Is Thailands view on Foreigners really changing?

[1FinickyOne]

On 10/7/2016 at 11:56 AM, sanemax said:

 

   Although it is still quite possible to stay in Thailand on tourist visas.

They did clamp down on people staying in Thailand long term on Visa Exempt Stamps , But that did make a mockery of the whole Thai Visa system .

   Why bother getting a tourist visa, retirement visa or anything else, when you could just step across a border and come straight back with no need to get any kind of visa.

    I used to live in Thailand for three years on VES , and its caused me hardship to get proper visas, but all the same I thoroughly understand and agree with why they did it

Hi 6choicemax... For most of us it can take a full day to step across a border and go back home... I surely prefer the retirement system the way it is... best regards... no.border.run24ken

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, kenk24 said:

Hi 6choicemax... For most of us it can take a full day to step across a border and go back home... I surely prefer the retirement system the way it is... best regards... no.border.run24ken

Took me 3 days to step across a border (Laos) and return with a VISA last week.

[Fex Bluse]

8 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Thailand does not have an insignificant economy. It is around $450 billion annually, and is ranked 26th in the world. It is the 8th largest economy in Asia. Nothing tiny about that.

Perhaps it would have been better for me to say that Thailand's economy is insignificant in the following ways

 

a) insignificant to big economies like many of western countries and

 

b) insignificant in that, in addition to contributing a tiny percentage to western trade economics, also offers little strategic advantage that can't be moved swiftly elsewhere. They have cheap labor, fullstop. Not an educated populace. Not anything unique that allows them to position (unlike, for example, China). They produce nothing of great benefit. 

Edited November 2, 2018 by Fex Bluse

[1FinickyOne]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

Took me 3 days to step across a border (Laos) and return with a VISA last week.

that doesn't sound like fun for me... how long is the visa good for and how much did it cost you in travel expense? 

[Pilotman]

It very much depends on what 'Thailand' you are talking about. I have been visiting this country for many many years, and now live here,  and I detect only the rise over past 25 years  of a Urban middle class that despise the farangs, while seeking to be like them.  The Elite in LOS always did despise foreigners of all kinds, with an arrogance that has held the country back from making any real progress.  However, the friendliness, helpfulness and joy around most of the rural village peoples has never changed, in my view.  They are as generous a set of communities as you will find anyway. As more of them  move to live in the growing big Cities I guess that their attitudes may eventually change, but I don't detect that yet.   Just as a postscript, Phuket,  the tourist islands, Pattaya etc,  especially Pattaya, are not, in my view,  an example of Thailand  as a whole and the country should not be judged by the Thais living there, for good or bad. 

Edited November 2, 2018 by Pilotman

[hobz]

On 10/6/2016 at 5:44 PM, Familyonthemove said:

Not sure it's changed.  Tesco Lotus entered Thailand in 1997 - almost immediately there were proposals for zoning to protect Thai businesses and a competition commission investigation into supplier relationships.  Then a hand grenade attack on one store and an anti-tank rocket shot at another.

 

The banking sector in Thailand is largely local and imported cars, bikes etc are taxed heavily.  The current issues about Chinese tour businesses and even the focus on foreign criminals is further evidence.

 

I think there's always been a drive to protect 'Thai' businesses.  It's not free trade as we know it ..... but sometimes I wish my home country was a bit less 'free'. 

The grenade attacks and bombings against Tesco was over a security contract dispute. 

[Dick Crank]

Foreigners with money and huge dicks invading in droves and screwing the women

 

If I was a thai dude id be one pissed off sob

[Bournville]

Government seems to be protecting it's own.  No issue with that (though I think they could be more creative in incentivising rather than threatening only).

On the ground I have noticed a difference though, not particularly against foreigners, but between themselves too.  Last week I was sitting on a roadside waiting for GF as she was buying food at the market before we went onward to a friends.  A young woman came by with her toddler and smiled as she passed in the sense of just saying "good morning".  I was shocked!  How much of a boiled frog have we become that something so simple and innocent stands out as a leading measure?  This was a glimpse of Thailand past, and I hadn't really noticed it as it happened slowly, but a smile with a stranger is almost unknown to me now, where it was at every street or corner, every shop or anywhere, young and old alike.  I suspect if you are to find it at all, it has to be village rather than city.
 
