Australian aged pension, new rules for portability payments (whilst living/travelling overseas)

[cheynewalk]

A friend of mine has recently returned fron a trip to australia to claim the age pension. His interviewing officer told him that as of next year ALL new aged pension applicants must reside in australia for 2 years before their age pension is paid to them whilst overseas. This is regardless of whether the applicant has lived their entire life in australia or is returning from living overseas to claim the pension. The new rules are meant to coincide with the staggering of the age increase from 65 to 67 years before claiming the age pension.

New recipients who travel overseas during the initial 2 year period will have their payments suspended whilst overseas and the time spent overseas added to their 2 year residency period.

So it looks as though all aussies will have to accept their "2 years time" in australia before they can be paid whilst living overseas.

[bdenner]

Nothing new here, has been in force for at least 3 years, or more, now. An acquaintance has just returned to Thailand after doing his 2 year "penitence"! And yes, the time he spend over seas whilst doing the 2 years was added and he did not receive the pension when here visiting his wife and child during that period.

Edited April 9, 2016 by bdenner

[cheynewalk]

No, if you read my post it now applies to all new applicants. Your friend would have been termed a "returning resident" under the old rules and required to do his 2 years in australia. The new replies apply to everybody, even if they have never left australia before.

Those people working back in australia who may have holidayed in thailand before and are contemplating retiring here may well have to wait another 2 years before coming over to thailand.

[nev]

No, if you read my post it now applies to all new applicants. Your friend would have been termed a "returning resident" under the old rules and required to do his 2 years in australia. The new replies apply to everybody, even if they have never left australia before.

Those people working back in australia who may have holidayed in thailand before and are contemplating retiring here may well have to wait another 2 years before coming over to thailand.

It has been in for years, and mainly applies to those that are overseas, the ones already Australia and not lived overseas would have resided in Australia for the two years wouldn't they have??, nothing has changed might as well merge this thread with the other as no new news here.

[cheynewalk]

No, previously people who had lived and worked in australia up to pension age would continue to receive their pension if they travelled overseas. Now they don't. The old rule only applied to "returning residents", people who had lived overseas prior to coming back to australia to claim their pension. These applicants had to fulfill the residency requirement of 2 years. ALL applicants must now fulfill the 2 year residency requirement after claiming the age pension, even if they have lived in australia their whole life.

This is quite different to the old rule and will affect many more people.

[nev]

No, previously people who had lived and worked in australia up to pension age would continue to receive their pension if they travelled overseas. Now they don't. The old rule only applied to "returning residents", people who had lived overseas prior to coming back to australia to claim their pension. These applicants had to fulfill the residency requirement of 2 years. ALL applicants must now fulfill the 2 year residency requirement after claiming the age pension, even if they have lived in australia their whole life.

This is quite different to the old rule and will affect many more people.

But if you have never left Australia or only left for short holidays wouldn't they have already fulfilled the residency requirement?.

[Inquisitorial]

Attached in the link to the govt web site

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/age-pension-while-travelling-outside-australia

[bdenner]

No, previously people who had lived and worked in australia up to pension age would continue to receive their pension if they travelled overseas. Now they don't. The old rule only applied to "returning residents", people who had lived overseas prior to coming back to australia to claim their pension. These applicants had to fulfill the residency requirement of 2 years. ALL applicants must now fulfill the 2 year residency requirement after claiming the age pension, even if they have lived in australia their whole life.

This is quite different to the old rule and will affect many more people.

OK, that is a better explanation and I now hear what you are saying. The old age pensioners reward for busting his/her guts their working life is an extra 2 years confinement within Australian boarders no matter their situation when applying! = Pricks - TTF I'm a self funded retiree.

Edited April 10, 2016 by bdenner

[DavisH]

For the full pension, isn't residency 35 years now (from age 16)? I'd have to go back and work until I retired just to get a full pension. I left when I was 31 and am 47 now.

