Can they actually read all the subtitles?

[wump]

This is not a troll question or a Thai bashing thread. I just find it incredibly difficult to read all the Thai subtitles in the theater when there is like 100 letters shown for less than 2 seconds on the screen. The problem for me is the absence of spaces between words... makes it so hard. 

 

If you tell me to just practice my reading more then I challenge you to watch any foreign film with subtitles in Roman letters but without the spaces... next to impossible to read it all in time.

 

What's the trick?

Edited September 1, 2016 by wump
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[evilebxxx]

practice

[sirmud63]

theres no trick . im profoundly deaf and have been use english subtitles for most of my life .  its pointless ,as by the time you read it ,you dont get to watch the program or movie ,you miss 90% of it. you might as well read a book . 

[wump]

I have no problem at all following roman subtitles even if the whole sentence only "flashes" on the screen for less than a second. The brain can actually "see" words and that's why I would say I miss less than 5% of the movie reading the subtitles.

 

But without the spaces, "seeing" words doesn't work for me so I am wondering.

[Peterw42]

You are talking about how you learnt to read at age 5, obviously different for Thais. They learnt to read with no spaces. The most popular movies in Thailand are usually action movies, more visual less dialogue. I congratulate you being able to read any Thai.

[wump]

SoyouthinkifIwroteatextlikethisitwouldbepossibleforyoutoreaditwithinafewseconds?

 

Not having spaces is just so much extra work for the brain.

[Peterw42]

5 minutes ago, wump said:

SoyouthinkifIwroteatextlikethisitwouldbepossibleforyoutoreaditwithinafewseconds?

 

Not having spaces is just so much extra work for the brain.

 

I agree, but we didnt learn to read like that at age 5, for Thais I imagine its automatic. For us its like learning to read again. 

[evilebxxx]

you read words as brain got adjusted over time

[manfredtillmann]

my wife, who is not stupid at all, can definitely NOT read more than 20% or so of the thai subtitles in english language movies. it takes her minutes just to read the specials conditions on the Tesco receipt - and than she often gets it wrong.

some can - some can't.

[wump]

This was my experience as well but then again I didn't get to hang out much with hi-so types. I found most girls I met didn't even understand random promo conditions when reading them... same goes for some of the staff (who just seem to make them up as they don't understand either). Now promo conditions are simple, but dialogue in most movies is not.

[MissAndry]

13 minutes ago, manfredtillmann said:

my wife, who is not stupid at all, can definitely NOT read more than 20% or so of the thai subtitles in english language movies. it takes her minutes just to read the specials conditions on the Tesco receipt - and than she often gets it wrong.

some can - some can't.

 

Thais don't read much, the more you read the faster you get. When did you last see your gf reading a book (comics don't count). I read a couple of novels every week, fairly normal for a western educated person IMHO.

 

Reading is a skill most Thais just don't have (educated or not, stupid or not).

Edited September 2, 2016 by MissAndry

[Fookhaht]

It really depends heavily on the educational level of the Thai person.  I've seen the whole spectrum of ability to read Thai subtitles from university graduates to those who didn't make it past primary school.   I'm sure my lesser-educated friends miss 50% or more.  

 

The well-educated Thais (bi-lingual) continually gripe about the lousy translations.  So they're not much better off.  Idiomatic expressions get murdered.  One movie which contained,  "He couldn't make it to first base with his date" morphed into "He couldn't get a calendar appointment to play cricket," in the Thai subtitles.  

 

So maybe it's not that desirable of a skill anyway.  

Edited September 2, 2016 by Fookhaht

[Oxx]

Written Thai includes lots of clues showing where the breaks are:  certain vowels can only occur at the start of a syllable, others only at the end or in the middle; some consonants can't end a syllable; tone marks can only be over the first or second consonant of a syllable, etc..  And there are lots of common words (e.g. ที่, เป็น, ก็) and syllables (e.g. กระ, ธรรม, ประ) which are easily recognised and help define further boundaries within a sentence.  Not so difficult, really once the rules have become subliminal.

[evilebxxx]

well said

[manfredtillmann]

5 hours ago, MissAndry said:

 

Thais don't read much, the more you read the faster you get. When did you last see your gf reading a book (comics don't count). I read a couple of novels every week, fairly normal for a western educated person IMHO.

 

Reading is a skill most Thais just don't have (educated or not, stupid or not).

perfectly observed, we don't own a single book,  however, she does a lot of 'facebooking', which does require some reading.

i don't know if she is a valid example for 'Thais' but all experiences i have had with thais not being able to observe the 'written law / rule' do fully validate your post.

