Eating: high fat, near zero carb, grain free, mostly “paleo”

[PT4]

(to be revised)

Edited April 15, 2016 by PT4

[PT4]

(being revised)

Edited April 15, 2016 by PT4

[PT4]

I have recently started on a Low-carb (LC) diet after seeing a respected documentary and my own follow-up research. In a week I have lost about 3 kgs.

​Valuable information. Thank you, CM4, for posting.

​

Low-fat/reduced-fat products (the fats have been replaced by sugar to make them more edible).

​I didn't know that about added sugar in low-fat products. Sneaky!

​

Full strength dairy products, like Milk, butter, cheese, yoghurt, etc, are all OK,

​Maybe not milk or yoghurt. Lactose (milk sugar) stimulates insulin production. Butter and hard cheese, however, are virtually all fat, virtually no carbs.

​

If one does some searching one can find some tasty recipes for LC diet, some of which I use are Beef Stroganoff with Blue Cheese, Asparagus Soup, Cauliflower Rice, Crispbread

Crispbread? What are the ingredients? One of the things I miss most eating this way is "crunch". A "legal" crispbread would be very welcome.

[humqdpf]

It is a very good idea to cut back on carbs as they are often understood as a major source of visceral fat.

However, there are concerns about cutting down too much on carbs - you can read about this on the web re Hodgkins Diet. For instance, certain kinds of meat can give rise to gout. Even if you have never had gout and even if you have had a low uric acid reading, you can still get gout. Some foods are surprisingly high in purine (for instance, soya/tofu!). You need to ensure you are getting other non-carb food, especially greens.

I have found that a basic zero sugar carb breakfast is a food idea, then keeping all carbs to as low as possible for the rest of the day. If there have to be some carbs, you should use the slowest carbs.

The main benefit for me of this diet is that it keeps appetite in check and I never get the need to binge.

[chingching]

You might find this article interesting

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/apr/07/the-sugar-conspiracy-robert-lustig-john-yudkin

[JHolmesJr]

I have found that a basic zero sugar carb breakfast is a food idea, then keeping all carbs to as low as possible for the rest of the day. If there have to be some carbs, you should use the slowest carbs.

The main benefit for me of this diet is that it keeps appetite in check and I never get the need to binge.

Ive arrived at this thinking as well….no more desserts, soft drinks for me….or starchy carbs

Just stick to the lean low GI carbs…okra, bean sprouts, cauliflower, cabbage…heaps more.

Avoid starchy high GI carbs like potato, carrots etc.

I stick to fish and chicken (free range only, not supermarket ones shot with growth hormones and antibiotics)

A lot of high GI carbs have been linked to causing inflammation at the cellular level…which is the starting point for just about every chronic disease.

[Taggart]

Everyone is different but I still eat mostly potatoes (not fried in oil), brown rice, oats, and whole grain bread and if any of these foods are supposed to cause weight gain, I certainly haven't noticed. I'm 66 and my metabolism isn't any where near what it used to be, but by sticking with these foods I'm actually losing excess weight.

[sometimewoodworker]

I have been on a similar diet for 5 years ! Love it!

So have I.

One further benefit is that I had incipient metabolic syndrome (fat deposits round my liver and other internal organs) now even though I'm still overweight BMI about 30 the internal fat has gone. My doctor was very surprised:)

[MikeWill]

What do you guys eating for breakfast?

[Gulfsailor]

Cave men did NOT eat a high fat diet. Any anumals that would have been available to them would likely have been very lean and sinewy. It irkse to mix marketing with reality.

Cave men, if they had the chance, would eat the high fat bits of an animal. But in most cases they were happy to scavenge the leftovers from an animal kill, which meant most good organ meats and brain were already eaten. That would leave human with the muscle meat. Later humans were good hunters themselves and as such would make the kill themselves and thus feast on all the high fat parts of the animal. Some modern tribes in Africa live on a diet consisting of 80+% saturated fat, and they live far longer than neighboring tribes people who adopted a more varied or a Western diet.

[stillbornagain]

Cave men did NOT eat a high fat diet. Any anumals that would have been available to them would likely have been very lean and sinewy. It irkse to mix marketing with reality.

