realistically how long can I stay in Thailand long-term doing visa runs

[BBreinlig]

Hello everybody!

 

If the problem I will mention in this topic was discussed before anywhere here, then I'm sorry, but I just cou;dn't find anything that would address my issue.

 

I'm from a European Union (Schengen) country, but not any of G7 and below 50 yo, I work remotely as an IT Project Manager. I came to Asia 8 months ago; I got visa on arrival 4 times, two of them I have extended for another 30 days. I feel like I want to move in to Thailand now and rent out an apartment (for which most of landlords require at least 1 year contract), but after reading tens of articles on possible non-immigrant visas I come to a sad conclusion that none of them allows me (is suitable for me) to stay legally in Thailand for a longer period of time like I wish to. 

 

Given all that I wanted to ask for how long realistically I can be getting 6 months tourist visas by going abroad every 3 months to a consulate in an adjacent country? I heard stories about guys doing it for 6 or 9 years without any major problems apart from sporadically answering a couple of questions on the purpose of stay at a Thai consulate abroad, but could this really work out like this? It kindss of makes me insecure that I will rent out an apartment here and onee day I might be denied entry to Thailand and getting back to my apartment, my friends, my girlfriend and my life as whole basically.

Does any of you have experience in this field? Do you think it's feasible to live like this in Thailand? How does it work for you? Any problems so far? Any feeddback welcomed.

 

 

[ubonjoe]

There are not many options for you. Trying to stay indefinitely by getting tourist visa is not a good option.

If you can afford to pay for 500k baht to get a multiple entry visa that allows unlimited 1 year entries for 5 years the Thai Elite program might be a good option. See the pinned topic about it at the top of page one of this forum.

[BBreinlig]

What about these guys that are doing it for a couple of years already? Or is it just a matter of luck?

[aquario33]

In Chiangmai there is a good chance to stay on a Volunteer Visa , for at least 21 months. (costs approx. 33k THB)

Its a organization which is helping underprivileged kids , in rural areas mostly. If you need some details please right me  private message.

Another chance of course would be learning thai language, tho im not sure exactly what the regulations are since the military changed the rules a while ago. This so called NON IMM  ED visa would be possible to at least stretch for 2 years , probably longer but it seems there are stricter controls due many foreigners abusing it and there is also no work permit available based on it.

 

 

 

[futsukayoi]

55 minutes ago, aquario33 said:

In Chiangmai there is a good chance to stay on a Volunteer Visa , for at least 21 months. (costs approx. 33k THB)

Its a organization which is helping underprivileged kids , in rural areas mostly. If you need some details please right me  private message.

Another chance of course would be learning thai language, tho im not sure exactly what the regulations are since the military changed the rules a while ago. This so called NON IMM  ED visa would be possible to at least stretch for 2 years , probably longer but it seems there are stricter controls due many foreigners abusing it and there is also no work permit available based on it.

 

 

 

 

At least here in Samui they have been clamping down on the Thai school visa factories.  To retain the student visa most of the schools are getting fairly strict about you having to turn up to class.  Of course if you plan to be here long term investing some time learning Thai might be a good option.

 

[thaitero]

OP, You are asking something nobody can give definite answer. Things are getting tougher to live on touristvisas, exempt entries and extensions to these but it is still doable. When it is going to stop, nobody knows..

 

I have 3 years to go when i hit 50 and living about this way. I am not worried but that is because i have a temporary exitplan. I suggest you have one too and it is also good to check discussionforums just before your borderjumps..

Edited August 21, 2016 by thaitero

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, BBreinlig said:

What about these guys that are doing it for a couple of years already? Or is it just a matter of luck?

Things changed a lot last year when the METV started. Not being able to get 2 or 3 entry visa at a location within the region makes it harder now.

If a person could make a trip home once a year to get a METV they could probably stay long term without a big problem. Getting a METV can allow a total stay of almost 9 months. After that a single entry tourist from a nearby location would make it a almost a year. Then get another METV back home start the year again.

[JackThompson]

I have been living here (but not working) on Tourist Visas for over a year, and most of two previous years.  I would not make a bet on what the future will bring, but here is the current process:

 

1. Only use Tourist Visas - not exempts.

2. Spread out your Tourist Visas from different consulates, as each consulate has its own rules for how many they will give you.  Figure a cost of 30K to 40K Baht/yr for these visas and runs, depending on your means of travel and accommodations.

3. After you have reached the limits of nearby consulates, obtain a new passport from your home-country (it will likely be nearly full of stamps / stickers at this point).  This resets the count at the local consulates.  The consulate-limits are not based on any laws, so you are not breaking / circumventing any laws by doing this.  Starting from a 'clean' passport, figure 1 TV from HCMC, Hanoi, or Hong Kong, 3-4 from Laos, 2-3 from Penang (iffy, at the moment), and 2-3 from Phnom Penh.  So every ~2 years you will need to do this.

