The anti-Trump resistance takes shape: 'Government's supposed to fear us'

[lannarebirth]

19 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

The popular "resistance" not being quite as popular is a given. Generally speaking, mass protests rarely involve a majority of the citizens or anything close to it. IMO, a better measure for the "resistance"'s success would be if it remains a "thing" and if it will manage to involve wider groups and sectors. I have my doubts with regard to both.

 

That you feel your own life were not effected does not provide any good indication how others feel about it. And the opposite stands for those cheering the "resistance". Neither you nor them are Main Street, but rather trying to present the general public as supportive of your views. Life going on as usual, is normal - at least for most Americans. Guess that's less of a certainty when it comes to some groups, minorities and businesses. Dismissing it out of hand does not make their fears less relevant, and it does give the impression that Main Street is an idiosyncratic concept.

 

Trump's conduct is toxic. Not just a media bubble point of view. Supporters can say that Obama's years in office were also something of the sort. My answer would be that there are marked difference in quantity and quality.

 

America is plenty free enough now. People are worried that Trump's presidency might change that. It doesn't have to be the sky is falling sort of thing as some assert, but there's certainly reason to worry.

 

A good indication of whether or not there is a "resistance" or more appropriately a viable opposition is if the Democrats or other parties can begin to reverse their losses in state legislatures, governorships. and in the mid-term elections. To that end it is my recommendation they throw their support behind Trump, Ryan and Cruz's term limit pitch and not resist it simply because the other side has proposed it. They're going to need to play the long game and not simply be disruptors and deniers of reality in the short term.

Edited December 10, 2016 by lannarebirth

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

A good indication of whether or not there is a "resistance" or more appropriately a viable opposition is if the Democrats or other parties can begin to reverse their losses in state legislatures, governorships. and in the mid-term elections. To that end it is my recommendation they throw their support behind Trump, Ryan and Cruz's term limit pitch and not resist it simply because the other side has proposed it. They're going to need to play the long game and not simply be disruptors and deniers of reality in the short term.

 

Differentiating between "resistance" and opposition feels helpful, even if some will see it as semantics. Seems like there's a certain disconnect between the sort of heroic uncompromising "resistance" envisaged by some, and the political reality, warts and all, of the "mainstream" Democratic Party. The best outcome, IMO, would be if there was a constructive dialogue leading to change and reforms. Not holding my breath, though.

[lannarebirth]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Differentiating between "resistance" and opposition feels helpful, even if some will see it as semantics. Seems like there's a certain disconnect between the sort of heroic uncompromising "resistance" envisaged by some, and the political reality, warts and all, of the "mainstream" Democratic Party. The best outcome, IMO, would be if there was a constructive dialogue leading to change and reforms. Not holding my breath, though.

 

I'm not sure the Democrats have the ability much less the will to return to being a party of principals rather than a party of group identities.

[lannarebirth]

2 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

His latest pick is absolutely astonishing. It's Gary Cohn, the number 2 guy at Goldman Sachs, to be head of the National Council of Economic Advisors.  Cohn was instrumental in backing those toxic mortgage deals that nearly put the United States and the World into a major depression. Drain the Swamp? Go Trump!

 

Exxon CEO as Secretary of State? Oh My Lord!

 

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/309813-trump-picks-exxon-ceo-tillerson-for-secretary-of-state-report

 

Not good.

Edited December 10, 2016 by lannarebirth

[lannarebirth]

2 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

" All this seemingly erratic behavior [of Trump} can be explained — if not justified — by thinking of Trump as a fascist. Not in the sense of an all-purpose bad guy, but in the sense of somebody who sincerely believes that the toxic combination of strong government and strong corporations should run the nation and the world. He spent his previous career negotiating with the government on behalf of corporations; now he has switched teams."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/donald-trump-is-actually-a-fascist/2016/12/09/e193a2b6-bd77-11e6-94ac-3d324840106c_story.html?hpid=hp_no-name_opinion-card-d%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.4301bf17fa2d

 

I think that comes pretty close to explaining what's going on.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, Morch said:

 

I don't know who is paying. Why don't you find out if it bothers you?

