Whey powder, casein protein etc - do I need these?

[simon43]

Tropo, good advice to buy the whey protein in Thailand from Club-Protein.  I will be in Bangkok for a few weeks in April and I can have it sent to my hotel.

 

According to their website, they will mail it to Myanmar, but I have a very poor track record of getting anything delivered to me in Myanmar from overseas, (that means zero items sent to me have actually been delivered).

 

Since I don't have cooking facilities, I can't buy meat and chicken in the supermarket.  There is an extremely poor choice of ready-cooked meats, so I rely on eating meat in the Thai restaurant.  Some of the dishes, such as chicken in tamarind sauce are very tasty, and there are many dishes with vegetables.

 

Milk is available but, like Thailand, seems to suffer from shelf-life problems, (ie, it is bad when you open the bottle).

 

But Myanmar has extremely good natural yogurts.  I buy these to add a spoonful or two to my homemade salads.

 

Finally for eggs, since I cannot cook, I have about 4 friend eggs each week from my hotel breakfast.  The hotel cook offers a choice of friend egg or no fried egg, so I limit my weekly intake (not keen on fried foods).

[transam]

5 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Tropo, good advice to buy the whey protein in Thailand from Club-Protein.  I will be in Bangkok for a few weeks in April and I can have it sent to my hotel.

 

According to their website, they will mail it to Myanmar, but I have a very poor track record of getting anything delivered to me in Myanmar from overseas, (that means zero items sent to me have actually been delivered).

 

Since I don't have cooking facilities, I can't buy meat and chicken in the supermarket.  There is an extremely poor choice of ready-cooked meats, so I rely on eating meat in the Thai restaurant.  Some of the dishes, such as chicken in tamarind sauce are very tasty, and there are many dishes with vegetables.

 

Milk is available but, like Thailand, seems to suffer from shelf-life problems, (ie, it is bad when you open the bottle).

 

But Myanmar has extremely good natural yogurts.  I buy these to add a spoonful or two to my homemade salads.

 

Finally for eggs, since I cannot cook, I have about 4 friend eggs each week from my hotel breakfast.  The hotel cook offers a choice of friend egg or no fried egg, so I limit my weekly intake (not keen on fried foods).

Lots of protein in veg....Google it...Even in beer, your body don't care where it comes from.....

[JayBird]

I get my protein from BPMuscle (Animal Brand protein).  They sometimes do same-day delivery in Bangkok.  Once they delivered it about 2 hours after I ordered it online.

 

But again, I've been accused of burning way too much money on protein and other pills.  Not unusual for me to spend about 20k/mo

 

Yeah.... don't do that I do unless you are spending too much time working out and have the money (bodybuilding is not only my hobby but its about the only thing that gets me out :) )

 

 

[tropo]

22 hours ago, Craig krup said:

Spot reduction doesn't exist. I've got ripped abs (oooo! - "Upload a picture, big talk!!), and 7% bodyfat.  

2

I'm not doubting that you think you're 7% bodyfat, but asking how you determined that you are. That's a very specific number which would suggest you've had it tested by an accurate method. What method did you use? Was it done in Thailand?

 

(There's no need to post pictures LOL)

[JayBird]

11 hours ago, tropo said:

I'm not doubting that you think you're 7% bodyfat, but asking how you determined that you are. That's a very specific number which would suggest you've had it tested by an accurate method. What method did you use? Was it done in Thailand?

 

(There's no need to post pictures LOL)

 

I know of at least two hospitals (Bangkok Hospital and either Bumrungrund or Samitevj?) that have a special sports clinic section.  Within it is a body composition scanner (not the cheap ones you find in the mall).  They are relatively accurate (and expensive) compared to most of the mainstream stuff.  I remember checking their price online and it was well over 30k USD each, so opted to NOT buy one

 

Although whatever number they spit out, its not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.  What you are looking for is consistency in measurements with the same device (if tracking changes in body composition).

 

Relatively speaking, if you are male and don't have any thick-skin problems, at 7% or so you should start to see abdominal muscles peeking through.  At 2% you start to look like the muscled skeleton in biology class.  At 0% you die.

 

 

[tfc]

I'm midway to approaching the "older" segment but FWIW when I got back into training I spent about a month doing daily bodyweight exercises primarily to get in touch with my body, "grease the groove," and make sure my internal structure *felt* correct.  I focused on push-ups, squats and pull-ups, all just for one single repetition but done very slowly, perhaps over 60-120 seconds.  My aim was to get my form right by focusing on my internal structure and making sure that everything felt *connected.*

 

I realize that this can come across as very ambiguous in writing and YMMV but it helped me greatly when I transitioned to doing 5-8 reps then 8-10 reps (at faster but moderate speed) of each and I found that my time spent doing that transferred easily to using free weights and machines in the gym.

