blacklisted for life

[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, AsianExport said:

If you own a business you should NEVER be there or you will ALWAYS be at risk. As simple as this.

Anytime an immigration playmobil will want to make problems, you are done.

 

I have met bar-owners who spend lots of time in their bars without any issue.  They never touch the cash-register, broom, mop, or a customer's drink, though.  At most, they walk around and talk to customers, then return to their chair and beer.  Perhaps in Phuket, even that is pushing one's luck. 

 

But since something about a 'neighbor' was mentioned, perhaps this is not specific to the area, but was the common case of someone being made to loose face.  There is a very simple rule for all foreigners who wish to stay here: Never criticize or question the actions of anyone with an official capacity yourself.  Even 'neighbors' may have friends in official capacities, so generally extend this rule to all locals.  If you want or need to do so, hire a Thai who knows the ropes to do it for you (and be careful even then).

[moe666]

11 hours ago, ezzra said:

Here you have a guy who tried to live by the laws of the land pay taxes and be

a good guest in this country, but bad luck and shitty neighbor has put an end to it,

what is really annoying irony here is there are many thousands of real criminals and many

more people who flaunt the laws of the land and nothing happened to them......

we areonly hearing one side of the story here, I personally like to hear from all sides before making a decision of who is right or wrong. Did he go to court before deportation and blacklist. Should have gotten a lawyer  from day one

[phuketrichard]

contact http://www.tilleke.com/offices/bangkok  in Bangkok, or in Phnom Penh, they are not cheap but they are not only a very respectable old  firm BUT, MORE important they have contacts and can get to the bottom of it and will set you straight.

 

on a retirement extension you cant work, so just being there they can assume ( correctly or incorrectly) you are working, especially if the club was closed at the time they arrested you.( seems they were watching)

the 25,000 baht to get to bangkok was because you had to pay for the  immigration guy to go there and back

as to Passport,when ur deported, it is taken away from you,  immigration process;'s you out of thailand and as he stated, the passport is given to airline staff and ONLY given to you after you deboard at your destination

 

It sucks but....... contact the above lawyers

Edited September 11, 2016 by phuketrichard

[Badbanker]

Tilleke do not handle criminal matters!  They are only into big corporate business and are Thailand's biggest IP law firm.  They charge USD 800 an hour!

 

The Swiss Embassy has a list of recommended lawyers so Swiss nationals may choose.

[philtrue]

23 hours ago, impulse said:

If you have something constructive to add, please do.  It'll probably be helpful to others as well.

 

If you're convinced the guy's telling a whopper, please just move on to the next thread.  Calling him a liar isn't helping anybody.

 

 

Many thanks

[philtrue]

30 minutes ago, Badbanker said:

Tilleke do not handle criminal matters!  They are only into big corporate business and are Thailand's biggest IP law firm.  They charge USD 800 an hour!

 

The Swiss Embassy has a list of recommended lawyers so Swiss nationals may choose.

You are right the Embassy did provide me with the list but i guess my case is a lost cause as i had only one reply, a negative one.

I did contact others and then you are right again it is between 10k to 12k and they suggest that it would take around 10 hours, ok with it the problem is that i trust no one anymore for the follow-up and as they explain it is not guaranteed.  

[Badbanker]

The normal charges I am seeing from several lawyers are for removal of the black list is 50k baht up front to submit the brief and then 150k baht after the removal is complete and your representative is given a court order clearing the immigration order!

 

I think you may have spent this much already?

[philtrue]

21 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Are you legally married to your wife?

 

And if you are not, have you legalized your kid as your child through courts?

Not legally married but did legalized my child.

[KBsinter]

I have had 2 bars in Pattaya, and know of two friends who where arrested for working

"shaking hands" was deemed ,"meeting and greeting"arrested,cost him 50.000.00 he was

flying to uk that night,long story and too personal,"enough" you are helpless once they 

arrest you,very few went to court,only one i know of went to court fined 2.000 bht

German chap,many of you would know. 

 

Edited September 11, 2016 by KBsinter

[KBsinter]

On 9/7/2016 at 3:55 PM, KKr said:

Who needs a Judge like that ?

Sounds like the Wild-West of olden days movies.

