US activists try to calm fears over transgender bathroom access

[SgtRock]

Jingthing

I am not arguing anything.

I made a statement that a lot of so called educated people have forgotten all about basic anatomy.

I am very much a believer in if you have danglies, use the mens. If you dont use the womens.

If someone wants to against this and gets arrested. Tough luck.

What you want is contrary to these new laws.

That may be so.

But after going through the operation and you still look like Chicog's avatar. Would it really be surprising if you got arrested and carted off to the cop shop whilst you were investigated ?

[Jingthing]

Amid this ginned up fake boogeyman hysteria about fictional threats of violence to women when m to f transgender people use women's bathrooms, let's not forget a group that is actually REALLY highly vulnerable to violence and murder.

TRANSGENDER PEOPLE!

Now legally mandate them to use male bathrooms in homophobic areas of the SOUTH ... and the violence and murders of them will surely increase.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jamieann-meyers/transgender-day-of-remembrance-and-the-transgender-movement_b_6168456.html

But anti GLBT bigots don't care. They don't care about BASIC CIVIL RIGHTS for GLBT people either (such as in employment and housing), as attacks on those are usually FOLDED INTO these bathroom boogeyman laws. Don't be fooled. It's a crafty tactic to oppose basic civil rights for GLBT Americans.

Edited April 13, 2016 by Jingthing

[lostboy]

He'll now be able to do it legally, that is a pretty big difference.

And maybe there are those who will be emboldened by the new law to follow suit.

The downsides outweigh the upsides.

What downside. You posit a bunch of maybes with nothing else. Have you even taken the time to find out the contents of the religious discrimination laws? You have any evidence to demonstrate that Trans people are sexual perverts and pose a risk to women and children in female bathrooms. Of course you don't You just have a bunch of weird fantasies about disgusting things and project them onto LGBT people in an attempt to incite and promote discrimination.

What is it about sexual perverts and female toilets that excites you so?

This is becoming boring

It has being pointed out several times in this Thread, that the fear is not of the transgender

people using the bathroom, but of the modification of bathroom use rules, which would certainly and with out debate benefit transgender people, But....

But it is fear that such modification is open to abuse by non transgender sexual predators

But why let facts get in the way of a good argument

I reject your narrative. The fear that you cite may well be your fear but it is not the fear. The male sex offender thing is just one of the ways this issue is being stirred up. Trans bathroom access is only one part of the legislation that allow religious based discrimination of LGBT people. The male sexual offender thing is a distraction; a side show; a beat up. Allowing Trans people to use female toilets opens no opportunity for male sex offenders to pose an increased risk to women and children.

Boring. Yes. Entirely. Why are people so easily fuelled and fooled by hate? They are so scared of non conformists that they retreat to insultingly bigoted positions to justify what cannot be justified.

In Mississippi an employer can sack people who support marriage equality, something upheld by SCOTUS as a constitutional right for same sex couples. While the reactionaries have their minds and mouths in the gutter, there are far higher issues at stake.

You may be convinced of your narrative. You have no authority to decide that it is the only narrative nor any control over the focus of discussions.

[FritsSikkink]

Transgender, When I was a young man, many years ago, in the Southern US, they were and still are called "Perverts". The Morals and Self Discipline of the last two or three generations is going to Hell in a "Hand Basket" !!

Instant gratification, big me little you, get out of the way is all some seem to think !!

here is a nice story:

So.... homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstances as preached by many, including a certain Dr ...Laura from a well known US radio talk show. The following was an open letter to that doctor!

Dear Dr. Laura

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.

1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I'm confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your adoring fan,

James M. Kauffman,

Ed.D. Professor Emeritus,

Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education University of Virginia

P.S. (It would be a damn shame if we couldn't own a Canadian.)

[SgtRock]

Transgender, When I was a young man, many years ago, in the Southern US, they were and still are called "Perverts". The Morals and Self Discipline of the last two or three generations is going to Hell in a "Hand Basket" !!

