Boris Johnson shrugs off Europe’s shock at top diplomatic job

[GAZZPA]

There won't be any restrictions on EU citizens entering the country if we want to stay in the single market. We simply don't have the leverage to insist on that.

I feel sorry for those duped into voting for something they were never going to get.

Thats true, but Britain will be in a position to manage its own laws.

Truth be told the UK could have done more to control immigration on its own. But thats not the only reason people voted to leave. Don't underestimate peoples ability to reason, and the key issue is that the EU is not working, mass unemployment, slow growth, indebted member states, its not good. Also it controls 60% of Britain's laws and this is only going to increase, it is moving toward a federal state governed by a central body dominated by Germany.

Immigration is one issue of many and I think most people understood this.

[GAZZPA]

In such political delegates roughly demagogues we will not go further.

With this kind of representative, sure that Europeans will respect you tomorrow Brits ...

Don't think the Brits give 2 sh*ts about having EU respect.

There were very stupid messages in the Brexit campaign it has to be said. But, we are where we are.

[dick dasterdly]

There won't be any restrictions on EU citizens entering the country if we want to stay in the single market. We simply don't have the leverage to insist on that.

I feel sorry for those duped into voting for something they were never going to get.

Thats true, but Britain will be in a position to manage its own laws.

Truth be told the UK could have done more to control immigration on its own. But thats not the only reason people voted to leave. Don't underestimate peoples ability to reason, and the key issue is that the EU is not working, mass unemployment, slow growth, indebted member states, its not good. Also it controls 60% of Britain's laws and this is only going to increase, it is moving toward a federal state governed by a central body dominated by Germany.

Immigration is one issue of many and I think most people understood this.

We all have our own opinions as to why so many voted to leave the EU, but even the remainers are saying that it was because of immigration.

My own opinion is that those who voted 'leave' would not be happy unless uncontrolled immigration is stopped.

Nobody has a problem with those in well-paid jobs being granted visas to work in the UK - its the many unskilled people entering the UK and cutting wages for the Brit. poor that has annoyed them enough to ignore politicians warnings, and vote brexit regardless.

Edited July 15, 2016 by dick dasterdly

[GAZZPA]

The Clarkson of politics. Welcome to the 'no-one likes us, we don't care' era of British history.

Yep, get the flag waving.

Why should the Brits care what the EU thinks of them? What if Holland leave next, and then someone else and someone else, are (what's left of) the EU going to hate everyone?

It does not matter, what matters is what deal can be done to benefit everyone. thats all, then leave Britain to manage it's own laws and International trade.

Hooorahh!

[GAZZPA]

There won't be any restrictions on EU citizens entering the country if we want to stay in the single market. We simply don't have the leverage to insist on that.

I feel sorry for those duped into voting for something they were never going to get.

Thats true, but Britain will be in a position to manage its own laws.

Truth be told the UK could have done more to control immigration on its own. But thats not the only reason people voted to leave. Don't underestimate peoples ability to reason, and the key issue is that the EU is not working, mass unemployment, slow growth, indebted member states, its not good. Also it controls 60% of Britain's laws and this is only going to increase, it is moving toward a federal state governed by a central body dominated by Germany.

Immigration is one issue of many and I think most people understood this.

We all have our own opinions as to why so many voted to leave the EU, but even the remainers are saying that it was because of immigration.

My own opinion is that those who voted 'leave' would not be happy unless uncontrolled immigration is stopped.

Nobody has a problem with those in well-paid jobs being granted visas to work in the UK - its the many unskilled people entering the UK and cutting wages for the Brit. poor that has annoyed them enough to ignore politicians warnings, and vote brexit regardless.

That's fair enough but isn't it better that the freedom of movement is maintained but Britain manages it's own laws to manage who can stay and how? I don't agree that foreigners necessarily push down the wages, at the end of the day you can't stop companies paying a salary (that is legally above minimal wage) for the positions they have available. If the polish (for example) can come and work in Britain and survive on the salaries then the Brits will have to compete, simple as that.

The days when a bricklayer can command 400 quid a day are gone, long gone. A friend of mine used to be in the building trade, he earned as much money as a company executive for laying bricks! He didn't mind but it just was not sustainable, that was nearly 20 years ago mind you.

Might be tough but that's the way it is.

International and EU competition drives prices down, always has and always will and the Worlds not going to change.

