Truck rams into crowd in Jerusalem, 4 dead, up to 15 reportedly injured

[The Deerhunter]

6 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Was it a millionaire who said "imagine no possessions"?

 

 

Probably. But as an artist it doesn't count.  Better ask Roger Waters for his opinion.  He is a real long term socialist.

[The Deerhunter]

3 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

 

Really? And what of Quakers who are pacifists? What of the religious Christians who have fed millions of starving people around the world for decades?

 

 

The resident Israel & jew bashers of Thaiv Visa will be along soon enough. patience old boy, patience. 

 

Bite your tongue. May Australia be spared such an event. The though of a maniac running down a bunch of shoppers is sickening.

Top post.  Probably starving because of religious or sectarian wars (read "Killed because of their beliefs"  or religious beliefs like lack of contraception anyway.  So negative so that.

Edited January 9, 2017 by The Deerhunter

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, The Deerhunter said:

Probably. But as an artist it doesn't count.  Better ask Roger Waters for his opinion.  He is a real long term socialist.

 

As the next line of the same tune goes - A poor little schoolboy who said "we don't need no lessons"?

[Morch]

5 hours ago, elgordo38 said:

Yes these type of events always seem solved on the spot no later costly trial in Israel. 

 

Would you have preferred for more to be mowed down by the truck, while a policeman was writing him a ticket?

[Morch]

4 hours ago, pumpuy said:

There was a chance to make peace a few years ago , but now , the " point of no return " has been passed it seems .

Violence leads to more violence , and in the end all this violence creates a " climate " where nobody is able to living a happy live anymore .

it would have been more clever for the Israelis to make a few concessions that would eventually have lead to peace instead of ignoring everything and just doing whatever they want without caring for the consequencies .

Not very intelligent , but being deeply traumatised by the Holocaust , they apparently prefer to kill all and everything that might become a threat to Israel .

No need to talk about Israels international reputation , now they are famed to be the real " hardliners " who do not care about anything except themselves .

I am happy I do not have to live anywhere near , I am somebody who thinks that people should work together to solve problems that sometimes one alone cannot .

 

But it all goes the wrong way now ... it leads to more hate , war and destruction . Is that what the people want ? I doubt it .

 

""

Human Rights Watch said on Monday that video footage or witness accounts raised serious questions about many of the more than 150 instances in which Israeli forces have fatally shot Palestinians during attacks or attempted attacks on Israelis. ""

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-38501886

 

 

 

What "chance" would that have been? When?

As for smart concessions, goes both ways, the Palestinian could have cut their losses and settle for an agreement. Both sides aren't known for being especially reasonable. And accordingly, both sides have their hardliners. It's not a one-sided affair as you present.

 

 

 

 

[elgordo38]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

Would you have preferred for more to be mowed down by the truck, while a policeman was writing him a ticket?

Noooo but I liked the part where they dealt with the guy on the spot bang! game over. That was the point. Easy hoss we are all on the same page. 

[bangon04]

On 1/8/2017 at 8:34 PM, dave_boo said:

Just another terrorist attack. How can a settlement be reached when such atrocities are committed? 

maybe you shouldn't use the word "settlement"......

there is no intention to reach any agreement. Netanyahu has never and will never negotiate in good faith with any Palestinian. He will ignore all critics like he is officially ignoring the UN, even as his backers hinted that maybe he is going a bit too far too fast.

The terrorists are just demonstrating their desperation. Not right, but hardly a surprise.

[dundee48]

On 08/01/2017 at 2:21 PM, Grouse said:

Truely appalling. How can anyone hope to justify such actions ?

There will be a few on here who will try.

[swfsql]

"Truck rams.."

Now that's a BAD TRUCK! Running over people like that!?

Look's like Transformer's Mohammedtron are really making a move against humans!

[halloween]

13 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

 

Really? And what of Quakers who are pacifists? What of the religious Christians who have fed millions of starving people around the world for decades?

 

 

The resident Israel & jew bashers of Thaiv Visa will be along soon enough. patience old boy, patience. 

 

Bite your tongue. May Australia be spared such an event. The though of a maniac running down a bunch of shoppers is sickening.