Instant gratification, big me little you, get out of the way is all some seem to think !!

here is a nice story:

So.... homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstances as preached by many, including a certain Dr ...Laura from a well known US radio talk show. The following was an open letter to that doctor!

Dear Dr. Laura

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.

1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I'm confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your adoring fan,

James M. Kauffman,

Ed.D. Professor Emeritus,

Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education University of Virginia

P.S. (It would be a damn shame if we couldn't own a Canadian.)

Was Lev a closet Muslim ?

As a perceived Christian. Here is my take.

1. I have no wish to have slaves, be they Canadian, Mexican or otherwise. Contrary to the beliefs of some Muslims.

2. I have no desire to sell my daughter. Suggestions to the contrary would result in instant death. 10 camels are still the going rate in some Countries.

3. A womans menstrual cyclle has no concern for me. Pity some Countries cannot say the same.

4. I do not burn bulls. I am however partial to good steak on the BBQ.

5. I constantly worked on the sabbath. Triple time. I am still alive to tell the tale. Now try asking a Muslim to work on a Friday.

6. Yes. Muslims will put you right on the various degrees of abomination.

7. None so blind as those that cannot see. No specs in Lev's day.

8. Man I shave my pubic hair. I must be destined for hell.

9. They do not make footballs nowadays from pig skin. But I just love pork and pork products.

10. Honour killings. The speciality of Muslims.

Lev was definately a closet Muslim.

Edited April 13, 2016 by SgtRock

[FritsSikkink]

Transgender, When I was a young man, many years ago, in the Southern US, they were and still are called "Perverts". The Morals and Self Discipline of the last two or three generations is going to Hell in a "Hand Basket" !!

Instant gratification, big me little you, get out of the way is all some seem to think !!

here is a nice story:

So.... homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstances as preached by many, including a certain Dr ...Laura from a well known US radio talk show. The following was an open letter to that doctor!

Dear Dr. Laura

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.

1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I'm confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your adoring fan,

James M. Kauffman,

Ed.D. Professor Emeritus,

Dept. Of Curriculum, Instruction, and Special Education University of Virginia

P.S. (It would be a damn shame if we couldn't own a Canadian.)

Was Lev a closet Muslim ?

As a perceived Christian. Here is my take.

1. I have no wish to have slaves, be they Canadian, Mexican or otherwise. Contrary to the beliefs of some Muslims.

2. I have no desire to sell my daughter. Suggestions to the contrary would result in instant death. 10 camels are still the going rate in some Countries.

3. A womans menstrual cyclle has no concern for me. Pity some Countries cannot say the same.

4. I do not burn bulls. I am however partial to good steak on the BBQ.

5. I constantly worked on the sabbath. Triple time. I am still alive to tell the tale. Now try asking a Muslim to work on a Friday.

6. Yes. Muslims will put you right on the various degrees of abomination.

7. None so blind as those that cannot see. No specs in Lev's day.

8. Man I shave my pubic hair. I must be destined for hell.

9. They do not make footballs nowadays from pig skin. But I just love pork and pork products.

10. Honour killings. The speciality of Muslims.

Lev was definately a closet Muslim.

It is a shame that as perceived Christian you now nothing about the bible even when it is just presented to you.

[Scott]

Posts and replies removed.

[SgtRock]

As a perceived Christian.

Why would I know anything about the bible ?

Try refuting what I said and not what is perceived.

[up-country_sinclair]

So a pervert straight guy... dresses as a women to get into the ladies restroom to attack them.

Exactly.

And that is why the good people of North Carolina passed this common sense legislation.

You really don't get it do you? That guy will still do that.... he won't care if there is a law to stop transgendered people using the female restroom.

You really don't get it do you? Thieves (presumably) want to rob your house. Are you going to put a sign on your front door that says it's unlocked?

[Chicog]

*Removed post edited out*

Because allegedly there is proof that men are willing to go and get dressed up in women's clothing (which is not the same as transgender) in order to BREAK THE LAW, people think that having another law to break will solve that problem.

Yeah, good luck with that.

If it doesn't stop Republican politicians, why would it stop the man in the street?

