Clinton v Trump: stage is set on Long Island for first TV debate

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, stander said:

Trump needs to change the dialogue to talking about migration, Islamification and Marxism in the USA. "Jobs" only has a limited mileage

Marxism? 

[stander]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Marxism? 

Yes, Marxism. There is  Very little difference between classical Marxism and modern globalism. In practice, both end with nations destroyed and a tiny elite in charge

[Gary A]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

All those self selecting online media polls are totally worthless. Ignore them ALL!

 

But BBC mentioned one poll done in a more scientific way where a representative group of voters was selected.

 

The results of who won that ONE actually scientific method poll?

 

Clinton 51

Trump 40

Undecided 9

 

Pretty darn impressive considering the vast majority of people are already decided, so partisan people will lie and say their side won, even when they don't think that.

 

I will now go on record with a SPECIFIC prediction.

This time NEXT week the Real Clear Politics national average will show Clinton ahead by 4.5 percent. Currently, it's 2.4 percent which BTW has gone up even just today!

This uptick will be a direct result of the DRAMATIC debate win for Clinton.

trump can't seem to get above about 43 percent nationally (remember we have two waste your vote choices too). That will NOT cut it. 

Yes, there was some PANIC for a spell among democrats ... now it's time for trumpeters to panic. Not sure how he can pull this out now.

 

 

I'll certainly remember your prediction Will you be suicidal if it goes the other way?

[Gary A]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

All those self selecting online media polls are totally worthless. Ignore them ALL!

 

But BBC mentioned one poll done in a more scientific way where a representative group of voters was selected.

 

The results of who won that ONE actually scientific method poll?

 

Clinton 51

Trump 40

Undecided 9

 

Pretty darn impressive considering the vast majority of people are already decided, so partisan people will lie and say their side won, even when they don't think that.

 

I will now go on record with a SPECIFIC prediction.

This time NEXT week the Real Clear Politics national average will show Clinton ahead by 4.5 percent. Currently, it's 2.4 percent which BTW has gone up even just today!

This uptick will be a direct result of the DRAMATIC debate win for Clinton.

trump can't seem to get above about 43 percent nationally (remember we have two waste your vote choices too). That will NOT cut it. 

Yes, there was some PANIC for a spell among democrats ... now it's time for trumpeters to panic. Not sure how he can pull this out now.

 

 

I'll certainly remember your prediction Will you be suicidal if it goes the other way?

[Pinot]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

It might come down to those emails that Assange says he has. 

 

It might come down to pigs flying out of my bum. Wingnuts are grasping at a miracle at this point. 

 

1 hour ago, stander said:

Trump needs to change the dialogue to talking about migration, Islamification and Marxism in the USA. "Jobs" only has a limited mileage

 

He needs to change everything, but as shown last night, incapable of changing anything. THE worst candidate in American history. He'll be an embarrassment for the Republican party for a generation. The next Republican President hasn't been born yet. This will be a beating they're not coming back from. 

 

It's over. 

 

Marxism...d'oh!   

[Pinot]

This morning:

 

“He gave me very unfair questions at the end. But you know I’m not complaining about that,” the real estate mogul added. 

 

It's just a damn shame Hannity couldn't have spoon fed him the questions...like usual. 

[Publicus]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Caveat Emptor went out with the 19th century.

 

I guess you never visited Thailand then!

 

You'd need to go to the Thailand Forum because this is the World News Forum and the thread topic is Clinton-Trump First TV Debate. This is what we are talking about. Reaching out to Thailand is an indicator of an intellectual non-sequitur and a state of political disorientation. It is a glib response if nothing else.

 

Trump and his fanboyz are fading fast. They got nuthin. 

[Scotwight]

6 minutes ago, Pinot said:

This morning:

 

“He gave me very unfair questions at the end. But you know I’m not complaining about that,” the real estate mogul added. 

 

It's just a damn shame Hannity couldn't have spoon fed him the questions...like usual. 

Was Hannity at the Republican Primary debates?  He was there after todays debate to talk about Hillary's use of the term "Super predator" and backed up Trump's statement that he was not in favor of the Iraq war.  

[Pinot]

AHHHHHHH!

 

It was the microphone! Trump this morning with his newest conspiracy bullshit. 