I hate to see how they've picked up the worst habits of the rest of the world ('need' for objects, keeping up with the Joneses, the love of money etc), but didn't take with it the foundational values of honesty, integrity and so on - the things that should be entirely compatible/same as their own culture and therefore not imposing.

I'd be curious to see what the debt is of various generations, inflation adjusted might look like.  It seems they're less happy now than when I came here in 2006, and suspect there may be some correlation showing (potentially) at least part of what the causes are.
 

LOS since being here 6 years is a mystery to me. No smiles! [emoji23][emoji23] Most days now a get zero smiles.. Not even a nod of the head. Sad indeed.

[Bournville]

No other country in the world makes it as easy to enter and stay to live as Thailand.  
 
In fact, farang are treated far better in Thailand than any Thai or non-white person would be in western countries.  
 
How many western countries would let people enter and live so easily?

555555. The most ill informed comment in this thread! 55555

[Bournville]

What cries out to me is the fact  that 30 years ago most Thais were a happy lot.
Maybe the " innocence " is gone, and disillusion has stepped in. I see a lot of miserable, sullen shop workers and owners, people in all walks of life who can often be quite rude, something I never experienced before. I've seen some Thai people behaving abominably to tourists, and it shocks me and upsets me and my vision of the once lovely folk. 

Correct. There you have it.

[Bournville]

 
Overly proud is in the eye of the beholder, I certainly do not agree with that statement.
 
I cannot see that they refuse acknowledgement of other cultures either. I see the opposite:
 
Thai's are tolerant of other cultures. Anyone think they are not???
 

I've never met a thai that likes Muslims!

[hobz]

14 minutes ago, Bournville said:

LOS since being here 6 years is a mystery to me. No smiles! Most days now a get zero smiles.. Not even a nod of the head. Sad indeed.

Where you living? Getting tons of smiles up here in Chiang Mai.

[MikeyIdea]

10 hours ago, Bournville said:

On ‎10‎/‎7‎/‎2016 at 3:56 PM, MikeyIdea said:

 
Overly proud is in the eye of the beholder, I certainly do not agree with that statement.
 
I cannot see that they refuse acknowledgement of other cultures either. I see the opposite:
 
Thai's are tolerant of other cultures. Anyone think they are not???
 

I've never met a thai that likes Muslims!

I have been working in Thailand for 27 years, some of the Thai's I work with are Muslims but most are not. None of the Thai's I worked with ever cared if their coworker was a Muslim or not and they certainly didn't dislike Muslims. My opinion is that educated people both in the west and in Thailand try to understand differences and accept them, uneducated or lower educated people don't really try and is quite often negative to what they don't know instead

 

Not badly meant but may I ask how long experience in Thailand and with what kind of people you base your opinion on please

Edited November 9, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[Dick Crank]

10 hours ago, Bournville said:

LOS since being here 6 years is a mystery to me. No smiles! Most days now a get zero smiles.. Not even a nod of the head. Sad indeed.

I've found that getting to know the locals is not that easy, but superficial type greeting stuff is fairly common.

 

the whole land of smiles stuff seems based on a superficial view of cultural norms or etiquette, rather then genuine want to know you friendliness.

 

this from living in a local cm area for several years.

[Bournville]

I have been working in Thailand for 27 years, some of the Thai's I work with are Muslims but most are not. None of the Thai's I worked with ever cared if their coworker was a Muslim or not and they certainly didn't dislike Muslims. My opinion is that educated people both in the west and in Thailand try to understand differences and accept them, uneducated or lower educated people don't really try and is quite often negative to what they don't know instead
 
Not badly meant but may I ask how long experience in Thailand and with what kind of people you base your opinion on please

6 years in Thailand and when I mention the word.. Muslim.. It has ALWAYS been met with distaste. These are middle-class Thai for the most part.. With a few bar girl types too.

[Fex Bluse]

On 11/9/2018 at 10:02 AM, Dick Crank said:

I've found that getting to know the locals is not that easy, but superficial type greeting stuff is fairly common.