[jak2002003]

Because allegedly there is proof that men are willing to go and get dressed up in women's clothing (which is not the same as transgender) in order to BREAK THE LAW, people think that having another law to break will solve that problem.

There are laws against robbing houses, but criminals still do it. So, it's probably not a good idea to leave your front door open. Keep it closed and locked, and you're less likely to get robbed. It's common sense.

There are laws against stealing cars, but criminals still do it. So, it's probably not a good idea to leave the engine running when you run into the corner shop for five minutes. Turn off the engine and lock the doors, and it's less likely to be stolen. It's common sense.

This poorly thought out pile of horse manure is opening the door for increased attacks on women and girls. Rapists other sexual offenders are certainly going to take advantage of this, and it's women and girls that are going to suffer the horrific consequences.

The good people of North Carolina have come up with a common sense approach at crime prevention.

Law makes it illegal for transgender people to use female restrooms........

Straight pervert dresses up as women and enters female restroom to molest women and little girls.

How has having a law making it illegal for transgender people to use female restrooms stopped him?

Please think about this... as you don't seem to be able to grasp this simple concept.

[GinBoy2]

Just to throw a wrench into the works...do all the 'outraged' have the same moral outrage about female to male transgendered heading in the male bathroom?

Do we have the same horror about that?

[Jingthing]

Just to throw a wrench into the works...do all the 'outraged' have the same moral outrage about female to male transgendered heading in the male bathroom?

Do we have the same horror about that?

The bigot laws apply to both kinds of transgender persons.

Male to female and female to male.

The pattern is to legally require ALL to use the gender label toilet of their BIRTH gender. No matter what. No matter the appearance. No matter the current genitals. Crazy, huh?

Of course the external transgender experience is a PROCESS and only the individual involved decides on how far to go with it and how long it takes.

There is also ZERO compassion from the supporters of the BIGOT laws for the feelings of a female to male transgendered people who will now be required by law to use the WOMEN'S while appearing as a man.

These are really HATE laws. Pure evil ginned up on an issue that doesn't exist -- the fake trans predator MYTH.

Again, if someone wants to be a rapist they can be a rapist in all kinds of places now, in all kinds of bathrooms now, dressed in all kinds of ways now.

Rape is ALREADY illegal.

Edited April 13, 2016 by Jingthing

[Scott]

Off-topic, troll and inflammatory posts and replies removed along with replies.

Suspensions have been issued.

[Chicog]

If I had to guess, based on this Republican creeps behaviour, they probably want to keep transgender people out of the ladies toilet so that they can have a clear run at them.

Considering proponents of the bill claim that it’s necessary to protect women and children, one of its other sponsors, Rep. Jeremy Durham ( R ), has ironically been exiled from various House offices because of accusations of recurring sexual harassment. House Speaker Beth Harwell ® announced last week that she was moving his office and limiting his access to committee rooms and the House chamber because of a “pattern of conduct” toward women that allegedly includes sexual comments and inappropriate physical contact.

The move follows an investigation of Durham’s conduct by Attorney General Slatery. “Representative Durham’s alleged behavior may pose a continuing risk to unsuspecting women who are employed by or interact with the Legislature,” said in his memo to Harwell. Durham denies any wrong-doing.

Though there continue to be zero cases of transgender women abusing their access to women’s restrooms to harm others, 34 women have expressed complaints about Durham’s behavior. Durham does not identify as transgender.

http://thinkprogress.org/lgbt/2016/04/12/3768671/tennessee-transgender-bill-sexual-harassment/

Let's get real here folks. These bible bashing right wing nuts are just desperately trying to find remaining ways to harrass and discriminate against people who don't fit into their pretty little Good Christian boxes, having lost, to popular opinion, decision after decision to stop them imposing their religious beliefs on people who do not share their zeal for the good book.

Edited April 13, 2016 by Chicog

[lostboy]

In North Carolina it seems that common sense prevails.

