20 percent of critically-ill patients in Thailand die in ambulances while being rushed to hospitals

[Netzero]

For all of the talk about traffic deaths and horrible Thai driving practices - this is ONE of the worst I have seen. I have not seen this anywhere else. No giving way to Ambulances or other emergency vehicles. I lived in KL and did not see this behavior.

 

Thai police need to make traffic stops - not just do roadblocks! If they (legitimately) see a traffic violation - like not giving way to an Ambulance they need to pull that vehicle over and give them a ticket. Current practice means no ramification for illegal and dangerous road behavior because Thai police to no pull cars over.

[silent]

13 hours ago, hanuman2543 said:

Because they bring the patients to the hospital which pays the biggest commission. 2 years ago I had a motorbike accident in CM. Instead of bringing me to a government hospital 200m down the road, they first drove me home to pick up my insurance details and then to a private hospital. The hospital charged for cleaning the wounds, some plaster, pain killers, bandages and a 30 second visit from one of their doctors in the ER 4500 Baht. The ambulance drivers only left after they were paid for the "delivery" of me.

Just think if they were being given a finder's fee too.

[maoro2013]

I have never witnessed a situation, in Thailand, where motorists give a damn about ambulances, fire trucks or police vehicles with lights and sirens on the go. In  my country these things are policed, and I would always give way to the emergency vehicles. Its to do with education I would suspect.

[hansnl]

16 hours ago, sweatalot said:

" unintentional blocking of ambulances by motorists "

 

unintenional? I doubt this

Just say: INTENTIONAL!

Simply because no Thai driver, yes THAI, wants to give way to another car, motorbike, bicycle, pedestrian, or whatever, it's a bl**dy face thing.

Shameful behaviour bordering on criminal.

 

 

Big trucks and buses are bigger.

Edited January 17, 2017 by hansnl

[little mary sunshine]

With the carnage on the roads, and the

speeding, I thought the death rate on

the way to the hospital would be

much greater than 20%.

[robertthesculptor]

Unintentional my ass....I see almost daily, ambulances with lights and sirens blocked by selfish drivers and oblivious ones. There needs to be....By caring spiritual and civic leaders a retraining of the citizenry, to value life....Human life as well...There is a huge amount of, it isn't me so <deleted> it, among people I have observed.

 

[callcharlie2001]

Does Thailand have many (or any) medical helicopters & landing pads on hospitals with level 1 trauma centers?

[biplanebluey]

1 hour ago, toenail said:

If Thai drivers were  ever taught the rules of driving & police enforced  the laws &.., society took the attitude of obeying rules of the road.,. I think this country would not have this problem

 

They are taught!!!---------- they get 5 hours of it all drummed into then !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[hobobo]

17 hours ago, thedemon said:

I followed an ambulance with lights and siren blaring last week on the expressway for about 30km.

 

I was wondering why they drove a critically ill patient past at least half a dozen hospitals.

 

But of course, I always get as far out of their way as possible, despite some scepticism.

They could have been going to pick up a patient or an accident victim.

[akampa]

check out this piece of work !

 

 

[mick220675]

I think part of the problem is a accident victim is taken to there local hospital. The facility's are poor and can only offer basic first aid, so they are then put in a ambulance and transfer'd to the provinces capital where the hospital has operating facility's.

 

A patient can be in there local hospital in 20 min's, but it can take well over a hour to get to a good hospital. If you are seriously ill the first hour is the time when you can be saved. 

 

 

[SOTIRIOS]

...define 'ambulance'.....

 

...a pickup bed is NOT an ambulance....

 

...then there is handling and positioning of the patient.....

 

...I had a friend in ICU last June.....he was choking on his phlegm.....

 

....I asked them to put him in a 'semi-Fowler' position......it saved his life....

[iancnx]

I am a First Responder, and a First Aid Instructor.  I have given my wife strict instructions to pile me in the car and drive me to hospital herself.  I consider I have a much better chance of survival than wait for the mistreatment and lack of first aid knowledge of the local hospital taxi's.  Nearest village clinic has no defibrillator.  Hospital is  20 mins drive.  If I suffer something catastrophic I die in either scenario.  Otherwise my vote goes to my missus.

 

it goes without saying of course you slow down and pull over to give way to any emergency vehicle.  The issue here is there is no law.  And I have witnessed on several occasions ambulances using 'blue lights' and 'sirens' for non life threatening taxi runs from my village.  It will take a generation to change the mindsets indeed.

