World scorns Thai lies on rights, democracy

[AGareth2]

8 hours ago, MartinBangkok said:

For me as a 'farang' whoevers in charge in Thailand does not affect me. But for the Thai people? Well they are slaves of the 0.1% mafia elite. They are unfortunately accustomed to this for centuries. So not much change for them. True. But are we wrong feeling sorry for them and trying to convey the truth to them? I give you a quote from Goethe which is so true regarding Thailand:

"The best slave is the one who thinks he is free"

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Sent from my SM-N920C using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

the thing is they are beginning to know they are not

[halloween]

18 hours ago, yellowboat said:

Yes, stolen at gunpoint.  That is what happens when a government is deposed by soldiers.  Soldiers have guns. 

 

The democracy was working.  It elected a prime minister.  The farce is what we are witnessing now: Bike lanes, beach chairs, redundant steering committees, panels, sub panels, sub committees. 

 

Of course he is allowed to offer his opinion.  His opinion then may get challenged.  It is an open discussion.  Something not available in Thailand under martial law.   

The democracy was working? That may be your delusion, it's not mine. Besides your list of trivialities, you might also consider those being prosecuted, and those yet to be, for their abuse of the democratic system.

[Ace of Pop]

He's got a funny sense of values .Thaksin bought his Position from the Poor in the NE


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[soalbundy]

and yet the happiness index lately ranked Thailand as number one. I don't think that America under Trump should sit on a high horse, they have voted for a semi literate narcissist to lead them

[darksidedog]

7 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

and yet the happiness index lately ranked Thailand as number one. I don't think that America under Trump should sit on a high horse, they have voted for a semi literate narcissist to lead them

I think you are being very generous by calling him semi literate.

[yellowboat]

34 minutes ago, halloween said:

The democracy was working? That may be your delusion, it's not mine. Besides your list of trivialities, you might also consider those being prosecuted, and those yet to be, for their abuse of the democratic system.

Working as there were elections.  There are no delusions.  There were problems, but a coup is not the answer as we can plainly see by the trivialities the junta spends its time on.  

 

If those people are prosecuted for breaking the law, then fine.  But if it is just about marginalizing those who oppose the unelected, then they will do damage to the country that will last for years.  

[AGareth2]

the report is nothing but a tissue of lies!!!!

isn't it?

[smutcakes]

4 minutes ago, yellowboat said:

Working as there were elections.  There are no delusions.  There were problems, but a coup is not the answer as we can plainly see by the trivialities the junta spends its time on.  

 

If those people are prosecuted for breaking the law, then fine.  But if it is just about marginalizing those who oppose the unelected, then they will do damage to the country that will last for years.  

If the coup was the answer, maybe it would have worked one of the previous dozen or so times.......

 

or maybe the army would of tried to solve some of the issues over some of the decades they have been in power.

[Eligius]

55 minutes ago, smutcakes said:

If the coup was the answer, maybe it would have worked one of the previous dozen or so times.......

 

or maybe the army would of tried to solve some of the issues over some of the decades they have been in power.

Right, Smutcakes! The definition of STUPIDITY is doing the same thing again and again and getting the same failed result.

 

Except that the Powers That Be here always get the result they want: deliberately ill-educated, insularised and disenfranchised serfdom for the bulk of the Thai population, TO WHOM THIS COUNTRY ACTUALLY BELONGS!

[Becker]

18 hours ago, bangkokorbust said:

How does it affect you? And yes maybe you were not in Thailand at the the time but it was close to civil war so yeah good they stepped in unless of course you prefer thousands dead.

The only people making a song and dance are farang.. So keep your nose out of it, your just a tourist.. Or like you said go elsewhere in Asia. Up to you

I was here and Thailand was not even close to a civil war. That myth has been debunked so thoroughly it's just ridiculous that some still buy into it.

What do you mean "the only people making a song and dance"? Thais are not allowed to "make a song and dance" for a reason, it's because a lot of them would if they could.

[halloween]

2 hours ago, yellowboat said:

Working as there were elections.  There are no delusions.  There were problems, but a coup is not the answer as we can plainly see by the trivialities the junta spends its time on.  

 

If those people are prosecuted for breaking the law, then fine.  But if it is just about marginalizing those who oppose the unelected, then they will do damage to the country that will last for years.  

"there were elections"  If that's where your understanding of democracy stops, there is no hope for you. Try looking for some of the other fundamentals such as an informed and educated populace, a free and critical press, and an oversight of politician's actions - all either missing or suppressed during and after your elections.

[Becker]

7 minutes ago, halloween said:

"there were elections"  If that's where your understanding of democracy stops, there is no hope for you. Try looking for some of the other fundamentals such as an informed and educated populace, a free and critical press, and an oversight of politician's actions - all either missing or suppressed during and after your elections.