"Roy Cooper NC DOJ Will Not Defend HB 2" http://www.indyweek.com/news/archives/2016/03/29/roy-cooper-nc-doj-will-not-defend-house-bill-2

"In defending his office's nondiscrimination policy and a similar policy at the state treasurer's office, Cooper says he would argue that House Bill 2 is unconstitutional. "

​In all the diversion into off topic hysterics about male sexual offenders in female toilets and the beat up of the fear that is solely being generated by hate groups, primarily religious based, that are demanding the right to discriminate against LGBT people, the core issue is being shrouded. The core issue is equal protection for all people. In the US this is guaranteed in the constitution for all US citizens. As the US goes, so does the rest of the western world.

These hate bills, the existence of which seem to be completely oblivious to the Toilet Birthers, are full of discriminatory practices. Those who want to promote fear and hate deliberately promote the unrelated issues of male sexual predators. They ignore the core element of the regulations. Employers can dismiss a straight person who expresses support for marriage equality. LGBT people can be denied access to housing and public services because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. State and private employees are equally subject to the discriminatory provisions of such bills.

The promoters or hate and division are being thwarted at every turn as we see from the actual good people of North Carolina.

[sirineou]

He'll now be able to do it legally, that is a pretty big difference.

And maybe there are those who will be emboldened by the new law to follow suit.

The downsides outweigh the upsides.

What downside. You posit a bunch of maybes with nothing else. Have you even taken the time to find out the contents of the religious discrimination laws? You have any evidence to demonstrate that Trans people are sexual perverts and pose a risk to women and children in female bathrooms. Of course you don't You just have a bunch of weird fantasies about disgusting things and project them onto LGBT people in an attempt to incite and promote discrimination.

What is it about sexual perverts and female toilets that excites you so?

This is becoming boring

It has being pointed out several times in this Thread, that the fear is not of the transgender

people using the bathroom, but of the modification of bathroom use rules, which would certainly and with out debate benefit transgender people, But....

But it is fear that such modification is open to abuse by non transgender sexual predators

But why let facts get in the way of a good argument

I reject your narrative. The fear that you cite may well be your fear but it is not the fear. The male sex offender thing is just one of the ways this issue is being stirred up. Trans bathroom access is only one part of the legislation that allow religious based discrimination of LGBT people. The male sexual offender thing is a distraction; a side show; a beat up. Allowing Trans people to use female toilets opens no opportunity for male sex offenders to pose an increased risk to women and children.

Boring. Yes. Entirely. Why are people so easily fuelled and fooled by hate? They are so scared of non conformists that they retreat to insultingly bigoted positions to justify what cannot be justified.

In Mississippi an employer can sack people who support marriage equality, something upheld by SCOTUS as a constitutional right for same sex couples. While the reactionaries have their minds and mouths in the gutter, there are far higher issues at stake.

You may be convinced of your narrative. You have no authority to decide that it is the only narrative nor any control over the focus of discussions.

It is not my narrative, it is the subject of this Thread

"

US activists try to calm fears over transgender bathroom access

"

and I thought that's what we were talking about

are there other parts of the legislation that discriminate, such as marriage equality, or religious freedom? sure there are and I am against them. There have being several threads that address these issues, and if you like you can start an other one, but this Thread is and I quote again,

"

US activists try to calm fears over transgender bathroom access

"

[HLover]

It doesn't seem the activists are calming many people down...

[Publicus]

What's with this dismissive , "next" stuff are you some kind of authority or pseudo mod here? I'm being gentlemanly in my discussion with you and I see no reason to insult me.

Since there will be no toilet ID's issued it becomes a salient question as to the difference between a serious TG and a weekend CD looking for cheap thrills.

You mentioned, "stalls." I believe what men CDs or not, do for fun in stalls is called, "cottaging" and is quiet common in some countries as is the appearance of small mirrors on the floor of toilets. Since I don't believe ants or cockroaches use make up mirrors I think the mirrors are placed on the floor to look at the person in the next stall.

I can see the problem especially here in Thailand with so many tourist women from creepy countries with odd moral codes and who might be aghast if a beach road lady boy walked in the ladies room at the Marriott to poop.