 

the whole land of smiles stuff seems based on a superficial view of cultural norms or etiquette, rather then genuine want to know you friendliness.

 

this from living in a local cm area for several years.

Agree. There is a big difference between politeness and friendliness. Thais try to be polite but they are generally not friendly people. 

[mogandave]

I’ve been here 18 years, 17 of them managing a manufacturing facility.

I think Thais are generally happy, friendly and get along well.

It is a different culture, and the language is difficult so making close friends is a little tough, but going to weddings, funerals, graduations and temples and whatnot I’ve never felt anything but welcome.

[tingtongtourist]

On 10/7/2016 at 12:20 AM, MikeyIdea said:

 

I certainly don't want them to change. Where would I go if they change to be like Europeans?  

 

aye, so very true

 

[MikeyIdea]

On ‎11‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 12:42 PM, Bournville said:

On ‎11‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 9:54 AM, MikeyIdea said:

I have been working in Thailand for 27 years, some of the Thai's I work with are Muslims but most are not. None of the Thai's I worked with ever cared if their coworker was a Muslim or not and they certainly didn't dislike Muslims. My opinion is that educated people both in the west and in Thailand try to understand differences and accept them, uneducated or lower educated people don't really try and is quite often negative to what they don't know instead
 
Not badly meant but may I ask how long experience in Thailand and with what kind of people you base your opinion on please

6 years in Thailand and when I mention the word.. Muslim.. It has ALWAYS been met with distaste. These are middle-class Thai for the most part.. With a few bar girl types too.

I think we can conclude that we must meet different people ???? That's OK, how boring the world would be if everybody were the same

Edited November 16, 2018 by MikeyIdea

[Nyezhov]

On 11/11/2018 at 8:55 AM, mogandave said:

I’ve been here 18 years, 17 of them managing a manufacturing facility.

I think Thais are generally happy, friendly and get along well.

It is a different culture, and the language is difficult so making close friends is a little tough, but going to weddings, funerals, graduations and temples and whatnot I’ve never felt anything but welcome.

Im a part timer here, sometimes staying, some times visiting, dont speak the language any more than a two year old, but the above is exactly my impression over the past 25 years

 

[whiteman]

As you are a Millwall supporter most people have a different impression of you and not good ????

 

As for Mogandave they all like you because of the money you give at these events ????

 

[mogandave]

As you are a Millwall supporter most people have a different impression of you and not good [emoji846]
 
As for Mogandave they all like you because of the money you give at these events [emoji846]
 

I know it’s different in Europe where it seems everyone is a tight fisted piker, but in the US where people are more generous, no one I know would ever go to a wedding, graduation, funeral or temple empty handed.

What a crappy little world you money-grubbers must live it.

[whiteman]

Know one said you went empty handed I said they liked you because you gave more generously hence why they welcomed you every time ???? the Thais

[mogandave]

Know one said you went empty handed I said they liked you because you gave more generously hence why they welcomed you every time [emoji846] the Thais

I didn’t say they liked me, I said I always felt welcomed. I generally did not give more than anyone else.

With you chiselers your (you’re?) whole (hole?) world seems (seams?) to (two?) revolve around money.

[pjthefey]

I've felt a lot less welcome here in the last 6-9 months compared to 2-4 years ago.  When I apply for visas, and even extensions I'm given the third degree (applying a couple of weeks ago in Hanoi being the exception), and even when I last left Thailand departing immigration hassled me.... when I was LEAVING the country.

 

I haven't noticed any issues with non-government Thai citizens, but I do feel less welcome.  I've actually made the decision to relocated to Hanoi in December-January.  I have friends there that are helping me negotiate a condo which is less money for 2-5x the size of what I have now in the same quality building (Swimming pools, work out rooms, etc.).  

 

I don't like the feeling that next visa run might be the time when I'm unable to get back to my condo and belongings, so yeah.. relocating to a country that gives my nationality 1 year tourist visas without the hassle.  I can't speak for other countries in the region, but VN seems to actually want my kind there. 

