Local Credit Card Theft

[KhonKaenKowboy]

The Canadian ones aren't nearly as generous as the US, and I was offered a Korean Air card, and it was pathetic, as were the ROC and British. You ever seen a Japanese card giving 40-50K miles (not points) for only spending 1-2000 USD?

http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.com/2014/10/01/japanese-airlines-bad-credit-cards/

Did you take the stuffed animal or the 5000 miles? You have the entire internet in front of you, go ahead, show us a link.

Edited May 18, 2016 by KhonKaenKowboy

[Fookhaht]

Who cares about U.S. banks. This is not America and many of us don't bank there.

What a Cretin, misanthropic post.

Get up on the wrong side of the bed today, did we?

Edited May 19, 2016 by Fookhaht

[Fookhaht]

Who cares about U.S. banks. This is not America and many of us don't bank there.

What a Cretin, misanthropic post.

Get up on the wrong side of the bed today, did we?

The 30,000+ Americans who live here might have some slight interest. Spare them just a moment, if you can...

[GarryP]

Happened to me last week on a Thai credit card. The bank called me about a suspicious payment of slightly over 100 Baht and said it had stopped the transaction and cancelled my card. Still waiting for the new card now. I use my card sparingly and can only put it down to the cashier at Central Department Store, Bang Na, Bangkok. It has happened three times to me in the past 12 months so I am starting to feel targeted. I have not suffered any losses but am getting fed up of needing frequent card replacement.

One time I found air tickets in the US charged to my Thai credit card. This was amusing because I have never been to the US and they were domestic flights. The person whose tickets were charged to me had the same first and last name but different middle initial. The cost for resolving that was a long distance call to the states to find out what the travel website had been doing. 90 days to get that transaction expunged from my card. Those tickets were cancelled so perhaps the poor fellow ended up stuck at the airport.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

Who cares about U.S. banks. This is not America and many of us don't bank there.

What a Cretin, misanthropic post.

Get up on the wrong side of the bed today, did we?

Did I mention becoming "stateless" is not a great way to get good credit cards. But, still waiting on the OP to give us one decent deal in Japan....Seems like many there are paying high annual fees for the right to earn miles.

[FolkGuitar]

Who cares about U.S. banks. This is not America and many of us don't bank there.

What a Cretin, misanthropic post.

Get up on the wrong side of the bed today, did we?

Did I mention becoming "stateless" is not a great way to get good credit cards. But, still waiting on the OP to give us one decent deal in Japan....Seems like many there are paying high annual fees for the right to earn miles.

I hope you'll forgive me for not having any interest in giving you anything... I find you to be a rather unpleasant fellow, and have no wish to assist you.

If you have internet access and a command of the Japanese language, you can find it yourself.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

I was just giving you a chance to prove you're not delusional. but didn't expect a member of the hard way team to take advantage of it.

[Aussie69]

Remember in the case of credit cards it isnt the issuing bank that runs the security/protection systems, it is VISA, Mastercard, American Express, etc. It doesnt matter if its a Thai VISA card or American VISA card.

[opalred]

good story

did they go missing when buying first logans

in a mountain village fruit stall

[FolkGuitar]

deleted

Edited May 19, 2016 by FolkGuitar

[JimGant]

It doesnt matter if its a Thai VISA card or American VISA card.

Yes, it does matter. Certainly Visa has security guidelines for all the issuers of its cards, and for the merchants who accept them. But it's country specific law that dictates one's liability. I don't know exactly what Thai laws are regarding liability, but we've seen stories on this forum about the difficulty -- in some situations -- in getting one's money back after fraud involving Thai issued plastic.

Now, the US has laws that are very pro consumer (elektrified, no need to read further).

The Fair Credit Billing Act (FCBA) and the Electronic Fund Transfer Act (EFTA) offer protection if your credit, ATM, or debit cards are lost or stolen.