Actually, for hunter gatherers the choice parts are the internal organs which are very high in fat. Same goes for predators. Muscle meat gets eaten last.

[Airalee]

If anybody is interested in a website/blog written by a woman on a quest to lose 100lbs (no...not for her special interest story but rather her recipes) check out Peaceloveandlowcarb dot com. She even makes low carb "bread" products such as pizza crust, cakes and cookies using almond flour. I haven't gotten around to trying many myself but those I have were really quite delicious.

[Linzz]

OP what you describe sounds very much like the Ketogenic Diet…high fat and animal protein…low to no carb, zero sugar etc...

Yes you're describing Aitkins Diet, been around a long time. I tried that and it worked but had trouble with constipation because of all the meat I reckon. Anyone have some experience or ideas on that? You need carbs and fibre for good working bowel system I think.

I have tried Alkaline diet (no acid foods) and that works and is healthy too but is a real pain trying to separate the two, especially in Thai food nigh impossible.

[cumgranosalum]

Cave men did NOT eat a high fat diet. Any anumals that would have been available to them would likely have been very lean and sinewy. It irkse to mix marketing with reality.

Cave men, if they had the chance, would eat the high fat bits of an animal. But in most cases they were happy to scavenge the leftovers from an animal kill, which meant most good organ meats and brain were already eaten. That would leave human with the muscle meat. Later humans were good hunters themselves and as such would make the kill themselves and thus feast on all the high fat parts of the animal. Some modern tribes in Africa live on a diet consisting of 80+% saturated fat, and they live far longer than neighboring tribes people who adopted a more varied or a Western diet.

?

Really? what TV show did you watch??? Care to hazard a guess on life expectancy of any of the "groups" you care to mention?

Edited April 16, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[tonray]

Cave men did NOT eat a high fat diet. Any anumals that would have been available to them would likely have been very lean and sinewy. It irkse to mix marketing with reality.

Cave men, if they had the chance, would eat the high fat bits of an animal. But in most cases they were happy to scavenge the leftovers from an animal kill, which meant most good organ meats and brain were already eaten. That would leave human with the muscle meat. Later humans were good hunters themselves and as such would make the kill themselves and thus feast on all the high fat parts of the animal. Some modern tribes in Africa live on a diet consisting of 80+% saturated fat, and they live far longer than neighboring tribes people who adopted a more varied or a Western diet.

The 'paleo' moniker is a joke. More than likely they binged on whatever was available, and there is very little fat on wild animals that survive on grass and vegetation. Ever eat venison or real free range chicken ? They are tough and dry. The fat content of our meats today is there because of commercial feed schedules to get animals as big as they can as fast as they can.

Ancient man likely killed an animal and then gorged on that carcass for a few days and lacking preservation methods , ate all while fresh because he might not eat for another few days. And as far as low carb.....another joke....when they found something sweet (berries, fruits, etc) they again gorged to prevent competitors from eating same. So likely had massive spikes in insulin levels after gorging on fruits for a few hours.

And as far as African tribes eating 80% saturated fat diets....who, what and where ?

[Shiver]

Sounds like you have most of it nailed already. Back in the day when I used to exert a lot more energy in cooler climates (eg. challenging mountain biking for long hours - never was a fan of the flat trails), I would be virtually carb free most of the time except for when training where I'd want some fast sugar on hand when I 'hit the wall'. I don't find that necessary now that most of my exercise is more about walking briskly around lakes and no extreme energy output, so the 'energy ballast tanks, or float chamber in carburettor talk' always have adequate supply just with real time fat conversion.

With regard to more 'interesting' tasting foods, I'm a huge lover of different sauces, and with some creativity you can come up with some amazing stuff that would make even soylent green taste interesting. They don't have to have sugar, but if you're using salt, then get something well rounded in minerals (they have pink Himalayan salt available in Thailand), which is balanced rather than that garbage you get in the supermarket that has little more than sodium and anti caking agents and creates imbalance in the transfer of salts in cells (potassium salts are the counter measure to sodium), but a good mix of 80+ minerals can't be all bad. I think that's where the myth of salt and blood pressure comes from, they're talking about sodium salts rather than full spectrum minerals - also has a delicious flavour compared to what most people consider as table salt. Even the local ground salts I would imagine are much better (about 20baht/Kg), though I've never sent them for testing. Remember that your body is basically a bag of sea water brought with you onto land (albeit in much more diluted form).

