1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

Chamberlain and Quisling were quite different individuals and neither appropriate for a sensible conversation on this thread unless one is committed to thoroughly over-the-top juvenile nonsense in a vain attempt to land a knock out blow.

And the Strawman who never contributes anything to the thread decides what is sensible and appropriate?

 

Chamberlain and Quisling were real life characters who felt that capitulations was the way forward rather than to stand up against the unification of Europe under the Germans much the same as Melvin who feels we have nothing to negotiate with and would simply give in to the EU bully boys (and Frau).

1 hour ago, Naam said:

 

So you also think that Britannia is overstamped by the Germans? 

 

This on it's own is reason to leave the EU.

1 hour ago, Flustered said:

And the Strawman who never contributes anything to the thread decides what is sensible and appropriate?

 

Chamberlain and Quisling were real life characters who felt that capitulations was the way forward rather than to stand up against the unification of Europe under the Germans much the same as Melvin who feels we have nothing to negotiate with and would simply give in to the EU bully boys (and Frau).

Chamberlain has been judged by history to have been weak, but on a completely different level to that of Quisling who was a collaborationist which is a rather different thing altogether, so to bracket them together is not only naive but to betray a poor and lazy sense of history. However, as I am increasingly suspecting, the shrill and ridiculous comparisons between Brexit and WW2 betray an underlying Conspiracy Theory view of the world which is dribbling out by bit. All a rather sad indictment of some (and I emphasise some) Brexiteers whose resentments in life have become subsumed in bitterness. How sad.

An inflammatory, baiting post has been removed.   Please stay on topic and keep from making personal remarks aimed at others.  

7 hours ago, Loaded said:

Until the UK leaves the German Union, to pass any new law/act, there must be unanimous agreement between all 28 members. The UK has recently refused to pass two recent acts/laws going through the EU. It struck me immediately that this is a strategy that the UK should use until they leave - halt all EU development by vetoing all laws/acts unless they negotiate above the negotiating level of a petulant 3 year old. After all, it is the strategy that they have openly threatened the UK with - "unfortunately all 27 countries need to agree on a deal after you leave".

 

This will kibosh Vichy France 2 and the 4th Reich's plans to create a Kraut super state.

 

deutschland über quislings

Dear me, isn't all that WW2 stuff rather passé?

 

Let me update you, Macron is centre left. He is president; Le Pen lost, you know. So how is it Vichy France?

 

I thought Merkel was accuse of being an East German Stasi? Now she's Hitler? But allows immigration?

 

Then we have undemocratic EU insisting on agreement by all 28/27 member states. Compare this with the Con Party's attempt to avoid parliament and use the Royal prerogative.

 

Finally, I thought the idea was to leave but negotiate a good trade deal? How does your plot achieve this?

 

So, not a very bright post....

5 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

had a few too many?

 

this is not the time for UK to be difficult re EU developments

no reason whatsoever to upset the EU crew -- would make the coming negos even more difficult

 

UK does not have a strong hand in these negos, she has a weak hand in my view, endeavour to make the most of it

ie behave

 

economy/import/export/trade/tax/duty . . . will probably not be the most important issues

political and social clout will probably be way more important

 

UK has a lot to lose UK has a lot to gain

UK has little to offer UK has a lot win

 

so take care, watch your mouth and make the most of it

 

Please don't use the word "negos"; I had to get my glasses.

UK inflation now at 2.7%, outstripping wage increases. Great....

3 hours ago, Grouse said:

Dear me, isn't all that WW2 stuff rather passé?

 

Let me update you, Macron is centre left. He is president; Le Pen lost, you know. So how is it Vichy France?

 

I thought Merkel was accuse of being an East German Stasi? Now she's Hitler? But allows immigration?

 

Then we have undemocratic EU insisting on agreement by all 28/27 member states. Compare this with the Con Party's attempt to avoid parliament and use the Royal prerogative.

 

Finally, I thought the idea was to leave but negotiate a good trade deal? How does your plot achieve this?

 

So, not a very bright post....

We already have trade deals with the rest of the world - they are called WTO tariffs. It works well for us.

 

We don't need to negotiate any deal with the GU. It's very simple: we have a massive negative trade balance with the GU. They need to trade with us. They can't find new markets without involving the slow bureaucratic processes of Brussels. We'll just flick a switch and start trading the next day. You can do that when you control your own country.

19 hours ago, nauseus said:

Well, different people will form different interpretations of the term "ill conceived regulations". To me it means those trivial rules, hurriedly put in place, without due consideration, and which are relatively far more costly for small firms to comply with than for the big multinationals. The rate of issue of new EU regulations has often been over 1000/year and I'm not going to try to sift through them!

 

But the removal of trivial regulations would reduce the total number anyway, which would help small businesses to be able to cope a little better and maybe create a bit of profit and a few new jobs. This would particularly benefit the UK non-exporting businesses.

 

The plan you mention is the Carer's Allowance, I think, but the money is so poor that I don't think that it will be much use to most people, who still might lose their jobs after 12 months anyway. How can you put a timeline on how long old or sick people will need care? 