There are at least two malls close to beach road that have ladyboys as customers. Frankly, I've never noticed which restroom they use but I believe it is the ladies as I've never run into one in the men's room.

I also think there is a college in Thailand that has TG toilets.

The issue seems much more topical in Thailand than the US anyway given the current emphasis on Thai ness to solve almost any problem.

If the powers that be are upset about pretty girls dancing at auto shows what on earth would they say about men using Thai women's restrooms at upscale malls and public buildings?

Has anyone thought about referring this thorny problem to the government to get a well thought out answer and plan of action?

I'll go further than "Next" dude.

No interest in communicating with a person who trollishly raises "cottaging" as a relevant issue on this topic.

Pure fear mongering, pure homophobic crapola. Shame on you.

Welcome to my ignore list.

Now something on topic for people who are actually interested in the actual topic, as opposed to those just here to spread off topic garbage anti-GLBT hate speech.

Sprigg couldn’t come up with any concrete evidence to contradict Cuomo — the “restroom predator” myth has been widely debunked — but he said women and girls will feel their privacy has been violated if they see someone in their restroom “who is obviously a man.” “It is a privacy issue,” he said. “Even if their safety is never violated in practice.”

Cuomo then pointed out that laws like this would force transgender men into women’s restrooms, saying, “You’re creating the problem. You’re not solving it.”

http://www.advocate.com/transgender/2016/4/04/chris-cuomo-trashes-bathroom-predator-myth-exchange-anti-lgbt-activist-video

You are either incredibly naive or never have the necessity to use a public restroom.

Peephole problem in men's restrooms has college campus on edge

http://abc13.com/news/peephole-problem-has-college-campus-on-edge/553614/

Sorry but men trash toilets. Putting men in women's toilets will do the same thing.

Seems to me there are only two reasonable choices. TG males go to the men's room or build them a separate toilet.

When this poster was working and living in South Korea many of us many times went to a major amusement park attended daily by families and by groups of school children from grades K-12.

I dunno how many times we went into the rest room facilities throughout the grounds where work women were inside continuously cleaning while the males from bois to men did our duty.

So I'd like to say the issue is not always a big thing but that might be uncomfortable terminology for some. It in fact is not an issue.

Yet S Korea has a public bathhouse on just about every other block and they're always full of ordinary people, which means all kinds of people. Women downstairs at each one, men upstairs at each one.

Generations of a family go to the bathhouses to share hours of relaxation, showers, massage etc. One sees many instances of a grandfather with his son and his grandson(s) together at the bathhouse.

Virtually all of the large corporations and businesses in the USA that are objecting to this bill also have workout rooms and saunas and the like and there does not seem to be any problem with their policies there in respect of gender access to include gender transformation and/or identity.

This bill is a big ado about the right's small ideas about real life and real people. The good book youse people over there read all the time has long overstayed its natural shelf life. It was always out of place over here anyhow, as is only recently becoming increasingly evident.

[jak2002003]

[thaibeachlovers]

This has gotten beyond ridiculous. Who in their right mind would say it is perfectly normal for their eight year old daughter or anyone's young daughter to go into a bathroom where men are openly urinating? If a person supports the activists this is exactly what they are saying.

???????????????

Have you ever been in a female public toilet? They don't have urinals in them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

When I was doing nurse training, so few men did it that they didn't have toilets for men only so I had to use the female toilets. No big deal.

However, it's only a matter of time if they have men in dresses using female public facilities that the perverts start dressing in drag to have a cheap thrill, and of course the serial killers are a worry.

[thaibeachlovers]

In North Carolina it seems that common sense prevails.

"Roy Cooper NC DOJ Will Not Defend HB 2" http://www.indyweek.com/news/archives/2016/03/29/roy-cooper-nc-doj-will-not-defend-house-bill-2

"In defending his office's nondiscrimination policy and a similar policy at the state treasurer's office, Cooper says he would argue that House Bill 2 is unconstitutional. "

​In all the diversion into off topic hysterics about male sexual offenders in female toilets and the beat up of the fear that is solely being generated by hate groups, primarily religious based, that are demanding the right to discriminate against LGBT people, the core issue is being shrouded. The core issue is equal protection for all people. In the US this is guaranteed in the constitution for all US citizens. As the US goes, so does the rest of the western world.