 

“My microphone ― in the room they couldn’t hear me,” the GOP nominee told Fox News’ “Fox and Friends” in a Tuesday phone interview. “You know it was going on and off which isn’t exactly great.”

“I wonder if it was set up that way,” he added. “It was terrible.”

 

It's always something...cue Roseanne Roseannadanna

 

 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Gary A said:

 

I'll certainly remember your prediction Will you be suicidal if it goes the other way?

What a rude and obnoxious personally baiting question.

Here's a bone dude ... if trump wins, I will move even FURTHER away from the USA than Thailand.

Hmm. 

Edited September 27, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, stander said:

Yes, Marxism. There is  Very little difference between classical Marxism and modern globalism. In practice, both end with nations destroyed and a tiny elite in charge

A trumpeter speaks. Sound like typical conspiracy theory crapola. Pepe anyone? 

[iReason]

Fact-checking the presidential debate between Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump

 

 

"Liar, liar, pants on fire: Who has the worst track record of sticking to the facts? 

According to PolitiFact's fact-checking since Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump announced their candidacies, Trump leads Clinton in the "pants on fire" category with 18 percent of his statements deemed as such compared to 3 percent of Clinton's."

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016/09/26/newspoliticselectionsfact-checking-presidential-debate-between-hillary-clinton-donald-trump/91145368/

 

No surprise there.

The Bloviator retains his crown as the preeminent liar.

The one about stiffing the little guy ( hundreds of them) must have gone over well... 

[Jingthing]

Bipartisan humor break --

 

 

[Ulysses G.]

17 minutes ago, iReason said:

Fact-checking the presidential debate between Hillary Clinton, Donald Trump

 

 

"Liar, liar, pants on fire: Who has the worst track record of sticking to the facts? 

 

 

You seem pound of the fact that Hillary is  a proven liar. Who cares which one tells the most?

[iReason]

Trump Blames Others After Combative Debate With Clinton

"Donald Trump blamed the moderator, a bad microphone and anyone but himself Tuesday after he was forced onto defense by Hillary Clinton's cascade of critiques about his taxes, honesty and character in the first presidential debate."

"Though he said on Twitter he had "really enjoyed" the debate, Trump accused moderator Lester Holt of a left-leaning performance and going harder on him than Clinton."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/clinton-puts-trump-defensive-combative-debate-42384535

 

Boo hoo.

Whatta big baby.

[Ulysses G.]

14 minutes ago, iReason said:

"Donald Trump blamed the moderator, a bad microphone and anyone but himself Tuesday after he was forced onto defense by Hillary Clinton's cascade of critiques about his taxes, honesty and character in the first presidential debate."

 

 

Hillary was the better debater, but Trump has a point. The moderator spent a lot of time on his scandals and pretty much ignored Hillary's. There was legitimate bias here.

[dunroaming]

Let's see what happens at the next debate.  That is if Trump turns up!

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

You seem pound of the fact that Hillary is  a proven liar. Who cares which one tells the most?

It's a matter of RAISINS, dude. Definitely worth a watch:

 

 

[iReason]

Trump interrupted Clinton 25 times in the first 26 minutes of the debate

 

"It didn’t take long during Monday night’s presidential debate before Donald Trump started interrupting Hillary Clinton. A lot, and aggressively."

"By the end of the debate, Trump had interrupted Clinton three times more than she interrupted him — 51 interruptions, compared to Clinton’s 17."

"And then things escalated pretty quickly. Trump started loudly talking over Clinton and at times interrupted her with snide, even childish-sounding remarks."

http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2016/9/26/13068010/presidential-debate-2016-trump-clinton-interruptions

 

 

Deplorable.

[bendejo]

11 hours ago, Prbkk said:

 

In the event of a Clinton administration, surely old Bill will be encouraged to play more golf and stay out of White House closets. She would be insane to use him actively.

 

He'll have an assignment to keep his fly closed him busy.  He'll also be there to advise.  Even O'Reilly says this is a positive.

 

If you believe that history repeats itself, look to what happened while Mrs Kirchner was in office in Argentina (in regards to her spouse).

 

 

[bendejo]

9 hours ago, Gary A said:

What kind of election is it when we are deciding who is worse? Maybe the truth is that anyone has to be unbalanced to want to run for president.

 

For once I can agree with you.  I'm with LBJ on this one when he said "you have to be crazy to want this job."

