Bank Accounts - Transfer on Death

[55Jay]

Before I talk to my banks, like to ping for advice/experience about this here first.

 

I filled out/signed TOD forms (Transfer on Death) through my US based financial advisor, covering US investments/portfolio.  If I kick my clogs, my wife is the beneficiary.  

 

I've got a few bank accounts between BKK Bank and Krung Si here.  All in my name except for one joint account with my wife, which I put relatively small amounts of money in via iBanking, and we both have our own ATM/Debit cards to access it as needed throughout the month.  Larger sums kept in the other sole accounts with no ATM access.

 

Short of having a Will or all Joint accounts, is there a similar TOD process to facilitate transfer of my sole owner accounts to the wife should I be killed/die suddenly?

[Pib]

Below is  quote from a Bangkok Bank webpage that talks the process.   Basically the court (Thai or home country) would need to issue a document saying "you get the money."   It's basically the typical probate process.   To the best of my knowledge there are no "beneficiary upon death" form like you are use to in the U.S.

 

http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PersonalBanking/SpecialServices/ForeignCustomers/Pages/FAQnew.aspx

 

Quote

 

1. My relative passed away and had an account with Bangkok Bank. What is the process for closing the account and distributing the funds to the administrator of the estate?
   In order to close the account of a deceased customer following documents must be sent to the Manager of the branch where the account was held:
   • Court order appointing the administrator of the deceased’s estate
   • Power of Attorney (Required when requesting a solicitor to act on behalf of the Administrator
   • Copy of the Death Certificate
   • Copy of the passport of the decease
   • Certified true copy of passport of the Administrator
   • Original passbook formerly held by the deceased; and
   • A letter from the Administrator of the deceased’s estate requesting Bangkok Bank to close the account and transfer the balance. Please include the details for the payment i.e., name of the beneficiary, account number, name of the bank where the account is held, SWIFT number for the receiving bank, name and address of the branch where the account is held.

• •  
  • Should these documents be issued in a country outside of Thailand where the language use is not English, they will have to be translated to Thai and Notarized by the Royal Thai Embassy/ Consulate in the country of issue.

 

 

 

 

 

[chiang mai]

In other words, probate.

[55Jay]

Thanks, reading a few older threads now as well.  

 

My buddy here tried to do TOD for his wife, for Wells Fargo account in the US.  They told him she had to walk into a branch with him and sign the forms in person.  I did mine via email. 

 

He's in the States solo for a visit right now, emailed today saying he was able to fill out the TOD form at a Wells Fargo, then the branch employee said his wife would have to fly to the US to obtain the funds upon his death.  That doesn't sound quite right.  Anyway, got me to thinking about the accounts I have here.

 

[Pib]

Wells Fargo probably wanted him and the wife to show up in person so they could cross-sell then some products.    

[55Jay]

3 minutes ago, Pib said:

Wells Fargo probably wanted him and the wife to show up in person so they could cross-sell then some products.    

    Yup!  Well, maybe not anymore. 

 

[inThailand]

Won't a Thai Will naming your wife/GF executor and beneficiary be good enough? I would be interested if a better solution is available, for the whole idea is to make it easy for them when our livers give way.

 

Does anyone have actual experience in Thailand of the process for them to carry out your Will?

[chiang mai]

6 minutes ago, inThailand said:

Won't a Thai Will naming your wife/GF executor and beneficiary be good enough? I would be interested if a better solution is available, for the whole idea is to make it easy for them when our livers give way.

 

Does anyone have actual experience in Thailand of the process for them to carry out your Will?

 

Execution of a Will in Thailand requires Probate and that means court and a Thai lawyer, people who have gone through it report it is not an onerous process and is very similar to probate in the West.

[meatboy]

as CM states,we had wills drawn up by our lawyer,leaving my bank accs to the wife if i was to pass by,its as the lawyer told us it goes to court first.

the wife knows this as she has acted as an interpreter for a farang who had to go to court.

[SamuiRes]

I did this recently for a colleague who died intestate. His nearest living relative who inherits under Thai intestacy laws was his mother who lived outside of Thailand. While she was here for the funeral she appointed me as the Administrator on her behalf. This was done with a lawyer and had to be approved by the Court. That was what took time as getting an appointment with a judge here in Samui took a while. It then took another couple of weeks for the Court to issue the documentation. The whole situation was relatively easy as there were no assets other than three bank accounts - all Bangkok Bank. Two in Samui and one in Bangkok. Samui was easy they accepted the documentation and transferred the balance of funds to me which I transferred to his mother. The Bangkok branch was more tedious. First I had to go to Bangkok in person as they would not accept doing this through a local branch. Then, when I was there, they decided that they needed a further paper from the Samui Court that the Samui brach has not required which meant a wasted trip. Having got that I returned to Bangkok and they closed the account, transferred the funds to me which I thensent to his mother. I had to submit allthe documentation to the original judge to show that this had been done correctly.

[elgordo38]

On 10/21/2016 at 7:27 PM, 55Jay said:

    Yup!  Well, maybe not anymore. 