Laws are there, amongst others, to protect the less powerful from more powerful.
Counselling, psychiatric treatment, and studying what he should have known in the first place is in my opinion a waste of effort.
For a Judge, a bias for either side is unacceptable, therefore he is not suitable for his job.

Fire him and cancel all accumulated benefits.

• SORRY WRONG FILE SELECTED,

[KBsinter]

UBONJOE,you made a comment regarding Airlines not having access to Immigration,how about 

Mitsibshi,I took my truck to the said company for a service(MINBURI BKK) and they tried there hardest 

to sell me a new car, the computer was on a bend in the counter,and I thought hang on!!that looked like my details

I went around the counter there was "all" my immigration details on the screen,did not know what to think

did not care to be honest,just surprised,how many others have access ???and who do you complain too

if so disposed, this is Thailand.......... 

[thaibeachlovers]

I feel for anyone in this situation, but ever since meeting an English guy that owned a restaurant in Pattaya, but could not make his own breakfast in his own kitchen without being done for "working", I vowed never to "own" anything in LOS that I could not afford to leave behind.

I know that it seems like "living the dream" to own  business in LOS and live here happily, but for too many it turns into the worst nightmare possible. Like the English guy that went into the bar business with an English mate, only to be dragged out into the street and thumped, by his English mate.

[djlest]

bit difficult to know all the facts...

by any chance have you ever been convicted criminal in Switzerland or any history there?
These days Thai immigration are trying to keep out all prior convicted criminals... maybe that flagged you?

Otherwise i would strongly be looking towards your wife, and not the neigbours... seems she has more to gain from your absence and more money to pay off the right people to keep you out. plus the perfect scapegoat..

[chainarong]

On ‎9‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 5:11 PM, Straight8 said:

Wow, the TV detectives at their finest!

 

I also believe the story, good luck with it all.

 

Another lesson, never sever all ties to your real home. You never know when you need a plan to fall back on.

 

 

Quite true , I seen a documentary on Heathrow and a guy spent 3 weeks living at the terminal , after coming back from Thai after 15 years, had nothing, lost the lot,  had no friends nothing, all over a sweet young thing.  

[philtrue]

3 hours ago, KBsinter said:

UBONJOE,you made a comment regarding Airlines not having access to Immigration,how about 

Mitsibshi,I took my truck to the said company for a service(MINBURI BKK) and they tried there hardest 

to sell me a new car, the computer was on a bend in the counter,and I thought hang on!!that looked like my details

I went around the counter there was "all" my immigration details on the screen,did not know what to think

did not care to be honest,just surprised,how many others have access ???and who do you complain too

if so disposed, this is Thailand.......... 

Many thanks.

[FritsSikkink]

you own the place and was watching people working for you, this is supervising and needs a work permit.

[hohososo]

you own the place and was watching people working for you, this is supervising and needs a work permit.

You volunteering your time advising people on the intricacies of Thai labor law also requires a work permit.

[philtrue]

On 9/10/2016 at 8:43 PM, Thaidream said:

The OPs post is absolutely genuine and his description of events is exactly what I know to be true as it has happened to others in the same manner.  The only question I have is if there is a stamp in your passport in red - Thai writing- indicating the blacklist exists. If there is- there is no doubt that indeed you have been blacklisted.  The advice of Bad Banker is spot on- It is reversible via a petition to the Administrative Court- and a discussion with the arresting officer who may be willing to reverse his decision- a good Thai lawyer is a must and if you have the funds I would go with the top firms in Bangkok. As long as you have no prior record-  and you have a lengthy time and family in Thailand your chances are good. The downside is it will be costly and take time.

My best to you and your family. Let us know how you proceed so others can be assisted who may end up with the same problem.

Just as an aside- never get into any type of bar or restaurant business in Thailand. 

Again many thanks to the more and more interesting post. Yes when recovering my passport after landing in Switzerland then and only then i was able to look at the departure stamp, a small blue and a small red with the mention of my 3000.- thb fine. 

[stevenl]

I believe this to be not true (the airlines being able to enter a blacklist register that is).

 

I also believe the story to be not true.

After reading the whole thread, yes, the OP's story does seem true.
But airlines still have no access to a blacklist register.

[Ronuk]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

After reading the whole thread, yes, the OP's story does seem true.
But airlines still have no access to a blacklist register.

Haven't they?