Credit Card Loss or Fraudulent Charges

Under the FCBA, your liability for unauthorized use of your credit card tops out at $50 [and many banks will even waive this]. However, if you report the loss before your credit card is used, the FCBA says you are not responsible for any charges you didn’t authorize. If your credit card number is stolen, but not the card, you are not liable for unauthorized use.

ATM or Debit Card Loss or Fraudulent Transfers.

If you report an ATM or debit card missing before someone uses it, the EFTA says you are not responsible for any unauthorized transactions. If someone uses your ATM or debit card before you report it lost or stolen, your liability depends on how quickly you report it: E.G., if within 2 business days, $50. Over 2 days, $500.

The above also points out the superiority (at least re US law) of carrying a credit card, not a debit card, if you plan to do POS purchases.

I would imagine most Western countries have similar laws to that of the US.

[dingdongrb]

I really do not understand why anyone uses a foreign card for supermarket payment here (and foreign fee/exchange rate issues). I find it a good source of small bills for taxi and such. Cash is accepted everywhere - if you must use plastic some local cards offer SMS alerts when used which would immediately alert you of any fraud and do not involve exchange/foreign usage loss.

Yepper.... I use cash for everything !!!

[dingdongrb]

Thanks, FG.

The reason I asked is I had a credit card from Hawaii that I had used sparingly in Thailand for years and never had a problem. A couple years ago I went to Hawaii and used the card for some dinners.

When I returned to Chiang Mai I found out my financial institution had blocked the card because of suspicious activity. They were very minor charges from New Mexico. I had to have a new card issued. The only hassle with that is changing the card information for online use in the USA.

Glad you got taken care of by your companies.

Typically it's best to call the CC company and inform them when and where you'll e traveling and you'll be using your card.

[dingdongrb]

"There is NO QUESTION about the fact that these card numbers were harvested by someone at one of these supermarkets."

I wouldn't be so certain about that. There are several ways your card information could have been obtained that had nothing to do with someone at the supermarket itself:

Someone could have remotely installed malicious software on the company's POS devices, someone could have hacked the firm that does the credit card processing between the stores and the banks, someone could have hacked your bank's database, etc.

Nice that your credit card issuers are on the ball, though. Bit of a hassle since they'll cancel/replace your cards but much better than the alternative.

I would like to believe that anyone clever enough to remotely install malicious software on the company's POS devices, or hack the firm that does the credit card processing, would be smart enough NOT to use the stolen card to reserve a Thai hotel room, or order mail-order delivery of a custom-made wet-suit from a Thai company, as this thief did... What ever the manner of garnering the numbers, who ever was responsible should be in police custody shortly.

Seems to indicate a young, stupid crook.

The hackers make their money by selling lists of CC numbers and the PINs to those that have more nads to use that information.

[NancyL]

I really do not understand why anyone uses a foreign card for supermarket payment here (and foreign fee/exchange rate issues). I find it a good source of small bills for taxi and such. Cash is accepted everywhere - if you must use plastic some local cards offer SMS alerts when used which would immediately alert you of any fraud and do not involve exchange/foreign usage loss.

Yepper.... I use cash for everything !!!

There have been several times when I've been very glad we made a purchase with a U.S. credit card here because we've had to file claims for non-performance or non-delivery of the service purchased, i.e. cancelled in-country air flights and the CMU Language Institute.

Had we paid cash in these instances we would have been S.O.L.

[lopburi3]

That is not normally a supermarket purchase however.

[bazza40]

I only use an Australian debit card at an ATM which has the bank next to it, and even then for emergencies only. For anything else, there's my trusty Thai savings passbook which is basically unscammable. Pay cash for everything. Book airfares and accommodation online, pay with an Australian credit card.

IMHO a lot of credit card wounds are self-inflicted. Sorting out a local credit card's problems with different rules and a language barrier - good luck with that.

[orang37]

While I hesitate to generalize from one personal experience, I do use a Bangkok Bank/Visa debit card, and my recent experience with getting unauthorized purchases reversed quickly was much easier than I anticipated.

cheers, ~o:37;

[ozyjon]

I don't care, i have 1 credit card i've had since i was 20 yrs old

i do large amounts of financial transactions but limit my credit

card purchases to purchasing flights and hotel bookings.