[DM07]

There would even be a problem, if the morons on the streets here would know, how to open a safety- line for an ambulance and were even willing to do it: since every bit of space on the road is completely blocked, there is no way for a willing driver, to go!

 

[JAG]

There appears to be competition [baht] between the Toyota pickup rescue teams, who seem to be highly territorial with a gang mentality, and hospital ambulances. Ask somebody local that is well-connected and you are likely to learn that the pickup cowboys have been known to harvest body parts enroute to emergency rooms. So long as this kind of corruption is allowed to persist, what is the likelihood of improvement in legitimate ambulance practices?

I can't speak for any other part of the country, but I have had some interaction with my local (Chiang Rai) rescue foundation. They were volunteers, enthusiastic, and with rudimentary equipment and first aid skills ( taught by some local doctors and nurses).

Not of course comparable with a sophisticated western ambulance and it's highly trained paramedics. Better than nothing else, and outside of the big cities there is nothing else.

I totally agree with all the comments on ignorant selfish driving.

[saminoz]

16 hours ago, khunpa said:

Here in Chiang Mai, we have traffic lights actually creating the traffic jams. You get red light for like e.g. 4-5 minutes and then green light for 15 seconds, if you are lucky.

 

Every time I sit and wait at the red light, I wonder if there might also be some high-end police boss who is also sitting there in his car and maybe thinking... "I could make this smarter and will send a person out to fix this..." (would require a minimum of brain-activity and effort)

 

But so far I guess no Police Boss seem to have figured it out yet. So we all just sit there happily waiting, while the traffic jam builds up... I guess the waiting is overwhelmed by the great feeling of pure joy and excitement, when being 1 of the 3 cars allowed to cross the road, when the green light finally turns on.

 

Not sure if this could save lives.. Might need a large committee set up and some expert statements to figure that out.

 

 

The Police boss is probably the one with his siren blaring passing you all on the wrong side of the road!  The timing of the lights not only don't affect him, they give him a chance to use his light and siren toys and, most importantly, show everyone how important HE is!

 

Of course, the fact that this behaviour tends to reinforce the belief in most Thais (because they share the same infantile mindset) that the lights and sirens are being abused, is a matter of supreme indifference to these selfish, egotistical little government play actors.

 

True disciples of the silly little general.

Edited January 17, 2017 by saminoz
typo

[ftpjtm]

16 hours ago, nottocus said:

Bit hard to move when in gridlock.

In the US we manage to move to the side in grid lock. Look in the mirror, see which way everyone behind you is moving, and inch in that direction. Exactly that happened to my Thai wife and I while driving in the US a few weeks ago, and it makes her so angry to know that Thai drivers would never extend the same courtesy. 

[jerojero]

Enforcement of traffic laws needed. Said a thousand times over. PM is obviously deaf.

[Happyman58]

Question ? Do Thai drivers actually know what an ambulance siren is used for or do they just think oh wow loud noise and just stay in the ambulances way. I think they really dont care as long it is me me me first

[saminoz]

26 minutes ago, ftpjtm said:

In the US we manage to move to the side in grid lock. Look in the mirror, see which way everyone behind you is moving, and inch in that direction. Exactly that happened to my Thai wife and I while driving in the US a few weeks ago, and it makes her so angry to know that Thai drivers would never extend the same courtesy. 

Hard to move to the side when it is already nose to tail with impatient car drivers creating an extra lane.......or food stalls!!

 

[Sydebolle]

Here you go - would love to see the faces of all those tussies behind their unpaid steering wheels when Rambo comes down the road ploughing the road free of those idiots 

[user82374298374]

18 hours ago, daveAustin said:

A lot of truth in that; the me thing, which is wholly un-Buddhist.

 

It is, however, wholly Asian.

[Ceruhe]

Just 20%? My guesstimate would've been higher if asked. Much higher even if it's during the time where the traffic police "works" lol

 

I'm looking forward to the next article in a few hours or days from some big shot announcing whatever something something lip service that will be changed and never see the light of day ever again. Just another one of those "You reap what you sow" situations that will just continue to get disregarded.