 

Bite your bum. 12 foiled attacks, 4 successful, in the last 2.5 years, from people (and their offspring) we have invited into our country.

[dexterm]

It is always sad when young people lose their lives unecessarily.

 

It is perhaps a reminder that it is time to move towards ending the Israeli occupation, but I fear opportunists will use the event with some knee jerk reaction that will push peace further away.

[dexterm]

Netanyahu's conflating the deaths of the 4 IDF with an ISIL attack is an opportunistic attempt to associate Israel's problems with Europe's and the USA ...we are all in this together boys. When in fact Israel's occupation is the root cause of this incident.

 

His distortion may backfire on him. Some may then ask, if ISIL is responsible, why is Israel not doing more to destroy the barbaric Daesh, such as sending ground troops and fighter jets to help the allies defeat them?

Edited January 10, 2017 by dexterm

[Morch]

10 hours ago, bangon04 said:

maybe you shouldn't use the word "settlement"......

there is no intention to reach any agreement. Netanyahu has never and will never negotiate in good faith with any Palestinian. He will ignore all critics like he is officially ignoring the UN, even as his backers hinted that maybe he is going a bit too far too fast.

The terrorists are just demonstrating their desperation. Not right, but hardly a surprise.

 

Intransigence was and is evident on both sides. Same goes for "good faith". 

[Morch]

31 minutes ago, dexterm said:

It is always sad when young people lose their lives unecessarily.

 

It is perhaps a reminder that it is time to move towards ending the Israeli occupation, but I fear opportunists will use the event with some knee jerk reaction that will push peace further away.

 

Talk about opportunist. Wasn't all that long ago when you didn't have much issues with the murder of young US citizen under similar circumstances. Guess you don't see running over people as "knee jerk reaction that will push peace further away".

[Morch]

33 minutes ago, dexterm said:

Netanyahu's conflating the deaths of the 4 IDF with an ISIL attack is an opportunistic attempt to associate Israel's problems with Europe's and the USA ...we are all in this together boys. When in fact Israel's occupation is the root cause of this incident.

 

His distortion may backfire on him. Some may then ask, if ISIL is responsible, why is Israel not doing more to destroy the barbaric Daesh, such as sending ground troops and fighter jets to help the allies defeat them?

 

As pointed out earlier in the topic, Netanyahu says a lot of things and is not beyond exploiting such circumstances for supposed political and diplomatic gains. Doubt his words are taken at face value by anyone but those already into this BS.

 

But bringing up opportunism, and then trying for an opportunist deflection isn't a whole lot better.

[dexterm]

44 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Talk about opportunist. Wasn't all that long ago when you didn't have much issues with the murder of young US citizen under similar circumstances. Guess you don't see running over people as "knee jerk reaction that will push peace further away".

As you yourself said above "The soldiers were on duty and armed." ..and I would add: belonging to an army of illegal occupation killed in illegally occupied East Jerusalem. That does not prevent me from feeling sad about young lives needlessly lost.

 

I suspect the attacker merely copied the tactics of lone wolf Daesh killings in Europe. It is Netanyahu who is trying to jump on the bandwagon, as he has done previously, to deflect from the sins of Israel's illegal occupation.

 

Any knee jerk reaction affecting the lives of occupied Palestinians must de facto come from Israel..they are the only ones with the power of a standing army and 100% control of Palestine.

Edited January 10, 2017 by dexterm

[dexterm]

21 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

As pointed out earlier in the topic, Netanyahu says a lot of things and is not beyond exploiting such circumstances for supposed political and diplomatic gains. Doubt his words are taken at face value by anyone but those already into this BS.

 

But bringing up opportunism, and then trying for an opportunist deflection isn't a whole lot better.

Netanyahu was the one to blame Daesh, not I.

 

We apppear both agreed on his reasons for doing so "exploiting such circumstances for supposed political and diplomatic gains"

 

If he doesn't intend his words to be taken at face value, then he shouldn't utter them, to have them later bite him in the butt, when people ask the obvious question: if ISIL is responsible for this, what are you going to do about making them pay? Or is he going to muddy the waters and make Palestinians pay for Daesh's sins?

