SURVEY: Do you agree with the Immigration Rules to ban those with an overstay?

[billd766]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

For me to bring my Thai wife to the UK I need to prove an income of £18,600 or 930,000 thb at the exchange rate of GBP£1 = 50 THB. This is simple a marriage extension as there is NO retirement extension.

[billd766]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Most hospitals that accept farang patients have an officer that liases with the local Immi office for medical extensions IME.

Does that also apply to government hospitals or only private ones?

[facthailand]

Let's face it, some folks just aren't so organised! Punishment is not going to change that.

The only regulation I think is too much is 90-day reporting. Those of us on one-year extensions by-and-large stay in one place.

One-year extensions are barely okay. However, anybody can pull their act together in the month before to do that paperwork an d show up within the weeks window. It's also only sensible to NEVER touch that visa money in the bank.

I'd like to see two-year extensions for retirees and five years for spouses, with annual reporting.

However, we can expect the military to make things tougher for foreigners not easier.

[MRH1959]

Yes, why not. How are people going to learn that it is a legal process and if you do what is required, then no problem.

Wish they would do similar with road users. Break the law/have an accident, anned to drive, 'temporary'.

[smotherb]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

Why is it that people who have poorly planned for their livelihood tell tales of woe about things just didn't go right for them? If you run out of money--it doesn't matter how--and have no viable contingency plan to regroup; you are an idiot. Duh, do you really think all things will go well?

[jacksam]

This thread really shows how, at times, thaivisa members just post for something to say. The new rules are now in place. Had so many threads did we have leading up to march 20 and people still can't let it go.

[Oishii]

Yes

[HerbalEd]

Being in a country where there is no such thing as justice I can't quite understand why any foreigner living here would support such a law. Find yourself in an accident and you too may be deported and banned from thailand for 5 or 10 years. Don't believe me? Then ask yourself would your family know what to do if you found yourself incapacitated? Think the Thai courts will bend the law just for you even if you did have a genuine reason?

I know for a fact that they'll "bend the law ... even if you did have a genuine reason."

During my many years in Thailand, I've heard many stories of tourists/expats being delayed past their visa's departure date because of sickness or accident, and all were forgiven by the Thai authorities and none were penalized beyond paying the 500-baht/day fine. .

[likeke]

I totally agree with the new overstay rules. As a guest in a foreign country, I feel it is important to obey the local rules. This is not rocket science folks. I only wish my home country (USA) would implement stronger visa scrutiny. It's a joke there. No follow-up on overstayers at all. And in many cases, they get benefits from the country they are in violation.

[robertthebruce]

Lots of low life and Trailer Park types going about, hopefully get rid of some of them....

Clean the place up ... I say....

[smotherb]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

For me to bring my Thai wife to the UK I need to prove an income of £18,600 or 930,000 thb at the exchange rate of GBP£1 = 50 THB. This is simple a marriage extension as there is NO retirement extension.

That is UK immigration law. What does it have to do with Thailand?

[HerbalEd]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

[Dan747]

I agree with the Thailand Overstay Rules and want to add that everyone should also remember no matter why you are here in Thailand that you should "Be Legal." "Be On Your Best Behavior"-You represent the country you are from. Do the right thing, do the best you can, and always show people you care and have "Fun in Thailand."

[NoshowJones]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Most hospitals that accept farang patients have an officer that liases with the local Immi office for medical extensions IME.

Does that also apply to government hospitals or only private ones?

Good question Bill.

[lkv]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

For me to bring my Thai wife to the UK I need to prove an income of £18,600 or 930,000 thb at the exchange rate of GBP£1 = 50 THB. This is simple a marriage extension as there is NO retirement extension.

That is UK immigration law. What does it have to do with Thailand?

Yes it is UK immigration law, but when the above poster makes these type of statements, he should also remember what benefits his wife is entitled to claim in the UK compared to what benefits he is entitled to claim here.

Ah...sorry. How can I forget. Permission to visit your wife in Thailand.

[NoshowJones]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

Of course I know, but maybe because of my large amount of posts, I know of cases where exceptions were not made.

and they still had to pay the 20.000 Bt for the overstay even though a certificate from the hospital was produced.