These hate bills, the existence of which seem to be completely oblivious to the Toilet Birthers, are full of discriminatory practices. Those who want to promote fear and hate deliberately promote the unrelated issues of male sexual predators. They ignore the core element of the regulations. Employers can dismiss a straight person who expresses support for marriage equality. LGBT people can be denied access to housing and public services because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. State and private employees are equally subject to the discriminatory provisions of such bills.

The promoters or hate and division are being thwarted at every turn as we see from the actual good people of North Carolina.

Re the "unconstitutional" bit. The founding fathers that wrote the constitution would probably have hung homosexuals and tarred and feathered any man they found in drag.

[lostboy]

In North Carolina it seems that common sense prevails.

"Roy Cooper NC DOJ Will Not Defend HB 2" http://www.indyweek.com/news/archives/2016/03/29/roy-cooper-nc-doj-will-not-defend-house-bill-2

"In defending his office's nondiscrimination policy and a similar policy at the state treasurer's office, Cooper says he would argue that House Bill 2 is unconstitutional. "

​In all the diversion into off topic hysterics about male sexual offenders in female toilets and the beat up of the fear that is solely being generated by hate groups, primarily religious based, that are demanding the right to discriminate against LGBT people, the core issue is being shrouded. The core issue is equal protection for all people. In the US this is guaranteed in the constitution for all US citizens. As the US goes, so does the rest of the western world.

These hate bills, the existence of which seem to be completely oblivious to the Toilet Birthers, are full of discriminatory practices. Those who want to promote fear and hate deliberately promote the unrelated issues of male sexual predators. They ignore the core element of the regulations. Employers can dismiss a straight person who expresses support for marriage equality. LGBT people can be denied access to housing and public services because of their sexual orientation or gender identity. State and private employees are equally subject to the discriminatory provisions of such bills.

The promoters or hate and division are being thwarted at every turn as we see from the actual good people of North Carolina.

Re the "unconstitutional" bit. The founding fathers that wrote the constitution would probably have hung homosexuals and tarred and feathered any man they found in drag.

For those who make a fetish about the 'Founding Fathers':

"Delving into the Founding Fathers’ own papers indicates something altogether different. Some of the Founding Fathers leaned right, but the majority were anti-monarchists, Freemasons and atheists who held what modern historical language would term a secularist and globalist view. In some cases — like George Washington’s — this included a strong gay-friendly attitude."http://gayhistoryproject.epgn.com/historical-profiles/george-washington-gay-friendly-father-of-our-country/

Washington as Gay Friendly. Alexander Hamilton probably either Bi or Gay. http://www.queerty.com/was-founding-father-alexander-hamilton-bisexual-his-letters-suggest-so-20140704

Is the sexual orientation of the signatories to the founding documents of the United States relevant? Probably not. The issue is that Equal Treatment is enshired in the 14th Amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

So Founding Fathers who were slave owners have constitutional rights extended to former slaves. Same with other minorities.

To me, this makes a complete mockery of the 'Constructionist' view that rejects the Constitution as a living document. Constructionists try to prevent social progress and consequently social justice by promoting the 'good old days' that really weren't that good after all.

Transgenders are the latest group to come out of the closet and remind everyone that they are people, citizens, with the right to equal protection. It happened with women. It happened with African Americans. It happened with Gays and Lesbians. Now it is the Transgenders turn. No big deal. The world will keep turning and people will finally understand what a Trans woman or a Trans man is and let the poop in comfort and security.