4a. Stay out for a week or so before re-entering, and also keep abreast of which crossing points are troublesome.  For example, do not attempt re-entry at Poipet, Sadao, and other unfriendly points of entry. 

4b. Although airports are generally considered less likely to reject entry, you could be be detained and sent 'all the way home' at their discretion.  Land border rejections mean only cancelling your last-country exit-stamp or buying a new entry, and returning to plan your next move.

5. Always have 20K Baht to show on entry, and show it at the first sign of questioning, without being asked; recent reports indicate they use "lack of funds" as a reason to deny entry, without actually asking you to show the funds.  I also keep my bank-book with me, showing all my income is transferred from overseas, which makes it more difficult to reject entry based on suspicion of working.

6. Have an exit-plan ready.  In your case, have your minimal necessary things with you at all times, and a plan + friend to ship anything you need from your apartment to you.  You need to be prepared to forfeit your apt-deposit, and possibly some other "left behind" stuff that is not cost-effective to ship.

7. On your visa runs, familiarize yourself with "Plan B" options - such as Phnom Penh and Sihanoukville in Cambodia.  Visas in Cambodia are payable by 1-mo, 3-mo, 6-mo, or 1-year - without any paperwork required, though you may need to spend an extra $100 on a 'work permit' that you never use.  A "Plan B" will offer much peace of mind.

Edited August 21, 2016 by JackThompson
clarification

[IMA_FARANG]

Not everone can aqulify for a volunteer visa.....which although I may be wrong I believe is an Australian thing only.

i am a U.S.  retiree with a government pension paid monthly.

I have a rented apartment in Bangkok with a 3 month contract (not a yearly contract) but i pay my rent each month.

My pension from the U.S. is enough for mr to pay my rent and other momthly living expenses leaving  approximately 60K baht left over each month....the exact amount depends on thr dollar/Baht exchange rateschange rate each month.

Whatever that amount is each month goes into my bank account in Thailand.

At present there is a reasonable chance that i should be able to meet the 500K needed for the Thai elite card by October of 2016...which as I said depends on the exchange rate....which i can not control can I.

Oviously, I am over 50 or i wouldn't be getting a U.S. retirement pension which you need to be 65 years old to apply for.

 

It is posssible.....and I do hope to reach the goal of at least the 500K for the Thai elite card by the end of 2016, (or with some luck in October).

In the meantime, I am not hurting and doing reasonably well where I am right now, and in my present circumstances.

What more can a simple  man ask for, anyhow these crazy days in this crazy world.

 

 

 

Edited August 21, 2016 by IMA_FARANG
dorrect typos

[elviajero]

You should be aware that remote IT work from within Thailand is technically illegal without a work permit. It is currently tolerated by the authorities, and it's highly unlikely that you'd be prosecuted, but most people doing remote work keep it to themselves.

[Plutojames88]

Ever considered two worlds near by?

Cambodia is offering three year visas next month.

 

You could live 2 months in each location off/ on

 

It's one solution 

[BBreinlig]

Thank your for all the advice! I really apreciate it.

 

So the only reason they deny entries is suspicion that Im working illegally in Thailand? What if I'd wave at them with my bank account statement each time they question me that will show lets say 200k THB saying Im coming regularly to Thailand to blow here all my money on tourist attractions, because I inherited a large amount of money? Would that fix all their questioning despite the amount of stamps in my passport?

 

I think I will check JACKTHOMSON's advice while stacking up money for elite card like UBONJOE and IMA_FARANG suggested. It seems that bouncing between Cambodia and Thailand like PLUTOJAMES88 mentioned is not a bad idea, but in this case I'd have to rent out 2 apartments at the same time (2 girlfriends as well?) and everytime one of them would be empty. Perhaps Airbnb could work out here. Anyway I prefer Bangkok much more compering to Phnom Penh.

@IMA_FARANG Can you provide a link to the website you have found this apartment on? The one with 3 months contract.
 

[Maestro]

JackThompson has succinctly posted the two all-important measures to reduce to a minimum the risk for a "perenniel tourist" such as you to be denied entry into Thailand, ie carry with you

1. minimum 20k Baht in cash
2. documentary evidence to show that you are defraying the cost of your touristic stays in Thailand with money brought in from outside Thailand

The importance of the second point must not be underestimated, as I believe you already understand. Make the remittances from a non-Thai bank account in your name to an account in your name in Thailand, make regular cash withdrawals and payments with the debit card.