 

What would be the point? Judging from numerous posts and topics, even coming up with clear evidence of wrongdoing will result it the usual denials, but-Hillarys, but-Obamas, calling information "whining", and all the familiar crapola. As a last resort, the default "I don't care" and "Trump won!" will be deployed.

 

You are almost right. "I don't care" and "she lost".

[thaibeachlovers]

10 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

I'm not sure the Democrats have the ability much less the will to return to being a party of principals rather than a party of group identities.

Which is why, if Trump does a half good job in the next two years, expect to see even more states go GOP in 2018.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎09‎.‎12‎.‎2016 at 7:28 PM, Morch said:

 

I don't see how disrupting the inauguration would do anything but increase Trump's approval ratings. Pretty much shoots down the whole "we accept the election results" line. It's been about a month since the elections, so yes...still short term. If and when anti-Trump activities will still be carried out with the same (or growing) intensity in a year's time you're welcome to celebrate it. Until then, just the flip side of  post fact society.

 

The NSC briefing thing, if factual, is a very legitimate criticism, and concerning as well.

 

Pence is, IMO, a way worse alternative when it comes to endangering many of the values you uphold.

IMO the GOP is secretly hoping for a massive inauguration disruption by the usual rent a crowd losers. Such will only turn even more people away from the Dems, and guarantee the GOP winning even more seats in the big house in 2018.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎09‎.‎12‎.‎2016 at 10:05 PM, MajarTheLion said:

 

I think "the resistance" is much smaller than many would believe. Oh sure, there are plenty who hate Trump. Like him or hate him, I doubt many would disagree that he has a big mouth and doesn't play by the PC rules. That and other things have clearly led to a toxic environment, from the media bubble perspective. But on Main Street, I assert it means little to nothing. My life wasn't affected when Obama said divisive things. It's not been affected by the things Trump has said. I would even challenge those who feel offended by Trump to show a demonstrable, measurable affect Trump's comments has had on their lives.

I suspect "the resistance" will soon diminish to a typical roar of people who hate the president (a group always present) and more people will simply accept he's president.

 

I have lived 52 years, through many types of presidents. I have managed to survive and even thrive through all sorts of them. There is no doubt a president can do much to affect many millions of lives. I still maintain America is plenty free enough to make of your life what you will.

IMO the media, domestic and foreign will continue with their anti Trump campaign because they are too committed to give up now.

That will only lose them even more paying customers, so that will be a good thing.

[NeverSure]

It will be really nice when in 40 days Trump becomes president and people can stop acting as they are still campaigning. These threads read like campaign debates as if it mattered now.

 

Hillary lost. That's it. Obama with his total lack of experience in so many areas can just ride off into the sunset, to be replaced by the grownups who've actually done real and big things in their lives.

 

Cheers.

[ilostmypassword]

10 minutes ago, NeverSure said:

It will be really nice when in 40 days Trump becomes president and people can stop acting as they are still campaigning. These threads read like campaign debates as if it mattered now.

 

Hillary lost. That's it. Obama with his total lack of experience in so many areas can just ride off into the sunset, to be replaced by the grownups who've actually done real and big things in their lives.

 

Cheers.

Like having declared bankruptcy several times over and defrauding people via a fake university. And pretty much lying nonstop. And if by "grownups" you mean Goldman Sachs, you've got a point.

Edited December 11, 2016 by ilostmypassword

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, ilostmypassword said:

Like having declared bankruptcy several times over and defrauding people via a fake university. And pretty much lying nonstop.

You are crying into the wind.

He won, and no one that supported him cares. I'm just happy she lost.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are crying into the wind.

He won, and no one that supported him cares. I'm just happy she lost.