[BangkokKen]

Of course not, the sanctions are way disproportionate.

Treating people like criminals for just being the wrong side of a border is inane and reinforce Thailand image of a dictatorship.

Thhats also why I dont think they will be enforced, it will give a bad press for tourism.

[Evilbaz]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

Of course I know, but maybe because of my large amount of posts, I know of cases where exceptions were not made.

and they still had to pay the 20.000 Bt for the overstay even though a certificate from the hospital was produced.

Was that certificate issued before they left the hospital or after?

[HerbalEd]

Being in a country where there is no such thing as justice I can't quite understand why any foreigner living here would support such a law. Find yourself in an accident and you too may be deported and banned from thailand for 5 or 10 years. Don't believe me? Then ask yourself would your family know what to do if you found yourself incapacitated? Think the Thai courts will bend the law just for you even if you did have a genuine reason?

Find yourself in a serious accident, you have no need to be on an overstay, there is provision within the existing laws to extend a visa, stay on medical grounds via a doctors or hospital letter

Find yourself in an accident and unconscious without ID and try to find out how well that provision works.

Do you actually think Thai immigration authority would deport a person who is unconscious? That's seems to be what you're implying.

[dotpoom]

None of my concern what other people do............my concerns are what I am doing.

[Bobotie]

Being in a country where there is no such thing as justice I can't quite understand why any foreigner living here would support such a law. Find yourself in an accident and you too may be deported and banned from thailand for 5 or 10 years. Don't believe me? Then ask yourself would your family know what to do if you found yourself incapacitated? Think the Thai courts will bend the law just for you even if you did have a genuine reason?

Find yourself in a serious accident, you have no need to be on an overstay, there is provision within the existing laws to extend a visa, stay on medical grounds via a doctors or hospital letter

Find yourself in an accident and unconscious without ID and try to find out how well that provision works.

Do you actually think Thai immigration authority would deport a person who is unconscious? That's seems to be what you're implying.

One suspects people will believe or say anthing to force their own agendas

[gandalf12]

I would classify overstayers as undesirables. There is no excuse for long overstaying. Its very easy to get a 3 month extension if you are sick or ill. Most of them took advantage of the easy visa requirements to live in Thailand and now that the country is trying to come in line with others as far as immigration is concerned they do nothing but complain and insult the immigration department.

They may have Thai wives and children, but that does not give them any special rights. They can get a marriage visa and if they do not have enough funds they should not expect to be able to stay here. I am sure a Thai in similar circumstances would not be able to stay in thier countries.

In the UK an unlimited stay visa can be obtained for a Thai wife / family. After 2 years this can be converted to a full residence visa without any hassle. I know I did for my wife. She had a National Insurance number which meant she could work and she could stay in the UK as long as she wanted and leave without having to get a visa to return

[HerbalEd]

None of my concern what other people do............my concerns are what I am doing.

What about when those "other people" are doing it to you? Are you concerned then?

[NoshowJones]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

Of course I know, but maybe because of my large amount of posts, I know of cases where exceptions were not made.

and they still had to pay the 20.000 Bt for the overstay even though a certificate from the hospital was produced.

Was that certificate issued before they left the hospital or after?

The case that I remember about, his wife got a certificate, then went to the Immigration office, and was told something along the lines of

"not matter, you must pay 20.000 Bt".

[Bobotie]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

Of course I know, but maybe because of my large amount of posts, I know of cases where exceptions were not made.

and they still had to pay the 20.000 Bt for the overstay even though a certificate from the hospital was produced.

Was that certificate issued before they left the hospital or after?

The case that I remember about, his wife got a certificate, then went to the Immigration office, and was told something along the lines of

"not matter, you must pay 20.000 Bt".

And what was the rest of the story ?

[billd766]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

For me to bring my Thai wife to the UK I need to prove an income of £18,600 or 930,000 thb at the exchange rate of GBP£1 = 50 THB. This is simple a marriage extension as there is NO retirement extension.

That is UK immigration law. What does it have to do with Thailand?

Look at the price difference between the two and it isn't that much.

[Gary A]

If the rules are absolute with no exceptions, then I don't agree with them. I do agree that if you don't have the money to stay here, you shouldn't be here. I wouldn't be able to stay illegally because I couldn't stand having to keep looking over my shoulder. Different strokes for different folks. There should be and maybe are exceptions for a few.