At the moment Britain have almost zero control over anything.

[Humberstone]

There's no such thing as a 'win win' in a negotiation. In all negotiated deals both parties walk away unsatisfied, that's what will happen with Brexit.

[dick dasterdly]

There won't be any restrictions on EU citizens entering the country if we want to stay in the single market. We simply don't have the leverage to insist on that.

I feel sorry for those duped into voting for something they were never going to get.

Thats true, but Britain will be in a position to manage its own laws.

Truth be told the UK could have done more to control immigration on its own. But thats not the only reason people voted to leave. Don't underestimate peoples ability to reason, and the key issue is that the EU is not working, mass unemployment, slow growth, indebted member states, its not good. Also it controls 60% of Britain's laws and this is only going to increase, it is moving toward a federal state governed by a central body dominated by Germany.

Immigration is one issue of many and I think most people understood this.

We all have our own opinions as to why so many voted to leave the EU, but even the remainers are saying that it was because of immigration.

My own opinion is that those who voted 'leave' would not be happy unless uncontrolled immigration is stopped.

Nobody has a problem with those in well-paid jobs being granted visas to work in the UK - its the many unskilled people entering the UK and cutting wages for the Brit. poor that has annoyed them enough to ignore politicians warnings, and vote brexit regardless.

That's fair enough but isn't it better that the freedom of movement is maintained but Britain manages it's own laws to manage who can stay and how? I don't agree that foreigners necessarily push down the wages, at the end of the day you can't stop companies paying a salary (that is legally above minimal wage) for the positions they have available. If the polish (for example) can come and work in Britain and survive on the salaries then the Brits will have to compete, simple as that.

The days when a bricklayer can command 400 quid a day are gone, long gone. A friend of mine used to be in the building trade, he earned as much money as a company executive for laying bricks! He didn't mind but it just was not sustainable, that was nearly 20 years ago mind you.

Might be tough but that's the way it is.

International and EU competition drives prices down, always has and always will and the Worlds not going to change.

At the moment Britain have almost zero control over anything.

And that's where we disagree because I have no doubt that uncontrolled immigration from the EU has lowered wages for those at the bottom of the heap.

It appears that those at the bottom of the heap agree with me.

Yes, this started long before uncontrolled immigration became a factor as companies came up with 're-structuring' to lower salaries.

Uncontrolled immigration (and outsourced jobs in India and the like) has just been the final straw for the working class IMO that resulted in the referendum vote.

Edited July 15, 2016 by dick dasterdly

[Guest]

Why is the UK going to lose on this deal? You don't know that, I suspect they will come out in a similar position they are today with EU trade and in a better position for governing themselves and International trade.

Time will tell, but I see it could be a bright future for Britain once all the dust settles and people sit around a table to negotiate the deals.

You are correct. The future will show how this turns out. One of the most important indicators for me would be the unemployment rate. What it's now and what it's in the future. Both in EU and in UK.

I think the expectations what the brexitters had are not in sync what the result of the negotiations will be. Restrict the free movement to UK (while hoping to have free movement outside). Being able to be part of the single market, without the duties what it brings along. Being able to catch fish without concern of others in the region..

It's just not what EU would want and UK can't simply dictate the rules of the deal, which some brexitters might have expected.

The biggest losers are going to be the British politicians. No longer they can blame EU of their lack of incompetence of running the country. Now they have to take the responsibilities which comes with the powers. There is no longer a big brother to blame, unless of course they'll start putting the blame to UN or other instances.

This should be good for the people of UK as the political field might get rid of the least capable politicians.

[dick dasterdly]

Why is the UK going to lose on this deal? You don't know that, I suspect they will come out in a similar position they are today with EU trade and in a better position for governing themselves and International trade.

Time will tell, but I see it could be a bright future for Britain once all the dust settles and people sit around a table to negotiate the deals.

You are correct. The future will show how this turns out. One of the most important indicators for me would be the unemployment rate. What it's now and what it's in the future. Both in EU and in UK.

I think the expectations what the brexitters had are not in sync what the result of the negotiations will be. Restrict the free movement to UK (while hoping to have free movement outside). Being able to be part of the single market, without the duties what it brings along. Being able to catch fish without concern of others in the region..

It's just not what EU would want and UK can't simply dictate the rules of the deal, which some brexitters might have expected.

