Uber and GrabCar "flagrantly breaking the law" says Land Transport department.

[snoop1130]

Uber and GrabCar "flagrantly breaking the law" says Land Transport department.

 

 

A deputy at Thailand's Land Transport department has said that Uber and GrabCar continue to flagrantly break the law by offering their service in the country.

Nanthapong Chertchu said that police are within their rights to make summary arrests of any driver not registered as a taxi driver.

He said the services are illegal and acting out a cloak and dagger operation.

He said that members of the public are not breaking the law by using applications for their service but they are risking falling prey to unscrupulous individuals.

He said that his department has no control over the drivers and the public is taking a risk as drivers and their histories are not officially registered.

Meanwhile, taxi operators are seeking ways in the courts to make it illegal for people to even use the service.

Thai Rath said that Uber were desperate to find a way through the impasse but were beginning to face the inevitable that they may have to pull out of Thailand.

The news media said that there are so many taxis and the associations that protect them are so strong that it is totally unlike places like Singapore where the concept of Uber and GrabCar has taken hold.

 

Source: http://www.thairath.co.th/content/958585

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2017-6-1

[newcomer71]

They really do live in their own muffled world...

[longtom]

Quote

He said that his department has no control over the drivers and the public is taking a risk as drivers and their histories are not officially registered.

Unlike the (officially registered) taxi driver who came out of jail after a rape conviction and raped another taxi passenger?

 

[halloween]

This is how UBER works in every country. They blatantly ignore the laws in place regarding registration, insurance, safety equipment and regulated fares, then wait to see if they will be enforced.

[beautifulthailand99]

19 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

He said the services are illegal and acting out a cloak and dagger operation.

Many taxis still operate illegally at and around attractions and the airports. I see little effort to eradicate this decades old problem. I'm sure many visitors to Thailand especially Phuket and Pattaya would use 'Cloak and Dagger' to describe the local official taxi services. 

He said that members of the public are not breaking the law by using applications for their service but they are risking falling prey to unscrupulous individuals.
The drivers are rated on the apps so it is a lot safer and less risk than just hailing a cab. If you grab a Bangkok cab there's a good chance you'll get a wrong 'un and there's no way to screen them.

He said that his department has no control over the drivers and the public is taking a risk as drivers and their histories are not officially registered.

Is he talking about taxi drivers here as there doesn't seem to be any control at all there either... Again, their history is recorded on the apps and customers can choose another driver. Official registration doesn't mean diddly squat here as we all know. 

Meanwhile, taxi operators are seeking ways in the courts to make it illegal for people to even use the service.

Good luck with that. Adapt or die I say. Why not start your own service and compete. Makes for more customer service which is what you should be aiming for anyway. 

err since when has Thailand been a bastion of free markets - I'm amazed they have managed to go for so long. As much as I wish they could grow and prosper I'm too much a realist as to the crude nature of power in Thailand to see that happening.

[balo]

The UBER drivers are registered via the app where you can rate them if they are doing a good job , unlike "official" taxi drivers.  Good enough for me. 

 

All transactions are tracked, if anything bad happens you can just show the GPS  to the police as evidence.  You can't do that with a normal taxi .  

 

 

 

[TheLobster]

36 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

I'm sure many visitors to Thailand especially Phuket and Pattaya would use 'Cloak and Dagger' to describe the local official taxi services. 

Great post, we don't say 'cloak and dagger' on Samui, the words 'Mafia' and 'Rip Off' come to mind but I've seen that in Bangkok as well.

 

I'm a little surprised the Land Transport Department hasn't highlighted taxis flagrantly breaking the law by refusing to turn on the meter. 

 

[fishbrando]

3 hours ago, halloween said:

This is how UBER works in every country. They blatantly ignore the laws in place regarding registration, insurance, safety equipment and regulated fares, then wait to see if they will be enforced.

This is one instance where I side with the pirates.  Most of the laws serve to protect the taxi industry, not the consumer.

[Jingthing]

Well, if they really do make it illegal to USE the service, that would probably work to kill it. 

[TheRascal]

12 hours ago, longtom said:

Unlike the (officially registered) taxi driver who came out of jail after a rape conviction and raped another taxi passenger?

 

Twice!

[mtls2005]

Thailand 4.0.

 

 

 

[jacko45k]

And so called 'legitimate' taxis do not break the law by refusing to use the meter, kicking passengers out mid-trip and taking the law into their own hands! Give me a break.

[halloween]

7 hours ago, fishbrando said:

This is one instance where I side with the pirates.  Most of the laws serve to protect the taxi industry, not the consumer.

The Thai taxi industry is a mess, but you are wrong when we are talking about developed countries. In-car cameras, correct insurance and registration, regular vehicle inspections, regulated fares, driver licensing including checks for health and criminal history, are all there for the protection of the customer, and they cost the vehicle owner a significant amount of his income. Oz taxis cannot increase (by multiples as UBER does) their fares when they are busy. the best they can do is multiple hire (if the primary hirer agrees) but this reduces the fare to 2/3 for both passengers.