 

We will be back!! Just in a different form. They got a slap on the wrist and that is all. They need something more meaningful in the way of punishment to get their attention but then all their political contributions kicked in and tried to save their bacon but EW soon scorched that route. I guess they will not contribute to Elizabeth Warrens campaign. 

[55Jay]

OK, thanks for the responses, which all point in the same direction.

[David in the north]

I've made a will in Thailand. Included in any assets is my Thai bank account (in my name only) with instructions it is for my wife on my demise.

[khunPer]

From what I have read, and from posters in this Forum, you'll need a Thai Will, and going through Court and executor, which is said to take a year or more. Bank accounts is said to be frozen.

 

Shared accounts, however – with two names, yours and your wife's – belongs to the other named person upon death, it's said; so best if money shall be available for instant access, is to have a shared account with some cash. Empty the account immediately, just in case of being part of an estate, and write in the Will, that specific (or all) shared accounts shall belong to the other named account holder.

 

A Thai Will is easy to make, either with help from a lawyer, or yourself – you can read about in other threads in Thai Visa Forum; or in the book "Thai Law for Foreigners", page 77-86, Paiboon Publishing, ISBN 978-1-887521-57-4.

[akentryan]

Open joint accounts in all Thai banks. If you "will it to her" there is an inheritance tax. Some banks (Krung Thai) will add a party to an exsisting account but most will not.. Others require a joint account.  Just went through this when my wife died.

[chiang mai]

2 hours ago, khunPer said:

From what I have read, and from posters in this Forum, you'll need a Thai Will, and going through Court and executor, which is said to take a year or more. Bank accounts is said to be frozen.

 

Shared accounts, however – with two names, yours and your wife's – belongs to the other named person upon death, it's said; so best if money shall be available for instant access, is to have a shared account with some cash. Empty the account immediately, just in case of being part of an estate, and write in the Will, that specific (or all) shared accounts shall belong to the other named account holder.

 

A Thai Will is easy to make, either with help from a lawyer, or yourself – you can read about in other threads in Thai Visa Forum; or in the book "Thai Law for Foreigners", page 77-86, Paiboon Publishing, ISBN 978-1-887521-57-4.

 

There is no reason why a probate for a foreigner should take a year or more, especially if al  that is involved is a bank account, post number 10 above suggests a much shorter period of time! Do you have any weight you can add to your statement because it sounds suspiciously incorrect.

[chiang mai]

3 minutes ago, akentryan said:

Open joint accounts in all Thai banks. If you "will it to her" there is an inheritance tax. Some banks (Krung Thai) will add a party to an exsisting account but most will not.. Others require a joint account.  Just went through this when my wife died.

 

I don't know of any bank in Thailand that will add a second name to an existing account, most however will allow a second signature to the account but ownership of it remains in a single name.

[chiang mai]

4 hours ago, 55Jay said:

OK, thanks for the responses, which all point in the same direction.

 

A professionally composed and written will, written by somebody such as Kuhn Sumalee in CM will cost about 7k Baht, assuming it is not overly complex and lots of assets are involved.

 

An alternate and far cheaper way to go is the Amphur will which costs under 100 baht and is a simple process involving Amphur staff.

 

Both achieve the same end result although unless the will involves minimal simple assets, probate is required. I have read reports of posters saying the Amphur will alone is sufficient to allow transfer of simple assets although the discretion of individual bank managers seems to be a major factor.

 

Finally, I've read reports that lawyers may charge up to 7% of the value of an estate to conduct probate through the courts for a farang will. I can't comment on the validity of those reports but it might be worth asking questions, if you have the chance.

 

Finally finally: some posters have set aside an amount of transition money in an account that is accessible by both parties, that's money to be used in the event of demise that will sustain the partner for x months, during which time probate can be enacted - I think that's a very good approach and I have done similar. Maybe something to consider.

 

[55Jay]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

 

A professionally composed and written will, written by somebody such as Kuhn Sumalee in CM will cost about 7k Baht, assuming it is not overly complex and lots of assets are involved.

 

An alternate and far cheaper way to go is the Amphur will which costs under 100 baht and is a simple process involving Amphur staff.

 

Both achieve the same end result although unless the will involves minimal simple assets, probate is required. I have read reports of posters saying the Amphur will alone is sufficient to allow transfer of simple assets although the discretion of individual bank managers seems to be a major factor.

 

Finally, I've read reports that lawyers may charge up to 7% of the value of an estate to conduct probate through the courts for a farang will. I can't comment on the validity of those reports but it might be worth asking questions, if you have the chance.

 

Finally finally: some posters have set aside an amount of transition money in an account that is accessible by both parties, that's money to be used in the event of demise that will sustain the partner for x months, during which time probate can be enacted - I think that's a very good approach and I have done similar. Maybe something to consider.

Was not aware of the Amphur route.  Yes, it's just money in a few accounts here.  Accounts in US  are under TOD rules, no other assets to deal with there either. 

