Burkini ban suspended by top French court

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.  

[Caps]

2 hours ago, stander said:

The overturning of the ban is only in one region out of the 31 regions and the mayors of those regions are going to uphold the ban.

 

Also Norway's right-wing Progress Party has called for full-body swimsuit to be outlawed

Politician claims that French towns were ;correct' to introduce a ban.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/burkini-ban-norway-france-progress-party-right-wing-islam-swimwear-muslims-a7211271.html

If they don't like it they can always move 

[7by7]

11 minutes ago, stander said:

The question of whether the burkini should be banned or not lies low down my list of concerns. I don't care if it's "hate speech" I don't care if sounds racist - we must destroy the Leftist/Muslim/immigrant alliance's hold on our nation’s political narrative. It is unsustainable

 

Be a good idea if you concentrated on the real problem, which is Islamic terrorism, militantism and radicalisation, instead of demonising the majority of Muslims who simply want to go about their daily lives in peace and are as appalled by the actions of the terrorist etc. as the rest of us; probably more so as it is their religion which the terrorists use to justify their atrocities!

 

Don't bother with the old "if ordinary Muslims don't support the terrorists why don't they demonstrate against them" ballocks. As has been shown countless times in many topics; they do.

 

[stevenl]

34 minutes ago, stander said:

The question of whether the burkini should be banned or not lies low down my list of concerns. I don't care if it's "hate speech" I don't care if sounds racist - we must destroy the Leftist/Muslim/immigrant alliance's hold on our nation’s political narrative. It is unsustainable

It does not only sound racist, it is racist. Or if you want to use a narrow definition of racism you can call it bigotry if you prefer that.

[GuestHouse]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

It does not only sound racist, it is racist. Or if you want to use a narrow definition of racism you can call it bigotry if you prefer that.

 

TVF is fast becoming a rich vein of racist, xenophobic and Islamophobic diatribe.

 

 

All recoverable via internet search engines.

 

 

[Steely Dan]

I wonder whether this thread concerning hurt feelings over a likely discriminatory law has surpassed that for the 84 people in Nice mowed down by a Jihaddist?

 

i don't disprove of vigilantism, nor discrimination. I agree in essence with what Maajid Nawaz wrote about this (Column in the daily Beast if anyone is interested).

 

However I fear we have reached a tipping point where illiberal laws will gain more popular support and voices of moderation will no longer be heard. In other words the clash of civilizations predicted by Samuel Huntington is here, those who brought about the mass immigration from Muslim nations in direct opposition to his recommendations are responsible.

[7by7]

No, those whose bigotry and ignorance means they blame the many for the actions of the few are responsible.

[ClutchClark]

4 minutes ago, stevenl said:

It does not only sound racist, it is racist. Or if you want to use a narrow definition of racism you can call it bigotry if you prefer that.

 

So a country that wants to retain its own cultural identity is not allowed by the PC police? 

 

One World Order, my brother. Amen.

 

One big old homogenized world... Well, not actually...it seems the PC folks are just angry at Western civilizations but could care a less about the injustices that occur in historically muslim countries. Maybe you could fight real injustices around the globe? Maybe you could fight gang rapes in India? Maybe honor killings in Pakistan? Maybe violent crimes against LGBTI's in half the world (notably absent from these Western countries you are so angry at for being "racist"). 

 

But then its alot easier to rail against something as unimportant as whether someone gets to wear a hoodie at the beach or not. Thats the injustice you have chosen to amke a stand on?

[Patsycat]

It doesn't bother me one bit what a woman wears on the beach.

 

The French were going a bit to far to ban the burkini, I feel sorry for the mothers who want to spend a day on the beach with their kids and are harrassed for what they wear.  They are not hurting anyone.

 

And are probably more offended by some dried up old topless woman!!

[Calach]

On the French middle-class average woman, burkini is quite more elegant than usual bikini. I hope this new trend will spread massively. 

[stander]

46 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 

Be a good idea if you concentrated on the real problem, which is Islamic terrorism, militantism and radicalisation, instead of demonising the majority of Muslims who simply want to go about their daily lives in peace and are as appalled by the actions of the terrorist etc. as the rest of us; probably more so as it is their religion which the terrorists use to justify their atrocities!

 

Don't bother with the old "if ordinary Muslims don't support the terrorists why don't they demonstrate against them" ballocks. As has been shown countless times in many topics; they do.

 

"Ordinary" Muslims may or may not have any influence over extremist Muslims, but in wars coming our way "ordinary" Muslims WILL take the side of the extremists.

[Anthony5]

43 minutes ago, stevenl said:

It does not only sound racist, it is racist. Or if you want to use a narrow definition of racism you can call it bigotry if you prefer that.

