If Thailand Adopted Tougher Immigration Rules

[Casanundra]

Let's get into the realm of future fantasy for a second and ask the following question:

If Thailand adopted tougher immigration rules that made it hard to get into the country and say implemented similar immigration policies to what we have back home in the UK and USA for example whereby you have to learn Thai, pass a Thai TOEFL/IELTS language test as well as undertake a Thai culture test and be in Thailand for a minimum of two years contributing to society, paying taxes and be married to a citizen etc...

The question is would you go for it and do the tests providing that Thailand gave you as a result of your hard work of integrating into Thai society the right to own property/land, the right to start up a company, the right to work here and all the things a foreigner would get back home.

Or

Would you up your sticks and move along and try an easier country with laxer immigration policies similar to what Thailand currently has and just get out of Dodge.

What would you do?

[lingyai]

Let's get into the realm of future fantasy for a second and ask the following question:

If Thailand adopted tougher immigration rules that made it hard to get into the country and say implemented similar immigration policies to what we have back home in the UK and USA for example whereby you have to learn Thai, pass a Thai TOEFL/IELTS language test as well as undertake a Thai culture test and be in Thailand for a minimum of two years contributing to society, paying taxes and be married to a citizen etc...

The question is would you go for it and do the tests providing that Thailand gave you as a result of your hard work of integrating into Thai society the right to own property/land, the right to start up a company, the right to work here and all the things a foreigner would get back home.

Or

Would you up your sticks and move along and try an easier country with laxer immigration policies similar to what Thailand currently has and just get out of Dodge.

What would you do?

You are not portraying the situation accurately. There are pros and cons to western countries immigration. Take America. $100 for the visa and you have to go for interview. Pain in the ass. Of course if you get it you get 6 months at a time. Many people get 10 year visas now. Here you get 2 months then have to leave. (or pay an extention). How many people would pay $100 for 6 months here? A lot. If you get a student visa to the US you don't have to report to the police station. Plus you can legally work on campus (though for only a limited amount of hours).

Edited December 26, 2006 by lingyai

[Crushdepth]

I'm not sure what you are getting at here. Thailand already HAS tougher immigration laws than the US. Way, way tougher.

Thailand is easier for the casual visitor, but getting residency in this country (let alone citizenship) is extremely difficult and time consuming.

[Sunny Valentine]

I would most likely go for it (of course after checkingthem out if I have a chance based on my specific situation).

Tougher rules might make sense, given they are published, and enforced by the book, and not by the mood of the "competent officer", who makes up and alters them as he pleases. Plus, the rules are thought out and there is a concept, that all relevant agencies stick to, not by different ministeries and entities making their own rules, ignoring the rules others have set.

Recent work permit and extension of stay is classic example of what a no-no should be.

No problem with stringent and demanding qualifications for a WP. But once you mastered that hurdle, you should be allowed to stay here, and work and make money for you and your employer and (by taxes and money spent in Thailand) the country.

Sunny

[ilyushin]

I would take language and common knowledge tests to stay for long term. Don't see a problem with it.

[junkofdavid2]

It is NOT GOOD to have this poll.

If you vote here "YES" that you are willing to go thru tougher rules, then you're really asking for it...

Edited December 26, 2006 by junkofdavid2

[hotgeekus]

Tougher immigration laws? I think we are missing the point.....before we talk about tougher immigration laws, can we first decide on the current laws being implemented everywhere the same and interpreted the same.

In USA, it is a pain in the neck I am sure, but if you pass the requirements which are black and white, then you are ok and approved. For instance, I have first hand experience on citizenship in USA. If you have five years residency, you can apply. It is a long, long process, mostly full of waiting. You send $500 for the forms, get called to give finger prints and then wait for background check. Then you get called for the test, which is quite easy.

Here, we are wondering what is going on, as border runs work for three months then get tougher in one area and easier if you go to embassy/consulate in a usa/european country (home country).

I completely understand what the laws and the new regulations are trying to propose, however, unless they all agree on a common approach with everything being inforced equally, it will never equate to USA/European system, which depends on mood/dress/attitude...

[wpcoe]

OK, how exactly are these results tabulated?

YES votes = 15

NO votes = 2

TOTAL VOTES cast = 19 ???

[jeebusjones]

Thailand is NOT the US or UK. It is a developing country that is literally just a step above the Third World.

If policies like what you suggested were implemented I'd be the first to pack my bags, but I think I'd be joined by thousands of others.

Edited December 26, 2006 by jeebusjones

[Vespa]

Thailand is NOT the US or UK. It is a developing country that is literally just a step above the Third World.

Is that why so many of their subjects are forced to prostitute themselves to make ends meet ?

Or is it their lack of social programs ?

[baboon]

No offence to the OP, but this poll has not been very well thought out. If they toughened up to this degree, the implication woud be that more folks would be granted citzenship, which is simply not going to happen.

[friend2]

the right to work here and all the things a foreigner would get back home.