"No one cares." Such an intelligent point. Really, you should copyright that one.  And the fact that they claimed to care before the election? Nobody cares.  That getting rid of Obamacare will hurt millions of Americans? Nobody cares.  That Trump has an adviser who is obviously paranoid?  Nobody cares. And that his chief economic adviser was personally complicit in the collapse of the mortgage meltdown that nearly gave the USA a 2nd depression? Nobody cares.   I guess I'm going to owe you some serious money for using your brilliant formulation 4 times.

[rabas]

56 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are crying into the wind.

He won, and no one that supported him cares. I'm just happy she lost.

"No one cares." Such an intelligent point. Really, you should copyright that one.  And the fact that they claimed to care before the election? Nobody cares.  That getting rid of Obamacare will hurt millions of Americans? Nobody cares.  That Trump has an adviser who is obviously paranoid?  Nobody cares. And that his chief economic adviser was personally complicit in the collapse of the mortgage meltdown that nearly gave the USA a 2nd depression? Nobody cares.   I guess I'm going to owe you some serious

 

Clinton did not loose because of Russian hacking.

 

Bill Clinton was signaturely responsible for the financial meltdown that nearly destroyed the world. His National Home Ownership Strategy forced millions into home loans they could not pay back, and was followed  by deregulation  of Wall Street,  CDSs, and toxic loans, so bankers could make a fortune while covering it up.

 

Although Russians and everyone else are here hacking, Hillary lost when she said "and we will let Bill fix the economy". After years of horrific hacking under Obama, his near instant CIA pronouncement that the Russians threw the election is just more of the same old, same old political hacking from the WH.

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

Edited December 11, 2016 by rabas

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

2 hours ago, rabas said:

 

Clinton did not loose because of Russian hacking.

 

Bill Clinton was signaturely responsible for the financial meltdown that nearly destroyed the world. His National Home Ownership Strategy forced millions into home loans they could not pay back, and was followed  by deregulation  of Wall Street,  CDSs, and toxic loans, so bankers could make a fortune while covering it up.

 

Although Russians and everyone else are here hacking, Hillary lost when she said "and we will let Bill fix the economy". After years of horrific hacking under Obama, his near instant CIA pronouncement that the Russians threw the election is just more of the same old, same old political hacking from the WH.

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

 

When will the Trumpy-boys get over the election. They are still campaigning for their idol whose feet of clay have already been exposed to the real world. Yet still this off topic nonsense. The anti-Trump resistance is  not about reversing the election. It is about protesting and opposing the scam that has been perpetrated on citizens.

 

The perpetuation of fake news and ideologically tainted attacks that was part of the Trump scam is continuing here. People reading the post above may feel free to review the Community Reinvestment Act 1977 and its various amendments up to 2008 and make up their own mind about President Clinton's 'culpability' in the Global Financial Crisis that occurred after 8 years of Baby Bushes regime. The absurdity of the above claims are glaringly obvious.

 

And it wouldn't be a right wing-nut rant without throwing in the term illegal immigrant and the totally fake and disproven claims about their alleged voting. Illegal Immigrants cannot exist in nature. A person cannot be illegal. Actions are illegal. These people are undocumented aliens.

 

But hey, anything to wind up the angry old white men waiting for Trump to deliver their American Dream that fell out of their reach in their high school years.

Edited December 11, 2016 by Tawan Dok Krating Daeng

[CharlieK]

The democrats will go the same way as Labour in the UK, they will become unelectable. 

[Strange]

24 minutes ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

When will the Trumpy-boys get over the election. They are still campaigning for their idol whose feet of clay have already been exposed to the real world. Yet still this off topic nonsense. The anti-Trump resistance is  not about reversing the election. It is about protesting and opposing the scam that has been perpetrated on citizens.

 

The perpetuation of fake news and ideologically tainted attacks that was part of the Trump scam is continuing here. People reading the post above may feel free to review the Community Reinvestment Act 1977 and its various amendments up to 2008 and make up their own mind about President Clinton's 'culpability' in the Global Financial Crisis that occurred after 8 years of Baby Bushes regime. The absurdity of the above claims are glaringly obvious.