The biggest losers are going to be the British politicians. No longer they can blame EU of their lack of incompetence of running the country. Now they have to take the responsibilities which comes with the powers. There is no longer a big brother to blame, unless of course they'll start putting the blame to UN or other instances.

This should be good for the people of UK as the political field might get rid of the least capable politicians.

Will that be a yet another 'new and improved' unemployment calculation'?

One thing I've learned is that unemployment rates are frequently changed to ensure they don't reflect true unemployment rates. The true rate would reflect badly on governments.

[Guest]

Will that be a yet another 'new and improved' unemployment calculation'?

One thing I've learned is that unemployment rates are frequently changed to ensure they don't reflect true unemployment rates. The true rate would reflect badly on governments.

Then calculate the number of people of between ages of 20-67 who are employed.

[bkkcanuck8]

Clever move by May, having the brexiters doing the brexiting. Despite many thinking he's a bumbling buffoon, he's very switched on and a shrewd operator. He's also a good salesmen and will either have folk on their toes or eating out of his hand.

May is just hedging her bets. By putting Boris, Davis and Fox in charge of the Brexit team she is saying " go and do what you have been promising during the campaign ". If they succeed great y the fail as I suppose they will then she can say she gave them a chance and tell the people that a soft Brexit is the best option. All bases covered.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Fair assumption, except that they will fail. i dont think they or Britain will fail striking a deal, neither side can afford for that to happen. The EU can play the big, hard stance as much as they want, fact is the EU is going to be considerably weaker so they at least must have Britain in a free trade agreement. if they are stupid enough to push them out or try to it will backfire from within, if they do a deal and Britain turn out ok it may motivate others to leave,, Britain has a good chance of succeeding, the EU has a no win situation in my book if it doesn't do a deal.

I agree there will be a deal but it won't be a hard Brexit. I don't agree with the assumption that the EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU or vice versa. They need each other mutually. When May says "Brexit means Brexit" what does that mean anyway? Brexit was never defined in detail during the campaign and can be sold in many ways.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Brexit is Britain exiting the EU membership, hence he . Pretty clearly defined in my book. The referendum was that simple "leave or stay". What else could it possibly mean.

It could mean staying in the Single market or not it could mean accepting free labour movement or restricted or total control or borders. The parameters were never set.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The referendum question was clear and the options were clear - but the majority of the leave side apparently (and the remain side) seem not to be able to read or understand English. The options were leave or stay - not negotiate a free trade agreement; not stand in the door picking one's nose; not whinge about not being treated fairly after one has left.... just... leave period.

[SoiBiker]

It also didn't say 'kick all the foreigners out' or 'take back the country' (whatever that means) - but a lot of people seem to think that's what they voted for.

[uptheos]

Every attack in France pushes Marine Le Pen closer to power and she too wants to Frexit, the EU will break up.

Boris will be OK, he's intelligent, speaks several languages and did two terms as Mayor of London.

He just needs to put his diplomat hat on.

Not much he can do about a lorry being driven into a crowd, a new tactic as even if it was stopped and searched it would be OK

You can't always guess that the driver is a killer

[Baerboxer]

Attempts at bulling and sour grapes will last for a couple of years until the politicians in Europe are forced to wake up and find that many of their own people also want out of the EU. I am proud to be British just like a German is proud to be German and an Italian Italian etc. We all want to retain our national identity and none of us want to be lumped together as 'Europeans'

Boris will do fine and one day in the future I think he will still be Prime Minister.

I don't particularly like Boris. His clowning, peculiar attempts at humor and general "act" are an acquired taste. But he did win a scholarship for Oxford, obtain a 2:1 and was twice voted Lord Mayor of London. Whether he makes a success as Foreign Secretary remains to be seen.

However, <deleted> are these arrogant French and German politicians to make such remarks. The French FM is right, Boris did lie and was caught lying. So have a considerable number of French presidents, senior French politicians and bureaucrats and one's who went on to head international bodies like the IMF. Plagued with sex scandals and corruption allegations. Perhaps he'd better look to his own backyard first. As for the Germans, Merkel opened the floodgates to Europe for illegal economic migrants, not just her own country; then tried to get out of it by forcing a quota system on other countries as if she is president of Europe; then closing the German borders whilst chastising others for doing the same thing and still refuses to apologies or even admit she made a mistake. One of her senior colleagues said "elections should not be allowed to change things" and several German MP's had to resign for cheating to get PhD's. Now their Defense Minister applauds Brexit and says she can move a EU Army and Military forward - why bother with an EU member vote, Germany has decided and their puppet EU president and his commission will rubber stamp whatever Merkel dictates. I seriously hope the AfD win the next elections and give the German people the referendum they now deserve. Most Germans I know deserve better than Merkel and the totalitarian EU super reich she and her cronies plan for Europe.