 

So why don't you try to show your Christian principles in Saudi Arabia, and report back how they respond.

 

Also let us know if that should be called racism and bigotry.

[Naam]

10 minutes ago, stander said:

"Ordinary" Muslims may or may not have any influence over extremist Muslims, but in wars coming our way "ordinary" Muslims WILL take the side of the extremists.

 

utmost, not only silly, but also irrelevant assumption.

[Naam]

36 minutes ago, ClutchClark said:

it seems the PC folks are just angry at Western civilizations but could care a less about the injustices that occur in historically muslim countries.

 

it seems your history knowledge lacks a lot!

[7by7]

49 minutes ago, stevenl said:

It does not only sound racist, it is racist. Or if you want to use a narrow definition of racism you can call it bigotry if you prefer that.

 

38 minutes ago, ClutchClark said:

 

So a country that wants to retain its own cultural identity is not allowed by the PC police? 

 

One World Order, my brother. Amen.

 

One big old homogenized world... Well, not actually...it seems the PC folks are just angry at Western civilizations but could care a less about the injustices that occur in historically muslim countries. Maybe you could fight real injustices around the globe? Maybe you could fight gang rapes in India? Maybe honor killings in Pakistan? Maybe violent crimes against LGBTI's in half the world (notably absent from these Western countries you are so angry at for being "racist"). 

 

But then its alot easier to rail against something as unimportant as whether someone gets to wear a hoodie at the beach or not. Thats the injustice you have chosen to amke a stand on?

 

Isn't part of France's cultural identity freedom and equality; the countries motto is, after all, Liberté, égalité, fraternité!

 

Maybe you believe that fine principle shouldn't apply to Muslims?

 

There's also, of course, the contributions to fashion made by French culture.

 

Of course the injustices you list elsewhere in the world matter; and I and others have expressed our protest against them elsewhere. But this is a topic about France in general and the freedom to wear what one wishes at the beach in particular.

[vogie]

51 minutes ago, GuestHouse said:

 

TVF is fast becoming a rich vein of racist, xenophobic and Islamophobic diatribe.

 

 

All recoverable via internet search engines.

 

 

 

Some people might say it is attracting its share of supercillious posters?

[7by7]

13 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

 

So why don't you try to show your Christian principles in Saudi Arabia, and report back how they respond.

 

Also let us know if that should be called racism and bigotry.

 

Ah, the old "other countries don't enjoy the freedoms we enjoy, so we should restrict those freedoms as well" BS.

 

[7by7]

29 minutes ago, stander said:

"Ordinary" Muslims may or may not have any influence over extremist Muslims, but in wars coming our way "ordinary" Muslims WILL take the side of the extremists.

 

Really? Your evidence of this being?

 

Do you know who is doing most of the fighting against ISIS on the ground right now? Muslims.

[stevenl]

51 minutes ago, ClutchClark said:

 

So a country that wants to retain its own cultural identity is not allowed by the PC police? 

 

One World Order, my brother. Amen.

 

One big old homogenized world... Well, not actually...it seems the PC folks are just angry at Western civilizations but could care a less about the injustices that occur in historically muslim countries. Maybe you could fight real injustices around the globe? Maybe you could fight gang rapes in India? Maybe honor killings in Pakistan? Maybe violent crimes against LGBTI's in half the world (notably absent from these Western countries you are so angry at for being "racist"). 

 

But then its alot easier to rail against something as unimportant as whether someone gets to wear a hoodie at the beach or not. Thats the injustice you have chosen to amke a stand on?

You really have the habit of distorting posts.

[Anthony5]

Just now, 7by7 said:

 

Ah, the old "other countries don't enjoy the freedoms we enjoy, so we should restrict those freedoms as well" BS.

 

 

Did you notice that those "other" countries are exactly those that are the subject of this thread.

 

I would agree with your comment if those "other" countries were third party countries, but that's not the case.

 

To make it a bit more clear to you, in my western home country Muslims demand that they get swimming time in the PUBLIC swimming pool when there are no not Muslims in the pool.

 

Now how would I be named and shamed when I demanded in my own country that I would get swimming time with no Muslims in the pool?

[7by7]

49 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

 

So why don't you try to show your Christian principles in Saudi Arabia, and report back how they respond.

 

Also let us know if that should be called racism and bigotry.

 

34 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 

Ah, the old "other countries don't enjoy the freedoms we enjoy, so we should restrict those freedoms as well" BS.

 

 

28 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

 

Did you notice that those "other" countries are exactly those that are the subject of this thread.

 

I would agree with your comment if those "other" countries were third party countries, but that's not the case.

 

 

What are you on about?

 

The country which is the subject of this thread is France.