 

And it wouldn't be a right wing-nut rant without throwing in the term illegal immigrant and the totally fake and disproven claims about their alleged voting. Illegal Immigrants cannot exist in nature. A person cannot be illegal. Actions are illegal. These people are undocumented aliens.

 

But hey, anything to wind up the angry old white men waiting for Trump to deliver their American Dream that fell out of their reach in their high school years.

 

They are illegal immigrants. You want to spin it to favor your beliefs so its easier to digest, and people are beyond tired of being force-fed that flat out nonsense. Out of all the things in the USA to pick on, illegal immigrants should be closer to the bottom of the list than the top. Americans, real life, documented Americans are the priority. That includes ANY American, of any color, race, birth country. Not illegal border jumpers. 

 

The ONLY people that think there is any scam going on are the progressives. The ONLY people complaining about EC, Popular Vote, Etc... Are a very select few hardline progressives that are so far left they fall right off the map. 

 

In all honesty, when I read what you write up here sometimes, its glaringly obvious that this mindset is the reason that Hillary lost. On the plus side, Democrats & Hardline Progressives clearly have not taken one bit of notice and continue on with the "resistance" and have not and (hopefully will not ever) change tactics - thus ensuring the GOP majority everywhere. 

 

Its one thing to have opinions and beliefs, its another to force feed it to people. No one likes that. 

 

So please, Resist-away. Continue ensuring GOP majority for the forceable future. 

[Strange]

3 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Like having declared bankruptcy several times over and defrauding people via a fake university. And pretty much lying nonstop. And if by "grownups" you mean Goldman Sachs, you've got a point.

 

Several times, sounds like a lot, but when you have like 500++ Businesses its not even noteworthy. Its literally part of the business plan. 

 

Trump himself did not intentionally defraud people with Trump U, its one of those things where his name was on something run by other people. Its not like he was there signing the checks and looking at spreadsheets, designing course plans etc.. 

 

You see this right?

 

In all honesty, these 2 things are nothing but clickbait non starters. 

 

Lying? Well I don't think thats hardly anything confined to Trump, Republicans, Democrats, Progressives, etc... Its across the board. Trump did it, Hillary did it... 

 

"If like your plan, you can keep your plan" <-------- Remember that Gem? Im still suffering from that one. 

 

As far as Goldman Sachs, its a nothing burger. Gonna have to wait and see how it plays out, but to assume that "Goldman Sachs" is in "The White House" and "Republicans" are only in politics to "Serve Themselves" is so small minded its unreal. 

[Morch]

10 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are almost right. "I don't care" and "she lost".

 

Which still doesn't make your opinion any more coherent or worthwhile. But at least you do not argue that it's otherwise.

[Morch]

9 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO the GOP is secretly hoping for a massive inauguration disruption by the usual rent a crowd losers. Such will only turn even more people away from the Dems, and guarantee the GOP winning even more seats in the big house in 2018.

 

The GOP would be very short-sighted to see anything of the sort as positive. Things like this go beyond partisan politics, and can easily be turned against any side. Long term, this is bad news for democracy in the US. Which, of course, is not to say that some on the GOP ranks won't celebrate any supposed short term gains.

[ilostmypassword]

10 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are almost right. "I don't care" and "she lost".

 

Which is pretty much the same as when a child sticks her fingers in her ear and starts to scream in order not to hear anything. And if you don't care, then why are you posting?

[Morch]

10 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO the media, domestic and foreign will continue with their anti Trump campaign because they are too committed to give up now.

That will only lose them even more paying customers, so that will be a good thing.

 

IMO, some of Trump's supporters will continue to cling to their fantasy that the president-elect ought to be offered a free pass for anything and everything. They are too committed to admit the possibility that not all is well in Trumpland. That will only make their views even more illogical, which is neither a bad or good thing, just sad.