 

I do would like to make a case that ambulances also are in need of a siren overall, I'd welcome a more uniform siren sound as opposed to a different tune on every other one, but very much would like them to ramp up their volume a bit as well. 6/10 I can barely hear directly behind me, let alone 2 car lenghts away. Usually see them long before I hear anything and that is not counting the ones that drive with their emergency lights on but sirens off.

 

Personally also not a fan of those islands(?) that separate out/incoming traffic with a U-Turn every 1.5km or so. I actually thought that was a really great idea when I first arrived in Thailand and was driven to my home, but after some while and seeing it in practice, it's causing more problems than I could argue for their use. U-turning here is usually without a traffic light, getting to turn can be quite time consuming, either there is a lot of traffic and no selfish bastard ever lets you turn, the speed gap between the turtle you are waiting on and the Mach 32905472340234 car just approaching and closing said safe turn distance again happens a crap ton to me, motorsais that are finding all the sweet spot driving some small distance behind some car cutting your turn short again with another car lined up, other cars u-turning the opposite end and blocking your vision quite a lot. Then of course my favorite, that kind of "single" car approching where you just can't tell fast enough if it's safe enough to turn and get flashed to tell you to get the <deleted> out BigShots way, regardless if you've actually stood there for some while already, had your hand brakes on and went shopping at 7/11 because you just can't get your turn in. Yes, I flash back because I'm immature and 0-100 pissed of instantly at that.

Not to mention all the wrong way drivers (though mostly motorsais) that come with it. Checked a few instances like HomePro/Watsadu etc. clogging in at a good avarage of 1km before being able to U-turn, my temptation to wrong way has been tested plenty of times already just thinking of the wasted time and fuel because of this retarded road "design", can't really blame bunch of people for doing it tbh

 

Ah well, sorry for ranting, most any of you know all that stuff already anyway and it'll fall of deaf ears all over again as well.

[hdkane]

One reason why I left Bangkok...I now live walking distance to the hospital...

[CliffH]

According to that well known Bangkok newspaper today, the fine for blocking an emergency vehicle with its lights flashing is UP TO 500 baht.  I spotted this on Beach Road Pattaya this morning, by the Pattaya's only traffic light controlled working pedestrian crossing, in front of the soi 9 police station.  Strange set of priorities!

[speckio]

only 20% ???? i figure it would have been much higher... there was an ambulance stuck in front of my condo for like 15 minutes with its lights and sirens blaring 2 days ago ... this has actually been a problem for the last 20 years and its unlikely to change anytime soon.

 

its common knowledge that if you are hurt really bad and have to take an ambulance good chance you won't make it to the hospital alive.

 

 

 

[apalink_thailand]

Part of the problem is that often the drivers will put on their lights and sirens even when there is no emergency or they are not carrying critically ill patients. Its well known to most motorists that these drivers just put them on in hopes that they can get through traffic faster than other vehicles. 

[hotchilli]

Possibly two main factors for this statistic,
First most EMS crews scrape up the patient and blaze a trail to a hospital, giving no road-side care/stabalisation or life saving practices within the ambulance, they just try to get you to a doctor before you bleed out & expire or run out of oxygen!

Second, blazing a trail on some roads is reduced to a crawl depending on time of the day, ie office hours, school runs etc

Thai people in the most might move an inch but not more, in heavy traffic they either hold their position or simply cannot move!

 

In my home country most police listen to emergency response calls with ambulances, a police car in the area will often attend the vicinity to make sure the ambulance has a clear path.

Having said that ambulances always carry highly trained paramedics and or doctors if deemed necessary, the patient is examined and stabalised at the scene before transporting anywhere, also patient info/condition is radioed ahead to the hospital team so that the correct personnel are in attendance to minimise any delays on arrival!

[ChidlomDweller]

My first thought was also "move where?" If the roads are already a parking lot.  I haven't personally seen this behavior described here of people not moving even if they could.  But then I don't drive here.  

 

If that's really true, it's consistent with the predominant ingroup-outgroup behavior in many Asian (e.g., Chinese) cultures.  Westerners tend to look at the world in terms of values of what's right and wrong.  In many Asian cultures, it's looking after your ingroup first, the others be damned.  That's why you see so many examples here of people treating others shabbily, or standing by the worst POS of a human being because he's family.

[hobz]

Thailand is a Thai country. Thai people should be allowed to drive however they want and do what they want. 

 

 

I'm starting to side with the PM on this.. there's nothing that can be done ... the people have decided to drive like idiots.. nothing can be done.