 

  

"The plan you mention is the Carer's Allowance,"  - no it isn't.

 

The Conservatives also pledged to introduce a new statutory right to request up to a year’s unpaid leave for caring duties.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/workers-rights-industrial-tribunal-fees-tuc-theresa-may-a7737456.html

19 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

When it comes to 'ill conceived' the prime example has to be the EU parliament moving from one place to another every month!

I do not think that anyone has ever advocated that the EU did not have its failings and this is certainly one of the worst.

 

I would have thought by now that even the French would have woken up to the fact they have forced themselves, as well as everyone else, to throw money down the drain.

The fundamental problem is that no one wants to suggest changing the treaty, bit like prodding a bee's nest.

23 minutes ago, Loaded said:

We already have trade deals with the rest of the world - they are called WTO tariffs. It works well for us.

 

We don't need to negotiate any deal with the GU. It's very simple: we have a massive negative trade balance with the GU. They need to trade with us. They can't find new markets without involving the slow bureaucratic processes of Brussels. We'll just flick a switch and start trading the next day. You can do that when you control your own country.

You obviously mean the tariffs negotiated in the WTO by the EU with their potential market of over half a billion people.

 

Anyone who thinks the trade balance with EU countries will not alter post brexit really need to think again.

 

A survey of more than 2,000 supply chain managers by the Chartered Institute of Procurement & Supply (CIPS) found 46 per cent of European managers working with UK suppliers are now seeking local suppliers because of Brexit. Just under a third (32 per cent) of UK businesses who work with suppliers on the Continent are actively looking for alternative suppliers based in the UK.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-latest-eu-businesses-cut-ties-uk-suppliers-european-union-a7736056.html

1 hour ago, Loaded said:

We already have trade deals with the rest of the world - they are called WTO tariffs. It works well for us.

 

We don't need to negotiate any deal with the GU. It's very simple: we have a massive negative trade balance with the GU. They need to trade with us. They can't find new markets without involving the slow bureaucratic processes of Brussels. We'll just flick a switch and start trading the next day. You can do that when you control your own country.

http://statisticstimes.com/economy/countries-by-projected-gdp.php

 

45% of the the top 20 countries by GDP are within Europe.

 

I assume you are aware of the gravitational model of economics? Trade is proportion to the GDP of both partners and inversely proportional to distance. Double the distance, half the trade. 

 

Only an economic dunderhead would not put Europe at the top of our list

 

The question is, why are we not exporting more to our neighbours? That's not the fault of the EU.,..

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

"The plan you mention is the Carer's Allowance,"  - no it isn't.

 

The Conservatives also pledged to introduce a new statutory right to request up to a year’s unpaid leave for caring duties.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/workers-rights-industrial-tribunal-fees-tuc-theresa-may-a7737456.html

If it isn't, what is it then? 

3 minutes ago, nauseus said:

If it isn't, what is it then? 

So you think an allowance and a statutory right are the same thing, that's a new one.

 

"The plan you mention is the Carer's Allowance, I think, but the money is so poor that I don't think that it will be much use to most people, "

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

You obviously mean the tariffs negotiated in the WTO by the EU with their potential market of over half a billion people.

 

Anyone who thinks the trade balance with EU countries will not alter post brexit really need to think again.

 

A survey of more than 2,000 supply chain managers by the Chartered Institute of Procurement & Supply (CIPS) found 46 per cent of European managers working with UK suppliers are now seeking local suppliers because of Brexit. Just under a third (32 per cent) of UK businesses who work with suppliers on the Continent are actively looking for alternative suppliers based in the UK.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-latest-eu-businesses-cut-ties-uk-suppliers-european-union-a7736056.html

No matter how many times it's repeated, remoaners still don't get it. The UK will always have access to the GU with their potential market of over half a billion people. The GU can't block trade unless they want to be thrown out of the WTO.

 

The trade balance will alter, nobody has said otherwise. Trade balances aren't a set metric.

No matter how many times it's repeated, remoaners still don't get it. The UK will always have access to the GU with their potential market of over half a billion people. The GU can't block trade unless they want to be thrown out of the WTO.
 
The trade balance will alter, nobody has said otherwise. Trade balances aren't a set metric.

A strawman argument if ever I have seen one.

Nobody is saying we will not have access to EU markets after we leave, what is being said is we will not enjoy the same access we have now.

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

So you think an allowance and a statutory right are the same thing, that's a new one.

 

"The plan you mention is the Carer's Allowance, I think, but the money is so poor that I don't think that it will be much use to most people, "

Read. I just asked a question. It was not an opinion!

Tony Blair and Brexit

 

Over the past couple of weeks or so I have seen some interviews with Blair in various newspapers.

Also some TV cuts.

 

He says roughly that he wants to return to politics one way or the other and that he wants to find a role in the Brexit process.

 

Says roughly that this Brexit issue is a big big mistake and that these are crucial times for the future of UK.

(thats OK, a view shared by many)

Also says that he disagrees strongly with Corbyn's approach to Brexit.

(also OK, many share that view)

Can't remember off hand if he said anything re May and her approach.