 

BTW the ATO has won a court case dispensing with the BS claims that it is not a business, just friends helping out. UBER now have to collect GST. Which means they will need an ABN for a business based on their car. If they continue to register and insure their vehicle as private use only, they will be committing fraud. Before you start with UBER providing insurance, ask are they an approved TPPI supplier?

[mtls2005]

11 hours ago, halloween said:

This is how UBER works in every country. They blatantly ignore the laws in place regarding registration, insurance, safety equipment and regulated fares, then wait to see if they will be enforced.

 

 

So, every car with green plates (white text on a green background) meets all of the "laws"?

 

Is insurance even compulsory here? Do all the taxis, tuk-tuks, songthaews, mini-vans, samlors meet all of the "laws"?

 

I honestly do not know what the requirements are to get green plates, but I assume that if one has green plates then you can be an Uber driver? Or not?

 

It would be nice, albeit wholly unexpected, if the "authorities" did something proactive regarding ride-sharing rather than just sit back and whinge. I think incorporating new services can benefit both Thai consumers, and Thai's looking for employment. Or maybe just go back to rickshaws?

 

I do understand that people are afraid of change, new things, disruptions.

[halloween]

7 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

 

So, every car with green plates (white text on a green background) meets all of the "laws"?

 

Is insurance even compulsory here? Do all the taxis, tuk-tuks, songthaews, mini-vans, samlors meet all of the "laws"?

 

I honestly do not know what the requirements are to get green plates, but I assume that if one has green plates then you can be an Uber driver? Or not?

 

It would be nice, albeit wholly unexpected, if the "authorities" did something proactive regarding ride-sharing rather than just sit back and whinge. I think incorporating new services can benefit both Thai consumers, and Thai's looking for employment. Or maybe just go back to rickshaws?

 

I do understand that people are afraid of change, new things, disruptions.

But, but, but.......My comment was about UBER disregarding laws, not Thai compliance with them.

 

BTW ride sharing is a BS claim. It is undeniably a business trying to operate outside the existing regulations.

Edited June 2, 2017 by halloween

[fishbrando]

1 hour ago, halloween said:

The Thai taxi industry is a mess, but you are wrong when we are talking about developed countries. In-car cameras, correct insurance and registration, regular vehicle inspections, regulated fares, driver licensing including checks for health and criminal history, are all there for the protection of the customer, and they cost the vehicle owner a significant amount of his income. Oz taxis cannot increase (by multiples as UBER does) their fares when they are busy. the best they can do is multiple hire (if the primary hirer agrees) but this reduces the fare to 2/3 for both passengers.

This is all fine for the most part although I disagree with regulated fares - the business should be able to charge what they want and increase fares based on demand (as long as it is equal across the board and not a "tourist tax").

 

I don't know how things work in Australia.  The question is: if someone meets all of the above requirements, can they start operating as a taxi?  Or do they have to have some sort of expensive government-granted license like the medallions in the US?

[halloween]

4 hours ago, fishbrando said:

This is all fine for the most part although I disagree with regulated fares - the business should be able to charge what they want and increase fares based on demand (as long as it is equal across the board and not a "tourist tax").

 

I don't know how things work in Australia.  The question is: if someone meets all of the above requirements, can they start operating as a taxi?  Or do they have to have some sort of expensive government-granted license like the medallions in the US?

No. A taxi must have a taxi licence plate, which were selling at a high price. That price has dropped considerably, and the Qld government is offering to buy them back at about 20% of the previous selling price.

Why would you be happy to pay 3, 4 or 5 times the price to get home as you paid to go out?

[fishbrando]

33 minutes ago, halloween said:

No. A taxi must have a taxi licence plate, which were selling at a high price. That price has dropped considerably, and the Qld government is offering to buy them back at about 20% of the previous selling price.

This is the sort of protectionism that needs to go.

 

Why would you be happy to pay 3, 4 or 5 times the price to get home as you paid to go out?

Who said I was happy?  I'm also not happy to pay thousands for Superbowl or World Cup tickets, but that's how supply and demand works.  If you don't let people raise prices during high demand, you get long lines.  The folks in Venezuela could tell you about this.

[YetAnother]

ask guys like this why we have laws and they will have no answer , cause they do not know

[IMA_FARANG]

I have talked to taxi drivers who RENT their taxis from the owners on a daily rental basis.

The difference between UBER and GRAB TAXI is that often the Taxi owners use UBER and the drivers that rent the taxis daily have no choice.

GRAB Taxi is more a taxi driver based system, which is why I prefer GRAB TAXI over UBER.

This is not always true however.

 

 

[halloween]

44 minutes ago, fishbrando said:

This is the sort of protectionism that needs to go.

 

Who said I was happy?  I'm also not happy to pay thousands for Superbowl or World Cup tickets, but that's how supply and demand works.  If you don't let people raise prices during high demand, you get long lines.  The folks in Venezuela could tell you about this.

Right, you want a deregulated industry, any T, D or H in any old banger. Others would much rather drivers vetted before they start transporting their children.