 

The names and phone numbers of a couple of Thai persons, eg the condominium juristic person manager, your landlord, etc, who are willing to confirm to an immigration officer, if called upon, that they have no reason to believe that you are working in Thailand are also useful. When you are sitting at your computer you are reading and answering your email, updating your blogs, reading the news, browsing websites that interest you, and the like, but never use the word "work" in conversations with anybody, including cohabitants (eg girlfriends) and close friends.

 

Optional but perhaps also useful would be a blog on which you post, with photos, about your touristic exploits in Thailand on evenings or days out in Bangkok and weekend excursions to other parts of the country. Wax enthusiastically about the beauty of the country, the kindness of the Thai people, the variety and excellence of the food, etc.

 

P.S. Add  these numbers to the contact list in your phone:

1178  Immigration Bureau hotline

1676; +66 2 141 9100 Ombudsman 

[Mook23]

i stayed in thailand for 7 years without any problems on TR visas. i simply flew back irregularly to home country 1ce a year and renewed triple entries from local consulate. hassle-free. at official price (no tea money involved). i never bothered to get any TR in regional countries. flying home is easy. i visited friends. did some work (+/- 8 weeks) and had enough to stay another 10 months in LOS legally. i border-ran every 3 months (1 entry = 2 months + 1 30days extension). all border runs were Myanmar. mostly I also actually travelled there then (not just an in-out run).

 

as for the visas: i simply applied for triple entry. added copy of savings. added copy of health insurance. added motivation letter (each time same copy paste letter btw) in which i explain my situation (honest and transparent).

 

locally immigration/police/government folks know me and my situation:

1. is NOT married to Thai.

2. is BELOW 50.

3 is NOT working here.

4. likes to LIVE here.

5. is respected by ALL....

 

never had the slightest issue. even got my DL here on TR visas... which I have to renew each year though.

 

 

[Mook23]

in addition. 1. i never had a contract signed for the house i live in... 2. i never had a local GF/buffalo either

but i think one in LOS and 1 in KHMEN is not a bad idea for some..................................

[eldragon]

I suggest speaking with an attorney who specializes in these types of situations. I've heard of situations where self-employed individuals were able to get a visa and work permit provided they paid taxes on their declared income.

[farang62]

So, you come here and do work,  get paid outside Thailand, pay no taxes.

You have no permanent ties or obligations to Thailand.

No responsibilities, you pay no taxes of any kind.

 

We have several guys in a rented house on tourist visas who play poker on line all night, they usually win 2-300 U.S.D. a night (they play as a team) which is paid into a Visa card in their home country.

 

Using the resources of "The Kingdom" free.

And you can "go away" at anytime with out a problem.

[maewang99]

I read a comment that "technically" it is illegal to do any kind of work for money using a computer, such as this fellow does.  I would have thought that aside from being unenforceable, unless we do get to a "cashless society" which might flip this....  "employment" and "work" in Thailand means doing busy work... IT work, even if it were straight out code writing or fixing for hire... is not busy work and that it overall net brings serious money into Thailand from overseas, that's not busy work stuff like "teaching" English etc. Busy work being activities associated with literacy.... for those who don't code....Zuckerberg Gates and Musk have their book lists not just because it is IP, the same concerns as their own businesses.. it is who they are.

Edited August 22, 2016 by maewang99

[does]

The Thai Elite program sounds good. Did they reduce the price? 500k is less that a retirement visa.

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, does said:

The Thai Elite program sounds good. Did they reduce the price? 500k is less that a retirement visa.

There are several membership options now for Thai Elite now. The 500k baht one is for 5 years.

See here for info: http://www.thailandelite.com/glimpse.php

[oldlakey]

Ubonjoe says in post 7 that you dont have many options

I think he is trying to let you down gently

The only option is the Elite Visa, if you want a guaranteed trouble free long term stay in Thailand

Some people like to live on the edge not good though if you want to put down even semi permanent roots

That would be the only way for me not that I have got 500K knocking around

Good luck

[oldlakey]

1 hour ago, farang62 said:

So, you come here and do work,  get paid outside Thailand, pay no taxes.

You have no permanent ties or obligations to Thailand.

No responsibilities, you pay no taxes of any kind.

 

We have several guys in a rented house on tourist visas who play poker on line all night, they usually win 2-300 U.S.D. a night (they play as a team) which is paid into a Visa card in their home country.

 

Using the resources of "The Kingdom" free.

And you can "go away" at anytime with out a problem.

Sounds good for them

[williamgeorgeallen]

elite is the only full proof option. study visa is a far second best. i would say get a multi entry tourist visa first. come over and test the water. easy to get 6 month rentals or even 3 month ones as there are so many vacant properties and condos around. always go for a 3 month rental if possible. you want to be mobile. bad neighbors can ruin life over here. my mate does monthly rentals on condos in pattaya if you are going there.