A very dangerous time ahead, governments are pushing for us

to be a cashless society with huge ramifications for the public,

in protest i use cash whenever possible and in any country i'm in.

[dotpoom]

I always use cash everywhere for shopping, never understood why people don't ....glad I do after reading your OP. Only use C/C for booking flights, wish I didn't have to though.

[mesquite]

I really do not understand why anyone uses a foreign card for supermarket payment here (and foreign fee/exchange rate issues). I find it a good source of small bills for taxi and such. Cash is accepted everywhere - if you must use plastic some local cards offer SMS alerts when used which would immediately alert you of any fraud and do not involve exchange/foreign usage loss.

Yepper.... I use cash for everything !!!

There have been several times when I've been very glad we made a purchase with a U.S. credit card here because we've had to file claims for non-performance or non-delivery of the service purchased, i.e. cancelled in-country air flights and the CMU Language Institute.

Had we paid cash in these instances we would have been S.O.L.

Yes. As a result of a dispute I filed with my credit card company, I just got word that I will receive a full refund from an airline notorious for denying refunds (I did not do adequate research before I booked with them - my bad). Using a US credit card with an easy-to-submit dispute procedure gives one enormous leverage.

Edited May 21, 2016 by mesquite

[jacko45k]

Wow, thanks for the heads-up. This is one reason we use U.S. credit cards, because we know we have protection when something like this goes wrong. Also, this is why we're set up to look at our account activity on-line. I make it a point to log-in and look at charges every few days to signs of suspicious activity. Like you, FolkGuitar, we're just using them at grocery stores and hospitals here. Certainly nowhere that they leave our sight and in places you'd consider to be very reputable.

I actually never use my non-Thai cards in Thailand, and even use my Thai ones reservedly.

So in my case I believe foreign cards are more of a risk. Do you get asked to insert a PIN at the POS?

Also the fact that I get an SMS/Text message when my Thai credit card is used helps me feel more secure.

[mesquite]

Wow, thanks for the heads-up. This is one reason we use U.S. credit cards, because we know we have protection when something like this goes wrong. Also, this is why we're set up to look at our account activity on-line. I make it a point to log-in and look at charges every few days to signs of suspicious activity. Like you, FolkGuitar, we're just using them at grocery stores and hospitals here. Certainly nowhere that they leave our sight and in places you'd consider to be very reputable.

I actually never use my non-Thai cards in Thailand, and even use my Thai ones reservedly.

So in my case I believe foreign cards are more of a risk. Do you get asked to insert a PIN at the POS?

Also the fact that I get an SMS/Text message when my Thai credit card is used helps me feel more secure.

No PIN at POS, but I get an email alert every time a purchase is made.

[luther]

Last year I charged something at Amazon with an American credit card. Somehow I clicked and sent the purchase to the house we sold a few years ago. I instantly realized the mistake and according to Amazon I had a time to make changes, but five minutes into a chat was told I was screwed. I called the credit card company and asked to stop payment. The woman speaking for the credit card company said, “We’ll take this to mediation. Are you up for a three way call?” I did almost no talking. The credit card rep had Amazon backing down in five minutes.” I doubt that would have possible with a credit card issued in Thailand, but correct me if I’m wrong. Every other time I go into my bank, they mention an offer. They won’t give me a lock box, but are pushing a credit card hard.

[KhonKaenKowboy]

My latest card is offering "single use card numbers," which can be generated with a smartphone app or PC. But, unless someone physically has my chip protected card, and can forge my signature (which they do at dispute time); the burden of proof is clearly on them. I didn't notice the Visa logo on the door of CMU LI, maybe just a coincidence, but if you agree to take Visa; you agree to give the consumer some protection. Some of those "claw-backs" can be pretty aggressive.

