenced one Israeli teen to life in prison and another to 21 years for the killing of 16-year-old Mohammed Abu Khdeir, court representative Shirley Koren said.

Abu Khdeir's death -- he was kidnapped in the Jerusalem area, beaten and burned alive -- was one of the events that stoked high tensions between Israelis and Palestinians in the summer of that year.

Full story: http://us.cnn.com/2016/02/04/middleeast/israeli-teens-sentenced-palestinian-death/index.html


-- CNN 2016-02-05

[ezzra]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

[dexterm]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

[robblok]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

[dexterm]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Far from being way off, it is a fact of life that rankles Palestinians occupied by the IDF in their own land and subjected to vandalism, beatings, and murders by illegal Zionist colonists. That a Jewish settler can murder a Palestinian who lives just a mile away in a West Bank village, but be tried in an Israeli court, whereas a Palestinian can by law be extra judicially executed no questions asked as to motives or sanity and then to add insult to injury their parents home demolished as a collective punishment

"The father of the victim pointed to the discrepancies in how the Israeli government punishes whole Palestinian families for the crimes of lone suspects.

"I ask the courts to demolish their homes," he said. "We won't accept anything less than that. If you have democracy, then where is it? If there wasn't racism then we would get the same thing as an Arab would, to demolish their homes."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/02/murdered-palestinian-boy-parents-slam-jail-sentences-160204113618073.html

[Jingthing]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

[JingerBen]

Summary execution is the fate that usually befalls captured Palestinian terrorists - and rightly so.

Israeli terrorists get their day in court or go entirely unpunished.

Whether or not this case is propaganda smoke and mirrors will depend on the killers serving their full terms.

Don't bet the kibbutz on it.

[Grestin]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Israeli law violators are SOMETIMES not immune from prosecution. But they do not recieve the same penalty as others.

[dexterm]

Summary execution is the fate that usually befalls captured Palestinian terrorists - and rightly so.

Israeli terrorists get their day in court or go entirely unpunished.

Whether or not this case is propaganda smoke and mirrors will depend on the killers serving their full terms.

Don't bet the kibbutz on it.

The ring leader of the Jewish terrorists in the OP, Yosef Haim Ben-David, claimed insanity at the last minute the day before the verdict. He is still being assessed. A luxury not afforded to any of the 160 Palestinians killed extra judicially.

The cop who was filmed beating up the OP victim's 15 year old cousin Tariq , an American citizen, got 6 weeks community service.

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.687009

So the jury is still out on whether it is smoke and mirrors propaganda.

Edited February 5, 2016 by dexterm

[Jingthing]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Israeli law violators are SOMETIMES not immune from prosecution. But they do not recieve the same penalty as others.

I see. Well, I think that I already covered that obvious point very well with my opening phrase: NOBODY IS CLAIMING THE ISRAELI SYSTEM IS PERFECT ...

Duh.

[farcanell]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could be wrong... But I suspect that a Jewish terrorist in a foreign country like Palestine, might get it worse than would happen the other way around.

Anyway... This article is about teenaged murder, not terrorists... And the sentencing seems to be in line with most first world countries... So it's all good

[Jingthing]

Indeed, it is good that these murderers have been prosecuted under Israeli law. Hopefully, such prosecutions will help deter any other far right wing Israelis understand they are not above Israeli law.

Edited February 5, 2016 by Jingthing

[Grestin]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could be wrong... But I suspect that a Jewish terrorist in a foreign country like Palestine, might get it worse than would happen the other way around.

Anyway... This article is about teenaged murder, not terrorists... And the sentencing seems to be in line with most first world countries... So it's all good

Its not all good when a palestinian would receive a harsher penalty for the same thing. Thats the difference.

[TheFishman1]

After reading the pros and con I think ISREAL is doing the right thing.