[rhodie]

Attached in the link to the govt web site

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/age-pension-while-travelling-outside-australia

"If you have returned to live in Australia within the last 2 years and you have started receiving Age Pension during this period, you cannot be paid outside Australia until the 2 year waiting period has passed. This rule also applies if you were previously paid under an international social security agreement while you were living outside Australia and your Age Pension continues to be paid now you have returned to live in Australia again.

If you are affected by this rule and you travel outside Australia while remaining an Australian resident, your absence is generally considered to be temporary and is counted as part of the 2 year period."

From the website. This does not corroborate what the OP is implying, so it would be good to have a link to confirm the new rules.

[simple1]

For the full pension, isn't residency 35 years now (from age 16)? I'd have to go back and work until I retired just to get a full pension. I left when I was 31 and am 47 now.

Yes, currently at the age of 16 a total of 35 years "working Life residency" to qualify for full Age Pension under the portability arrangements, this will include any periods of unemployment / disability and unable to work whilst in Oz.

[rhodie]

For the full pension, isn't residency 35 years now (from age 16)? I'd have to go back and work until I retired just to get a full pension. I left when I was 31 and am 47 now.

Well, at least if you did that you will have qualified for portability having been in Australia the last 2 years, and could leave again. But I doubt the rules will still be the same and you will probably need to work to 70 by then.

[guapo]

PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION TO STOP MORE CHANGES TO THE AUSTRALIAN OLD AGE PENSION.

Thank you for signing Australian Labor's petition to tell Malcolm Turnbull that we don't want changes to our pension.

The more people who are a part of a campaign, the stronger our voice is.

If you have any friends or family who you think might be interested in supporting this issue, please share this URL on Facebook, Twitter or even forward this to them: http://www.dontpocketourpension.com.au/?recruiter_id=321578

Thanks for your support,

The Australian Labor Team

[Rancid]

What's the bet that politician pensions have no restrictions?

[shirtless]

Well you guys should be happy you get a pension most Aussies now have to rely solely on Super.

[AlexRRR]

Well you guys should be happy you get a pension most Aussies now have to rely solely on Super.

Well my heart bleeds for you.

Your boss contributed 9% of and on top of your gross earnings, the older guys who were employed the super rules came in too late and if you were self employed you should have taken advantage of the tax breaks contributing to super.

[macksview]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

[simple1]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

Currently you have to return to Australia to apply for Age Pension then wait two years for portability. Current residency criteria, assets test etc for Age Pension eligibility at…

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/age-pension

Enrolment for Medicare for returning residents...

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/medicare-enrolment-returning-residents

[macksview]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

Currently you have to return to Australia to apply for Age Pension then wait two years for portability. Current residency criteria, assets test etc for Age Pension eligibility at…

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/age-pension

Enrolment for Medicare for returning residents...

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/medicare-enrolment-returning-residents

thanks mate, i am looking at other options as well.

living just over 6 months in aus, then thailand for the balance of the financial year.

by my reading, that would keep me resident, would that avoid the 2 yr thing?

[simple1]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

Currently you have to return to Australia to apply for Age Pension then wait two years for portability. Current residency criteria, assets test etc for Age Pension eligibility at…

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/age-pension

Enrolment for Medicare for returning residents...

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/medicare-enrolment-returning-residents

thanks mate, i am looking at other options as well.

living just over 6 months in aus, then thailand for the balance of the financial year.

by my reading, that would keep me resident, would that avoid the 2 yr thing?

Unsure. If you're in Oz why not contact Centrelink International on 131 673 for clarity

[macksview]

thanks, was hoping someone was doing similar before i talk to c/link

[halloween]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

Doing something similar, going back and working 6 months of each (financial ) year - make sure you have minimum 183 days in country. This makes you a tax resident with normal tax rules. If less than 183 days, 33% on every dollar earned.

I make sure medicare, voter registration, etc, all up to date. Even have a few club memberships.