The French FM did actually come up with a good idea. He suggested the EU needed to revisit it's vision, mission and put options to all EU citizens to get consensus on what people really wanted for the future. Needless to say that no one has shown any interest in that. Merkel, Hollande, Juncker - all believe they know what is best for the people and that democracy, transparency, accountability, tradition, culture, and sovereignty aren't on that list.

The EU is being driven in a direction the neo-liberal left wing want it to be; dominated by bureaucrats they appoint to make sure those with other political views are effectively neutered. Britain, for all it's faults stood against that and is now being reviled by those who have been pushing for so long for that to happen. Without Britain, and unless there are changes in Germany and France, that will happen. Europe will become the next socialist failure as every single previous socialist project has failed.

[Guest]

Every attack in France pushes Marine Le Pen closer to power and she too wants to Frexit, the EU will break up.

And yet, there are others, who think the opposite.

"At times like this, I feel more European than ever."

Even before this attack there has been signs of antipopulist movement in France. I hope this ideology learned from diving gains more ground in EU.

Stop, Breath, Think, Act.

[Johnyo]

Clever move by May, having the brexiters doing the brexiting. Despite many thinking he's a bumbling buffoon, he's very switched on and a shrewd operator. He's also a good salesmen and will either have folk on their toes or eating out of his hand.

May is just hedging her bets. By putting Boris, Davis and Fox in charge of the Brexit team she is saying " go and do what you have been promising during the campaign ". If they succeed great y the fail as I suppose they will then she can say she gave them a chance and tell the people that a soft Brexit is the best option. All bases covered.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Fair assumption, except that they will fail. i dont think they or Britain will fail striking a deal, neither side can afford for that to happen. The EU can play the big, hard stance as much as they want, fact is the EU is going to be considerably weaker so they at least must have Britain in a free trade agreement. if they are stupid enough to push them out or try to it will backfire from within, if they do a deal and Britain turn out ok it may motivate others to leave,, Britain has a good chance of succeeding, the EU has a no win situation in my book if it doesn't do a deal.

I agree there will be a deal but it won't be a hard Brexit. I don't agree with the assumption that the EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU or vice versa. They need each other mutually. When May says "Brexit means Brexit" what does that mean anyway? Brexit was never defined in detail during the campaign and can be sold in many ways.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Brexit is Britain exiting the EU membership, hence he . Pretty clearly defined in my book. The referendum was that simple "leave or stay". What else could it possibly mean.

It could mean staying in the Single market or not it could mean accepting free labour movement or restricted or total control or borders. The parameters were never set.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The referendum question was clear and the options were clear - but the majority of the leave side apparently (and the remain side) seem not to be able to read or understand English. The options were leave or stay - not negotiate a free trade agreement; not stand in the door picking one's nose; not whinge about not being treated fairly after one has left.... just... leave period.

Not going to happen.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[bkkcanuck8]

Boris will be OK, he's intelligent, speaks several languages and did two terms as Mayor of London.

Besides, if he screws things up he can always move to the US (he announced plans in 2015 to renounce US citizenship but I can find nothing after that - it would have been easy to prove it if he had).

Note: He announced plans to renounce citizenship over capital gains taxes IRS "requested" (US citizens are taxed on worldwide income.....he paid them but announced his intention to renounce citizenship over taxes.... what is more American than that.... Trump threatened to move to Florida over taxes... cricket, cricket

Edited July 15, 2016 by bkkcanuck8

[Guest]

Besides, if he screws things up he can always move to the US (he announced plans in 2015 to renounce US citizenship but I can find nothing after that - it would have been easy to prove it if he had).

Note: He announced plans to renounce citizenship over capital gains taxes IRS "requested" (US citizens are taxed on worldwide income.....he paid them but announced his intention to renounce citizenship over taxes.... what is more American than that.... Trump threatened to move to Florida over taxes... cricket, cricket

He would be the perfect VP candidate for Trump. Both share the same ideologies and they even look the same. Blond hair, blue/gray eyes, white skin.