 

I've been on a "intermittent fasting" diet ( close to the "warrior diet") for 5 years and its kinda of controversial in some circles but it worked for me in terms of cutting fat and maintaining stable energy levels throughout my day.  It's not for everyone though.  My best friend curses it.

 

I don't take protein supplements but glutamine after workouts seems to help with recovery.

 

 

 

 

 

[Orac]

20 hours ago, simon43 said:

Tropo, good advice to buy the whey protein in Thailand from Club-Protein.  I will be in Bangkok for a few weeks in April and I can have it sent to my hotel.

 

According to their website, they will mail it to Myanmar, but I have a very poor track record of getting anything delivered to me in Myanmar from overseas, (that means zero items sent to me have actually been delivered).

 

Since I don't have cooking facilities, I can't buy meat and chicken in the supermarket.  There is an extremely poor choice of ready-cooked meats, so I rely on eating meat in the Thai restaurant.  Some of the dishes, such as chicken in tamarind sauce are very tasty, and there are many dishes with vegetables.

 

Milk is available but, like Thailand, seems to suffer from shelf-life problems, (ie, it is bad when you open the bottle).

 

But Myanmar has extremely good natural yogurts.  I buy these to add a spoonful or two to my homemade salads.

 

Finally for eggs, since I cannot cook, I have about 4 friend eggs each week from my hotel breakfast.  The hotel cook offers a choice of friend egg or no fried egg, so I limit my weekly intake (not keen on fried foods).

 

Might be worth giving Club Protein a call if you are interested in having it delivered to Myanmar to see if she had problems with other deliveries. It is just a one woman operation and Korn there speaks good english and is very helpful. I have been buying from her for a few years now (following a recommendation on here from Tropo) and have had no problems at all.

[tropo]

7 hours ago, JayBird said:

 

I know of at least two hospitals (Bangkok Hospital and either Bumrungrund or Samitevj?) that have a special sports clinic section.  Within it is a body composition scanner (not the cheap ones you find in the mall).  They are relatively accurate (and expensive) compared to most of the mainstream stuff.  I remember checking their price online and it was well over 30k USD each, so opted to NOT buy one

 

Although whatever number they spit out, its not guaranteed to be 100% accurate.  What you are looking for is consistency in measurements with the same device (if tracking changes in body composition).

 

Relatively speaking, if you are male and don't have any thick-skin problems, at 7% or so you should start to see abdominal muscles peeking through.  At 2% you start to look like the muscled skeleton in biology class.  At 0% you die.

 

 

 

I was hoping you had a location of a DEXA scanner in Thailand, that can be used for body composition scanning. That's what I use in Australia. Even a Bod Pod would be nice.  

 

I've also had hydro static body fat testing (immersion in a tank), but that's old school.

 

I'm quite interested in absolute numbers. If I want comparative testing for progress, I use pinch testing at 9 points. I found that my pinch test results correlate very closely with my DEXA results.

 

Bioelectrical impedence analysis (probably what you used in BKK) tends not to be very accurate for people with a lot of muscle mass. They work ok for the average person. 

 

At 10% true bodyfat you can see abs quite clearly, but that would depend on the individual and the pattern of fat distribution throughout their body... and also the lighting helps a lot.

[tropo]

5 hours ago, Orac said:

 

Might be worth giving Club Protein a call if you are interested in having it delivered to Myanmar to see if she had problems with other deliveries. It is just a one woman operation and Korn there speaks good english and is very helpful. I have been buying from her for a few years now (following a recommendation on here from Tropo) and have had no problems at all.

 

I might add they also carry creatine monohydrate. No fancy packaging, but it's the real McCoy. 550 baht for 250g.

[JayBird]

5 hours ago, tropo said:

I was hoping you had a location of a DEXA scanner in Thailand, that can be used for body composition scanning. That's what I use in Australia. Even a Bod Pod would be nice.  

 

I've also had hydro static body fat testing (immersion in a tank), but that's old school.

 

I'm quite interested in absolute numbers. If I want comparative testing for progress, I use pinch testing at 9 points. I found that my pinch test results correlate very closely with my DEXA results.

 

Bioelectrical impedence analysis (probably what you used in BKK) tends not to be very accurate for people with a lot of muscle mass. They work ok for the average person. 

 

At 10% true bodyfat you can see abs quite clearly, but that would depend on the individual and the pattern of fat distribution throughout their body... and also the lighting helps a lot.