 

The other country you mentioned is Saudi Arabia.

 

Quote

To make it a bit more clear to you, in my western home country Muslims demand that they get swimming time in the PUBLIC swimming pool when there are no not Muslims in the pool.

 

Now how would I be named and shamed when I demanded in my own country that I would get swimming time with no Muslims in the pool?

 

Do Muslims demand or request these Muslim only sessions; or were they simply offered as a service to the local Muslim community, who pay local taxes the same as the rest of us? I suspect the latter.

 

Muslims are not the only religious group to desire and be given exclusive use of public pools: a public pool in Brooklyn has had a Jewish women only session since the 1990s;

Brooklyn Pool Can Keep Women-Only Swim Times

 

London, too: Muslim swimmers

Quote

This lunchtime splash is one of several women only sessions held by the pool every week, and while you don't have to be a Muslim to take part, almost all of the swimmers here today are.

It's a scene played out across London every week. Apart from women-only sessions, many pools offer men-only sessions aimed at Muslim men; others offer slots for Jewish women and Jewish schoolchildren.

 

Many other groups are offered exclusive use of swimming pools at certain times.  

 

Women-Only Swimming sessions common in many public pools in the UK.

 

Many pools also offer disabled only sessions (example).

 

Plus, of course, in many public pools swimming clubs, sub aqua clubs etc. hire the pool for their exclusive use.

 

So do you object to all of these; or just those aimed at Muslims?

 

 

Edited August 27, 2016 by 7by7

[Anthony5]

9 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

What are you on about?

 

The country which is the subject of this thread is France.

 

The other country you mentioned is Saudi Arabia.

 

Quote

To make it a bit more clear to you, in my western home country Muslims demand that they get swimming time in the PUBLIC swimming pool when there are no not Muslims in the pool.

 

Now how would I be named and shamed when I demanded in my own country that I would get swimming time with no Muslims in the pool?

 

Do Muslims demand or request these Muslim only sessions; or were they simply offered as a service to the local Muslim community, who pay local taxes the same as the rest of us? I suspect the latter.

 

It's even not worth replying to an apologist, so this is my last reply to you anyway.

 

Those who demand to wear a burkini are the French, not Muslims from countries other than France, right?

 

Now instead of having a poor excuse that Muslims pay tax, I also pay taxes and probably for more years already than any of them, why don't you answer my question how i would be named and shamed if I demanded swimming sessions without Muslims.

 

According to your logic, I am completely entitled to such, because I pay taxes.

 

http://www.bnp.org.uk/news/regional/muslim-women-demand-muslim-only-swim-bolton-one

 

Muslim women demand Muslim only swim at Bolton One!

http://madworldnews.com/muslims-swim-christian-mayor/

 

Entitled Muslims Demand Special Swim, Christian Mayor Makes Own Demand

Edited August 27, 2016 by Anthony5

[Naam]

27 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

To make it a bit more clear to you, in my western home country Muslims demand that they get swimming time in the PUBLIC swimming pool when there are no not Muslims in the pool.

 

to make it a bit more clear for us please specify what number of Muslims made that claim in how many locations. or are you referring to all Muslims all over your home country?

[Anthony5]

3 minutes ago, Naam said:

 

to make it a bit more clear for us please specify what number of Muslims made that claim in how many locations. or are you referring to all Muslims all over your home country?

 

See my post above. I guess it is fine for you to start cherry picking when it comes to defend Muslims and attack your own race.

[Baerboxer]

14 hours ago, NongKhaiKid said:

Yesterday Baerboxer posted he hoped the court will keep its nerve and uphold the ban but it didn't and in throwing the law out talked about fundamental personal freedoms.

However already three French mayors have said they will ignore the administrative court and enforce the ban so an issue involving Muslims will see the French pitted against their own system.

The BBC are showing an interview,   for all the world staged,   with a Muslim woman on a beach showing her excitement when the BBC informed her of the court decision and she was able to wax on about liberty and equality etc.

Funny thing though the woman was dressed in casual clothes,    bareheaded and was prepared to sit in public so attired but right on cue announced she's be back on the beach the next day all covered up.

Not only is the tail wagging the dog it get all the assistance it needs to do so.

 

Ah, those good old personal freedoms and human rights. It's o k for you to hate my culture, my race, my religion if I chose to believe one that isn't yours; to insist I respect all things you claim for your religion and if I don't you'll kill me. Of course you might kill me anyway as you want to be a martyr and your religion rewards Jihadists in the war to Islamify the world.

 

The tail wagging the dog indeed. Just like those London protesters and Mayor Khan. Quick to condemn the French and organize a protest at their Embassy in London. Not a word said about the Islamic countries who dictate what women can and cannot wear and can and cannot do in their countries - and savage medieval punishments if they disobey. Will Khan be taking that up with them - will he fcku.