[robblok]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Far from being way off, it is a fact of life that rankles Palestinians occupied by the IDF in their own land and subjected to vandalism, beatings, and murders by illegal Zionist colonists. That a Jewish settler can murder a Palestinian who lives just a mile away in a West Bank village, but be tried in an Israeli court, whereas a Palestinian can by law be extra judicially executed no questions asked as to motives or sanity and then to add insult to injury their parents home demolished as a collective punishment

"The father of the victim pointed to the discrepancies in how the Israeli government punishes whole Palestinian families for the crimes of lone suspects.

"I ask the courts to demolish their homes," he said. "We won't accept anything less than that. If you have democracy, then where is it? If there wasn't racism then we would get the same thing as an Arab would, to demolish their homes."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/02/murdered-palestinian-boy-parents-slam-jail-sentences-160204113618073.html

I am asking you a question how many Palestinians have been tried in their courts for attacking an Israeli. Guess that is zero as you can't give any answers. At least the Jews do have courts that punish their own for misdeeds.

[Steely Dan]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Not only do Palestinian murderers get off Scott free they get praised or eulogized by their leaders. Should they end up in Israeli jails they are paid a generous salary by the Palestinian terror statelet partly funded by the biased and clueless EU. Edited February 5, 2016 by Steely Dan

[Grestin]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Not only do Palestinian murderers get off Scott free they get praised or eulogized by their leaders. Should they end up in Israeli jails they are paid a generous salary by the Palestinian terror statelet partly funded by the biased and clueless EU.

Im sure you feel sorry for the deceased and happy the murderers were caught.

[Thorgal]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install
equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians
authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists
who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Far from being way off, it is a fact of life that rankles Palestinians occupied by the IDF in their own land and subjected to vandalism, beatings, and murders by illegal Zionist colonists. That a Jewish settler can murder a Palestinian who lives just a mile away in a West Bank village, but be tried in an Israeli court, whereas a Palestinian can by law be extra judicially executed no questions asked as to motives or sanity and then to add insult to injury their parents home demolished as a collective punishment

"The father of the victim pointed to the discrepancies in how the Israeli government punishes whole Palestinian families for the crimes of lone suspects.

"I ask the courts to demolish their homes," he said. "We won't accept anything less than that. If you have democracy, then where is it? If there wasn't racism then we would get the same thing as an Arab would, to demolish their homes."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/02/murdered-palestinian-boy-parents-slam-jail-sentences-160204113618073.html

I am asking you a question how many Palestinians have been tried in their courts for attacking an Israeli. Guess that is zero as you can't give any answers. At least the Jews do have courts that punish their own for misdeeds.

Palestian police and courts are completely controlled by Israeli military government.

Suggesting the contrary is proving not understanding the OP and the Israeli social and legal boycott/blockade since its occupation.

A third accused (adult) has not been sentenced in this case.

Kidnapping of the victim happened in East Jerusalem. The killing was in Jerusalem.

But the crime happened in war time. For me it's a war crime and should be tried by an International court.

Cheers !

[Steely Dan]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Not only do Palestinian murderers get off Scott free they get praised or eulogized by their leaders. Should they end up in Israeli jails they are paid a generous salary by the Palestinian terror statelet partly funded by the biased and clueless EU.

Im sure you feel sorry for the deceased and happy the murderers were caught.

Why of course, that's what separates the civilized man from the savage. I guess Ban Ki-moon would also have called this murder an act of terrorism, whilst at the same time saying it's only human nature considering the constant violence coming from Palestinians against Israeli civilians.

[Morch]

Good that the murderers were convicted and did not get off lightly.

The insanity claims by lawyers of the main perpetrator are not likely to do him much good. Seems like the court allowed the delay just in order to curtail possible future appeals on these grounds. There are bound to be certain legal, political and public attempts in the future to overturn the sentence or reduce punishment, but for now justice was served.

Reading some of the older topics relating to this murder, the usual posts about how it would be hushed, covered, not investigated, suspects will be let off the hook, suspects will be given light sentences....seem about as spot on as the usual fare spouted.