 

Now,

what he did not say, in the material I saw, was anything about what he want/hope to achieve through entering the political scene again.

New referendum? Softest possible Brexit? Bury the referendum and just keep on as a EU member state?

Nothing said about such issues as far as I have seen.

 

For sure he wants some of the Brexit limelight to shine upon his humble self, but in what form?

 

Although a somewhat faded star I guess Blair still would be able to make an impact one way or the other in the Brexit process.

 

Anyone in the know of which direction Blair is heading?

 

 

Off-topic posts and replies removed.   

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

Tony Blair and Brexit

 

Over the past couple of weeks or so I have seen some interviews with Blair in various newspapers.

Also some TV cuts.

 

He says roughly that he wants to return to politics one way or the other and that he wants to find a role in the Brexit process.

 

Says roughly that this Brexit issue is a big big mistake and that these are crucial times for the future of UK.

(thats OK, a view shared by many)

Also says that he disagrees strongly with Corbyn's approach to Brexit.

(also OK, many share that view)

Can't remember off hand if he said anything re May and her approach.

 

Now,

what he did not say, in the material I saw, was anything about what he want/hope to achieve through entering the political scene again.

New referendum? Softest possible Brexit? Bury the referendum and just keep on as a EU member state?

Nothing said about such issues as far as I have seen.

 

For sure he wants some of the Brexit limelight to shine upon his humble self, but in what form?

 

Although a somewhat faded star I guess Blair still would be able to make an impact one way or the other in the Brexit process.

 

Anyone in the know of which direction Blair is heading?

 

 

A faded star. Far more accurate  to describe  Tony WMD Blair as a dead, but very rich star. I can only  imagine how delighted T.M would be, for the most disliked British politician ( who did more damage to the U.K. during  his tenure, then even the Luftwaffe) if he were to try and re-enter the political arena.

As to where he should be heading,can I suggest the U.N's Court of Justice in The Hague.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

35 minutes ago, nontabury said:

A faded star. Far more accurate  to describe  Tony WMD Blair as a dead, but very rich star. I can only  imagine how delighted T.M would be, for the most disliked British politician ( who did more damage to the U.K. during  his tenure, then even the Luftwaffe) if he were to try and re-enter the political arena.

As to where he should be heading,can I suggest the U.N's Court of Justice in The Hague.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK, so let's have a list of how Blair damaged the UK economy. Most people will remember his times as boom times.

 

(don't bore me with the foreign war stories, it's just not relevant to this discussion)

3 hours ago, Loaded said:

No matter how many times it's repeated, remoaners still don't get it. The UK will always have access to the GU with their potential market of over half a billion people. The GU can't block trade unless they want to be thrown out of the WTO.

 

The trade balance will alter, nobody has said otherwise. Trade balances aren't a set metric.

If you accept that the trade balance will alter, why continue to push the current position.

 

" It's very simple: we have a massive negative trade balance with the GU. They need to trade with us. "

TM will be rubbing her hands, net migration figures going down.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-latest-news-standard-life-dublin-eu-headquarters-chairman-investment-a7739861.html

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-jpmorgan-agrees-to-buy-new-dublin-office-for-1000-staff-kennedy-wilson-a7736931.html

Non Tariff Trade Barriers

 

My thirteen year old decided to eat a Newman Deluxe Pizza for tea. Good!

 

It says on the box, put in oven at 425 degrees for 10 mins

 

After I put out the fire and straightened thing with security, I explained that 425F is 220C

 

Do you get it??

 

You really need to pay attention to this kind of thing if you want to export!

I heard of a great UK export opportunity: a new boat being a combination of an Oxbridge punt and a Welsh coracle. They plan to call it the poracle. Great idea!

7 hours ago, Grouse said:

OK, so let's have a list of how Blair damaged the UK economy. Most people will remember his times as boom times.

 

(don't bore me with the foreign war stories, it's just not relevant to this discussion)

I don't think that that "most" people will remember Phoney Blair for the boom times, he has left a far bigger legacy than that!

I don't think that that "most" people will remember Phoney Blair for the boom times, he has left a far bigger legacy than that!

Yes a legacy of hate and loathing to my shame i voted for the lying turd the first time .he and his wife should crawl back under the pile of shit they emerged from

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1 hour ago, Grouse said:

I heard of a great UK export opportunity: a new boat being a combination of an Oxbridge punt and a Welsh coracle. They plan to call it the poracle. Great idea!

I see you as a bit of a poracle grouse.  ?

May's brexit will be a corporate brexit - a further reduction in corporate tax rate which is already the lowest in the G20, which will further concentrate the wealth of the 1%.  The UK will become the Mexico of the north when the Tories are done.

3 hours ago, i claudius said:

Yes a legacy of hate and loathing to my shame i voted for the lying turd the first time .he and his wife should crawl back under the pile of shit they emerged from

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

You voted for him??? I hope it was only the first time. I saw through his revolting charade soon after he became leader of the party. I went from being a lifelong Labour supporter to a non-voter overnight. His skin-crawling speech about Princess Diana's tragic death just about summed him up for me: a total fake.