[The Deerhunter]

16 hours ago, Morch said:

 

As the next line of the same tune goes - A poor little schoolboy who said "we don't need no lessons"?

No!!!  Surely I don't remember those words in that song.  However, in the song you are thinking of, (by Roger, not John), there are scores of them, in chorus, male & female, singing....Repeat after me....  " We don't need no EDUCATION!!!!!!"   Shame on you. Not knowing that.     

Edited January 10, 2017 by The Deerhunter

[geriatrickid]

7 hours ago, halloween said:

 

Bite your bum. 12 foiled attacks, 4 successful, in the last 2.5 years, from people (and their offspring) we have invited into our country.

 

12 foiled attacks because the security agencies were  doing their job. The other 4 events really weren't successful although  there were 3 victims.  The reality is that they were crimes of opportunity. The Lindt Cafe killer was mentally deranged. The 15 year old who killed the police accountant was another  wacko.   On any given day, more Australians will lose their lives to  a drunk or idiot driver, or a woman will be murdered by her domestic partner, etc. The reality is that more Australians have died in the last year at the hands of homegrown Australians who have  murdered their families.

 

 

[Morch]

1 hour ago, The Deerhunter said:

No!!!  Surely I don't remember those words in that song.  However, in the song you are thinking of, (by Roger, not John), there are scores of them, in chorus, male & female, singing....Repeat after me....  " We don't need no EDUCATION!!!!!!"   Shame on you. Not knowing that.     

 

Both lines were quoted from the Elvis Costello song "The Other Side of Summer", which was linked above.

[Morch]

2 hours ago, dexterm said:

As you yourself said above "The soldiers were on duty and armed." ..and I would add: belonging to an army of illegal occupation killed in illegally occupied East Jerusalem. That does not prevent me from feeling sad about young lives needlessly lost.

 

I suspect the attacker merely copied the tactics of lone wolf Daesh killings in Europe. It is Netanyahu who is trying to jump on the bandwagon, as he has done previously, to deflect from the sins of Israel's illegal occupation.

 

Any knee jerk reaction affecting the lives of occupied Palestinians must de facto come from Israel..they are the only ones with the power of a standing army and 100% control of Palestine.

 

And is still doesn't change the fact that you regularly justify such attacks as in the case that was mentioned in my previous post.

 

This is hardly the first vehicle ramming terrorist attack to happen in Jerusalem during recent years. There were such attacks carried out before it became a "thing" with Islamic Terrorists in Europe.

 

The last bit is the usual drivel, attempting to portray the Palestinians as essentially a passive side in the conflict. If one was to accept your nonsense, then nothing whatsoever is related to actions taken by Palestinians. Yeah....right.

[Morch]

2 hours ago, dexterm said:

Netanyahu was the one to blame Daesh, not I.

 

We apppear both agreed on his reasons for doing so "exploiting such circumstances for supposed political and diplomatic gains"

 

If he doesn't intend his words to be taken at face value, then he shouldn't utter them, to have them later bite him in the butt, when people ask the obvious question: if ISIL is responsible for this, what are you going to do about making them pay? Or is he going to muddy the waters and make Palestinians pay for Daesh's sins?

 

Netanyahu being an opportunist does not exclude your from engaging in a similar fashion on these topics. Same goes foe exploitation or spin of every related piece of news "discussed".

 

And you go on in the same vein. Kinda lame, but expected.

 

 

 

[DavidVincent]

Occuptation or not, this is a stupid act which will only fuel the extremism in Israel and then again on Palestine.

 

 

[dexterm]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

And is still doesn't change the fact that you regularly justify such attacks as in the case that was mentioned in my previous post.

 

This is hardly the first vehicle ramming terrorist attack to happen in Jerusalem during recent years. There were such attacks carried out before it became a "thing" with Islamic Terrorists in Europe.

 

The last bit is the usual drivel, attempting to portray the Palestinians as essentially a passive side in the conflict. If one was to accept your nonsense, then nothing whatsoever is related to actions taken by Palestinians. Yeah....right.