Edited September 2, 2016 by manfredtillmann
addition, insertion

[MissAndry]

20 minutes ago, manfredtillmann said:

perfectly observed, we don't own a single book,  however, she does a lot of 'facebooking', which does require some reading.

i don't know if she is a valid example for 'Thais' but all experiences i have had with thais not being able to observe the 'written law / rule' do fully validate your post.

 

Facebook doesn't count either, they don't post in Thai, but some sort of textspeak slang.

[manfredtillmann]

Just now, MissAndry said:

 

Facebook doesn't count either, they don't post in Thai, but some sort of textspeak slang.

just checked, yes, they do. in thai, 100%. it is just a little bit more modern...

[Richard W]

On 02/09/2016 at 2:13 AM, Peterw42 said:

You are talking about how you learnt to read at age 5, obviously different for Thais. They learnt to read with no spaces.

That's not quite true.  Thais start reading with spaces between the syllables.

[NickJ]

I read an article on New Mandela that discused the topic Scriptural Continua. Writing with no separation between words. Pretty much discarded around the 13th century. The article touched on how Ditching it. Alleviated cognitive strain in deciphering text. People could read faster, silent and with increased comprehension.

[Richard W]

19 hours ago, NickJ said:

People could read faster, silent and with increased comprehension.

Unfortunately for progress, that doesn't work with literate Thais.  It works against the pre-existing uses of spaces for punctuation.  What one can do is to encourage greater uses of spaces in Thai.

 

Strings of monosyllabic Thai words aren't too hard to chop up into syllables - there are lots of clues.  (Adding mai kong to the Thai script for short /o/ would help a bit, though.)  I can remember, though, having a lot of trouble with คอมพิวเตอร์.  It wasn't until I saw the ro karan that I suddenly realised that I was must be looking at a European (probably English) loanword.

[Johpa]

Most of the subtitles in Thai are an abbreviated translation very similar to the English subtitles used for the Thai films my wife use to take me to go see in those old cavernous Thai movie theaters.  Even I can follow more than 20%of Thai subtitles even though my Thai reading is well below, slower, than that of most Thais.  I doubt most Thais would have that many problems although I also know many westerners who can't handle subtitles in English. I think that reading subtitles in a film is a skill that develops over time.

 

And like Richard, I am often stumped for several seconds by transliterated loanwords like คอมพิวเตอร์.

[tifino]

 

not having looked closely at thai subtitles per se

 

but I'm thinking the use of transliterated Thai, such as you can see when Thai is written to represent Pali.

 - much simplified, as the vowel extensions are eliminated - making it easier to see the screened text

 

 

but anyway, you as an English reader, seeing English subtitles...

if you have any practice at speed reading style,

your eyes aren't bouncing around the screen quite as much,

so there's the chance you won't miss all of the movie visuals

 

wifey just said, she sees the entire line of Thai text in a flash (when reading)

and this is where I related to her reading Pali so quickly in the temple,

so it seems to me a sort of speed reading is happening...

 

 

the real problem in reading subtitles, is when you are watching a pirated movie, all smudged...

 

 

 

 

 

[evilebxxx]

6 hours ago, tifino said:

 

not having looked closely at thai subtitles per se

 

but I'm thinking the use of transliterated Thai, such as you can see when Thai is written to represent Pali.

 - much simplified, as the vowel extensions are eliminated - making it easier to see the screened text

 

 

but anyway, you as an English reader, seeing English subtitles...

if you have any practice at speed reading style,

your eyes aren't bouncing around the screen quite as much,

so there's the chance you won't miss all of the movie visuals

 

wifey just said, she sees the entire line of Thai text in a flash (when reading)

and this is where I related to her reading Pali so quickly in the temple,

so it seems to me a sort of speed reading is happening...

 

 

the real problem in reading subtitles, is when you are watching a pirated movie, all smudged...

 

 

wifey just said, she sees the entire line of Thai text in a flash (when reading - same as me translation are in simple talking thai as i see it

 

 

 

[simon43]

When I read Thai sub-titles (or any Thai for that matter), I don't actually 'read' the words.  I simply recognise known word patterns.  In that respect, it is rather like 'reading' Chinese characters, where you recognise the word by the pattern of the character.

 

So using this technique, I can rapidly read Thai.  The system slows down when I come to a word that I don't know.  Then I have to apply the rules of written Thai, (as poster Oxx mentioned), to 'isolate' this new word by identfying where the last word ended and where the new word ends.  Then it is easy for me to correctly read/pronounce this new word, even if I don't know the meaning.