I'll take some oversight to absolutely no oversight any day of the week.Since you disagree with that then there is surely no hope for you.

[garyk]

22 hours ago, clifric said:

I have lived here for more than 10 years and will continue to live here; for those respondents who find Thailand not up to their homeland standards - go back and see how that has changed while you were away. Put up or shut up - the Thais will decide if they want to control or be controlled.

 

All I see on Thai Visa is moan, moan, moan

I go back to the U.S. each year for few months. Love it. 

 

[sjaak327]

1 hour ago, halloween said:

"there were elections"  If that's where your understanding of democracy stops, there is no hope for you. Try looking for some of the other fundamentals such as an informed and educated populace, a free and critical press, and an oversight of politician's actions - all either missing or suppressed during and after your elections.

Actually in case of almost all ot the things you mentioned we have seen a sharp decrease. Keep trying to pretend this is better, when the facts are that the things you mentioned all have taken a nosedive. Including a far reaching amnesty for a few people further negating any oversight.

 

It is suprising and incomprehensible how the current regime gets away with things no previous elected government has even approached. Does placebo rings any bells ?

Edited March 8, 2017 by sjaak327

[Deez]

All that is needed now is for the great general to start a nuclear program and invite Dennis Rodman for a visit

[trainman34014]

Farang no unerstan Thailan !

[sandemara]

On 3/7/2017 at 7:39 AM, Laughing Gravy said:

O)ne thing I have learnt in my many years here is that Thais don't give a damn what the outside world thinks.

In fact it may work in the authorities' favour. I've seen smart politicians elsewhere enjoy massive popularity because 'outsiders' have criticised or ridiculed  them.  The general population see themselves as 'attacked' and many start to swing behind 'their' leader, as a matter of national pride.

[Bangkok Barry]

On 3/7/2017 at 7:35 AM, darksidedog said:

The Foreign Ministry has already denied this report and will undoubtedly keep on trying to peddle their garbage about respecting and protecting human rights.

But the list of respected naysayers is getting very long. The US, The UN, Amnesty, Human Rights Watch, just to start with.

The truth can only be ignored for so long, and I think those days are growing shorter.

It doesn't matter at all to the government what others think. Why? Because there are zero consequences to all their wrongdoings. Same as when governments "condemn in the strongest possible terms" when, for example, North Korea tests their nuclear weapons. Everyone and their dog knows that sanctions have little to no effect. If foreign governments banned all trade with Thailand, or banned THAI from flying into those foreign countries, then there would be a reaction from the Thai government. But for reasons that are beyond us mere mortals to understand NOTHING HAPPENS. Nothing at all.

[bangkokorbust]

Leave the junta another 5 years, they have done more in the past 2 years than all the democratically elected governments have done in the past 50!

Love what they did on lower Sukhumvit right where my condo is. Big round of applause for that effort!!

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

[ammagic]

They've a great job of destroying the economy. Give them a few more years & they'll finish the job

[bangkokorbust]

They've a great job of destroying the economy. Give them a few more years & they'll finish the job

Destroyed what can you be more specific ? The baht is a good indicator. Still bullish

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

[newcomer71]

15 minutes ago, bangkokorbust said:

Destroyed what can you be more specific ? The baht is a good indicator. Still bullish

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk
 

 

If you take baht as a good indicator for the actual economic momentum you are way way off...

[bangkokorbust]

 
If you take baht as a good indicator for the actual economic momentum you are way way off...

Anyone who thinks the economy is "destroyed" is in fantasy land.

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

[newcomer71]

Just now, bangkokorbust said:

Anyone who thinks the economy is "destroyed" is in fantasy land.

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk
 

Another deflection... You remember me a previous user that is not posting anymore... A coincidence I suppose.

[hawker9000]

On ‎3‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 3:04 AM, bangkokorbust said:

How does it affect you? And yes maybe you were not in Thailand at the the time but it was close to civil war so yeah good they stepped in unless of course you prefer thousands dead.

The only people making a song and dance are farang.. So keep your nose out of it, your just a tourist.. Or like you said go elsewhere in Asia. Up to you

What incredible BS.  I was in Thailand too, and civil war was never even a minute possibility.  'Except in the minds perhaps of a few cranks here on TV.   "Thousands dead"...   Get back on those meds.

 

Yes, there was a degree of unrest, and it was growing.  Yes, there were protests.  Yes, PTP was off its leash.  But there's no point in overstating what really happened.  Nor in trying to silence opinions different from yours.  (The "do what I say or leave" thing is so hopelessly pathetic; it really is.)   Arguing justification for what happened in May 2014 everyone draws their own conclusions, but you do need to stick to at least some reasonable semblance of the facts.

