British migrant rights defender Andy Hall found guilty in a shock ruling by Bangkok court

[cloudhopper]

Most foreigners I know of convicted of even relatively minor crimes and given a fine and/or suspended sentence were immediately deported and I suspect that will happen in this case as well.

[elgordo38]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

Good point that probably explains (IIRC) why he is still in custody, despite being given a suspended sentence.

First you have to understand the meaning of the word shame before it applies to you. There is no shame here only saving face. I am sure the fruit company is giving a free lifetime supply of their product to certain people. The feelings of the international community mean little here. Its all a world war of words we live in little action or application of the law. Its like the wild wild west all over again. The PM should not be allowed to enter the UN building until he signs a pledge of compliance but that in the end would not worth the paper it is written on. 

[ChrisY1]

I feel for Andy.........he put his reputation on the line..challenged the Thai court system for it's adverse belief in foreign journalists........plus that they view adverse reporting on their "pure life systems"

But....Andy did put his eggs in the basket.......the Thais are so narrow minded...so insular.....and of course so childish in their pursuit to admonish foreign comment.....

[Baerboxer]

3 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

What will be more shocking is Andy found not guilty by this kangaroo court in this climate of fear and intimidation by a military government period. 

 

Give over Eric. Did the last government do anything about reforming the judicial system or changing the defamation laws? No, they tried to use them to their advantage.

 

Nothing to do with the government. Andy can now appeal and then dependent on the result of that appeal either he or the plaintiffs can appeal again to the Supreme Court. That's how legal systems work. 

 

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

3 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

Great news, he could not back up his claims with evidence in court and that's why he lost simple.

If only you knew how far removed from reality you are.

[joeyg]

8 minutes ago, ChrisY1 said:

I feel for Andy.........he put his reputation on the line..challenged the Thai court system for it's adverse belief in foreign journalists........plus that they view adverse reporting on their "pure life systems"

But....Andy did put his eggs in the basket.......the Thais are so narrow minded...so insular.....and of course so childish in their pursuit to admonish foreign comment.....

So did he not know or not care what the results of his action would be?

[Mickmouse1]

So will the BBC  also be taken to court and found guilty for their program on the Thai fishing industry that stinks with gross violation not only of human right abuses but also kidnapping , imprisonment and forced labour not mentioning the himan trafficking charge of Burmese and Cambodian workers? I rest my case your honour?

[MadDog2020]

2 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

 

If someone makes claims about your company that makes you lose money or possibly lose all your customers  don't you think you should have a right to take them to court?

 

 If Andy Hall had hard evidence then he would of been found not guilty.

Do you even know what you are talking about?  

[dominique355]

3 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

Great news, he could not back up his claims with evidence in court and that's why he lost simple.

and you are totally wrong, my dear.

Diffamation in Thailand has nothing to do with truth. Only with the reputation, irrespective of whether or not the claims are true.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, joeyg said:

So did he not know or not care what the results of his action would be?

I suspect that he is one of the VERY RARE individuals that care enough to tell the truth regardless of the consequences.

[dick dasterdly]

Just now, Mickmouse1 said:

So will the BBC  also be taken to court and found guilty for their program on the Thai fishing industry that stinks with gross violation not only of human right abuses but also kidnapping , imprisonment and forced labour not mentioning the himan trafficking charge of Burmese and Cambodian workers? I rest my case your honour?

Of course not - they're not in Thailand so cannot be prosecuted for defamation.

[joeyg]

6 minutes ago, SOUTHERNSTAR said:

If only you knew how far removed from reality you are.

Reality is relative.  I believe Vishnu, Ganesh, Qaun Yin and Buddha are real personalities.  And if I follow their teachings I can reach the perfection of life.

 

I also believe I can be very strong and healthy remaining on the vegetarian diet I've been on for 44 years.

Edited September 20, 2016 by joeyg

[Baerboxer]

16 minutes ago, Hawk said:

 

Enough evidence but the court was told to find him guilty because the government are trying their best to convince the world that slavery etc has/will be soon eradicated which is simply not true.

 

"No foreigner should think they have power above Thai sovereignty", this statement made by the head of the company says it exactly. Foreigners cannot win no matter how much evidence they have, Thais must and will win always.

 

Thai defamation laws are very different to what most foreigners are used to or expect. Even telling the truth, with evidence, does not guarantee you will be acquitted if a complaint is lodged. This is also a criminal as well as civil offense.

 

Knowing that, and the vagaries of the system, any comment that is likely to provoke the subject people / organization is always gonna be a role of the dice at best.

 

See how Andy's appeal goes and also see what pressure the Finnish and other similar organizations can bring to bear via the EU and national governments.

[dick dasterdly]

2 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Do you even know what you are talking about?  

He doesn't, and is best ignored.

[jessy88]

Confused here, why is he applying for bail if his imprisonment is suspended for 2 years?