I'd cut off my legs and donate them if I though i'd be getting

what's been quoted above.

Unfortunately that's simply never going to happen i'm afraid.

Any loophole being created with citizenry at the end is just a pipe dream.

They don't want you to be here, only your wallet.

<<ed Samran: references that break forum rules deleted>>

Edited December 28, 2006 by samran

[Dupont]

It's not a case of having to go home.

There are thousands of opportunites in Asia. Thailand chooses to keep one foot in the third world so its up to them. If they ever became sucessful (this is at least two generations off), thats when we would want to get out!! Keep the place poor for me anyday.

Vespa, don't know where you hang out, but I've never met any bar girl that wasn't there through choice. Lots of em have leap frogged the middle class, which is one of the reasons behind all this.

Not only are some poor people getting above themselves financially, but their (our) offspring are accessing education, meaning less poor around in future to be exploited by those nice white, ruling class in Bangkok.

The same ones that lost Thailand more money in a morning than Thaksin got away with in 6 years. Wait and see the inflow dry up when the tourists stop coming in the low season.

[sbk]

You are not portraying the situation accurately. There are pros and cons to western countries immigration. Take America. $100 for the visa and you have to go for interview. Pain in the ass. Of course if you get it you get 6 months at a time. Many people get 10 year visas now. Here you get 2 months then have to leave. (or pay an extention). How many people would pay $100 for 6 months here? A lot. If you get a student visa to the US you don't have to report to the police station. Plus you can legally work on campus (though for only a limited amount of hours).

I believe you are confusing the issue with this post. The OP is talking about immigration not tourist visas. A green card for the US is permanent , a b1-b2 visa is valid for up to 10 years.

As my husband would qualify for a green card to the US if he so chose, yes, I would go for similar rules for Thailand as well, since I would then, conversely, qualify for a similar such permanent residency here.

[tropo]

Thailand is NOT the US or UK. It is a developing country that is literally just a step above the Third World.

And that is the primary reason it's so popular. A third world country with third world prices. If Thailand made it to second or first world status, there wouldn't be much point being here.

[LivinLOS]

The US and UK require language tests to go there ??

Thailand is harder for me to stay in than the US / Europe / Oz / NZ.. In those countries there are massive benefits and an equal rights and basis under law..

Immigration for a 3rd world contry when your only a net contributor is a bit of a joke..

And sure if they gave me PR and equal rights under law (land etc) for simply taking some language proficiency tests I would do it..

[paulsmithson]

Hey I am from the Uk and I am coming to Thailand to claim asylum.

Wil I get a free house?

a free mobile phone?

Free new false teeth?

All my medical problems sorted out Free?

Will the Thai governement give me money every week to live?

Will Thai schools educate my kids for free?

Will they provide an interpreter in the schoollfor the kids?

Will I get free Thai language lessons

If they decide i am not a political refugeee wiil they pay for some top Thai wayer to fight my case throught the courts for years and years?

I could go to Europe and get all these benefits FREE! But I fancy some sunshine and wanna eat somtam

[drummer]

You have the option of a null vote. So right now, 6/41 votes weer "I don't wanna vote, I jut wanna see the results"

[thai_narak]

If I'm married to Thai just like now then I would. Otherwise, not in a million years. My only mistake was marrying my wife...

[Phil Conners]

Absurd, incorrect and biased poll, void.

[astral]

It is not a matter of a tougher policy, Thailand needs a fairer policy.

As a retired person married to a Thai lady I have no hope of getting Residence or Citizenship.

All I can get is a year by year visa, that may be revoked at any time, and will be if she predeceases me.

Yes I know I can get a retirement visa, but that means more money........

Although the UK has tightened the rules, my wife could get residence and citizenship if we chose to live in the UK.

I believe the US is similar.

[sriracha john]

apples and oranges poll

[The Dan Sai Kid]

I would totally be up for it. However, I would be looking for a return in the time inverstment. I would expect residency and citizenship to be formalities rather than unsurmountable hurdles. I would expect equal treatment and the ability to buy land.

That's like the UK and US, isn't it?

[brahmburgers]

We've been hearing about 10 year U.S. visas given w/o hassles to Thai wives of Yanks. Nothing remotely exists for farang husbands of Thai wives.

In the States, a Thai immigrant can get an address, car ownership, motorbike ownership, an electricity account, a phone account, start a business, buy land in his name, and enter parks without paying a discriminatory higher fee based on the color of his skin or the shape of his nose.

None of those things are legally allowable by a foreigner in Thailand - unless maybe if he's very rich, has friends in high places, or is one of the tiny % of farang who can get citizenship - again, only if he's very rich and well connected.

[cathyy]

The problem with this poll is that people are confusing immigration with visas. It is much, much easier to get a visa to enter Thailand than the US or UK. Particularly if you are a Thai female. Conversely, it is much, much harder to get permanent residency (PR here, Green card in the US) here in Thailand than in the US or UK. If I could get my PR by passing some tests on history and culture, and learning to read and write Thai I'd be there as soon as I had my 3 years. The sad fact is that I am unlikely to ever even be eligible for PR here, no matter how long I stay, how much I contribute to society, or how well I speak Thai.