 

Good idea about transition funds, thanks.

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, 55Jay said:

Was not aware of the Amphur route.  Yes, it's just money in a few accounts here.  Accounts in US  are under TOD rules, no other assets to deal with there either. 

 

Good idea about transition funds, thanks.

 

The Amphur will has been much discussed here over the years so you might find a thread or two. It involves two people going to the Amphur and the will maker writing out his/her list of assets and beneficiaries, all of which is witnessed by Amphur staff. The will is then sealed and a numbered receipt given, 60 baht or thereabouts - not useful if it's likely to be contested since it's written in Thai and not YOUR native language (apparently it doesn't matter how advanced your fluency is, it remains a risk legally).

[khunPer]

5 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

There is no reason why a probate for a foreigner should take a year or more, especially if al  that is involved is a bank account, post number 10 above suggests a much shorter period of time! Do you have any weight you can add to your statement because it sounds suspiciously incorrect.

Only from what other posters have said – and I don't believe a foreigner will jump up in front of a queue-line  in the Thai court – however, there might be differences in various areas of Thailand, so Koh Samui (where I also live) is fast (some things seem to be more simple at Samui, compared to other areas); or just has a shorter waiting list...

[khundon]

I left a note saying

 

I ****** ***** being of sound mind and body, spent the bl&&&dy lot before I died.

 

Saves so much hassle for the family.

[strabel23]

9 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

A professionally composed and written will, written by somebody such as Kuhn Sumalee in CM will cost about 7k Baht, assuming it is not overly complex and lots of assets are involved.

 

An alternate and far cheaper way to go is the Amphur will which costs under 100 baht and is a simple process involving Amphur staff.

 

Both achieve the same end result although unless the will involves minimal simple assets, probate is required. I have read reports of posters saying the Amphur will alone is sufficient to allow transfer of simple assets although the discretion of individual bank managers seems to be a major factor.

 

Finally, I've read reports that lawyers may charge up to 7% of the value of an estate to conduct probate through the courts for a farang will. I can't comment on the validity of those reports but it might be worth asking questions, if you have the chance.

 

Finally finally: some posters have set aside an amount of transition money in an account that is accessible by both parties, that's money to be used in the event of demise that will sustain the partner for x months, during which time probate can be enacted - I think that's a very good approach and I have done similar. Maybe something to consider.

 

How does one get a hold of Khun Sumalee ?

[chiang mai]

3 hours ago, strbl said:

How does one get a hold of Khun Sumalee ?

 

 

Here:

 

http://29tanin.com/

 

She's one of CM's finest legal people.

[Pilot3Boz]

The simplest thing by far would be add your wife to all your Thai accounts, then it becomes hers on the spot... With the international component I actually did a trust in the USA to cover my wife and take estate taxes out of the equation.... I also ensured she got her US citizenship before we departed the states for LOS, this way she has every right that I do and Social Security benefits won't be any issue for her either... you need to make it easy and painless for her... she will be grief stricken already, why add to her woes if you can avoid them... You have the power while alive to make her life simple beyond yours... 

[Farang99]

Bank accounts which support a retirement or marriage visa must be only in the visa holder's name, but I see no problem with having other accounts in joint names - provided you have a good and trustworthy relationship. This would make all the other balances immediately available to your widow in the event of your death.

[Grubster]

Get ATM cards for your other accounts,  Put the pin #s for these on a note to your wife in an envelope with all your other contact info, will, etc. in it. Instruct your wife on the note to start hitting all cards as soon as you are unconscious and in need of care or dead. My friend died with a good recent will and his wife cannot get the 400,000 baht he had in the bank for at least two years. She could have used some to try to save his life too. Glad you are thinking about it now. 

[Pib]

As much money as 55Jay has in his accounts the poor wife would have to do hundreds of ATM Bt30K withdrawals to eventually get all the money out.   

[55Jay]

Never really thought about all this until recently.  Maybe that I'm nearing the end of my 40's, realizing there are likely fewer years ahead than behind me, and that I'm not bullet proof like I was in my 20s and 30s.

 

I hang out at home most of the time but am about to start Thai language class, increasing my exposure to risk on Thai roads and highways with a 70km drive into the city for class 3x/week.   Less chance of getting flattened in the wife's SUV because it's been blessed and finger painted inside by a Monk.  My pick up truck hasn't, so I better get my affairs in order.   

[chiang mai]

18 hours ago, Grubster said:

Get ATM cards for your other accounts,  Put the pin #s for these on a note to your wife in an envelope with all your other contact info, will, etc. in it. Instruct your wife on the note to start hitting all cards as soon as you are unconscious and in need of care or dead. My friend died with a good recent will and his wife cannot get the 400,000 baht he had in the bank for at least two years. She could have used some to try to save his life too. Glad you are thinking about it now. 

 

You're the second poster in this thread to suggest that probate for a foreigner could take years and I'm curious to know why that should be the case, our lawyer tells us it's a fairly quick process where only simple assets are involved?