Together they could kick all the folks without those qualities out of the country.

[dunroaming]

Johnson is seen as a liar and a buffoon by many in the world and his appointment could well backfire on a Britain that is trying to heal the wounds of Brexit. On the other hand he now has to deal with the chaos that he was instrumental in causing. not only in Europe but also elsewhere where he has managed to insult many senior political figures. Fortunately he will not be directly involved in negotiations concerning any deals that can be done concerning brexit as others with more common sense will try to do that.

I am happy to eat humble pie if he manages to ingratiate himself with our allies and foreign friends and re-build relationships.

[MobileContent]

All this talk the UK is going to loose is plain rubbish.

If the EU or even Merkel try to play games the UK can just warn the European car industry that they will collect high tariffs on EU made cars or any European products and in no time the EU industry/companies will have a serious talk to the guys and gals that control Berlin and Paris.

[happy Joe]

Every attack in France pushes Marine Le Pen closer to power and she too wants to Frexit, the EU will break up...

As in the UK, the French like to pose the threat of extremists on the established parties.

But they are not stupid enough to put them in control...

[Johnyo]

All this talk the UK is going to loose is plain rubbish.

If the EU or even Merkel try to play games the UK can just warn the European car industry that they will collect high tariffs on EU made cars or any European products and in no time the EU industry/companies will have a serious talk to the guys and gals that control Berlin and Paris.

It will be interesting when they finally sit down and negotiate.

The EU does have the financial services trump card to play and as you say the UK has the fact that it imports a lot of goods from Europe so European manufacturers would not want to lose that market. Where the UK has a distinct disadvantage is in manufacturing as lot of it is foreign owned and I cant see a second Golden Age suddenly appearing out of thin air as such much emphasis has gone into services since Thatcher destroyed any industry that was left. Lets not forget that when the UK was an indutrialised powerhouse the British Empire conquered colonies and they supplied their raw materials to the UK at rock bottom dollar and bought them back as value added products refined and manufactured in England. Crucial to the system is that the colonies weren't allowed to do the profitable bits on pain of violent subjugation. I would surmise that the Americans, Canadians, Australians, Irish, Kiwis and Indians are unlikely to fall for it a second time around. So without the Financial Services industry the GDP could seriously suffer. I have no doubt that in the end the UK will keep the Financial services in London, that the Germans will sell their cars to the UK and a deal that suits all will be made. The price to pay for all this will be free labour movement, maybe with some restrictions and a hefty contribution to the EU coffers.

[Scott]

A post with an oversized graphic has been removed.

[GAZZPA]

Clever move by May, having the brexiters doing the brexiting. Despite many thinking he's a bumbling buffoon, he's very switched on and a shrewd operator. He's also a good salesmen and will either have folk on their toes or eating out of his hand.

May is just hedging her bets. By putting Boris, Davis and Fox in charge of the Brexit team she is saying " go and do what you have been promising during the campaign ". If they succeed great y the fail as I suppose they will then she can say she gave them a chance and tell the people that a soft Brexit is the best option. All bases covered.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Fair assumption, except that they will fail. i dont think they or Britain will fail striking a deal, neither side can afford for that to happen. The EU can play the big, hard stance as much as they want, fact is the EU is going to be considerably weaker so they at least must have Britain in a free trade agreement. if they are stupid enough to push them out or try to it will backfire from within, if they do a deal and Britain turn out ok it may motivate others to leave,, Britain has a good chance of succeeding, the EU has a no win situation in my book if it doesn't do a deal.

I agree there will be a deal but it won't be a hard Brexit. I don't agree with the assumption that the EU needs the UK more than the UK needs the EU or vice versa. They need each other mutually. When May says "Brexit means Brexit" what does that mean anyway? Brexit was never defined in detail during the campaign and can be sold in many ways.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Brexit is Britain exiting the EU membership, hence he . Pretty clearly defined in my book. The referendum was that simple "leave or stay". What else could it possibly mean.

It could mean staying in the Single market or not it could mean accepting free labour movement or restricted or total control or borders. The parameters were never set.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The referendum question was clear and the options were clear - but the majority of the leave side apparently (and the remain side) seem not to be able to read or understand English. The options were leave or stay - not negotiate a free trade agreement; not stand in the door picking one's nose; not whinge about not being treated fairly after one has left.... just... leave period.