Am I in favor of relaxing the rules for PR? Yes, of course I am. Am I in favor of relaxing the already lax rules for visiting here? No, I am in favor of the current crack-down due to the flagrant abuses of the VOA and people using it as a pseudo-PR.

[Poverty Packer]

Agree that the pole is stupid for reasons already outlined by posters. Also I would like to say that there are only 2 reasons why better than 90% of farangs chose to stay long time in Thailand. Either 1 or both of these reasons apply:

1. because hot chicks are super easy to get here and either the person has gotten one of these chicks or continuously likes to capture them

2. because Thailand has a cheap cost of living and peasant farangs can live here in, for example, a $75 house in Khon Kaen. I'm talking that they can live here for dirt spit or on a tiny miniscule fraction of the USA poverty line. These are the people who should be forced out as they contribute less than zero to the Thai economy. They are the true milkers. Round em up and get em out is what I say

Edited December 28, 2006 by Poverty Packer

[atlastaname]

Thailand is probably unique in Asia in being a country that SO many people want to go to and stay for as long as they want . If i were on the ruling junta i would look at this from a purely business point of view. The fact is that everyone who comes to Thailand spends money there , and whilst they are there doing that they are not spending their money in another country. Given this fact , i would allow anyone who wanted to come to Thailand to come and stay as long as they wanted to. Simple as that . The money inflow into Thailand would be immense , business would prosper unlike anything we see now, and the country would be enriched . The rake offs to the governent would be huge , HUGE, and even the ordinary trader would benefit because more money would be spent with him/her.

People think too deeply about things . Just let everyone in ...anyone see any problems with this? (i can almost predict some of the responces) . Thailand would become a much richer country , even if most of the increase would reside in a select fews pockets , and could then afford to run its own country how it chooses rather than have to bow to how the USA and the West thinks it should run it .

[LivinLOS]

Agree that the pole is stupid for reasons already outlined by posters. Also I would like to say that there are only 2 reasons why better than 90% of farangs chose to stay long time in Thailand. Either 1 or both of these reasons apply:

1. because hot chicks are super easy to get here and either the person has gotten one of these chicks or continuously likes to capture them

2. because Thailand has a cheap cost of living and peasant farangs can live here in, for example, a $75 house in Khon Kaen. I'm talking that they can live here for dirt spit or on a tiny miniscule fraction of the USA poverty line. These are the people who should be forced out as they contribute less than zero to the Thai economy. They are the true milkers. Round em up and get em out is what I say

Or option 3.

A farang can have a very high standard of living for a fairly normal amount of assets.. 300k GBP isnt a very special UK house but a 20 mil baht villa is pretty nice.. Say 3k GBP per month outgoings in the uk to live a normal middle class life in the cold v living very nicely at 200k per month here. Also appealing are climate, pool, servants, etc simply means you can off the rat race treadmill earlier.

Its a variation on the option 2 cost of living but not everyone making thier money go further is hard up for the money.

[jeebusjones]

Also I would like to say that there are only 2 reasons why better than 90% of farangs chose to stay long time in Thailand. Either 1 or both of these reasons apply:

1. because hot chicks are super easy to get here and either the person has gotten one of these chicks or continuously likes to capture them

2. because Thailand has a cheap cost of living and peasant farangs can live here in, for example, a $75 house in Khon Kaen.

This is very accurate. If anyone gives you another reason they're either one of a VERY small minority or they're lying.

I would guess most men come here the first time for reason number 1, then stay once they've "gotten one of these hot chicks." I've never really understood why women come to live in Thailand, unless they're with their farang husband, so reason 2 seems like a pretty good explanation.

Let's be honest... No one is here for the culture.

[brahmburgers]

When I resided in America, I sometimes resented so many foreigners coming to live there - but later I realized the U.S. is a big enough country (in size and in heart) to accommodate new people. Plus new people aften have a special zeal to work hard and do good.

i would allow anyone who wanted to come to Thailand to come and stay as long as they wanted to.

Given the overall condition of Earth, with its over-populationg and dwindling resources, it's tough to say where all the overflow of people should/could go. Currently, China and India

don't have enough females to satisfy their billions of males, and their land quality is quickly degenerating. Could Thailand handle an influx of hundreds of thousands of new people every year? I don't have an answer - plus it's a complicated issue that covers much more than money: it involves land resources and peoples' biases towards other types of people (us and them). As a species, we're still a couple hundred years away from John Lennon's "Imagine" consciousness. "...imagine there's no countries, ...no religion too, ...nothing to live or die for, ...imagine all the people, living life in peace ....I wonder if you can, .....it isn't hard to do" Maybe not hard for Beatlemaniacs and other oddballs, but world tolerance is hard to imagine for most people worldwide.