[up-country_sinclair]

For those who make a fetish about the 'Founding Fathers':

"Delving into the Founding Fathers’ own papers indicates something altogether different. Some of the Founding Fathers leaned right, but the majority were anti-monarchists, Freemasons and atheists who held what modern historical language would term a secularist and globalist view. In some cases — like George Washington’s — this included a strong gay-friendly attitude."http://gayhistoryproject.epgn.com/historical-profiles/george-washington-gay-friendly-father-of-our-country/

Washington as Gay Friendly. Alexander Hamilton probably either Bi or Gay. http://www.queerty.com/was-founding-father-alexander-hamilton-bisexual-his-letters-suggest-so-20140704

Is the sexual orientation of the signatories to the founding documents of the United States relevant? Probably not. The issue is that Equal Treatment is enshired in the 14th Amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

So Founding Fathers who were slave owners have constitutional rights extended to former slaves. Same with other minorities.

To me, this makes a complete mockery of the 'Constructionist' view that rejects the Constitution as a living document. Constructionists try to prevent social progress and consequently social justice by promoting the 'good old days' that really weren't that good after all.

Transgenders are the latest group to come out of the closet and remind everyone that they are people, citizens, with the right to equal protection. It happened with women. It happened with African Americans. It happened with Gays and Lesbians. Now it is the Transgenders turn. No big deal. The world will keep turning and people will finally understand what a Trans woman or a Trans man is and let the poop in comfort and security.

Not only is the majority of this post completely off topic, it's also patently absurd. This sort of revisionist history holds no water except for those willing to completely suspend disbelief and live in their own confirmation bias bubble. George Washington was gay friendly? 5555. Sure. And John Adams was for charter schools. And James Madison was a strong proponent of Cap and Trade.

Now then, let's get back on topic. Shall we?

The elected representatives of the good people of North Carolina see no need to make any changes to HB 2.

A North Carolina legislative leader said Wednesday he doesn't see the need to repeal or revise a law that limits protections for the LGBT community.

At a news conference on the upcoming legislative session, state Senate leader Phil Berger referred to the law as "our commonsense bathroom safety bill" for its measures governing transgender bathroom access in many public buildings.

Gender identity and sexual orientation are also excluded from statewide workplace and public accommodation protections in the law, which triggered widespread criticism from equality advocates and business leaders nationwide.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/appeals-ruling-threatens-key-provision-north-carolina-law-38532212

And by the way, it's beyond ironic that someone would use the term 'make a fetish' on this particular thread.

Edited May 2, 2016 by up-country_sinclair

[lostboy]

For those who make a fetish about the 'Founding Fathers':

"Delving into the Founding Fathers’ own papers indicates something altogether different. Some of the Founding Fathers leaned right, but the majority were anti-monarchists, Freemasons and atheists who held what modern historical language would term a secularist and globalist view. In some cases — like George Washington’s — this included a strong gay-friendly attitude."http://gayhistoryproject.epgn.com/historical-profiles/george-washington-gay-friendly-father-of-our-country/

Washington as Gay Friendly. Alexander Hamilton probably either Bi or Gay. http://www.queerty.com/was-founding-father-alexander-hamilton-bisexual-his-letters-suggest-so-20140704

Is the sexual orientation of the signatories to the founding documents of the United States relevant? Probably not. The issue is that Equal Treatment is enshired in the 14th Amendment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

So Founding Fathers who were slave owners have constitutional rights extended to former slaves. Same with other minorities.

To me, this makes a complete mockery of the 'Constructionist' view that rejects the Constitution as a living document. Constructionists try to prevent social progress and consequently social justice by promoting the 'good old days' that really weren't that good after all.

Transgenders are the latest group to come out of the closet and remind everyone that they are people, citizens, with the right to equal protection. It happened with women. It happened with African Americans. It happened with Gays and Lesbians. Now it is the Transgenders turn. No big deal. The world will keep turning and people will finally understand what a Trans woman or a Trans man is and let the poop in comfort and security.

Not only is the majority of this post completely off topic, it's also patently absurd. This sort of revisionist history holds no water except for those willing to completely suspend disbelief and live in their own confirmation bias bubble. George Washington was gay friendly? 5555. Sure. And John Adams was for charter schools. And James Madison was a strong proponent of Cap and Trade.

Now then, let's get back on topic. Shall we?

The elected representatives of the good people of North Carolina see no need to make any changes to HB 2.