Not going to happen.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It certainly will happen, article 50 in the next 4 to 5 months.

[GAZZPA]

All this talk the UK is going to loose is plain rubbish.

If the EU or even Merkel try to play games the UK can just warn the European car industry that they will collect high tariffs on EU made cars or any European products and in no time the EU industry/companies will have a serious talk to the guys and gals that control Berlin and Paris.

It will be interesting when they finally sit down and negotiate.

The EU does have the financial services trump card to play and as you say the UK has the fact that it imports a lot of goods from Europe so European manufacturers would not want to lose that market. Where the UK has a distinct disadvantage is in manufacturing as lot of it is foreign owned and I cant see a second Golden Age suddenly appearing out of thin air as such much emphasis has gone into services since Thatcher destroyed any industry that was left. Lets not forget that when the UK was an indutrialised powerhouse the British Empire conquered colonies and they supplied their raw materials to the UK at rock bottom dollar and bought them back as value added products refined and manufactured in England. Crucial to the system is that the colonies weren't allowed to do the profitable bits on pain of violent subjugation. I would surmise that the Americans, Canadians, Australians, Irish, Kiwis and Indians are unlikely to fall for it a second time around. So without the Financial Services industry the GDP could seriously suffer. I have no doubt that in the end the UK will keep the Financial services in London, that the Germans will sell their cars to the UK and a deal that suits all will be made. The price to pay for all this will be free labour movement, maybe with some restrictions and a hefty contribution to the EU coffers.

You do know that the Brits do not consider themselves to be empire builders anymore right? Also, London isn't foggy, Jack the Ripper is no longer in the news, nobody drinks tea on the lawn, croquet is not popular and I have never met the Queen.

As for manufacturing, well just about every Western nation has sold their shirt on that one, China is indeed the Worlds factory.

I think the Britain and everything else will be the same as you say, don't believe that the contribution will be anything to worry about, it certainly can't be as big as EU membership so who cares.

[GAZZPA]

Every attack in France pushes Marine Le Pen closer to power and she too wants to Frexit, the EU will break up...

As in the UK, the French like to pose the threat of extremists on the established parties.

But they are not stupid enough to put them in control...

They don't need to be in control to force a referendum.

[GAZZPA]

Johnson is seen as a liar and a buffoon by many in the world and his appointment could well backfire on a Britain that is trying to heal the wounds of Brexit. On the other hand he now has to deal with the chaos that he was instrumental in causing. not only in Europe but also elsewhere where he has managed to insult many senior political figures. Fortunately he will not be directly involved in negotiations concerning any deals that can be done concerning brexit as others with more common sense will try to do that.

I am happy to eat humble pie if he manages to ingratiate himself with our allies and foreign friends and re-build relationships.

I'll start baking your pie.

[wombat1943]

Attempts at bulling and sour grapes will last for a couple of years until the politicians in Europe are forced to wake up and find that many of their own people also want out of the EU. I am proud to be British just like a German is proud to be German and an Italian Italian etc. We all want to retain our national identity and none of us want to be lumped together as 'Europeans'

Boris will do fine and one day in the future I think he will still be Prime Minister.

I don't particularly like Boris. His clowning, peculiar attempts at humor and general "act" are an acquired taste. But he did win a scholarship for Oxford, obtain a 2:1 and was twice voted Lord Mayor of London. Whether he makes a success as Foreign Secretary remains to be seen.

However, <deleted> are these arrogant French and German politicians to make such remarks. The French FM is right, Boris did lie and was caught lying. So have a considerable number of French presidents, senior French politicians and bureaucrats and one's who went on to head international bodies like the IMF. Plagued with sex scandals and corruption allegations. Perhaps he'd better look to his own backyard first. As for the Germans, Merkel opened the floodgates to Europe for illegal economic migrants, not just her own country; then tried to get out of it by forcing a quota system on other countries as if she is president of Europe; then closing the German borders whilst chastising others for doing the same thing and still refuses to apologies or even admit she made a mistake. One of her senior colleagues said "elections should not be allowed to change things" and several German MP's had to resign for cheating to get PhD's. Now their Defense Minister applauds Brexit and says she can move a EU Army and Military forward - why bother with an EU member vote, Germany has decided and their puppet EU president and his commission will rubber stamp whatever Merkel dictates. I seriously hope the AfD win the next elections and give the German people the referendum they now deserve. Most Germans I know deserve better than Merkel and the totalitarian EU super reich she and her cronies plan for Europe.