 

I didn't find a DEXA here.  The bioelectrical impedance test I like as they use the exact same machine I used when I was being tested in the Sports Training Clinics in Switzerland (so I have consistent results).

 

And yup, abs may show differently on different bodies (depending on how big your muscles are, how thin or tight your skin is, if you flex it just right, and of course if you are pumped).

 

[Craig krup]

On 3/4/2017 at 3:41 PM, simon43 said:

 

Most of the food that I eat here is fruit or vegetables. That is because there is a lack of decent cooked chicken or meat. (I have no cooking facilities).  

Canned fish. Sardines, tuna and weird misnamed "mackerel" until the cows come home*. 

 

 

[*When they can be milked or slaughtered]. 

[tropo]

5 hours ago, Craig krup said:

Canned fish. Sardines, tuna and weird misnamed "mackerel" until the cows come home*. 

 

 

[*When they can be milked or slaughtered]. 

 

What is the correct name for the "mackerel"?

[Craig krup]

8 hours ago, tropo said:

What is the correct name for the "mackerel"?

 

Mackerel is an oily tuna relative - mad colours, best cooked quickly after catching. Pelagic. What's inside a can in SE Asia if it says "Mackerel" seems quite different. 

[transam]

2 minutes ago, Craig krup said:

 

Mackerel is an oily tuna relative - mad colours, best cooked quickly after catching. Pelagic. What's inside a can in SE Asia if it says "Mackerel" seems quite different. 

And great for using as bait for the bigger fish...

[Craig krup]

2 hours ago, transam said:

And great for using as bait for the bigger fish...

That's what people use them for, but I see that as a waste. There was a bloke used to catch them on the far side of Ailsa Craig (Scotland) and give them to my colleague, who couldn't refuse them, but wouldn't eat them. They're full of bones. But the trick is to pressure cook them for forty minutes on the high setting with loads of tomato puree or sieved tomato, a bit of stock, loads of garlic and onion and maybe a few carrots. The fish shrinks to about two-thirds size, acquires the texture of tuna and all the bones are like canned fish: you can just eat them. With a load of spuds they're sensational. 

[tropo]

2 hours ago, Craig krup said:

 

Mackerel is an oily tuna relative - mad colours, best cooked quickly after catching. Pelagic. What's inside a can in SE Asia if it says "Mackerel" seems quite different. 

 

I didn't think they were real mackerel, but seeing as you brought up the subject, I'd be very interested to know what they are. My wife loves them.

[Craig krup]

2 hours ago, tropo said:

I didn't think they were real mackerel, but seeing as you brought up the subject, I'd be very interested to know what they are. My wife loves them.

I like them too. Big oval Roza Big Mack cans are pretty good. But I'm not sure what's in them, and the little 120g tins of "mackerel" are definitely just sardines, or sardinella gibbosa (which always taste muddy). 

[tropo]

2 hours ago, Craig krup said:

I like them too. Big oval Roza Big Mack cans are pretty good. But I'm not sure what's in them, and the little 120g tins of "mackerel" are definitely just sardines, or sardinella gibbosa (which always taste muddy). 

 

I like sardines, so let's just call them that LOL. 

[transam]

11 hours ago, tropo said:

I like sardines, so let's just call them that LOL. 

Mackerel, wish I had a quid for everyone l caught off the English south coast.  When fully grown they are about a foot long..

 

[Khamtam Sutyoddi]

On 3/5/2017 at 1:40 PM, simon43 said:

Tropo, good advice to buy the whey protein in Thailand from Club-Protein.  I will be in Bangkok for a few weeks in April and I can have it sent to my hotel.

 

According to their website, they will mail it to Myanmar, but I have a very poor track record of getting anything delivered to me in Myanmar from overseas, (that means zero items sent to me have actually been delivered).

 

Since I don't have cooking facilities, I can't buy meat and chicken in the supermarket.  There is an extremely poor choice of ready-cooked meats, so I rely on eating meat in the Thai restaurant.  Some of the dishes, such as chicken in tamarind sauce are very tasty, and there are many dishes with vegetables.

 

Milk is available but, like Thailand, seems to suffer from shelf-life problems, (ie, it is bad when you open the bottle).

 

But Myanmar has extremely good natural yogurts.  I buy these to add a spoonful or two to my homemade salads.

 

Finally for eggs, since I cannot cook, I have about 4 friend eggs each week from my hotel breakfast.  The hotel cook offers a choice of friend egg or no fried egg, so I limit my weekly intake (not keen on fried foods).