Edited December 11, 2016 by Morch

[Morch]

10 hours ago, NeverSure said:

It will be really nice when in 40 days Trump becomes president and people can stop acting as they are still campaigning. These threads read like campaign debates as if it mattered now.

 

Hillary lost. That's it. Obama with his total lack of experience in so many areas can just ride off into the sunset, to be replaced by the grownups who've actually done real and big things in their lives.

 

Cheers.

 

Trumplogis at work: goes on about others "still campaigning" while doing the very same in the post above.

[Strange]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

IMO, Trump supporters will continue to cling to their fantasy that the president-elect ought to be offered a free pass for anything and everything. They are too committed to admit the possibility that not all is right in Trumpland. That will only make their views even more illogical, which is neither a bad or good thing, just sad.

 

No free pass, not at all, but sheesh nothing has even happened yet. Seriously. Nothing. Tweets, couple names of people being tossed around for spots. 

 

I don't want the US to go tits up insane, and it won't. That much I know. But there are so many hysterical people claiming it to be, before anything has even happened. 

 

Seriously there are some resident English on here and a couple progressives that have probably become full blown alcoholics over a whole bunch of nothing as of yet. 

 

I have not read a single thing yet that should be freaked out about in regards to trump. But of course I'm pro Americans and Pro Constitution and not a liberal. 

[Morch]

8 minutes ago, Strange said:

 

No free pass, not at all, but sheesh nothing has even happened yet. Seriously. Nothing. Tweets, couple names of people being tossed around for spots. 

 

I don't want the US to go tits up insane, and it won't. That much I know. But there are so many hysterical people claiming it to be, before anything has even happened. 

 

Seriously there are some resident English on here and a couple progressives that have probably become full blown alcoholics over a whole bunch of nothing as of yet. 

 

I have not read a single thing yet that should be freaked out about in regards to trump. But of course I'm pro Americans and Pro Constitution and not a liberal. 

 

How do the "I don't care" and "Trump won!" "arguments" suggested earlier constitute anything but a free pass?

 

Nothing happened? As in announced appointments of key positions, statements regarding the economy, foreign relations, and whatnot, ongoing conflict of interests issues, and yes a president-elect picking flame-wars on tweeter? That sort of "nothing happened"? The thing is if that's nothing, what would something look like?

 

There are hysterical people. There are also Trump supporters reacting on par whenever the president-elect is criticized. And that's without factoring in Trump's own reactions to criticism.

 

Trump supporters are not expected to be "freaked out" with regard to Trump. What's your point? I mean, other than painting anyone not supporting Trump as anti-American, anti-constitution or a liberal.

[Morch]

9 hours ago, rabas said:

 

Clinton did not loose because of Russian hacking.

 

Bill Clinton was signaturely responsible for the financial meltdown that nearly destroyed the world. His National Home Ownership Strategy forced millions into home loans they could not pay back, and was followed  by deregulation  of Wall Street,  CDSs, and toxic loans, so bankers could make a fortune while covering it up.

 

Although Russians and everyone else are here hacking, Hillary lost when she said "and we will let Bill fix the economy". After years of horrific hacking under Obama, his near instant CIA pronouncement that the Russians threw the election is just more of the same old, same old political hacking from the WH.

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

Actually there were a lot of words...here's a summary:

 

Trump thinks non-citizens are deciding elections. We debunked the research he’s citing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2016/10/19/trump-thinks-non-citizens-are-deciding-elections-we-debunked-the-research-hes-citing/

 

 

[ilostmypassword]

7 hours ago, CharlieK said:

The democrats will go the same way as Labour in the UK, they will become unelectable. 

Do you realize that Hllary Clinton that almost 3 million more Americans voted for Hillary Clinton than voted for Donald Trump?

[Strange]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

How do the "I don't care" and "Trump won!" "arguments" suggested earlier constitute anything but a free pass?

