Eric Loh Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 28 minutes ago, bangrak said: Khun Eric, now you're really stretching it about the UDD, even when it's your task to defend that and other Thaksin creations (yes, I know, the red colour was set as a conditio-si-nequa-non by former communist leaders Drs Deng and Tida in order to participate, but...), come on... A Union it might still be, as long as the money (from ...?) keeps flowing in, and the Northern and Eastern parts don't go each their own way, with the differences of opinion they have about how to go ahead. Against Dictatorship probably, well, as long as not by-and-for the 'Shins' Dynasty', that is, ...or even a neo-communist one some of its leaders, still, hope to establish one day... But for Democracy, NO ! This totally created 'movement' never, ever, had, any, tiny, bit of democratical content! And I think you are well placed to know that. So what? Just that fake abused and misuded 'thing' about 'democratical elections', to bring the master and his clan back on top? By rigging elections, buying votes, ...and treathening the population of whole swats of Thai land, recurring to violence against any kind of democratical opposition, and any person daring to have another opinion, of his own, is it? When you would write and speak Korean, I know a country where you would be appreciated for your 'sense' of Union, your 'vision' of Democracy, but you could not be against Dictatorship! Do you practice Korean? Any chance to see you move there? Long rant mostly denial and innuendos. Why so paranoid? UDD just want election and democracy with or without Shin. You don't read much I assumed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 2 minutes ago, Cuchulainn said: Atrocities, eh? Good one!! Yes it was and a good one. Enjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psimbo Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 4 hours ago, greenchair said: I looked him up on Wikipedia and that's what it says. Classic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangrak Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 3 hours ago, greenchair said: Seriously???, that government was not elected. They closed down the airport and demanded the elected government out that was reelected in after the coup. The people including the government of the time let the Democrats in for a limited period of time because the airport closure was costing the country more than a billion baht a day. There were many foreigner that were not able to go home, which effected tourism for many months to come. The true cost of the shut down that held the Thai people to ransom will never be known. As I said in a previous post, I was asking a question about seh dang for goodness sakes greenchair, 1) about that Seh Daeng character you seem to be specially interested in, there is in my post as much of an answer to your question to give knowingly and safely, use your imagination about, the many, who slept better after his death, there was quite a 'community of interests' about him to be 'erased' swiftly... 2) I don't know whether you have been wrongly informed or des-informed about the loss of majority in Parliament of the Thaksin party lead government, well after the 2006 coup, ...which actually let his party remain in power, with several despicable 'PMs' following him up, look for the smaller party which swinged to the DP to form an alternative majority (and why...), after the then-Thaksin-owned-government lost the vote of confidence in Parliament, you will be able, whenever you'd want to learn anything about the truth of things here, to find out those two parties together had a majority of 'democratically elected' MPs to support it, and maybe other interesting things about the why and how. Mind you, what you will discover is, very, remote from the cowboys-and-indians' stuff you seem to have been feeding on (fed with?) in Thailand. I warn you, it's all, a lot, more intricate and dark than your, on top of it dead wrong, black-and-white story... I think that, as an intelligent, educated individual you know 'it's never black or white, it's always in shades of grey', don't you? Can you, anyway, please, stop spreading lies and un-truth here, this has nothing to with 'an opinion' as it is 180° in contradiction with established and recognised facts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangrak Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 3 hours ago, Eric Loh said: Long rant mostly denial and innuendos. Why so paranoid? UDD just want election and democracy with or without Shin. You don't read much I assumed. Thank you for recognising the validity of my post! ...Well, in your way that is. LOL Let me quote again: 'UDD just want election and democracy with or without Shin': is this really you, the Khun Eric of yore, or has someone a lot less gifted than you, and quite rabid, been appointed to carry on, using your respected avatar in your absence? To write, and bluntly confirm, such non-sensical 'stuff' makes me fear the worst. (Oh, and 'paranoid', me? Funny, maybe some would-be psychiatrist has replaced the, versed, law specialist...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangrak Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 The, small, article I would like to read in BP, on page 13: 'Today is the tenth anniversary of the jailing of Mr Jatuporn, Mr Nattawut, Mr Arisman, Mr Weng, Mr ..., Mr ..., and Mrs Tida for terrorist and criminal activities, and other heinous crimes, etc., etc.' Not so much because I'm so busy with these pathetic murder-clowns with blood on their hands, but that I would still be reading my printed BP when I would, then, be 75... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 30 minutes ago, bangrak said: Thank you for recognising the validity of my post! ...Well, in your way that is. LOL Let me quote again: 'UDD just want election and democracy with or without Shin': is this really you, the Khun Eric of yore, or has someone a lot less gifted than you, and quite rabid, been appointed to carry on, using your respected avatar in your absence? To write, and bluntly confirm, such non-sensical 'stuff' makes me fear the worst. (Oh, and 'paranoid', me? Funny, maybe some would-be psychiatrist has replaced the, versed, law specialist...) More, EL: - Are you claiming that the UDD can stand alone without the paymaster? How strange, since none of them actually made a stand alone speech in parliament when they were in power recently, not allowed by the party owner (repeat owner), and they were actually paid employees of the paymaster. - Are you claiming the UDD have strong accurate realistic insights into what 'democracy' means, how to build it, how to protect it, etc? And how do they explain that the UDD mob don't have a democratic process to select their own leaders? Please share some very specific facts to convince us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slip Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 On 10/26/2016 at 2:16 PM, greenchair said: Seriously, on the grand scale of crimes against humanity, what has this guy done? ? Make a few speeches, set up up a few meetings, try to at least promote a little bit of oppositional voice. Come on get real. We all know why he's in prison. One of the reasons was he was sarcastic to the powers that be. Half of tv should be in there, if you all agree with that. Here is a direct quote from one of his co-leaders with whom he frequently shared a stage. Your 'few speeches, few meetings, a little bit of opposition' comments are the ones that seem unreal to me. You do better in threads about island murders. Quote For example, UDD leader Arisman Pongruengrong told supporters at a rally at Army Headquarters in Bangkok on January 29 they should carry out arson attacks if the government tried to disperse them, warning they would turn the city into a “sea of fire:” If you know they are going to [disperse] us, you don’t need to prepare much. Just show up each with one glass bottle to fill with gasoline. Fill it up 75cc to 1 liter. If we go to Bangkok with one million people and one million liters of gasoline, rest assured that Bangkok will turn into a sea of fire. This is the simple way to fight by the Red Shirts. I am telling the soldiers, the dog servants of the Privy Council, if you spill even one drop of the Red Shirts’ blood, it means Bangkok will instantly turn into a sea of fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuchulainn Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 Yeah Slip, but the blind sheep can't see that! You're wasting your time on people like that. "Democracy at any cost" (as long as it is on our terms) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemini81 Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 10 hours ago, Alive said: The fascists can't see the fascism. And of course, the truth about Thailand can never be discussed. Only one side of the story rules the Thai forums when it comes to some issues. He's certainly not a terrorist by the real world's standards. In the real world, there is fair and open discussion and a better chance of justice. This is Thailand were the truth is not up for criticism or discussion. Some including foreigners believe the lies and propaganda, and others suffer from their apathy and ignorance. You weren't here in 2010 I take it. Fascism huh? How about all that this dude represents is Maoism and communist (un)ethics and violence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slip Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Cuchulainn said: Yeah Slip, but the blind sheep can't see that! You're wasting your time on people like that. "Democracy at any cost" (as long as it is on our terms) Many may be disappointed about the actions and performance of those who followed the perpetrators of the extreme violence of those times, but what should not be allowed to happen is for people (whether through ignorance or political bias) to pretend that the behaviour was high japes or reasonable opposition. Certain posters repeatedly pull this trick on all manner of topics. I believe it is known as 'revisionism' when they rely on people's poor memories through feigned ignorance. Of course to give them benefit of the doubt, if they are truly ignorant, then they should simply refrain from commenting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuchulainn Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 Thank you again, Slip. But I fear your rhetoric may be lost on the blind sheep. Let the lemmings run to the cliff. Eric, are you ready to jump for your master? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomta Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 On 10/26/2016 at 5:20 PM, HOOD Robin said: Sure, this guy should never be released from jail ! i have to puke when i see his face !! And drop that other Red shirt "leader" in the same cell ! i'm talking about that fat ugly female with the glasses who also thought, just like this guy, she was untouchable (forgot her name... Thia or something like that ?). i assume she is hiding in Cambodia as i havent seen her anymore in the news for the past 2 years... Or did she maybe got shelter in Dubai ? You have only the slightest notion of who you are actually talking about and you want to condemn her to years in jail. If my guess is right as to who this person might be, she is in Thailand not in Dubai or Cambodia. Thida (or something like that)? But she's fat, ugly and female? Throw her in prison then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 10 hours ago, Eric Loh said: Long rant mostly denial and innuendos. Why so paranoid? UDD just want election and democracy with or without Shin. You don't read much I assumed. When has the UDD ever held an election to appoint their so-called leaders? The only one I have heard of was