Visa Extension

[irisheyes]

Hi..can someone advise..

As I live in Ireland I hold a uk and Irsih passport...would this mean I can stay for 90 days on one passport and then exit and return on the other for 90 days...meaning that I could really stay in thailand as long as I want just having to exit every 90 days to return on the other passport. I have now been to thailand 5 times and have met a few friends ..if I wanted to bring one home for say a holiday would it be easier to bring in via the Irish embassy or uk.

Thanks for any help.

[Mahout Angrit]

Hi..can someone advise..

As I live in Ireland I hold a uk and Irsih passport...would this mean I can stay for 90 days on one passport and then exit and return on the other for 90 days...meaning that I could really stay in thailand as long as I want just having to exit every 90 days to return on the other passport. I have now been to thailand 5 times and have met a few friends ..if I wanted to bring one home for say a holiday would it be easier to bring in via the Irish embassy or uk.

Thanks for any help.

There have been a number of threads recently in this forum on this subject you should check them out.

Presumably you are thinking of 30day Visa free entries x 3 then changing passports. It wont work on land border crossings or flights to neighbouring countries as you will always be missing a stamp (where do you change your passport?)

It may work if you return to UK or Ireland to change your passport (as they don't stamp your passport on entry or exit if you are a national of that country.

However, nobody knows how they check passports at Thai Immigration. If it's by name (and your name and date of birth is the same on both passports) you could have some explaining to do. Remember they even photograph you on arrival in Thailand now so you cant even say there are two of you with the same name and date of birth.

As for bringing friends on holiday you must decide where you want them to be on holiday as a Visa for UK will not allow them to visit Ireland or Visa Versa and neither is easy, but possible.

[LivinLOS]

Of course it works on flights.. How would they know you didnt just connect at the previous country airport and not clear customs, from a country with no stamps in or out for Euro passport holders..

I do this all the time between my passports.

I have flown out on one passport and flown back in on a different passport about 4 hours later (fast turnaround on a sing flight visa run.. Not a question.

Its his RIGHT to use whichever passport he wishes to enter a country, the country can of course deny him entry based on thier rules but he isnt breaking the law by using his passports this way.

Many posters seem to think theres something wrong or seaky about 2 passports or dual nationality.

Edited December 26, 2006 by LivinLOS

[irisheyes]

ok...i seem to have different opinions here but I feel that the second is right how would they know which passport I used...as for visas if I flew back into Dublin airport there is no check point or customs to drive north to uk...if I wanted then not that I would I could get boat to mainland uk ..u do not need passport to get boat or plane from Belfast just ID.

Maybe someone else can say dofferent ?

[Mahout Angrit]

Of course it works on flights.. How would they know you didnt just connect at the previous country airport and not clear customs, from a country with no stamps in or out for Euro passport holders..

You have to complete an immigration form which asks the point of embarkation, you lie at your own risk

Its his RIGHT to use whichever passport he wishes to enter a country, the country can of course deny him entry based on thier rules but he isnt breaking the law by using his passports this way.

The question wasn't whether he was breaking the law by using different passports, the question was whether it would work and whether he could outfox the Thai immigration this way.

Many posters seem to think theres something wrong or seaky about 2 passports or dual nationality.

We know it is acceptable to have two legitimate passports or to have dual nationality but the OP must decide how Thai immigration would view it if he were using his two passports to circumvent their regulations. With the technology currently in use its not difficult to detect.

Anyway why dont you just get a triple entry tourist Visa which would give you 9months with no worries, in the long run it wont cost any more as you will only have to do 2 visa runs(instead of 8). If you try to check in with your airline in UK or Ireland without a Visa and a return ticket that is dated longer than 30days away they could refuse to fly you without an onward ticket.

.u do not need passport to get boat or plane from Belfast just ID.

So what would your Thai guest use as ID if not the passport?

Edited December 26, 2006 by Mahout Angrit

[Krub]

If you have 2 passports of 2 different nationalities giving you the 30 days visa free stamp :

It will be possible to enter on Passport 1 get 30 days x 3. On the third exit leave on passort 1 then re-enter with passort 2 for three 30 days entry and repeat.

I am not sure if Thai immigration will make the link between the 2 passports as only the name is the same, all other data is different (nationality, passport number, etc.)

I would risk it if not working, if staying as a 'permanant tourist' with no other possibilities of 'proper' visa for long term.

[Maestro]

Of course it works on flights.. How would they know you didnt just connect at the previous country airport and not clear customs, from a country with no stamps in or out for Euro passport holders..

I do this all the time between my passports.

I have flown out on one passport and flown back in on a different passport about 4 hours later (fast turnaround on a sing flight visa run.. Not a question.

I was wondering about that when reading the original post, how it would work with switching passports for example in Singapore, and it is interesting to see your report from personal experience. Now I understand that without the Singapore stamps it can work, as long as the Thai immigration computers don’t make the connection between the two passports and you.

At this moment it is still too early for you to have tested it under the new rules but please do report back after you have a total of 90 days visa-exempt entries on one passport after October 1 followed by a visa-exempt entry on the other passport. There are a number of other members interested in this scenario, I believe, and a first-hand report is the only thing that counts.