[anotheruser]

On 9/10/2016 at 8:16 PM, AsianExport said:

 

True actually ! I didn't think about it, but why registering in your name ? It's so easy to have business but without anyone knowing, so why anybody with a brain would register in his own name when he has a wife to do everything.

 

Still feel for the OP but until he explains what he did wrong, BECAUSE HE OF COURSE DID WRONG THINGS, I will keep thinking that this kind of things only happen to some kinds of people...

 

Sorry if I am wrong, but this is what this post inspire.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

However the story plays out there are really only two indisputable facts that will not vary. He pissed somebody off and didn't grease the right palms. Everything else in the equation is irrelevant.

[muzmurray]

 

When travelling to or from certain countries, passengers are required to provide advance passenger information (API) before they check in or they will be unable to fly.^[8] These countries include

• Antigua
• Australia
• Barbados
• Canada
• China
• Costa Rica
• Cuba
• Dominican Republic
• Grenada
• India
• Ireland
• Jamaica
• Japan
• Maldives
• Mexico
• Republic of Korea
• Russian Federation
• Saint Lucia
• Spain (except for Schengen zone passengers)
• Taiwan^[9]
• Trinidad & Tobago
• Turkey^[10]
• United Kingdom
• United States

 

 

I notice Thailand is not on the list.   :-)

 

 

Also there is no mention of the APIS linking to the destination countries immigration files. I think you may be the "ignoramus".   :-)

Edited September 12, 2016 by ubonjoe
removed quote of removed post

[muzmurray]

10 hours ago, philtrue said:

Again many thanks to the more and more interesting post. Yes when recovering my passport after landing in Switzerland then and only then i was able to look at the departure stamp, a small blue and a small red with the mention of my 3000.- thb fine. 

 

A court imposed fine for working illegally would not be stamped in your passport. The small stamp you have described, with the 3000 on it sounds far more like the stamp you get for overstay, (6 days = 3000 Baht).

[philtrue]

22 hours ago, Ronuk said:

Haven't they?

Haven't they? Ronuk is so right. Just follow the previous post then figure it out. 

[philtrue]

On 9/10/2016 at 10:54 AM, gk10002000 said:

What is the name of the club?

Do ask for your name Sir..?

[philtrue]

On 9/10/2016 at 11:41 AM, stevenl said:

I believe this to be not true (the airlines being able to enter a blacklist register that is).

 

I also believe the story to be not true.

Well lets not call it blacklisted and more diplomatic, "persona non grata" which is the relevant term for an unwanted alien. 

Information in the data base are not of what i did or not, just not allowed in the kingdom of Thailand.

I hope, dear stevenl that you learn from that.

[philtrue]

On 9/10/2016 at 0:21 PM, jamesbrock said:

 

How could the Thai embassy in Switzerland grant you a visa a. without a passport; and b. while you were blacklisted?

 

You need to concoct a more believable story for your next scam attempt.

Dear Jamesbrock.

Thai embassy are just representative of the kingdom not the police, the immigration or the army. As in most country of the world.

[gk10002000]

4 hours ago, philtrue said:

Do ask for your name Sir..?

Your story seems phony and fake.  Why won't you mention the name of your club or your wife's club or whatever it is? 

[Maestro]

Philtrue, from what you have posted I get the impression that you are a bit confused about your situation.

 

I suggest that at this point you should not waste money on trying to get your blacklisting removed. Instead, you should get a complete and accurate translation made by a professional translator -- ie not your old lawyer, wife, friends, etc -- of the court's judgement and of all entries in Thai language made in your passport since the day of you arrest. This will give you a better understanding of the reason for your arrest, trial and sentencing and for deportation and blacklisting.

 

From the translation you will probably also learn that you were given a limited period of time to appeal your sentence and as you apparently have not used that option there is now nothing you can do to overturn that ruling; you remain guilty as sentenced.

 

Then you can return to your plan of getting your blacklisting ended with an appeal to the Commissioner of the Thai Immigration Bureau, for example by citing humanitarian reasons, ie living with your Thai wife in Thailand. The Swiss embassy has a list of lawyers on its website from which to choose, or select any other lawyer you personally consider suitable. This process won't be cheap, costing perhaps millon's of Baht, and success will not not be guaranteed.

 

 

[longstay]

Airlines can not check immigration database, but immigration can check airlines reservation database