[macksview]

ok lads, after advice

still working in aus, until i will be 60, age for pension 67, will have worked in aus for over 35 years.

at 60, if living in thailand, what resident criteria do i have to meet for age pension at 67?

will rent out my aus house when 60

looking to keep my super funds in aus bank, except usual bank account for thai immi.

wish to maintain medicare so i can always seek services in aus for health reasons.

some general help would be greatly appreciated.

Doing something similar, going back and working 6 months of each (financial ) year - make sure you have minimum 183 days in country. This makes you a tax resident with normal tax rules. If less than 183 days, 33% on every dollar earned.

I make sure medicare, voter registration, etc, all up to date. Even have a few club memberships.

yes, thats kind of gear i am looking at.

maintain aus tax status, not putting more in thai banks than i need to.

it is a game i need to listen to.

[halloween]

Remember under no circumstances mention that you have a foreign national live-in g/f or wife. if they know you have such, they will reduce single pension by 25%.

AFAIK there is no upside of doing it.

BTW If you spend first 183 days of year in Oz and last 183 of the next year, theoretically you could be o/s for 364 days and still be a tax resident.

[marquis22]

Remember under no circumstances mention that you have a foreign national live-in g/f or wife. if they know you have such, they will reduce single pension by 25%.

AFAIK there is no upside of doing it.

BTW If you spend first 183 days of year in Oz and last 183 of the next year, theoretically you could be o/s for 364 days and still be a tax resident.

If married to a Thai woman and she works in Thailand then wouldn't the Aus DHS know you are married even if you did not tell them?

Do you know the rate at which the pension will be reduced if they know the income of the wife?

[BB24]

Currently you have to return to Australia to apply for Age Pension then wait two years for portability. Current residency criteria, assets test etc for Age Pension eligibility at…

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/age-pension

Enrolment for Medicare for returning residents...

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/enablers/medicare-enrolment-returning-residents

thanks mate, i am looking at other options as well.

living just over 6 months in aus, then thailand for the balance of the financial year.

by my reading, that would keep me resident, would that avoid the 2 yr thing?

I am in a similar situation, and thought I should advise yourself/others to keep in mind that remaining a 'resident' for Tax purposes and for Social Welfare purposes are not the same thing, and can vary from person to person - even those in similar situations. The basic difference is that you/I can get an answer provided by ATO now, but you cannot get a binding one from CLink. CLink will only give you answers 'informally' (sometimes wrong) and they do not apply if the future - they have no precedent. Until you/I have formally completed any application (eg for the Age Pension) CLink will not give a definitive answer (too complex). ATO can/will give you an answer now regarding something you may do in the future, and they can be held to that (unless the laws are changed). CLink looks at each situation (only after application) and makes their own determination at that time.

Also keep in mind that (after you apply fopr Age Pension) that you will have to convince CLink that you are resident in Australia. They may/will try to claim that your Thailand premises is your main residence. You need to do things to ensure that as far as anyone 'impartial' concerned, that you are a resident of Australia and that you are on 'holidays' in Thailand. Things like being in Aust for 6 months will definitely help - and maintaining a home in Australia - and moving homes in Thailand - and visiting other countries - etc etc etc. Keep bank accounts open - keep regsitered on electoral roll and keep voting - have car registration and driving licence maintained. Keep doing things in Australia - just like it is your main residence. CLink are told when you have left and entered the country for the last 5 years - and many many other things - once you apply for any Pension/Payment. If they think you are going to get the Age Pension and then go and live overseas (true) then they will try to deny your claim. You have to do things so that they cannot deny your claim.

Regarding the comment about not telling CLink you have Thai GF/BF. As far as I have been able to ascertain, as long as you do not officially marry a Thai person, then you are not married as far as the Laws of Australia are concerned - de-facto laws do not apply in Thailand and therefore you are not married under Aust Law. Therefore, you are under no obligation to tell CLink now or ever that you have a GF/BF. If you do marry a Thai officially, then you should tell them once you are applying for the pension. They have many means to find things out (other Agencies) and they will take back overpayments - and they may/will penalise you.