 

France, far more than just about any European country has cherished it's heritage and taken great steps to preserve the past and ensure future generations would benefit from the skills, arts, crafts and general "Frenchness". Now it's being eroded before their eyes. 

But the liberal left PC politicians that now dominate the EU will insist we all accommodate the Muslim's, respect their beliefs and cherish the rich diversity they add to out culture. And our beliefs, culture and identity is no longer valid.

 

The politicians just do get it that the people have had enough, nor do they care. They've had so long being able to do what they want because of wide spread apathy at elections and poor accountability. This is all going to blow up at some point - which is why the likes of Merkel and Junncke want a EU Army,  EU Police Force and EU Courts and Laws.

 

 

[7by7]

26 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

 

It's even not worth replying to an apologist, so this is my last reply to you anyway.

 

Ah, the old 'not responding to an apologist' accusation regularly  used as an excuse by some when running out of argument!

Quote

 

Those who demand to wear a burkini are the French, not Muslims from countries other than France, right?

Yes, so why did you bring Saudi Arabia into it?

Quote

 

Now instead of having a poor excuse that Muslims pay tax, I also pay taxes and probably for more years already than any of them, why don't you answer my question how i would be named and shamed if I demanded swimming sessions without Muslims.

As you refuse to say what your home country is, I cannot answer.

Quote

 

According to your logic, I am completely entitled to such, because I pay taxes.

 

http://www.bnp.org.uk/news/regional/muslim-women-demand-muslim-only-swim-bolton-one

 

Muslim women demand Muslim only swim at Bolton One!

http://madworldnews.com/muslims-swim-christian-mayor/

 

Entitled Muslims Demand Special Swim, Christian Mayor Makes Own Demand

 

If any group makes a valid case to you local council for sessions exclusive to them then most councils will do their best to accommodate them; as already shown. At least in the UK; I can't speak for your country as you wont say which it is.

 

Edited August 27, 2016 by 7by7
repair formatting

[GuestHouse]

3 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

If any group makes a valid case to you local council for sessions exclusive to them then most councils will do their best to accommodate them; as already shown. At least in the UK; I can't speak for your country as you wont say which it is.

 

 

The local pool in my home town has sessions during which access is restricted to: The women's swimming club. The local canoe club, several young people's swimming sessions banded by age, the local sub aqua club and the Over 50s swimming night.

 

They also have a notice that anyone wishing to book club or social group access to the pool should contact the manager for details. 

 

As you say, absolutely nothing unusual about groups os people booking local swimming pools for use of the facilities based on club membership or other social group association. 

 

[Anthony5]

10 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

If any group makes a valid case to you local council for sessions exclusive to them then most councils will do their best to accommodate them; as already shown. At least in the UK; I can't speak for your country as you wont say which it is.

 

No it are not the French who demanded to wear a burkini, there may be a few French among them but there are also a lot immigrants included hence the mention of Saudi Arabia which actually could have been any other middle Eastern country, and as I'm aware France is not Muslim .

My country is not the subject of this thread as it applies to all western countries, the links I posted are from your country.

Now just try to make the same demands in ANY of the countries from which the Muslims originate from.Please let us know who that turns out.

 

I could take the time to find similar links for almost every country in Europe, <removed>

[ilostmypassword]

44 minutes ago, Anthony5 said:

 

No it are not the French who demanded to wear a burkini, there may be a few French among them but there are also a lot immigrants included hence the mention of Saudi Arabia which actually could have been any other middle Eastern country, and as I'm aware France is not Muslim .

My country is not the subject of this thread as it applies to all western countries, the links I posted are from your country.

Now just try to make the same demands in ANY of the countries from which the Muslims originate from.Please let us know who that turns out.

 

I could take the time to find similar links for almost every country in Europe, <removed>

So, if you had loyal North Koreans in France, and they criticized the French president, it would be okay to execute them because that's what would happen in North Korea? Or rather merely imprisoning them for life would pass as enlightened in France because if they were in North Korea they would be executed?

[PTC]

9 hours ago, stander said:

The burkini is not about a dress choice, it’s about  a warped theology, which is nothing more than medieval clerical opinion with its 7th Century barbarism.

 

 

Something tells me that you do not have any demonstrable record of advocacy of women's rights. Unless it is the right for men to tell them what to do with their bodies. As charming as it may seem to be stuck in the 50's, most of us want to deal with the current world and that means dealing with diversity.

 

Your arrogance in assuming your life and lifestyle is superior to others, particularly when those others tend to have brown skin, is demeaning, disgraceful and disgusting.