[Morch]

Summary execution is the fate that usually befalls captured Palestinian terrorists - and rightly so.

Israeli terrorists get their day in court or go entirely unpunished.

Whether or not this case is propaganda smoke and mirrors will depend on the killers serving their full terms.

Don't bet the kibbutz on it.

Most Palestinian terrorists are not summarily executed. What you are probably referring to is the recent numbers of Palestinian terrorists killed while carrying out attacks. Different picture when not focusing on recent events, and when considering the figures for Palestinian terrorists serving out terms in Israeli prisons. Even so, applying this proposition to "captured" is nothing but nonsense, apprehended (or "captured") Palestinian terrorists do not usually face a "summary execution".

In previous topics, similar doubts were raised regarding the investigation, arrests, trial etc. Now that these are done with, seems like the last ditch before grudgingly admitting justice was served is to wait for after murderers serve their full terms. That should give about 20 years to come up with another reason to doubt things...

[Grestin]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Not only do Palestinian murderers get off Scott free they get praised or eulogized by their leaders. Should they end up in Israeli jails they are paid a generous salary by the Palestinian terror statelet partly funded by the biased and clueless EU.

Im sure you feel sorry for the deceased and happy the murderers were caught.

Why of course, that's what separates the civilized man from the savage. I guess Ban Ki-moon would also have called this murder an act of terrorism, whilst at the same time saying it's only human nature considering the constant violence coming from Palestinians against Israeli civilians.

I dont know why you think ban ki moon would say that, he never said it was human nature for palestinians to commit acts of terrorism.

You cant bring yourself to condemn the murderers though.

[dexterm]

Democracy at work in Israel, yes, not all is sugar and honey, but at least they appear to install

equality for all when it come to home grown terrorists, unlike other Arab country and the Palestinians

authority that just yesterday Mahmoud Abbas has hosted a party to the relatives of terrorists

who died while committing terror acts.......

Not true. Jewish terrorists come under Israeli civil law, so their parents' houses will not be demolished like the homes of West Bank Palestinians who conveniently are treated differently under Israeli military law.

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Israel as an occupying force control most of the security in the West Bank, so they would be the ones doing most of the arresting (or usually shooting first and asking questions later). But despite that...

"The Palestinian Authority has foiled 200 attacks against Israelis in the upsurge in violence that began in October and it will continue its security coordination with Israel, Palestinian intelligence chief Majid Faraj said in an interview this week with Defense News."

http://normanfinkelstein.com/2016/01/21/the-palestinian-authoritys-big-victory-palestinian-security-and-intelligence-forces-confiscated-weapons-and-arrested-about-100-palestinians/

"Palestinian Authority security forces arrested five Palestinians in Bethlehem on charges they were helping set up terrorist infrastructure for an Iranian-backed group in the West Bank, Israel Radio reported on Wednesday."

http://www.algemeiner.com/2016/02/03/report-palestinian-security-forces-arrest-5-members-of-iran-backed-west-bank-group/

You seem to be unaware that the IDF is an occupying army. They and private Israeli firms run most of the security in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Israeli colonists are also allowed to carry weapons.

Palestinians occasionally enjoy the luxury of being arrested by Israeli occupying forces. 160 have been shot extra judicially since October.

[arjunadawn]

Nobody is claiming the Israeli system is perfect or that the Palestinians don't have valid grievances, but this case does show, yet again, that Israeli Jewish law violators are not immune from prosecution when the victims are Palestinian Arabs. I realize the obsessive Israel demonization movement which has proven time and time again that it doesn't accept the right of Israel to exist or defend itself will try to suggest such prosecutions are propaganda. Israel demonization -- the "gift" that keeps on giving.

Not only do Palestinian murderers get off Scott free they get praised or eulogized by their leaders. Should they end up in Israeli jails they are paid a generous salary by the Palestinian terror statelet partly funded by the biased and clueless EU.