 

 

[bendejo]

5 hours ago, Pinot said:

It was the microphone! Trump this morning with his newest conspiracy bullshit. 

 

“My microphone ― in the room they couldn’t hear me,” the GOP nominee told Fox News’ “Fox and Friends” in a Tuesday phone interview. “You know it was going on and off which isn’t exactly great.”

“I wonder if it was set up that way,” he added. “It was terrible.”

 

You can bet that if he thought there was something wrong with the microphone he would have said something.  Does anyone think he would be too shy or polite to speak up? 

 

Two things no one has brought up yet:

once, while addressing Hillary, he referred to Obama as "YOUR president";

when she brought up the fat-shaming of the beauty pageant gal, he freaked -- "where did you get that? WHERE DID YOU GET THAT?"  He lost it there.  He wouldn't have responded like that if it weren't true.

 

 

Edited September 27, 2016 by bendejo

[Neurath]

14 hours ago, keemapoot said:

Yeah, it seemed a bit strange to me that team Trump was segregated on stage,

Nah, that's not strange at all - that's their natural element.

[keemapoot]

Waking up this morning I see the post mortems are in. Rather than post them all, do a google news search with Trump as the header and you get things like this from Bloomberg:

Clinton Seeks to Maximize Debate Advantage as Trump on Defensive

http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-09-27/clinton-seeks-to-maximize-debate-advantage-as-trump-on-defensive

and:

 

Why the Donald Trump who appeared on stage Monday can't win

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/09/27/why-the-donald-trump-who-appeared-on-stage-monday-cant-win.html

 

It's nice to see him exposed for who he is with 100 million Americans tuned in. Bring on two more of these debates and we can hopefully start ordering embalming fluid.

 

But, I ABSOLUTELY LOVE this idiot misogynist comment from Fox News' Brit Hume:

 

Quote

Fox News commentator: Trump looked "annoyed, put out, uncomfortable," Clinton looked "composed, smug sometimes, not necessarily attractive"

 

Edited September 27, 2016 by keemapoot
adding commentary

[Neurath]

6 hours ago, stander said:

Yes, Marxism. There is  Very little difference between classical Marxism and modern globalism. In practice, both end with nations destroyed and a tiny elite in charge

Sure. You might want to add the Mongol Empire as well - ends with nations destroyed and a tiny elite in charge. Saying that modern global capitalism and Marxism are  pretty much the same thing ("very little difference") is like claiming that there is very little difference between a horse and table as they both have 4 legs. 

[tuktuktuk]

The stock market's up. Further confirmation that Trump won. Looks to me like a whole bunch of celebrities will be looking for new countries to move to come November. Do you think they'll split this year or wait until after the the inauguration. I'm ready now. I so hope Whoopi Goldberg leaves. Amy Schumer would be another top pick. I think I'd miss Al Sharpton. He's a lot funnier than Amy. 

[Berkshire]

4 minutes ago, tuktuktuk said:

The stock market's up. Further confirmation that Trump won.

 

Of course it's the exact opposite.  If Trump had won, the market would have cratered.  I'm in the market.  The market does not want Trump as President.  The market is freaked out at the idea of Trump as President.  If the stock market started to believe that a Trump presidency was likely, it would head south and I'd be heading for the exits.

[Publicus]

 

Good headlines and links from poot. Allow me to develop that by filling in some content...

 

Dan Drezner*: “Hillary Clinton wiped the floor with Donald Trump in the first presidential debate Monday night. But it was the way in which she wiped the floor with him that was so interesting.”

 

 

Andrew Sullivan: “Clinton was not great at times; her language was occasionally stilted; she missed some obvious moments to go in for the kill; but she was solid and reassuring and composed… I’ve been a nervous wreck these past two weeks; my nerves are calmed now.”

 

 

Jonathan Chait: “The contrast between an obviously and eminently qualified public servant and a ranting bully was as stark as any presidential debate in American history.”

 

 

Glenn Thrush: “Trump is supposed to be the big meanie but it was Clinton who hit him where it hurt most. It doesn’t take a Jung (or even Dr. Phil after a couple of Bud Lights) to figure out that the GOP nominee – who boasts like a barfly – just might be over-compensating. Hence, Clinton, who started the debate a little tentatively, quickly launched into a carefully planned program of Freudian mind-games, contrasting her own middle-class businessman dad (who had his own issues) with Trump’s imperious, larger-than-life father Fred who launched his son’s business career but also was said to be extremely tough on him.”