[NoshowJones]

I would, in principle agree with the rules, but what about someone who is in hospital seriously ill or in a coma?

Immigration needs to have rules at every IO in Thailand, allowing overstay to be overlooked if a doctor states

in writing, a letter telling IOs about a patients condition, instead of allowing IO bosses to decide themselves.

Given your large number of posts, I'm surprised you don't already know that Thai immigration authorities do indeed make exceptions for those on overstay incapacitated by illness or accident.

Of course I know, but maybe because of my large amount of posts, I know of cases where exceptions were not made.

and they still had to pay the 20.000 Bt for the overstay even though a certificate from the hospital was produced.

Was that certificate issued before they left the hospital or after?

The case that I remember about, his wife got a certificate, then went to the Immigration office, and was told something along the lines of

"not matter, you must pay 20.000 Bt".

And what was the rest of the story ?

His wife had no choice but to pay it. I think in maybe 95% of cases that would not happen, and she was just unlucky.

But unfortunately, as IO officials make up their own rules, and they do, they can get away with it.

What do you think the rest of the story was?

[BritTim]

Being in a country where there is no such thing as justice I can't quite understand why any foreigner living here would support such a law. Find yourself in an accident and you too may be deported and banned from thailand for 5 or 10 years. Don't believe me? Then ask yourself would your family know what to do if you found yourself incapacitated? Think the Thai courts will bend the law just for you even if you did have a genuine reason?

I know for a fact that they'll "bend the law ... even if you did have a genuine reason."

During my many years in Thailand, I've heard many stories of tourists/expats being delayed past their visa's departure date because of sickness or accident, and all were forgiven by the Thai authorities and none were penalized beyond paying the 500-baht/day fine. .

Sure, all according to the law at that time. In the future, they will not be penalized beyond the 500 baht per day fine and being blacklisted from returning to Thailand for the specified period of time.

The only flexibility will be around the "arrested" versus "surrendered" aspect.

Overall, I am conflicted over the new rules. Most see this as a black and white issue, but I see it as complicated. Not to write a novel, here are two reasons I am uncomfortable that most would disagree with:

• Someone can easily fall into a deep clinical depression. These are sometimes fatal, when those affected can summon the energy to kill themselves. Most do survive. However, during the episode (which can last months or longer) they tend to find it difficult to eat or shower, let alone deal with immigration formalities. I know such people are not a sympathetic group but, provided they have enough money to support themselves, wallowing here in their misery has not hurt anyone else. For them, at the time they are finally recovering, to be forced to relocate to another country is tough.
• I believe we would be better off without laws that restrict people's freedom of movement. State borders are really just arbitrary accidents of history, determined almost entirely by victories and defeats in warfare, and deals by world powers that divided regions up without reference to the wishes of those living there. Within those arbitrary borders, laws are admittedly sometimes influenced by popular will (people are tribal by nature) but have nothing to do with universal human rights.

As against the above, if people want to form tribes and exclude others based on any criteria they choose, I do support their right to do so. (For that reason, clubs that want to exclude others based on sex, religion or race are reprehensible but should be legal.)

[Tchooptip]

Any enforced or new law will be opposed by the ones affected by it, especialy the criminals, and law breakers.I love the idea of getting rid of the thai haters, feels gooooooooooood.

You are so wrong. I am not affected by it at all. But i do know people who are, and through s##t that happens in life are now in a bad situation. It will split families up even though the person in mind brings enough money every month to take care of his family, he can't meet the retirement conditions.

I understand the law is the law, but now he has a bad choice to make, stay and hope all is ok or go home and lose his family.

Why is it that people who have poorly planned for their livelihood tell tales of woe about things just didn't go right for them? If you run out of money--it doesn't matter how--and have no viable contingency plan to regroup; you are an idiot. Duh, do you really think all things will go well?

"If you run out of money--it doesn't matter how--and have no viable contingency plan to regroup; you are an idiot."

I hope one day Karma will not be too tough on you for having spoken like that. There are many stories of people ruined due to no fault of them like the subprime crisis for instance.