Im sure you feel sorry for the deceased and happy the murderers were caught.

Jeez, who presumes such sarcasm in another human? How can a person be taken seriously after assigning such mercenary motives to another?

[seedy]

off topic and troll / flaming posts removed

[Morch]

Palestian police and courts are completely controlled by Israeli military government.

Suggesting the contrary is proving not understanding the OP and the Israeli social and legal boycott/blockade since its occupation.

A third accused (adult) has not been sentenced in this case.

Kidnapping of the victim happened in East Jerusalem. The killing was in Jerusalem.

But the crime happened in war time. For me it's a war crime and should be tried by an International court.

Cheers !

Palestinian police and courts are not completely controlled by "Israeli military government". Suggesting this proves not having much of real clue - not with regards to the OP, and not with the rest of the usual ramblings. Nothing new there.

The third accused will be sentenced, just a matter of legal delays. Even if the bogus insanity plea will somehow be accepted, he will still go behind bars. Trying to make it sound otherwise is all very routine, but incorrect.

The kidnapping took place in an area annexed by Israel, and therefore Israeli law (as opposed to the Israeli military law) applies. This is, partially, the reason that the convictions were pretty straightforward. While it may have suited propaganda purposes to advocate the trial as a matter for an international court (and can't offhand recall this ever being seriously suggested), justice would not have been served any better.

As for "the crime happened in war time" - what war would that be? Israel is not officially at war with the Palestinian Authority, nor is it at war with Jordan (the previous de facto sovereign). Additionally, unless mistaken, family members hold Israeli ID's.

[Morch]

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Israel as an occupying force control most of the security in the West Bank, so they would be the ones doing most of the arresting (or usually shooting first and asking questions later). But despite that...

"The Palestinian Authority has foiled 200 attacks against Israelis in the upsurge in violence that began in October and it will continue its security coordination with Israel, Palestinian intelligence chief Majid Faraj said in an interview this week with Defense News."

http://normanfinkelstein.com/2016/01/21/the-palestinian-authoritys-big-victory-palestinian-security-and-intelligence-forces-confiscated-weapons-and-arrested-about-100-palestinians/

"Palestinian Authority security forces arrested five Palestinians in Bethlehem on charges they were helping set up terrorist infrastructure for an Iranian-backed group in the West Bank, Israel Radio reported on Wednesday."

http://www.algemeiner.com/2016/02/03/report-palestinian-security-forces-arrest-5-members-of-iran-backed-west-bank-group/

You seem to be unaware that the IDF is an occupying army. They and private Israeli firms run most of the security in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Israeli colonists are also allowed to carry weapons.

Palestinians occasionally enjoy the luxury of being arrested by Israeli occupying forces. 160 have been shot extra judicially since October.

If one is to take your post seriously, it would need to be assumed that there are no Palestinians held in Israeli prisons. While the current violence is certainly characterized by many Palestinian attackers being shot and killed, making it a generality is nothing but the usual misleading statements. All of those shot were just taking a stroll...right?

The Palestinian security forces under the Palestinian Authority do quite a bit to curb attacks against Israeli targets. This is routinely acknowledged by the IDF and Israeli security services, often dismissed by right wing politicians. The security coordination is also what allows the Palestinian Authority to prevail over challenges by other groups (especially Hamas), and so, benefits both sides. The security coordination is less effective with regards to the current violence, as attack profile changed (less organized, less warning signs). Hence Abbas regularly threats to stop said cooperation, and never quite acts on it.

Putting it mildly, the various Palestinian security organizations are not locally well known for their adherence to legalities, human rights or procedure.

[dexterm]

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Israel as an occupying force control most of the security in the West Bank, so they would be the ones doing most of the arresting (or usually shooting first and asking questions later). But despite that...