About proteins, I just discovered this local brand that manufacture protein bars made only with natural ingredients in Bangkok and I'm actually getting along pretty well with those. Using them as post-workout and meal replacement. The company is called Ironfit Food.

[JayBird]

57 minutes ago, Khamtam Sutyoddi said:

About proteins, I just discovered this local brand that manufacture protein bars made only with natural ingredients in Bangkok and I'm actually getting along pretty well with those. Using them as post-workout and meal replacement. The company is called Ironfit Food.

If that is the: The Original Plus – High Protein Bar

That is 260 calories / 24g of protein, so about 10.8 calories / protein.  A bit high if meant as a source of protein, but not too bad if meant as a meal supplement.  (Otherwise it looks tasty!)

 

[tropo]

2 hours ago, Khamtam Sutyoddi said:

About proteins, I just discovered this local brand that manufacture protein bars made only with natural ingredients in Bangkok and I'm actually getting along pretty well with those. Using them as post-workout and meal replacement. The company is called Ironfit Food.

 

They look like a tasty snack for times when you're in a hurry and need some protein. It's an expensive way to get protein, though. For example, the 90 baht 24g total protein bar has 18g of whey protein, which works out at 5 baht per gram of protein. This is 5 times more than I pay for whey protein from Club protein. 

[robblok]

Even my dog knows you should use whey or casein if you want to stay low calories but high in protein (proven many times that high protein during a diet works best keeping your muscle and losing more fat)

 

[Craig krup]

On 3/5/2017 at 1:29 PM, tropo said:

I'm not doubting that you think you're 7% bodyfat, but asking how you determined that you are. That's a very specific number which would suggest you've had it tested by an accurate method. What method did you use? Was it done in Thailand?

 

(There's no need to post pictures LOL)

 

Back in 1994 when I was at uni there was a bloke doing an exercise physiology experiment. At the time I was on the "bulking up" phase - whole bags of oven chips, six eggs, tin of beans, most of an 800g loaf...I was a fat b******d compared to how I normally looked. I could still see my abs but I had love handles. But getting immersion weighing with residual gas analysis for free was too good an offer to miss. So I sat on the stool in Glasgow Uni's circular deep pool and got weighed under water, popping up and breathing the inert gas at the end, so that they could work out ow much air I'd had in my lungs. It came out at 7.07 and 7.57. God only knows how low it had been before, but I was getting massive cramps and twitches, which (apparently) is the myelin sheaths on your nerves falling apart. In 2014 in Bangkok I tried my pals fancy $100 bio-impedance scales. Stupidly I used them after sweating like **** in the gym for the best part of an hour, (apparently) makes you seem fatter because the water is effectively measured as muscle but the fat remains. It showed 8%, with 0.8% visceral fat. My pal said that he was always 1% under if he used them before the CV wrkout, rather than after. So - basically - I've managed to maintain 7% bodyfat for over 20 years through 1) eating no garbage, 2) high-intensity interval sessions (just finished one, actually), and 3) weight-training to absolute failure with short recoveries. 

 

I eat a huge amount of starch, and manage to consume more than 150g of protein from food without even trying. 

[robblok]

10 hours ago, Craig krup said:

 

Back in 1994 when I was at uni there was a bloke doing an exercise physiology experiment. At the time I was on the "bulking up" phase - whole bags of oven chips, six eggs, tin of beans, most of an 800g loaf...I was a fat b******d compared to how I normally looked. I could still see my abs but I had love handles. But getting immersion weighing with residual gas analysis for free was too good an offer to miss. So I sat on the stool in Glasgow Uni's circular deep pool and got weighed under water, popping up and breathing the inert gas at the end, so that they could work out ow much air I'd had in my lungs. It came out at 7.07 and 7.57. God only knows how low it had been before, but I was getting massive cramps and twitches, which (apparently) is the myelin sheaths on your nerves falling apart. In 2014 in Bangkok I tried my pals fancy $100 bio-impedance scales. Stupidly I used them after sweating like **** in the gym for the best part of an hour, (apparently) makes you seem fatter because the water is effectively measured as muscle but the fat remains. It showed 8%, with 0.8% visceral fat. My pal said that he was always 1% under if he used them before the CV wrkout, rather than after. So - basically - I've managed to maintain 7% bodyfat for over 20 years through 1) eating no garbage, 2) high-intensity interval sessions (just finished one, actually), and 3) weight-training to absolute failure with short recoveries. 

 

I eat a huge amount of starch, and manage to consume more than 150g of protein from food without even trying. 