 

 

Ross Douthat: “More, as ever in this campaign, he showed no ability to evade or duck or simply retreat on issues — his business dealings and his taxes, birtherism and racism — where long Trumpish answers make things only worse.”

 

 

Nate Silver: “My editor tells me that readers want my subjective impressions of the debate, knowing full well that they’re subjective. And my impressions are that Clinton became a more plausible president tonight and Trump became a less plausible one.”

 

 

Ezra Klein: “The first presidential debate featured a man who didn’t know what he was talking about repeatedly shouting over a woman who was extraordinarily prepared.”

 

 

Chris Cillizza: “This was a clear win for her on virtually every front.”

 

 

The Great Republican Train Wreck of 2016. 

 

 

*Dan Drezner is a professor, Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy, Tufts University, Boston MA.

[boomerangutang]

20 hours ago, stander said:

Polls will continue to move in Trump's direction, all he has to do is show he is competent, people don't like her.

 

       He's about as competent as Chris Christie doing the pole vault.   Trump fans don't have to like HRC when she becomes prez. But what they'll do, and what Republicans are so adept at, is attack, attack attack, mostly for no good reasons.  Already, Trump is denigrating blacks, their poorer neighborhoods, US military commanders, and its military prowess. He also denigrates the Iran deal, which is keeping Iran from developing nuclear weapons.   

 

     Until the age of 22, I spent half my life in Europe and half in the US, so I have a good perspective on how Europeans think. I can say, unequivocally, that thinking Europeans see Trump is a complete dufus. The only Europeans who think Trump is halfway decent are a handful of hard right wingers.   As an American, I resent that Trump continually depicts the US as third world with a weak military.  Anyone, other than a decrepit redneck knows that's untrue and damaging to the US's interests.   .....almost as much as praising Putin while denigrating a popular US president and a future president.   I can't think of a worse example for American kids and kids around the world.  Pol Pot is a better role model than Trump.

 

20 hours ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

How else does one judge women and ladyboys?

 

You prove my point. Trump's sheeple fans can't face up to HRC on issues and policy proposals, so all they're left with is denigrating her appearance, the wrinkles in her 68 yr old face, or her choice of clothes.

[Publicus]

 

These though are the two best statements I've seen since yesterday...

 

 

First Read: “Maybe the most damaging part of last night’s debate for Trump was that it only extended the tax and birtherism stories, which are bound to come up again at the VP and second presidential debate over the next two weeks. On taxes, not only did Trump suggest that he’d release his taxes if Clinton releases her emails (so it’s not the audit after all?), he also seemed to admit that he indeed pays no taxes.”

 

“And on birtherism — Trump’s longstanding charge that President Obama wasn’t born in the United States and thus potentially illegitimate to be president — he (falsely) accused Clinton’s ’08 campaign of starting the issue. He also said he brought it to an end after getting Obama to produce his birth certificate. But he never apologized or explained what changed his mind (from 2011-2016 to two weeks ago) that Obama was indeed born in the U.S.”

 

 

And this one sums up Trump very well....

 

“When Clinton said he’d wanted to take advantage of the real estate crisis, he said that was ‘called business, by the way.’ He wouldn’t say if Russia is responsible for hacking Democratic email systems, instead raising the specter of a hypothetical 400-pound hacker. He said not paying federal income taxes ‘makes me smart.’ He defended not paying contractors who have worked on his properties. He rekindled a feud with Rosie O’Donnell, whose appearance he has insulted, saying she ‘deserves’ it. And he defended his long-running questioning of President Obama’s birthplace, arguing that he actually cleared up the controversy by getting Obama to release his birth certificate.”

 

“Trump, in other words, handed reinforcements to the Clinton campaign in several different areas: foreign policy, Trump’s treatment of women, his business dealings, and to what extent he pays taxes. Democrats in the post-debate spin room were openly celebrating the material Trump had handed them for future attack ads.”

 

 

So the fun is just beginning. Two more debates to watch Trump start out strong then wilt as the debate goes deeper in. HRC meanwhile was fresh, bright, easily showed her stamina and was excellently measured and paced. In other words, Trump shot his wad during the first 20 minutes while HRC was doing aerobics throughout.