[Basil B]

5 minutes ago, Mickmouse1 said:

So will the BBC  also be taken to court and found guilty for their program on the Thai fishing industry that stinks with gross violation not only of human right abuses but also kidnapping , imprisonment and forced labour not mentioning the himan trafficking charge of Burmese and Cambodian workers? I rest my case your honour?

 

Am I right in thinking Johnathon Head has been keeping a low profile recently???

 

 

Edited September 20, 2016 by Basil B

[Baerboxer]

1 minute ago, dick dasterdly said:

Of course not - they're not in Thailand so cannot be prosecuted for defamation.

 

The author is in Thaialnd.

[Navalator]

Where in all of the text about this case does it memorialize how the Natural Fruit Company suffered damages from the Finnwatch report.  This must be a SLAPP suit filed by Natural against Hall.

[NextStationBangkok]

We know what will be the International Headlines in all publications for tomorrow.

 

Thailand is digging hole for themselves to bury their rights to express their views.

[Hawk]

3 hours ago, DiscoDan said:

Great news, he could not back up his claims with evidence in court and that's why he lost simple.

 

 

In a Thai court the defendant's evidence can and will be purposely ignored by the judge if it contradicts what the police/ prosecution want.  Obviously the government were well aware of this case and how it could cause problems for their them, so a guilty verdict of defamation gives the company and the government a clean bill of health. He had to be found guilty.

[joeyg]

No one cares.  Everything will go on as it has.

 

[F4UCorsair]

29 minutes ago, DM07 said:

Sooooo...not too long ago, Europe and the US were burning witches!

If that happened here, would you step back and say "let Thailand make it's way"?

Oh...of course you would, because you are Thai'er than Thai...that's why they all love you!

 

 

What a bizarre post.   I'm Thai'er than Thai, and they all love me???

 

Please explain what you mean, because I have no idea, and I haven't had a single expression of love from a Thai.

 

Even Thailand has gone beyond the witch burning phase, but is still lagging many developed countries in human rights, but many developed countries also violate basic human rights.

 

Just confirm for me that you are active in opposing your own country's human rights violations????

Edited September 20, 2016 by F4UCorsair

[Pib]

He probably won't serve a day in prison....might have to pay some money...but he won't go to jail even if his appeals are denied.

 

Quote

A suspended sentence is a legal term for a judge's delaying of a defendant's serving of a sentence after they have been found guilty, in order to allow the defendant to perform a period of probation. If the defendant does not break the law during that period, and fulfills the particular conditions of the probation, the judge usually dismisses the sentence.

 

[joeyg]

Just now, F4UCorsair said:

 

What a bizarre post.   I'm Thai'er than Thai, and they all love me???

 

Please explain what you mean, because I haven't had a single expression of love from a Thai.

 

Even Thailand has gone beyond the witch burning phase, but is still lagging many developed countries in human rights, but many developed countries also violate basic human rights.

 

Just confirm for me that you are active in opposing your own country's human rights violations????

Thank You...

[joeyg]

1 minute ago, Pib said:

He probably won't serve a day in prison....might have to pay some money...but he won't go to jail even if his appeals are denied.

 

 

Is he at home or in a resort right now?

 

[F4UCorsair]

Just now, NextStationBangkok said:

We know what will be the International Headlines in all publications for tomorrow.

 

Thailand is digging hole for themselves to bury their rights to express their views.

 

 

Well I can tell you that the international headlines won't be, and that's about Andy Hall being found guilty.

 

This is small beer, and it will be lucky to see a second day in the Thai press.

 

I think it hsould be international headlines, but if you believe that, you'll be pi$$ing into a 40 knot northerly.

[Khun Han]

35 minutes ago, pookiki said:

There are many Thais living in exile because they knew it was a better option that standing trial as a defendant in cases concerning criminal defamation or allegations of LM.  Andy was lucky in that the first case against him was dismissed because of a technicality.

 

I admire the work that Andy does in defending migrant workers.  However, it defies reality to think that he will get a fair shake in Thai courts.

 

In fighting the current cases, is Andy bringing more attention to himself or to the plight of the migrant workers for whom he fights?

 

Both, hopefully. And, hopefully the other miscarriage of justice he's helping to try to put right, too.

[pookiki]

4 minutes ago, joeyg said:

No one cares.  Everything will go on as it has.

 

Based on your prior post, you did work on issues involving child abuse. Have you been jaded by your experience doing the work?  Do you really think that no one cares?

[dick dasterdly]

5 minutes ago, Navalator said:

Where in all of the text about this case does it memorialize how the Natural Fruit Company suffered damages from the Finnwatch report.  This must be a SLAPP suit filed by Natural against Hall.

They probably have suffered as a result of the truth told about their practices.

 

I for one am very careful about the pineapples I buy nowadays.  Of course, I'm one lone individual - but I expect/hope the company is encountering searching questions when they export produce.

[Jonmarleesco]

Hardly a surprise. We're talking a Thai court, and the dictionary interpretation of defamation, and of corporate responsibility, versus Thailand's version.