I have a hard time getting 150 g from foods only, got a slow metabolic rate. Still quite muscular but metabolic rate sucks and I always need to keep my food in check to make sure I don't get fat. 

[Craig krup]

8 hours ago, robblok said:

I have a hard time getting 150 g from foods only, got a slow metabolic rate. Still quite muscular but metabolic rate sucks and I always need to keep my food in check to make sure I don't get fat. 

 

I don't think I eat much more than 3,000 kcals. A big bowl of oats soaked in water and skimmed milk powder, with nuts and fruit, is about 45g. A lunch of split pea soup and a couple of cottage cheese sandwiches is about the same again. An evening meal of 250g of pasta, a couple of tins of sardines, a tin of pulses (say chickpeas or kidney beans) and a load of veg is about 90g. I'm well over 150g most days. I just 1) don't consume empty calories of sugar and fat, and 2) pick starches which have loads of protein (like oats and pasta). 

[robblok]

32 minutes ago, Craig krup said:

 

I don't think I eat much more than 3,000 kcals. A big bowl of oats soaked in water and skimmed milk powder, with nuts and fruit, is about 45g. A lunch of split pea soup and a couple of cottage cheese sandwiches is about the same again. An evening meal of 250g of pasta, a couple of tins of sardines, a tin of pulses (say chickpeas or kidney beans) and a load of veg is about 90g. I'm well over 150g most days. I just 1) don't consume empty calories of sugar and fat, and 2) pick starches which have loads of protein (like oats and pasta). 

Your eating at least 1000 calories more then me, even at maintenance. No wonder you have no problems getting your protein requirements. 

[Craig krup]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

Your eating at least 1000 calories more then me, even at maintenance. No wonder you have no problems getting your protein requirements. 

 

Well, if you've got a load of muscle you'll burn a load of extra calories, plus I do hard CV, plus I like going for long walks, plus "healthy" food isn't fully digested, so 3,000 is probably nearer 2,700: a load of it comes out of your backside!

 

Having said all of that, I eat less in Thailand - because you certainly don't burn much staying warm - and it is more of a struggle getting protein "in passing". Rice has almost half the nitrogen of "western" starches. If you've a pressure cooker the various dried beans from TescoLotus are a good option. I think they're about 44 baht a kg, which is a load of protein. Buy a chicken carcass from the butchery counter, soak the beans, pressure cook the lot with veg, chilies, garlic and curry powder, hand carcass to your most pain in the arse soi dog and you've got five massive high protein meals for not a lot of money. 

[robblok]

17 minutes ago, Craig krup said:

 

Well, if you've got a load of muscle you'll burn a load of extra calories, plus I do hard CV, plus I like going for long walks, plus "healthy" food isn't fully digested, so 3,000 is probably nearer 2,700: a load of it comes out of your backside!

 

Having said all of that, I eat less in Thailand - because you certainly don't burn much staying warm - and it is more of a struggle getting protein "in passing". Rice has almost half the nitrogen of "western" starches. If you've a pressure cooker the various dried beans from TescoLotus are a good option. I think they're about 44 baht a kg, which is a load of protein. Buy a chicken carcass from the butchery counter, soak the beans, pressure cook the lot with veg, chilies, garlic and curry powder, hand carcass to your most pain in the arse soi dog and you've got five massive high protein meals for not a lot of money. 

I think I would qualify for a load of muscles.. quite sure of it after all the lifting I do. I can do 5 sets of 5 with 170 kg of dead-lift, I do 4 sets of 8 with 120 kg of bench. I just have a slow metabolism, i have learned to live with it. I have been working for a real long time and real consistent for at least 6 years now. Just don't burn much and always have to look out what I am eating. So for me protein powders are a must. I do have a slow thyroid proven by tests. I could take medicine for it but the times I had it did not help my metabolic rate much and I had a lot of trouble sleeping.

 

 

[Craig krup]

25 minutes ago, robblok said:

I think I would qualify for a load of muscles.. quite sure of it after all the lifting I do. I can do 5 sets of 5 with 170 kg of dead-lift, I do 4 sets of 8 with 120 kg of bench. I just have a slow metabolism, i have learned to live with it. I have been working for a real long time and real consistent for at least 6 years now. Just don't burn much and always have to look out what I am eating. So for me protein powders are a must. I do have a slow thyroid proven by tests. I could take medicine for it but the times I had it did not help my metabolic rate much and I had a lot of trouble sleeping.

 

 

I, by contrast, do run a bit "hot". My granny had an overactive thyroid, and when I ended up in front of the doctor doing a Robin Williams act they tested me. I was "within a normal range". That is, pretty f'kin high.