Edited April 16, 2016 by Shiver

[JHolmesJr]

Ever eat venison or real free range chicken ? They are tough and dry. The fat content of our meats today is there because of commercial feed schedules to get animals as big as they can as fast as they can.

I eat only free range chicken from the wet market….It is a remarkably different looking and tasting bird….the meat is lean and flavourful….there is still a little fat but nowhere near the amount on those supermarket broilers. I even ask the butcher to remove ALL the skin that is visible.

I also like goat meat since it is low in fat and the animals are not fed on growth hormones etc….but Ive discovered my metabolism doesn't take well to red meat so Ive ditched it.

Both these meats come at a hefty premium…so a lot of people just walk away from them…..nutritious food, it would seem, comes with a higher price tag.

I wish the politicians could sort this out and make good food accessible to all...instead of the dumb stuff they are preoccupied with, most of the time. But it would seem they are fully bought and paid for by the sugar/refined foods/livestock lobby.

[PT4]

if you're using salt, then get something well rounded in minerals (they have pink Himalayan salt available in Thailand),

Wouldn't a simple mineral supplement (tablets, capsules, or liquid) provide all you need, without the overload of sodium?

[PT4]

​low in fat ... I even ask the butcher to remove ALL the skin that is visible ... goat meat ... is low in fat

​

What are your reasons for minimizing fat?

Edited April 16, 2016 by PT4

[verito]

Many of you,guys,are mistaken and confused different diets- fat fast,lchf,paleo,Atkins,New Atkins,even Ducan...

They are very different...

It's impossible to make a mix of them...

[JHolmesJr]

​low in fat ... I even ask the butcher to remove ALL the skin that is visible ... goat meat ... is low in fat

​

What are your reasons for minimizing fat?

I just dont like animal fat...the taste mostly....have no problem with fat from macadamia nuts, coconut oil and the omega 3 chain. I even bought this fat called ghee which is clarified butter....i love it for an occasional omelette.

Im quite leery of putting away huge amounts of animal fat just because i saw it in a documentary...i would say my diet patterns centre around occasional animal protein cooked in olive oil or dusted with some ghee before grilling, and mainly vegetables and legumes that are lower in carb content.

Yesterday i made a dish with cauliflower, capsicum and haricovert beans....today a black eyed peas salad. Thats what i mainly eat....with meat once a week.

Have totally cut out wheat.....and 99% on sugar and rice.

[bangsaenguy]

Just cut out

Flour

Sugar

Rice

Potatoes

Weight will fall off. You will feel great

[cumgranosalum]

if you need to know why so many expats are overweight and unhealthy, read this thread - almost to a man they haven't a clue.

[lvr181]

It has been a good weight loss tool for me, though I do get cravings or maybe better put, I can be full but not satisfied - - and I get tired of meat...

​Thank you, Ken, for that post. Encouraging to know about your weight loss; none for me, yet.

​

​Yes, I get tired of meat, too, so I'm searching for a tasty fish that's available here.

​

​"Full but not satisfied." Happens to me, too. I take a gulp of coconut oil (2-3 tablespoons, or 2 tablespoons of un-salted butter. Nowhere near as tasty as 2 handfuls of "Kettle Cooked Potato Chips", but do feel fully satisfied for several hours.

​

​

​

"Full but not satisfied"? Then perhaps you're not eating correctly? If you think you are, then eat fruit, particularly bananas!

And the most important meal of the day IS BREAKFAST. How long ago was it you ate a reasonable meal before breakfast time? Many many hours I would suggest. Breakfast is time to "stoke up the furnaces" again.

Breakfast like a King

Lunch like a Prince.

Dinner like a Pauper.

Or, do what many asians do and just snack regularly all day rather than the caucasian three meal a day scenario?

And don't listen to snake oil salesmen or bulls hit marketers.

I thought the paleo diet had been discredited as being dangerous? REMEMBER "google" is your friend, do your homework THOROUGHLY (many only read what they already believe in) unfortunately.