On busy nights there a long lines anyway, but as the regulated taxis are forced out of business because they can't reduce their prices in quiet times, the high fares in busy times will become the only option.

[WhizBang]

The day that all the LEGAL taxis abide by the law (use their meter, drive safely, etc.) and there are no more rogue taxi drivers trying to scam passengers, or worse, rob, rape or kill them, is the day that the Land Department can harp on about how 'illegal' Uber and Grab are.

 

Until then, shut up and do something about reigning in the so called 'legal' taxis.  If the 'legal' taxis were safe and trustworthy, the public would not need to turn to the likes of Uber or Grab.

 

[beautifulthailand99]

This is Thailand where the rule of law does not apply - might is right and that is the law. 

[fishbrando]

1 hour ago, halloween said:

Right, you want a deregulated industry, any T, D or H in any old banger. Others would much rather drivers vetted before they start transporting their children.

More deregulation would be good as it would give more choices.  The folks who are short on cash can take their chances with the more questionable drivers who provide the cheapest service.  People who want premium services and/or additional safety for their children can pay accordingly.  This situation would be much better than one substandard choice enforced and protected by the government.

 

1 hour ago, halloween said:

On busy nights there a long lines anyway, but as the regulated taxis are forced out of business because they can't reduce their prices in quiet times, the high fares in busy times will become the only option.

Not sure what you mean by "anyway".  The long lines are due to the regulated prices.  If prices went up with demand, the long lines would go away as people either paid or found alternatives.  Higher prices will encourage more people to come into the market which will increase supply and cause prices to go down.

[halloween]

1 hour ago, fishbrando said:

More deregulation would be good as it would give more choices.  The folks who are short on cash can take their chances with the more questionable drivers who provide the cheapest service.  People who want premium services and/or additional safety for their children can pay accordingly.  This situation would be much better than one substandard choice enforced and protected by the government.

 

Not sure what you mean by "anyway".  The long lines are due to the regulated prices.  If prices went up with demand, the long lines would go away as people either paid or found alternatives.  Higher prices will encourage more people to come into the market which will increase supply and cause prices to go down.

So you want one service tightly bound by regulation, and another able to completely ignore those regulations, competing for the same customers? sure, that will work.

BTW the long lines are caused by restaurants closing at the same time. Similarly later, when hotels and clubs close at around the same time. by your scenario, a night out is going to be much more expensive.

Edited June 2, 2017 by halloween

[fishbrando]

14 minutes ago, halloween said:

So you want one service tightly bound by regulation, and another able to completely ignore those regulations, competing for the same customers? sure, that will work.

BTW the long lines are caused by restaurants closing at the same time. Similarly later, when hotels and clubs close at around the same time. by your scenario, a night out is going to be much more expensive.

Your debate style is interesting.  You put words into my mouth and then talk about how ridiculous those words are.

 

And yes, when you want to do the same thing at the same time as many of other people, it becomes expensive, like going to the world cup.

[halloween]

13 hours ago, fishbrando said:

Your debate style is interesting.  You put words into my mouth and then talk about how ridiculous those words are.

 

And yes, when you want to do the same thing at the same time as many of other people, it becomes expensive, like going to the world cup.

That is the current situation. Do you prefer deregulation of the taxi industry to the level UBER operates under at the moment, because that is going to cause some serious problems. Taxis are required by law to accept all fares (with some exceptions). Try getting a UBER for a half kilometre trip, or to take granny with her walker and trolley of shopping, or the guy with the fold-up wheelchair.

[11223344]

11 hours ago, halloween said:

That is the current situation. Do you prefer deregulation of the taxi industry to the level UBER operates under at the moment, because that is going to cause some serious problems. Taxis are required by law to accept all fares (with some exceptions). Try getting a UBER for a half kilometre trip, or to take granny with her walker and trolley of shopping, or the guy with the fold-up wheelchair.

You seem to be delusional ... or you mix Australia with Thailand? 

 

Yes "Try getting a UBER for a half kilometre trip, or to take granny with her walker and trolley of shopping, or the guy with the fold-up wheelchair." and it won't be a problem

 

Try that with a taxi and you most likely won't have luck.

[Jonmarleesco]

On 6/1/2017 at 7:40 PM, snoop1130 said:

He said that members of the public ... are risking falling prey to unscrupulous individuals.

Which planet is he standing on? What does he suppose is at the root of the whole taximeter issue?

Edited June 4, 2017 by Jonmarleesco

[Jonmarleesco]

On 6/3/2017 at 10:35 AM, halloween said:

That is the current situation. Do you prefer deregulation of the taxi industry to the level UBER operates under at the moment, because that is going to cause some serious problems. Taxis are required by law to accept all fares (with some exceptions). Try getting a UBER for a half kilometre trip, or to take granny with her walker and trolley of shopping, or the guy with the fold-up wheelchair.

Are you thinking and writing under some delusion about the way taxis in LoS operate? As with everything in LoS, what taxis might be legally required to do, and what they often actually do, are two entirely different things.