"The Palestinian Authority has foiled 200 attacks against Israelis in the upsurge in violence that began in October and it will continue its security coordination with Israel, Palestinian intelligence chief Majid Faraj said in an interview this week with Defense News."

http://normanfinkelstein.com/2016/01/21/the-palestinian-authoritys-big-victory-palestinian-security-and-intelligence-forces-confiscated-weapons-and-arrested-about-100-palestinians/

"Palestinian Authority security forces arrested five Palestinians in Bethlehem on charges they were helping set up terrorist infrastructure for an Iranian-backed group in the West Bank, Israel Radio reported on Wednesday."

http://www.algemeiner.com/2016/02/03/report-palestinian-security-forces-arrest-5-members-of-iran-backed-west-bank-group/

You seem to be unaware that the IDF is an occupying army. They and private Israeli firms run most of the security in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Israeli colonists are also allowed to carry weapons.

Palestinians occasionally enjoy the luxury of being arrested by Israeli occupying forces. 160 have been shot extra judicially since October.

If one is to take your post seriously, it would need to be assumed that there are no Palestinians held in Israeli prisons. While the current violence is certainly characterized by many Palestinian attackers being shot and killed, making it a generality is nothing but the usual misleading statements. All of those shot were just taking a stroll...right?

The Palestinian security forces under the Palestinian Authority do quite a bit to curb attacks against Israeli targets. This is routinely acknowledged by the IDF and Israeli security services, often dismissed by right wing politicians. The security coordination is also what allows the Palestinian Authority to prevail over challenges by other groups (especially Hamas), and so, benefits both sides. The security coordination is less effective with regards to the current violence, as attack profile changed (less organized, less warning signs). Hence Abbas regularly threats to stop said cooperation, and never quite acts on it.

Putting it mildly, the various Palestinian security organizations are not locally well known for their adherence to legalities, human rights or procedure.

Your first paragraph is silly hyperbole, followed by the old chestnut nonsensical black/white without any shades of gray fallacy that you are hiding behind.

To continue the fallacy would you claim all IDF and Israeli colonists' on the spot extra judicial killings are completely morally and legally justified and no mistakes are ever made...right?

It would perhaps be more transparent if every extra judicial killing of Palestinians...and we have seen several videos on this forum of many dubious cases....were followed up with a full coronial investigations similar to the OP.

The rest of your post is off topic besmirching of the PA. Robblok asked me a question; I answered it.

Edited February 6, 2016 by dexterm

[dexterm]

Palestian police and courts are completely controlled by Israeli military government.

Suggesting the contrary is proving not understanding the OP and the Israeli social and legal boycott/blockade since its occupation.

A third accused (adult) has not been sentenced in this case.

Kidnapping of the victim happened in East Jerusalem. The killing was in Jerusalem.

But the crime happened in war time. For me it's a war crime and should be tried by an International court.

Cheers !

Palestinian police and courts are not completely controlled by "Israeli military government". Suggesting this proves not having much of real clue - not with regards to the OP, and not with the rest of the usual ramblings. Nothing new there.

The third accused will be sentenced, just a matter of legal delays. Even if the bogus insanity plea will somehow be accepted, he will still go behind bars. Trying to make it sound otherwise is all very routine, but incorrect.

The kidnapping took place in an area annexed by Israel, and therefore Israeli law (as opposed to the Israeli military law) applies. This is, partially, the reason that the convictions were pretty straightforward. While it may have suited propaganda purposes to advocate the trial as a matter for an international court (and can't offhand recall this ever being seriously suggested), justice would not have been served any better.

As for "the crime happened in war time" - what war would that be? Israel is not officially at war with the Palestinian Authority, nor is it at war with Jordan (the previous de facto sovereign). Additionally, unless mistaken, family members hold Israeli ID's.

If Israeli annexation is illegal according to international law, how does that make Israeli laws military or otherwise in East Jerusalem and the West Bank legal? Legal in the eyes of only one country in the world.