 

Nothing happened? As in announced appointments of key positions, statements regarding the economy, foreign relations, and whatnot, ongoing conflict of interests issues, and yes a president-elect picking flame-wars on tweeter? That sort of "nothing happened"? The thing is if that's nothing, what would something look like?

 

There are hysterical people. There are also Trump supporters reacting on par whenever the president-elect is criticized. And that's without factoring in Trump's own reactions to criticism.

 

Trump supporters are not expected to be "freaked out" with regard to Trump. What's your point? I mean, other than painting anyone not supporting Trump as anti-American, anti-constitution or a liberal.

 

Because most people (spare me the KKK Nazi Groping Rapist nonsense) voted trump knowing full well that it meant a whole bunch of unknowns. It meant getting Republicans back in play. It meant busting HRC back out on her ass where she belongs. 

 

Illegal Immigrants, while not really a big deal themselves, are a problem from south of the border. People seem to get a tear in their eye for Alejandro farming somewhere for pocket change, but clearly forget and overlook the cartels in Juarez hanging people from overpasses and beheading people in Texas and the extreme terrorist level violence & mafia drug business coming out of Alejandro's home country. Non americans will never understand this as they are not exposed to it. Liberals choose to ignore it as it does not fit their agenda. Mexico is a country that has Thailand beaten 1000 fold on drugs, violence, corruption, murder, you name it, its there in extreme abundance. Even their own government can not control it and fear these cartels. 

 

Key Positions? So what? These key positions are not there to self serve the people holding them. Its easy for the simple minded and easily led to believe it, but honestly, by that logic, it applies to both parties. Its not a exclusively Republican thing. 

 

Economy? What economy? You mean "everything obama has done in the last 8 years"? In all honesty that would be a big fat nothing. Obama gets credit or sitting in the presidents chair and everything "getting better" around him. 

 

Foreign Policy? Again, what? People should be a little nervous if they are on the US taxpayer tit. 

 

You asked me what "something" would look like... Well I can't really answer that because I'm not nearly as soft as the "resistance" but things that literally effect a majority of Americans negatively. There is absolutely nothing a person or group of people can do for 300,000,000 people without any negative effect on SOMEONE. The electoral vote was won by Trump and Democrats are just gonna have to weather the storm. They had their chance and blew it, very hard. 

 

I get it, there is concern. But the hysteria and "protesting" is a bit knee jerk isn't it? 

[Strange]

4 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Do you realize that Hllary Clinton that almost 3 million more Americans voted for Hillary Clinton than voted for Donald Trump?

 

You realize that this means absolutely nothing? Its mind boggling to me that people can not understand this. This phenomenon is the exact reason that the Electoral College was created. To keep tyranny out of the land from huge population centers. It does not usually happen like this, but this was not a usual election was it?

 

I would have supported HRC if she won by these terms as well because I support the EC system. 

[rabas]

5 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

9 hours ago, rabas said:

 

Clinton did not loose because of Russian hacking.

 

Bill Clinton was signaturely responsible for the financial meltdown that nearly destroyed the world. His National Home Ownership Strategy forced millions into home loans they could not pay back, and was followed  by deregulation  of Wall Street,  CDSs, and toxic loans, so bankers could make a fortune while covering it up.

 

Although Russians and everyone else are here hacking, Hillary lost when she said "and we will let Bill fix the economy". After years of horrific hacking under Obama, his near instant CIA pronouncement that the Russians threw the election is just more of the same old, same old political hacking from the WH.

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

 

And not a word about the scale of illegal real illegal immigrant voting.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0261379414000973

 

Actually there were a lot of words...here's a summary:

 

Trump thinks non-citizens are deciding elections. We debunked the research he’s citing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2016/10/19/trump-thinks-non-citizens-are-deciding-elections-we-debunked-the-research-hes-citing/

 

I don't care what Trump thinks, I provided real scientific studies on the issue, please read, not a word from any politician.

And you quote the Washington Post, the most biased of them all?

The National Enquirer of Swamp politics?