I think you ought to be addressing your 2nd paragraph to Netanyahu. He appears to be the one conflating this attack with an ISIL "thing" to score a few international sympathy votes. I find it disgusting that he is making political capital out of the deaths of 4 of his own soldiers, rather than tackle the issue that ultimately caused their deaths... his own incitement and encouragement of the illegal occupation of 4.8 miilion Palestinians.

 

You would perhaps have a point in your 3rd paragraph about the relative passivity of Palestinians if it were a level playing field with Palestinians having a standing army bristling with weaponry, tanks, F-16s, and nuclear bombs. As it is, it is Israel who mainly call the shots and hold all the cards for a peace agreement, bringing an end to incidents such as in the OP.

[Morch]

28 minutes ago, dexterm said:

I think you ought to be addressing your 2nd paragraph to Netanyahu. He appears to be the one conflating this attack with an ISIL "thing" to score a few international sympathy votes. I find it disgusting that he is making political capital out of the deaths of 4 of his own soldiers, rather than tackle the issue that ultimately caused their deaths... his own incitement and encouragement of the illegal occupation of 4.8 miilion Palestinians.

 

You would perhaps have a point in your 3rd paragraph about the relative passivity of Palestinians if it were a level playing field with Palestinians having a standing army bristling with weaponry, tanks, F-16s, and nuclear bombs. As it is, it is Israel who mainly call the shots and hold all the cards for a peace agreement, bringing an end to incidents such as in the OP.

 

I think Netanyahu is not a member of this forum, so it would be kinda pointless. Already addressed his words and expressed my opinion. '

 

The issue which caused the soldiers deaths was being rammed and run over by a Palestinian driving a truck. Spin it.

 

And kindly, stop twisting my words. The one harping about Palestinian passivity is you - not me. Your usual nonsense notwithstanding, action does not require having equal means to carry it. Israel does not hold all the cards nor does it call all the shots. It is not solely responsible for the conflict or for resolving it. As expected, we're back to your justifying a terrorist attack, well done.

[dexterm]

14 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

I think Netanyahu is not a member of this forum, so it would be kinda pointless. Already addressed his words and expressed my opinion. '

 

The issue which caused the soldiers deaths was being rammed and run over by a Palestinian driving a truck. Spin it.

 

And kindly, stop twisting my words. The one harping about Palestinian passivity is you - not me. Your usual nonsense notwithstanding, action does not require having equal means to carry it. Israel does not hold all the cards nor does it call all the shots. It is not solely responsible for the conflict or for resolving it. As expected, we're back to your justifying a terrorist attack, well done.

>>It [Israel]is not solely responsible for the conflict or for resolving it. 
..this, your false premise, is where we fundamentally disagree. But that would best be discussed in another thread.

 

>>As expected, we're back to your justifying a terrorist attack, well done.
... again we disagree. You conveniently call people resisting an illegal occupation by attacking foreign armed soldiers "terrorists". I would reverse that nomenclature.

Edited January 10, 2017 by dexterm
spelling

[Morch]

31 minutes ago, dexterm said:

>>It [Israel]is not solely responsible for the conflict or for resolving it. 
..this, your false premise, is where we fundamentally disagree. But that would best be discussed in another thread.

 

>>As expected, we're back to your justifying a terrorist attack, well done.
... again we disagree. You conveniently call people resisting an illegal occupation by attacking foreign armed soldiers "terrorists". I would reverse that nomenclature.

 

It is not "my" premise, nor is it "false". Pretty much how things are viewed globally. There are no views of consequences which conform to your one sided take. Not even the ones you cherry pick from. As usual, bringing an issue up, then claiming it fits for another topic. 

 

You can hide behind "nomenclature" all you like. At the end of the day, you justify a terrorist attack. And it wouldn't be the first time, as pointed out earlier.

[The Deerhunter]

11 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Both lines were quoted from the Elvis Costello song "The Other Side of Summer", which was linked above.

I am obviously very familiar with the songs of the Beatles and Pink Floyd, plus many others including the other Elvis but am hard pressed to think of a single song I associate with Elvis Costello.  Sorry about that.