--

Maestro

[Maestro]

You have to complete an immigration form which asks the point of embarkation, you lie at your own risk

It is interesting you should mention that, because I was confronted with that dilemma when I flew from Milan to Bangkok via Vienna. Now, if it had been one flight number all the way with a stop-over in Vienna, I would have had no problem: write that single flight number and Milan as point of embarkation on the arrival card. But I had two flight numbers: OS 516 from Milan to Vienna, OS 025 from Vienna to Bangkok.

So what do I put on the arrival card? I tried to put myself in the place of the immigration officer. What would I want to see in his place? And I decided that I would want to see the flight number on which the passenger arrived, because that’s what I, as immigration officer, have to write next to the arrival stamp in the passport. Logically, therefore, the point of embarkation should be the airport where the passenger boarded the flight with that number.

I don’t think I lied when I wrote OS 025 and Vienna on my arrival card.

--

Maestro

[astral]

Strangely enough Immigration is not interested in where you came from,

only where you boarded the plane, so no lying is needed.

[Mahout Angrit]

Strangely enough Immigration is not interested in where you came from,

only where you boarded the plane, so no lying is needed.

In that case if you swop passports on a Visa run to Singapore and write Singapore as your point of embarkation wouldn't the immigration officer be within his rights to ask where the Singapore entry/exit stamps were? No lying but a lot of explaining to do.

LivinLOS implied he was telling them his journey started in Europe (a lie) when it actually only started in Singapore to avoid the question about Singapore stamps.

As you say personal experiences are the key but not always consistent.

Edited December 27, 2006 by Mahout Angrit

[Krub]

Strangely enough Immigration is not interested in where you came from,

only where you boarded the plane, so no lying is needed.

In that case if you swop passports on a Visa run to Singapore and write Singapore as your point of embarkation wouldn't the immigration officer be within his rights to ask where the Singapore entry/exit stamps were? No lying but a lot of explaining to do.

LivinLOS implied he was telling them his journey started in Europe (a lie) when it actually only started in Singapore to avoid the question about Singapore stamps.

As you say personal experiences are the key but not always consistent.

I have 2 passports from 2 different European countries.

I live partly in Japan and partly in Thailand

I use passport A for my visas and permit of stays in Japan and passport B for my visas, permit of stay, re-entries etc. for Thailand.

When I leave Japan I go out on passport A as it is with this one that I enterred japan it is also in this one that I have re-entry permits (yes I need those in Japan also) for Japan. When I arrive in Bangkok (if I am on a direct flight or even if I have spend some days in Jakarta or Singapore prior to arriving in Bangkok) I always present my B passport as this is the one with the visa, extension of stay, re-entry for Thailand. They have never questionned the presence or lack of stamps from my departure country (wther it be Tokoy, Singapore, Jakarta or others).

Obviously I will leave Thailand always with my B passport.

All other countries where I do not have/need a re-entry or period of stay I use either A or B making sure I always leave on the same passport I enterred.

I think therefore that the 3 x 30 days on one passport followed by 3 x 30 days on the second passport might be possible but it is abusing the system as those 30 days stamp are for short stays. I would not recommend it.

[LivinLOS]

Of course it works on flights.. How would they know you didnt just connect at the previous country airport and not clear customs, from a country with no stamps in or out for Euro passport holders..

I do this all the time between my passports.

I have flown out on one passport and flown back in on a different passport about 4 hours later (fast turnaround on a sing flight visa run.. Not a question.

I was wondering about that when reading the original post, how it would work with switching passports for example in Singapore, and it is interesting to see your report from personal experience. Now I understand that without the Singapore stamps it can work, as long as the Thai immigration computers don’t make the connection between the two passports and you.

At this moment it is still too early for you to have tested it under the new rules but please do report back after you have a total of 90 days visa-exempt entries on one passport after October 1 followed by a visa-exempt entry on the other passport. There are a number of other members interested in this scenario, I believe, and a first-hand report is the only thing that counts.

--

Maestro

I cannot give you that report as I will not be flipping passports until mid summer.. Currently doing 90 day visa runs and the renewal will be then..

I can however confirm I have flipped passports for the last 4 years.. sometimes with as little as 4 hours between leaving immigration and re-entering.. Going the the same airports.. Smiling into the same recognition cameras.. Seeing the same immigration faces.. No one has ever said this is a problem.

My government says this 'flipping' is ok.. The Thai consul in my home country says this is ok.. I dont lie on any forms (point of embarkation was BKK how does sing immigration know if I stayed in the transit lounge).. I have not lied.

Just because the Thai system of needing to take shoes and socks off and count days making arcane scrawls in peoples passports is a joke.. Doesn't mean I have done anything illegal.

[LivinLOS]

Strangely enough Immigration is not interested in where you came from,

only where you boarded the plane, so no lying is needed.

In that case if you swop passports on a Visa run to Singapore and write Singapore as your point of embarkation wouldn't the immigration officer be within his rights to ask where the Singapore entry/exit stamps were? No lying but a lot of explaining to do.