for the Shinawatra appointed crowd to decide who was top dog. And how does it exist without those who pay the bills? Members subscriptions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 11 hours ago, scorecard said: More, EL: - Are you claiming that the UDD can stand alone without the paymaster? How strange, since none of them actually made a stand alone speech in parliament when they were in power recently, not allowed by the party owner (repeat owner), and they were actually paid employees of the paymaster. - Are you claiming the UDD have strong accurate realistic insights into what 'democracy' means, how to build it, how to protect it, etc? And how do they explain that the UDD mob don't have a democratic process to select their own leaders? Please share some very specific facts to convince us... Your opening statement is wrong. You mentioned paymaster and I assumed you meant Thaksin. Thaksin is a UDD supporter but not the main financiers. You don;t know much. So far on my record, the UDD is against dictator and coup and demonstrated strongly against a PM installed by a silent coup and by strongarm military tactic to install Ahbsit as PM. UDD protested for an election and return back to democracy. Tell me what are the PDRC and PAD violently protesting for? I tell you, for a military take over of an elected government and cessation of democracy. Seem the way you and your kinds like. UDD is a pressure group just ike PDRC and PAD. Do they have a democratic process to chose their leaders? Do the junta government has a democratic process to chose the NCPO leaders or in the NLA? Please share your thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuchulainn Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 ........ Thaksin is a UDD supporter but not the main financiers ............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 9 hours ago, Cuchulainn said: Thank you again, Slip. But I fear your rhetoric may be lost on the blind sheep. Let the lemmings run to the cliff. Eric, are you ready to jump for your master? That is the difference between you and me. You support coups and have a disdain for election and may even habour a love for authoritarian rule (the D word) while I support people mandate, election and democracy. Democracy to whatever form is miles better than a military government and the curtailment of freedom of expression and human right violations. I will jump for that but not for Thaksin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 5 minutes ago, Cuchulainn said: ........ Thaksin is a UDD supporter but not the main financiers ............... So you does admit the Thaksin is not THE paymaster but is ONE of the financiers. An improvement. Well done. Learning by the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bamukloy Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 On Wednesday, October 26, 2016 at 1:52 PM, lemonjelly said: This is the guy that said he and his gang would burn the country to the ground right? Key... throw away. Sent from my twisted mind using Thaivisa Connect Dont know about that but i can remember he once climbed out a window on rolled up sheets to get away from the cops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 19 hours ago, Eric Loh said: UDD seem the only group that stand by their namesake asking for election and democracy. Whatever happen to the People Democracy for Reform(PDRC) People Alliance for Democracy (PAD) and the worst of the namesake and truly a misnomer, the Democratic Party. What have these groups done for democracy to deserve inclusion in their name. I can accept what you say about the UDD, elections and democracy. Do you think that it would be a good idea if they practiced what they preach. Since the UDD was formed back in 2006 there have been NO elections for any leadership position, there doesnt seem to be any list of members, no transparency or accountability in their accounts, at least that I could find. From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Front_for_Democracy_Against_Dictatorship The UDD calls for the replacement of the Ammatayathipatai (อำมาตยาธิปไตย, aristocratic polity)— One of the UDD's favorite targets is Prem Tinsulanonda, the president of the privy council. Protests urge the immediate resignation of Prem from the privy council. Due to its insistence that palace insiders stop interfering in politics, the UDD has been criticized by the PAD as being an "anti-monarchist", and even a "republican" movement, and many websites and other media sympathetic to the UDD have been shut down under Thailand's strict lèse majesté laws. UDD leaders and supporters have been jailed under the same laws. They are however not a political party, yet accuse the system in which palace insiders, the military, and bureaucrats effectively ignore the popular mandate—with an electoral democracy, something which is alien to them as they dont seem to believe in democracy themselves, unless it suits their particular aim at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuchulainn Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Eric Loh said: So you does admit the Thaksin is not THE paymaster but is ONE of the financiers. An improvement. Well done. Learning by the day. Maybe I does (sic)!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuchulainn Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 ^^ And I think you'll find that that is your quote (post No 49). Jump, Eric. Jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 48 minutes ago, billd766 said: Since the UDD was formed back in 2006 there have been NO elections for any leadership position, there doesnt seem to be any list of members, no transparency or accountability in their accounts, at least that I could find. Any groups or associations like the UDD has to be registered with the appropriate ministries or it will be illegal association. They have to file annual reports, audited income and expense, memberships and copies of minutes of AGM. It is up to their association charter to decide on their leadership appointment process and within a budget they can afford. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Loh Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 5 minutes ago, Cuchulainn said: ^^ And I think you'll find that that is your quote (post No 49). Jump, Eric. Jump. Good song Jump by House of Pain and Van Halen. Cheer up or you may burst an artery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 1 hour ago, Eric Loh said: Any groups or associations like the UDD has to be registered with the appropriate ministries or it will be illegal association. They have to file annual reports, audited income and expense, memberships and copies of minutes of AGM. It is up to their association charter to decide on their leadership appointment process and within a budget they can afford. Thank you for that information. It didn't help that much as I am still ploughing through Google (in English which probably makes it harder). There are quite a few mentions about the UDD including one by Giles Ungpakorn form May 2014 https://uglytruththailand.wordpress.com/tag/the-udd-red-shirts-leadership/ There is Facebook and Twitter stuff and even a blogspot called the Land Destroyer report http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2011/08/confirmed-thailands-pro-democracy.html but I am lost now until my family comes back from holiday and if I can get my wife interested I may be able to find out more. My wife and the neighbours aren't really into politics as they realise, as do so many Thais that it doesnt really who is in power as the Thai people will get screwed anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TVGerry Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 On 10/26/2016 at 3:08 PM, greenchair said: Terrorism and national security are terms used very loosely in Thailand. Perhaps. But in Jatuporn's case, it's well deserved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangrak Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 5 hours ago, Eric Loh said: So you does admit the Thaksin is not THE paymaster but is ONE of the financiers. An improvement. Well done. Learning by the day. 'Eric Loh': now I'm sure I've lost the Khun Eric I didn't share the ideas of but appreciated the posts of, the last posts alas prove it to me: faulty style, grammatics and orthograph are so unlike you, the real Khun Eric. You will be missed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halloween Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 5 hours ago, Eric Loh said: Any groups or associations like the UDD has to be registered with the appropriate ministries or it will be illegal association. They have to file annual reports, audited income and expense, memberships and copies of minutes of AGM. It is up to their association charter to decide on their leadership appointment process and within a budget they can afford. That is one massive claim without an iota of evidence to support it. Can you supply a link to justify any of it, the legal requirements, any of the documentation allegedly issued, or even any of the claimed other financial backers? My g/f is pinkish - where can she pick up an application to join the UDD, or attend a local meeting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 8 hours ago, Eric Loh said: Your opening statement is wrong. You mentioned paymaster and I assumed you meant Thaksin. Thaksin is a UDD supporter but not the main financiers. You don;t know much. So far on my record, the UDD is against dictator and coup and demonstrated strongly against a PM installed by a silent coup and by strongarm military tactic to install Ahbsit as PM. UDD protested for an election and return back to democracy. Tell me what are the PDRC and PAD violently protesting for? I tell you, for a military take over of an elected government and cessation of democracy. Seem the way you and your kinds like. UDD is a pressure group just ike PDRC and PAD. Do they have a democratic process to chose their leaders? Do the junta government has a democratic process to chose the NCPO leaders or in the NLA? Please share your thoughts. Eric, Many folks, me included, have known for years that the UDD, Red shirts / PT party have other backers, no doubt folks who have a vested interest (want to gain a return) from backing these groups. In terms of the PT party it's well established that the paymaster paid all of the PT members of parliament (and little doubt others) a sizable monthly salary, in addition to their salary from taxpayers funds, to just get elected, any way you can, support available to get elected, then just sit their in the parliament and keep your mouth shut. In fact breaking all the values and morals attached to quality democracy. But you didn't answer my question, do you believe UDD can survive just on their values, etc? Please answer. And I throw in a further question: - Do they have an agreed and published manifesto? Your second paragraph: "So far on my record, the UDD is against dictator...." . Surely you jest. This point has been debated in regard to UDD, Reds, PT, the shin machine family working hard to set up a dictatorship, punish anybody who speaks out, and kill democracy. Have you been sleeping. The rest of your second paragraph, again been debated to death but you refuse to see anything but your bias aligned POV. Your paragraph 3, again you try to divert, how about a specific answer to how the UDD internal democratic elections work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted October 30, 2016 Share Posted October 30, 2016 On 10/26/2016 at 5:14 PM, greenchair said: Harsh words. All he wants is checks and balances in elections and referendums. What are you so afraid of. Ohh the irony of what you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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