[beammeup]

​low in fat ... I even ask the butcher to remove ALL the skin that is visible ... goat meat ... is low in fat

​

What are your reasons for minimizing fat?

I just dont like animal fat...the taste mostly....have no problem with fat from macadamia nuts, coconut oil and the omega 3 chain. I even bought this fat called ghee which is clarified butter....i love it for an occasional omelette.

Im quite leery of putting away huge amounts of animal fat just because i saw it in a documentary...i would say my diet patterns centre around occasional animal protein cooked in olive oil or dusted with some ghee before grilling, and mainly vegetables and legumes that are lower in carb content.

Yesterday i made a dish with cauliflower, capsicum and haricovert beans....today a black eyed peas salad. Thats what i mainly eat....with meat once a week.

Have totally cut out wheat.....and 99% on sugar and rice.

Try reading "good calories, bad calories" by Gary Taubes. I doubt you will be leery after that. The problem with high protein is that once you have consumed your dietary requirements then the rest gets converted to glucose so you might as well just eat carbs. You need about 1 gram/kg of body weight of protein. If you imagine the hunter gatherers catching a deer or something like that. the muscle meat would have been very tough (have you had Thai beef) but the fat and organs would be quite easy to eat. Thats what has been happening for millions of years. Thats what our bodies are programmed for.

Edited April 17, 2016 by beammeup

[cumgranosalum]

all these diets ignore the humans have lived for millennia on all sorts of stuff, so what has changed to make people - especially Americans - fat? Blame Nixon.. in the 1970s and the production of HFCS.....take that out of your diet and you'll be GENUINELY amazed.

[MikeWill]

HFCS - high fructose corn syrup. It also called Corn Sugar.

Almost all boxed foods contain HFCS including:

1. Yogurts
2. Breads
3. Frozen pizzas
4. Cereal bars
5. Cocktail peanuts
6. Boxed macaroni and cheese
7. Salad Dressing
8. Tonic
9. Applesauce
10. Canned Fruit

[BritManToo]

all these diets ignore the humans have lived for millennia on all sorts of stuff, so what has changed to make people - especially Americans - fat? Blame Nixon.. in the 1970s and the production of HFCS.....take that out of your diet and you'll be GENUINELY amazed.

No, what's happened is people don't do manual labour any more.

No exercise = fat person.

[cumgranosalum]

all these diets ignore the humans have lived for millennia on all sorts of stuff, so what has changed to make people - especially Americans - fat? Blame Nixon.. in the 1970s and the production of HFCS.....take that out of your diet and you'll be GENUINELY amazed.

No, what's happened is people don't do manual labour any more.

No exercise = fat person.

largely incorrect - just look at "lazy" populations and your theory falls flat.

The other thing is that most of the energy your body needs is to keep your body temp at around 36 and regulate it.....exercise has only a secondary effect on weight.

The processed food industry in USA switched to using large amounts of HSCF in just about everything - it has some very peculiar effects.......basically it prevents your body from saying "i'm full"....good for selling food, but not for the consumer. InEurope the "low Fat" food products were not as popular as the "low sugar" ones and the resulting differeces in weight and obesity followed. That's not to say that some European countries are catching up.

[cumgranosalum]

HFCS - high fructose corn syrup. It also called Corn Sugar.

Almost all boxed foods contain HFCS including:

1. Yogurts
2. Breads
3. Frozen pizzas
4. Cereal bars
5. Cocktail peanuts
6. Boxed macaroni and cheese
7. Salad Dressing
8. Tonic
9. Applesauce
10. Canned Fruit

Nixon subsidised the corn farmers back in the 70s and this resulted in a glut....converting it to "sugar" and selling it cheap to the food processing industry was the answer. US lead the way in using HFCS.

Currently, USA consumes the most - http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/11/study-countries-that-use-more-high-fructose-corn-syrup-have-more-diabetes/265607/

e.g - ""All indicators of diabetes were higher in countries that use HFCS as compared to those that do not,"

For instance some countries do or don't use it in Coca Cola......

for political reasons the supply is restricted in the EU.

USA is by far the largest producer making over 65% of the world's supply.

this graph shows calorific intake by nation and the relative amounts by HFCS

now think about obesity...........

Edited April 17, 2016 by cumgranosalum