[oldlakey]

12 hours ago, Mook23 said:

i stayed in thailand for 7 years without any problems on TR visas. i simply flew back irregularly to home country 1ce a year and renewed triple entries from local consulate. hassle-free. at official price (no tea money involved). i never bothered to get any TR in regional countries. flying home is easy. i visited friends. did some work (+/- 8 weeks) and had enough to stay another 10 months in LOS legally. i border-ran every 3 months (1 entry = 2 months + 1 30days extension). all border runs were Myanmar. mostly I also actually travelled there then (not just an in-out run).

 

as for the visas: i simply applied for triple entry. added copy of savings. added copy of health insurance. added motivation letter (each time same copy paste letter btw) in which i explain my situation (honest and transparent).

 

locally immigration/police/government folks know me and my situation:

1. is NOT married to Thai.

2. is BELOW 50.

3 is NOT working here.

4. likes to LIVE here.

5. is respected by ALL....

 

never had the slightest issue. even got my DL here on TR visas... which I have to renew each year though.

 

 

Good for you, not every body is in such a healthy financial position as yourself

It seems the OP needs gainful employment which can get in the way at times when it comes to enjoying life

Just one other point I can see 1-4 no problem, as for 5 have you got that in writing

[hdkane]

On 8/21/2016 at 8:23 AM, aquario33 said:

In Chiangmai there is a good chance to stay on a Volunteer Visa , for at least 21 months. (costs approx. 33k THB)

Its a organization which is helping underprivileged kids , in rural areas mostly. If you need some details please right me  private message.

Another chance of course would be learning thai language, tho im not sure exactly what the regulations are since the military changed the rules a while ago. This so called NON IMM  ED visa would be possible to at least stretch for 2 years , probably longer but it seems there are stricter controls due many foreigners abusing it and there is also no work permit available based on it.

 

 

 

Thanks for mentioning the volunteer visa...it's an option I had never considered, and a chance to do some good...

[aquario33]

1 hour ago, hdkane said:

Thanks for mentioning the volunteer visa...it's an option I had never considered, and a chance to do some good...

considering costs...far the best option to be honest.21 months is nearby two years, for 33 K THB, not even the ED visa is providing that possibilty.

[TimTang]

22 minutes ago, aquario33 said:

considering costs...far the best option to be honest.21 months is nearby two years, for 33 K THB, not even the ED visa is providing that possibilty.

 

But doesn't that mean you'll be doing some form of volunteer work for nothing the whole time you're in Thailand? What kind of volunteer work are you required to do.

[kokopelli]

3 hours ago, does said:

The Thai Elite program sounds good. Did they reduce the price? 500k is less that a retirement visa.

 Maybe you misunderstand?  The 500 k is a fee you pay for this visa not an amount you retain in your bank account.

[csabo]

21 hours ago, IMA_FARANG said:

Not everone can aqulify for a volunteer visa.....which although I may be wrong I believe is an Australian thing only.

i am a U.S.  retiree with a government pension paid monthly.

I have a rented apartment in Bangkok with a 3 month contract (not a yearly contract) but i pay my rent each month.

My pension from the U.S. is enough for mr to pay my rent and other momthly living expenses leaving  approximately 60K baht left over each month....the exact amount depends on thr dollar/Baht exchange rateschange rate each month.

Whatever that amount is each month goes into my bank account in Thailand.

At present there is a reasonable chance that i should be able to meet the 500K needed for the Thai elite card by October of 2016...which as I said depends on the exchange rate....which i can not control can I.

Oviously, I am over 50 or i wouldn't be getting a U.S. retirement pension which you need to be 65 years old to apply for.

 

It is posssible.....and I do hope to reach the goal of at least the 500K for the Thai elite card by the end of 2016, (or with some luck in October).

In the meantime, I am not hurting and doing reasonably well where I am right now, and in my present circumstances.

What more can a simple  man ask for, anyhow these crazy days in this crazy world.

 

 

 

 

You are over 50 (presumably on a retirement extension but you did not say) and you need to scrape money together to get an Elite Visa?  Why?  I know there are guys over 50 that opt for Elite over Retirement extension but I think part of the reason is they have the disposable income and are willing to pay for luxury.  You obviously don't so please elaborate.

Edited August 22, 2016 by csabo

[aquario33]

54 minutes ago, TimTang said:

 

But doesn't that mean you'll be doing some form of volunteer work for nothing the whole time you're in Thailand? What kind of volunteer work are you required to do.

send me private message if you need details.