Edited November 16, 2018 by pjthefey

[mogandave]

I've felt a lot less welcome here in the last 6-9 months compared to 2-4 years ago.  When I apply for visas, and even extensions I'm given the third degree (applying a couple of weeks ago in Hanoi being the exception), and even when I last left Thailand departing immigration hassled me.... when I was LEAVING the country.
 
I haven't noticed any issues with non-government Thai citizens, but I do feel less welcome.  I've actually made the decision to relocated to Hanoi in December-January.  I have friends there that are helping me negotiate a condo which is less money for 2-5x the size of what I have now in the same quality building (Swimming pools, work out rooms, etc.).  
 
I don't like the feeling that next visa run might be the time when I'm unable to get back to my condo and belongings, so yeah.. relocating to a country that gives my nationality 1 year tourist visas without the hassle.  I can't speak for other countries in the region, but VN seems to actually want my kind there. 

Good luck, I hope it works out well for you.

In all fairness to immigration, I imagine the ratio of knuckle-heads/polite-people they have to deal with has gone up significantly...

[Bournville]

Good luck, I hope it works out well for you.

In all fairness to immigration, I imagine the ratio of knuckle-heads/polite-people they have to deal with has gone up significantly...

This doesn't explain or excuse the needs for such excessive tracking of long term expats here. Tm47 tm28 tm 30.. It's all too much.. and very invasive and unwelcoming. Police are Photographing random people in the streets of Chiang Mai.. Road blocks every day fir all sorts of violation checks. No. Not welcoming and it's hurting Thai tourism and expat plans in the long run.

[mogandave]

This doesn't explain or excuse the needs for such excessive tracking of long term expats here. Tm47 tm28 tm 30.. It's all too much.. and very invasive and unwelcoming. Police are Photographing random people in the streets of Chiang Mai.. Road blocks every day fir all sorts of violation checks. No. Not welcoming and it's hurting Thai tourism and expat plans in the long run.

While it may hurt expat plans, I don’t see how it would have any significant impact on tourism.

Thailand (apparently) wants to get a handle on the undesirables that seem to be popping up, and I support that effort.

[pjthefey]

32 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

While it may hurt expat plans, I don’t see how it would have any significant impact on tourism.

Thailand (apparently) wants to get a handle on the undesirables that seem to be popping up, and I support that effort.

 

 

I understand them wanting to get rid of the criminal element. 

 

It'd be nice if they could come out with an official position on digital nomads (articles a few months ago seemed to indicate that they are open to us by not requiring a work permit), while also creating a long term visa to accommodate it.  I don't mind a bunch of questions and showing a bunch of documentation to get before a long term visa as long as the questions and hassles stop once it's been issued. 

 

What I don't like is being questioned about stealing jobs from Thais every time I go to an immigration related office or pass through a checkpoint.  I mean... If I have a valid visa, they should know that I already provided documentation to the embassy/consulate that issued it.   It's so tiresome.   This is the only country I've been hassled so much in upon entering and leaving, and no this is not the first place in Asia I've stayed long term. 

 

Usually people at the airport look at your passport, see you have a visa and say  "Welcome," or nothing at all before stamping you in. 

[tingtongtourist]

On 11/17/2018 at 12:40 AM, pjthefey said:

I've felt a lot less welcome here in the last 6-9 months compared to 2-4 years ago.  When I apply for visas, and even extensions I'm given the third degree (applying a couple of weeks ago in Hanoi being the exception), and even when I last left Thailand departing immigration hassled me.... when I was LEAVING the country.

 

I haven't noticed any issues with non-government Thai citizens, but I do feel less welcome.  I've actually made the decision to relocated to Hanoi in December-January.  I have friends there that are helping me negotiate a condo which is less money for 2-5x the size of what I have now in the same quality building (Swimming pools, work out rooms, etc.).  

 

I don't like the feeling that next visa run might be the time when I'm unable to get back to my condo and belongings, so yeah.. relocating to a country that gives my nationality 1 year tourist visas without the hassle.  I can't speak for other countries in the region, but VN seems to actually want my kind there. 

Yes, how ridiculous it is that you can invest in the condo in Thailand but must worry if they give you the visa.

 

what can you say about this? but to say maybe best to not invest anything in the place.