Geez, it sure would be nice if some of the bitter Europeans and others could show us some decent offers on foreign credit cards...I generally use my miles to fly ANA, Thai, Lufthansa, Korean, and ANA. Looks like I will have one with Cathay Pacific, soon. So I might as well get their cards, but in 30 years of getting free trips; I've never seen one.

Edited May 21, 2016 by KhonKaenKowboy

[NancyL]

Yes, agreed. In a former life, Hubby and I had a small business and accepted Visa/MC, so yes I know the merchant has to keep themselves squeaky clean or their rates can skyrocket.

It's no wonder so few Thai business accept Visa/MC and those that do want to add 3% to your bill.

For us as small business owners, we liked it when customers used Visa/MC credit cards vs. cash or debit cards -- their average purchase was higher than when they used cash or debit card. And don't get me started on personal checks. They were a giant PITA and I wished we didn't feel like we had to accept 'em.

(It was a big help when Wayne Cty, Michigan's excellent County Prosecutor took on this issue and it was easier for us file claims against people who wrote bad checks via email AND the perps made good, because if it went to trial and they were found guilty they owed us 3X the face amount of the check.)

[peergin]

I have had exactly the same problems as the OP:

1. Chiangmai: unauthorised charges whilst I had used my credit card only at a hypermarket on the Chiangmai-Lampang highway (the one that was sold to a new owner and now has a different name) and at the private hospital with the short name. I informed both companies by registered letters, addressed to management, but never received any reaction….. Subsequent telephone enquiries revealed that nobody knew anything about this matter. I think it was done by staff at the two companies. The total amount involved was nearly B 30,000.

2. Luxembourg: that was probably done by a company, not by an individual member of the staff because I found many complaints of identical theft on the Internet committed by the same company (and by its 2 dozen subsidiaries). They were (are?) VOIP providers in Luxembourg which could not be contacted by phone, postal mail or Internet. Some of the companies' customers lost thousands of US$. In my case the parent company made a purchase at an Apple store in Luxembourg City and used my credit card. (The VOIP parent company had my credit card details because I was a customer there.) Having posted this story on Thai Visa I received a quick Personal Message from the company offering to refund the money. That was a clear admission of guilt!

[peergin]

I have had exactly the same problems as the OP:

.

1. Chiangmai: unauthorised charges whilst I had used my credit card only at a hypermarket on the Chiangmai-Lampang highway (the one that was sold to a new owner and now has a different name) and at the private hospital with the short name. I informed both companies by registered letters, addressed to management, but never received any reaction….. Subsequent telephone enquiries revealed that nobody knew anything about this matter. I think it was done by staff at the two companies. The total amount involved was nearly B 30,000.

.

2. Luxembourg: that was probably done by a company, not by an individual member of the staff because I found many complaints of identical theft on the Internet committed by the same company (and by its 2 dozen subsidiaries). They were (are?) VOIP providers in Luxembourg which could not be contacted by phone, postal mail or Internet. Some of the companies' customers lost thousands of US$. In my case the parent company made a purchase at an Apple store in Luxembourg City and used my credit card. (The VOIP parent company had my credit card details because I was a customer there.) Having posted this story on Thai Visa I received a quick Personal Message from the company offering to refund the money. That was a clear admission of guilt!

Edited May 23, 2016 by peergin

[peergin]

FolkGuitar:

Thank you for your useful post. I have already added my comment (post # 58) because I have some identical experiences including in Chiangmai.

However, I would like to ask you about the anti-skimming plates which you mentioned:

1, Can you please let me know where I can buy these?

2. Do you know whether these plates shield the body from the cellphone’s harmful emissions?

Many thanks.

[Mark123456]

I always use cash everywhere for shopping, never understood why people don't ....glad I do after reading your OP. Only use C/C for booking flights, wish I didn't have to though.

It's easier to pay with a card. I don't understand why people waste time withdrawing cash from an ATM when they could just pay for their purchases with a debit card. I rarely use cash nowadays - can't be bothered.