The reduction in Age Pension for someone who is overseas and is married, is currently down from $21,255 PA to $16,062 PA (24.4%). It is irrelevent whether they work or not, whethere they are Thai or Aust, or whether they are sick/dying. For obvious reasons (costs) they apply the same rules to someone living in Australia who is married to an Australian. One of the many things that is wrong, but they aint gonna change it anytime soon.

[macksview]

thanks for that bb24

[hellofagal]

Unfortunately none of the comments seem to clarify portability of the aged pension! My husband has resided in Australia for the past 2 years. He is still working but will want to claim the aged pension when he retires next year. I cannot claim the pension unless I return to Australia for 2 years. What is unclear is this; Does my husband qualify to receive the pension and leave permanently or does he have to reside in Australia for two years after he receives the pension? He meets the requirements of residency but the two year requirement is confusing.   

[4MyEgo]

On 19/05/2016 at 5:08 PM, BB24 said:

I am in a similar situation, and thought I should advise yourself/others to keep in mind that remaining a 'resident' for Tax purposes and for Social Welfare purposes are not the same thing, and can vary from person to person - even those in similar situations. The basic difference is that you/I can get an answer provided by ATO now, but you cannot get a binding one from CLink. CLink will only give you answers 'informally' (sometimes wrong) and they do not apply if the future - they have no precedent. Until you/I have formally completed any application (eg for the Age Pension) CLink will not give a definitive answer (too complex). ATO can/will give you an answer now regarding something you may do in the future, and they can be held to that (unless the laws are changed). CLink looks at each situation (only after application) and makes their own determination at that time.

Also keep in mind that (after you apply fopr Age Pension) that you will have to convince CLink that you are resident in Australia. They may/will try to claim that your Thailand premises is your main residence. You need to do things to ensure that as far as anyone 'impartial' concerned, that you are a resident of Australia and that you are on 'holidays' in Thailand. Things like being in Aust for 6 months will definitely help - and maintaining a home in Australia - and moving homes in Thailand - and visiting other countries - etc etc etc. Keep bank accounts open - keep regsitered on electoral roll and keep voting - have car registration and driving licence maintained. Keep doing things in Australia - just like it is your main residence. CLink are told when you have left and entered the country for the last 5 years - and many many other things - once you apply for any Pension/Payment. If they think you are going to get the Age Pension and then go and live overseas (true) then they will try to deny your claim. You have to do things so that they cannot deny your claim.

Regarding the comment about not telling CLink you have Thai GF/BF. As far as I have been able to ascertain, as long as you do not officially marry a Thai person, then you are not married as far as the Laws of Australia are concerned - de-facto laws do not apply in Thailand and therefore you are not married under Aust Law. Therefore, you are under no obligation to tell CLink now or ever that you have a GF/BF. If you do marry a Thai officially, then you should tell them once you are applying for the pension. They have many means to find things out (other Agencies) and they will take back overpayments - and they may/will penalise you.

The reduction in Age Pension for someone who is overseas and is married, is currently down from $21,255 PA to $16,062 PA (24.4%). It is irrelevent whether they work or not, whethere they are Thai or Aust, or whether they are sick/dying. For obvious reasons (costs) they apply the same rules to someone living in Australia who is married to an Australian. One of the many things that is wrong, but they aint gonna change it anytime soon.

 

I agree with 99% of your reply however, only if you have it in writing from the ATO, anything you do on the ATO's site that can be printed off, usually has a disclaimer at the bottom of it, so watch that uppercut

 

[halloween]

On 18/05/2016 at 10:04 PM, marquis22 said:

If married to a Thai woman and she works in Thailand then wouldn't the Aus DHS know you are married even if you did not tell them?

Do you know the rate at which the pension will be reduced if they know the income of the wife?

Sorry to be slow getting back. If you have informed embassy/centrelink that you are married then they deduct 25% of single OAP, without consideration of her income or lack of it, just assuming she is working. Working on the assumption that a long term g/f would be considered a de facto wife, I am telling them SFA.