 

And no, "the only people making a song and dance" today are obviously NOT just farang.  Get a grip.

 

[halloween]

14 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

Actually in case of almost all ot the things you mentioned we have seen a sharp decrease. Keep trying to pretend this is better, when the facts are that the things you mentioned all have taken a nosedive. Including a far reaching amnesty for a few people further negating any oversight.

 

It is suprising and incomprehensible how the current regime gets away with things no previous elected government has even approached. Does placebo rings any bells ?

But I am not claiming this is a democracy, only a pathway to a better version of it. Things are far from democratic now, they were just as far before. All you are claiming is that a non-democratic form of government is less democratic than the farce of democracy previous. Does damned by faint praise ring any bells?

[sjaak327]

9 minutes ago, halloween said:

But I am not claiming this is a democracy, only a pathway to a better version of it. Things are far from democratic now, they were just as far before. All you are claiming is that a non-democratic form of government is less democratic than the farce of democracy previous. Does damned by faint praise ring any bells?

Of course it is, as that democracy wasn't a farce. You only call it a farce because the electorate kept voting in parties you seem to dislike.

 

If you still haven't figured out that we are most definitely not on a pathway to a better version of democracy (as opposed to the real people's constitution of 1997) there might be no hope you would ever find the clue. Maybe read up on the 'approved' charter to see exactly what kind of democracy Thailand will get.

 

One advantage for you is that the Thai electorate voting in parties you don't like has been made almost completely inconsequential. Better version of democracy, thanks for the laugh !

Edited March 8, 2017 by sjaak327

[halloween]

7 minutes ago, sjaak327 said:

Of course it is, as that democracy wasn't a farce. You only call it a farce because the electorate kept voting in parties you seem to dislike.

 

If you still haven't figured out that we are most definitely not on a pathway to a better version of democracy (as opposed to the real people's constitution of 1997) there might be no hope you would ever find the clue. Maybe read up on the 'approved' charter to see exactly what kind of democracy Thailand will get.

 

One advantage for you is that the Thai electorate voting in parties you don't like has been made almost completely inconsequential. Better version of democracy, thanks for the laugh !

Really? Then give me just one working democracy to which the Thai version compared well. Give me one working democracy where members of the ruling party are PAID by a fugitive criminal to vote to his order, or where a party list is stacked with family members, criminal cronies and thugs facing serious criminal charges.

[sjaak327]

14 minutes ago, halloween said:

Really? Then give me just one working democracy to which the Thai version compared well. Give me one working democracy where members of the ruling party are PAID by a fugitive criminal to vote to his order, or where a party list is stacked with family members, criminal cronies and thugs facing serious criminal charges.

Haha the fugitive criminal argument roars it's ugly head. Since he was convicted in Thailand, by a Thai court, one would think the term is highly subject to inflation. Especially considering there are quite a few people currently in appointed leadership roles that have exempted themselves from any prosecution for past and future crimes.

 

Not sure why it would be wrong for a political party to place family members on their voting list, after all, the party still needs to secure votes before those family members could ever be allowed to sit in parliament. Now those family members (such as say Prayuth brother) are sure of those positions, as the electorate cannot possibly make their voices heard.

 

Another instance where the situation got far worse, but I guess in your view it is ok, after all these are the good people right ?

Edited March 8, 2017 by sjaak327

[halloween]

6 minutes ago, sjaak327 said:

Haha the fugitive criminal argument roars it's ugly head. Since he was convicted in Thailand, by a Thai court, one would think the term is highly subject to inflation. Especially considering there are quite a few people currently in appointed leadership roles that have exempted themselves from any prosecution for past and future crimes.

 

Not sure why it would be wrong for a political party to place family members on their voting list, after all, the party still needs to secure votes before those family members could ever be allowed to sit in parliament. Now those family members (such as say Prayuth brother) are sure of those positions, as the electorate cannot possibly make their voices heard.

 

Another instance where the situation got far worse, but I guess in your view it is ok, after all these are the good people right ?

So no comparison - unsurprising! If you can't nominate ONE democracy that the last compared to, how can you deny that it was a farce?

Ignore the fugitive criminal then, do you know of any government whose members are paid by a 3rd party, a 3rd party allowed access to cabinet meetings? In most democracies, both would be serious criminal offences.

You don't know what's wrong with nepotism and cronyism on a party list? Do you think Chalerm could be elected any other way?

You can't defend the Shinawatra regimes so you attack the present. All I am saying is that the previous democracy was a farce, and change was needed. When democracy is restored we can judge the change.