The French FM did actually come up with a good idea. He suggested the EU needed to revisit it's vision, mission and put options to all EU citizens to get consensus on what people really wanted for the future. Needless to say that no one has shown any interest in that. Merkel, Hollande, Juncker - all believe they know what is best for the people and that democracy, transparency, accountability, tradition, culture, and sovereignty aren't on that list.

The EU is being driven in a direction the neo-liberal left wing want it to be; dominated by bureaucrats they appoint to make sure those with other political views are effectively neutered. Britain, for all it's faults stood against that and is now being reviled by those who have been pushing for so long for that to happen. Without Britain, and unless there are changes in Germany and France, that will happen. Europe will become the next socialist failure as every single previous socialist project has failed.

[wombat1943]

Attempts at bulling and sour grapes will last for a couple of years until the politicians in Europe are forced to wake up and find that many of their own people also want out of the EU. I am proud to be British just like a German is proud to be German and an Italian Italian etc. We all want to retain our national identity and none of us want to be lumped together as 'Europeans'

Boris will do fine and one day in the future I think he will still be Prime Minister.

I don't particularly like Boris. His clowning, peculiar attempts at humor and general "act" are an acquired taste. But he did win a scholarship for Oxford, obtain a 2:1 and was twice voted Lord Mayor of London. Whether he makes a success as Foreign Secretary remains to be seen.

However, <deleted> are these arrogant French and German politicians to make such remarks. The French FM is right, Boris did lie and was caught lying. So have a considerable number of French presidents, senior French politicians and bureaucrats and one's who went on to head international bodies like the IMF. Plagued with sex scandals and corruption allegations. Perhaps he'd better look to his own backyard first. As for the Germans, Merkel opened the floodgates to Europe for illegal economic migrants, not just her own country; then tried to get out of it by forcing a quota system on other countries as if she is president of Europe; then closing the German borders whilst chastising others for doing the same thing and still refuses to apologies or even admit she made a mistake. One of her senior colleagues said "elections should not be allowed to change things" and several German MP's had to resign for cheating to get PhD's. Now their Defense Minister applauds Brexit and says she can move a EU Army and Military forward - why bother with an EU member vote, Germany has decided and their puppet EU president and his commission will rubber stamp whatever Merkel dictates. I seriously hope the AfD win the next elections and give the German people the referendum they now deserve. Most Germans I know deserve better than Merkel and the totalitarian EU super reich she and her cronies plan for Europe.

The French FM did actually come up with a good idea. He suggested the EU needed to revisit it's vision, mission and put options to all EU citizens to get consensus on what people really wanted for the future. Needless to say that no one has shown any interest in that. Merkel, Hollande, Juncker - all believe they know what is best for the people and that democracy, transparency, accountability, tradition, culture, and sovereignty aren't on that list.

The EU is being driven in a direction the neo-liberal left wing want it to be; dominated by bureaucrats they appoint to make sure those with other political views are effectively neutered. Britain, for all it's faults stood against that and is now being reviled by those who have been pushing for so long for that to happen. Without Britain, and unless there are changes in Germany and France, that will happen. Europe will become the next socialist failure as every single previous socialist project has failed.

Thank you Baerboxer for the best post of many pages. I happen to like BJ - he at least make the news interesting to read. A surprising, courageous and I think good decision by Ms. May. The world and particularly the media are controlled by the "politically correct" Gestapo - Boris is the other side of the coin. Interesting few months ahead. Good luck BJ!

[Mr Moo]

Wonderful Boris! To have the level of criticism and vitriol leveled at one, particularly when it comes from France and Germany, one should wear that with a badge of distinction.

You are spot on. It is really Germany and France that wants a United Europe.

Let's qualify that - Germany sees itself at the head of a Europe in which it is the predominant economic force, and therefore calls the shots. France sees itself as the natural leader of Europe, and rather likes (and needs) the Germans money. The UK doesn't and really never has fitted into their ideas.

What we have done, which they find unforgivable, is by deciding to leave, opening up that same possibility to the very significant Eurosceptic constituencies amongst the other 27 members.

Hence the vitriol from so many European politicians.

Whose next?

Wait till one of the big southern countries goes bust...

Here's the proof:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/683739/EU-referendum-German-French-European-superstate-Brexit