A North Carolina legislative leader said Wednesday he doesn't see the need to repeal or revise a law that limits protections for the LGBT community.

At a news conference on the upcoming legislative session, state Senate leader Phil Berger referred to the law as "our commonsense bathroom safety bill" for its measures governing transgender bathroom access in many public buildings.

Gender identity and sexual orientation are also excluded from statewide workplace and public accommodation protections in the law, which triggered widespread criticism from equality advocates and business leaders nationwide.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/appeals-ruling-threatens-key-provision-north-carolina-law-38532212

And by the way, it's beyond ironic that someone would use the term 'make a fetish' on this particular thread.

Oh good. The Potty Police are here. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/barbra-siperstein/will-north-carolina-be-po_b_9570480.html

So nice of you to stick your Potty Proboscis into Thaibeachlovers post. Of course, with typical boorishness you don't actually debunk anything that is stated by the sources on the social liberalism of the Founding Fathers. You merely sneer and try the off-topic play. Off topic? The whole point in the post was the 14th Amendment. No response to that. No mention of this issue. Why not?

For those whose minds are not limited to the toilet, HB2 defines minorities that may receive protection from discrimination. This definition does not extend to LGBT people. This means that the rotten people of North Carolina believe, through their bigoted legislature influenced by the religious nut bags, that the protections guaranteed under the 14th Amendment do not extend to LGBT people.

This is the crux of HB2 and similar religiously promoted hate legislation.

The fellow travellers of these fringe lunatics are promoting this discrimination by beat up the non issue of potty pandemonium http://www.joemygod.com/2016/04/24/frank-bruni-on-ted-cruz-and-potty-pandemonium/

The bigotry is shameful. The promotion of discrimination against minorities is shameful. This disgrace being touted as common sense? People afraid of transgenders. People too ignorant to try to understand transgenders. People happy in their own bigoted little world.

It is clear why you continue to diver the issue to the toilet. You have no sensible, credible or valid argument on any of the real issues. The right to Equal Protection. The right to dignity. The role of LGBT people in history. Nothing. Complete and utter intellectual bankruptcy. So of course we have to beat up the toilet issue. Talk about a fetish.

[up-country_sinclair]

Some seem to be unaware that the following words are contained in the title of this thread:

bathroom access

[up-country_sinclair]

US activists try to calm fears over transgender bathroom access

Those activists have their work cut out for them, because clear thinking Americans are taking a stand. More than 1,000,000 people have signed the pledge to boycott Target. By the way, Target's stock price has dropped approximately 6% since the announcement.

Whooops!

http://dailycaller.com/2016/04/29/target-stock-prices-drop-amid-new-bathroom-policy-and-boycott/

And to think this all could have been avoided if these people would have just used the single stall, handicapped bathrooms. But that's not good enough for less than 1/2 of 1%. They need to impose their will on the overwhelming majority.

[lostboy]

Some seem to be unaware that the following words are contained in the title of this thread:

bathroom access

Some people, despite weeks of googling and the desperate clutching of straws have never demonstrated that any transgender women committed any sexual offences against females in the toilet.

So why keep the minds in the potty? Why beat up a non issue?

I guess some people don't have the guts to confront their own bigotry and need lame excuses and diversions.

[Jingthing]

Also, as if a temporary stock price fluctuation trumps CIVIL RIGHTS.

U.S. Attorney General Loretta Lynch

http://www.advocate.com/transgender/2016/5/02/us-attorney-general-loretta-lynch-ending-transgender-discrimination-about

"We decided over 200 years ago that we wanted to be an inclusive society, and we wanted to guarantee equal rights for all," she told BuzzFeed's Chris Geidner. She went on to explain her position:

"For that to mean something, we have to be careful, we have to be vigilant, so that when people, for whatever reason, are either [made to] feel like they’re on the outside — a particular group — or are placed on the outside, that that doesn’t happen. And transgender issues are no different, to me, in that regard.”

Edited May 2, 2016 by Jingthing

[seedy]

Flaming posts Removed.