LivinLOS implied he was telling them his journey started in Europe (a lie) when it actually only started in Singapore to avoid the question about Singapore stamps.

As you say personal experiences are the key but not always consistent.

As people are pointing out.. This is 'where did you get on the arriving plane' not 'where did you start your journey' (lets see.. well I was born in Scotland.. then.. )..

Also if you are concerned about Thai authorities looking for sing entry and exit stamps on arrival then 'flip' the passport on the outbound journey and get sing entry and exit chops.. Sing doesn't especially care and you still have given 'Thailand' as your previous destination (again they dont know that wasn't the transit lounge).

[chokdeekrap]

i would like to know more about this with regards to border runs. i read earlier posts in thaivisa.com that discouraged me against this idea.

i have 2 passports & if i could hang in LOS this way it would be ok with me.

i had to re-new one of my passports in BKK. when i did do a 30 day visa run with it last year i was a little nervous. but i stamped out of LOS with my old passport, got the cambodia visa in new passport (new passport issued from BKK), stamped out of cambodia & into thailand. i thought there might be some questions with the new passport entering thailand but i got a quick smile & stamp in no problems/questions.

so i have thought many times this would be the way to go... stamp out with the same passport you stamp into thailand with & use the other passport (after 90 days) to stamp into thailand with... repeat every 90 days.

Edited December 27, 2006 by chokdeekrap

[LivinLOS]

I once tried to flip at a land border and they did not allow it.. The immigration guy said it would be ok.. I went to burma and on the return a different immigration guy said it wasnt ok.. He then got very irate (exploded) when I asked to speak to the other guy (who was his boss I think)..

Though this was at the Ranong / Burma place where they stamp you out and you walk out the door back into Thailand.. I can see that they have no control over you actually going to burma that way.

I did calmly try to point out that the passport I didnt want to use was nearly full but he wasnt listening (when I asked where the boss was is when he flipped.. Loss of face if over ruled.. The other guy there has always been really friendly and even funny and cracking jokes)..

So I can confirm Ranong is a no no but can see why its a problem there. I should have thought about it and tried to flip on the entry to burma instead of the return.

[astral]

Going the the same airports.. Smiling into the same recognition cameras.. Seeing the same immigration faces.. No one has ever said this is a problem.

I doubt the cameras really recognise anyone.

That takes a great deal of computer processing power and even then you would have left the immigration desk before they got a match.

At best it is a record for the future...............

Strangely enough Immigration is not interested in where you came from,

only where you boarded the plane, so no lying is needed.

I have never been asked where I actually came from, the opposite in fact.

When I did fill in the form giving my actual starting point for the journey,

I was asked by the immigration officer where I boarded the plane..............

Then he amended the form.

[loong]

Hi..can someone advise..

As I live in Ireland I hold a uk and Irsih passport...would this mean I can stay for 90 days on one passport and then exit and return on the other for 90 days...meaning that I could really stay in thailand as long as I want just having to exit every 90 days to return on the other passport. I have now been to thailand 5 times and have met a few friends ..if I wanted to bring one home for say a holiday would it be easier to bring in via the Irish embassy or uk.

Thanks for any help.

I'm assuming that you mean doing the 3 border runs every 30 days on 1 passport and then using the other for 3 more consecutive border runs. so no need for a visa.

If this is the case is a bit risky. At the Mae Sai border crossing they may well expect to see an exit stamp from Thailand and the Burma visa in your passport. If there is not one they may well be suspicious. People have tried to avoid paying for the visa into Burma by simply walking thru the Thai exit, crossing the road and walking back into the entry side without actually crossing the bridge.

They've presented their passport with the exit from Thailand, but no stamps for entering and leaving Burma and been told to go and get the necessary stamps.

If you were planning on flying out every 30 days, I would think that this would get expensive. You may as well fly to Penang and get a tourist visa. Remember also, when arriving at an airport without a confirmed flight out of Thailand within 30 days you will be turned back. I think that most airlines will not allow you to board flights into Thailand unless you have the necessary ticket or a visa.

That will be the next thing that the immigration will start to enforce. For some reason, at the moment they will issue 30 days permission to stay at land entry points without seeing the necessary confirmed air ticket out of Thailand within the 30 days. But it is still the law and they are obviously waiting for everyone to get resigned to the new regs b4 p**sing everybody off again.

[loong]

Now I don't know if this is possible or legit.

You have UK and Irish Passport

Can you post your Uk passport to a friend in the UK while staying here on your Irish one.

Your friend then posts the passport and application to Hull for a one year multi entry "O" and then sends the passport with visa back to you.

You fly out of Thailand on your Irish and then fly back using your UK passport with the visa and get 90 days. you do 4 border runs, getting 90 days every time, will give you a total of nearly 15 months.

Repeat

I'm sure that there must be pitfalls, not least the possibility of the passport getting lost

[LivinLOS]

The forum will tell you that is illegal.

My own embassy and the Thai consul in UK have both said that it is not in writing.. As a matter of fact one of the reasons for the issuing of a second passport from the brits is to facilitate the application of visa's.

It would however be very illegal for you to use send the passport that you have used for entry into the country (with the entry chop) outside the country without you accompanying it.