Edited February 6, 2016 by dexterm

[Morch]

Could you tell me how many Palestinians are convicted by the Palestine courts for attacking Jews ? I bet that does not even happen so how Israel treats it is already much better. Usually I keep out of this discussion because I think the two parties are both wrong, but in this case your remark is way off.

Israel as an occupying force control most of the security in the West Bank, so they would be the ones doing most of the arresting (or usually shooting first and asking questions later). But despite that...

"The Palestinian Authority has foiled 200 attacks against Israelis in the upsurge in violence that began in October and it will continue its security coordination with Israel, Palestinian intelligence chief Majid Faraj said in an interview this week with Defense News."

http://normanfinkelstein.com/2016/01/21/the-palestinian-authoritys-big-victory-palestinian-security-and-intelligence-forces-confiscated-weapons-and-arrested-about-100-palestinians/

"Palestinian Authority security forces arrested five Palestinians in Bethlehem on charges they were helping set up terrorist infrastructure for an Iranian-backed group in the West Bank, Israel Radio reported on Wednesday."

http://www.algemeiner.com/2016/02/03/report-palestinian-security-forces-arrest-5-members-of-iran-backed-west-bank-group/

You seem to be unaware that the IDF is an occupying army. They and private Israeli firms run most of the security in the West Bank and East Jerusalem. Israeli colonists are also allowed to carry weapons.

Palestinians occasionally enjoy the luxury of being arrested by Israeli occupying forces. 160 have been shot extra judicially since October.

If one is to take your post seriously, it would need to be assumed that there are no Palestinians held in Israeli prisons. While the current violence is certainly characterized by many Palestinian attackers being shot and killed, making it a generality is nothing but the usual misleading statements. All of those shot were just taking a stroll...right?

The Palestinian security forces under the Palestinian Authority do quite a bit to curb attacks against Israeli targets. This is routinely acknowledged by the IDF and Israeli security services, often dismissed by right wing politicians. The security coordination is also what allows the Palestinian Authority to prevail over challenges by other groups (especially Hamas), and so, benefits both sides. The security coordination is less effective with regards to the current violence, as attack profile changed (less organized, less warning signs). Hence Abbas regularly threats to stop said cooperation, and never quite acts on it.

Putting it mildly, the various Palestinian security organizations are not locally well known for their adherence to legalities, human rights or procedure.

Your first paragraph is silly hyperbole, followed by the old chestnut nonsensical black/white take it or leave it fallacy that you are hiding behind.

To continue the fallacy would you claim all IDF and Israeli colonists' on the spot extra judicial killings are completely morally and legally justified and no mistakes are ever made...right?

It would perhaps be more transparent if every extra judicial killing of Palestinians...and we have seen several videos on this forum of many dubious cases....were followed up with a full coronial investigations similar to the OP.

The rest of your post is off topic besmirching of the PA. Robblok asked me a question; I answered it.

No. The hyperbole is claiming that Palestinians are more often shot than arrested by the IDF. Quoting recent figures to support this impression is dishonest, but well practiced on these topics. As for your ongoing insistence on over-simplifying complex situations, using slogans, catchphrases and whatever is the talking point of the day - yeah, not buying into that.

I never made the claim that ALL killings by the IDF or the illegal settlers are justified- and you know it. Just go back and reference that non-black-and-white world view, which obviously would counter such a statement. While I'm sure that you would love nothing more than to turn a topic dealing with justice served into another Israeli-bashing thread, do try to keep on-topic.

And once again, read before posting - my post related to the security coordination between Israel and the Palestinian Authority, which can be looked at from various points of view. Before spouting your usual "besmirching", may want to have a clue as to how Palestinians view their own security organizations. Like I said, this was putting it very mildly. The point was, again, that things are more complex than they seem.

Allow me to doubt your knowledge as to the workings of the Palestinian security, law enforcement and legal system.