Why The Next Recession Will Morph Into A Decades Long Depressionary Event

[Asiantravel]

2 hours ago, suzannegoh said:

 

Obviously it would have been a big loss if someone invested once and once only in Japanese stocks and they made that investment in 1989, but have you ever run the math on what rate of return a Japanese salaryman would have achieved if he dollar-cost-averaged into Japanese stocks starting in the mid 80's and put X% if his salary into Japanese stocks each month at whatever the prevailing price of stocks was at the end of that month? In that scenario, he would have done a lot of buying when prices were depressed and achieved a much higher ROI than someone who made a single investment at the market peak in 1989.

 

but timing would have been essential and how many Japanese salarymen would have had such skills?  

anyway that  graph was only used to illustrate what happens when a bubble economy collapses

[suzannegoh]

but timing would have been essential and how many Japanese salarymen would have had such skills?  
anyway that  graph was only used to illustrate what happens when a bubble economy collapses

It doesn't take skills to invest like that, quite the opposite. Dollar cost averaging is how many working people invest in IRAs and 401k's and the Japan experience is a common argument against that style of investing.

[Asiantravel]

12 hours ago, suzannegoh said:

It doesn't take skills to invest like that, quite the opposite. Dollar cost averaging is how many working people invest in IRAs and 401k's and the Japan experience is a common argument against that style of investing.

I guess it's your opinion at the end of the day .

Anyway I've been reading more than just a few people who claim there isn't even a real market anymore because it's ultimately ruled by bots

 

http://time.com/money/4668059/why-dollar-cost-averaging-is-a-lousy-retirement-investing-strategy/

[Naam]

On 6/26/2017 at 1:26 PM, Asiantravel said:

On 6/26/2017 at 10:30 AM, F4UCorsair said:

There's never a shortage of doomsayers....they thrive on negativity, house prices are about to crash, the markets are about to collapse, we'll all be living on rabbit stew, etc.

I've been investing for a long time, and the value just keeps increasing, with 'corrections' along the way.

and there is never a shortage of those who are too scared to even debate the issue...

...because it's a waste of precious time to debate the issue with hardcore gloom&doomers who are spreading their lopsided gospel since decades. yes there'll be more crises like 2008. some perhaps even more severe. and only the super rich will get through them unscathed. 

[Kiwiken]

As long as the Leaders of Nations and their financial advisers keep believing in the Freidman theory of trickle down the Worlds economy will continue spiralling down. The only time the bottom tier get trickle down is when some rich man pisses on them. The middle classes think they are safe but the cannot see that their bases is being eroded too.

 

[Asiantravel]

3 hours ago, Naam said:

...because it's a waste of precious time to debate the issue with hardcore gloom&doomers who are spreading their lopsided gospel since decades. yes there'll be more crises like 2008. some perhaps even more severe. and only the super rich will get through them unscathed. 

 

If 1% were that confident about their ability to protect their wealth, why then almost on a weekly basis are they trying to start off nuclear world War 3 somewhere on the globe? And even if they plan to escape to their luxuryunderground bunkers the world will not be  a  nice place to live for a very long time after the event.

 

The End of the (Petro)Dollar: What the Federal Reserve Doesn’t Want You to Know
 

Quote

 

Despite the mainstream narrative, there are several other reasons why Qatar is in the crosshairs. Over the past two years, it conducted over $86 billion worth of transactions in Chinese yuan and has signed other agreements with China that encourage further economic cooperation. Qatar also shares the world’s largest natural gas field with Iran, giving the two countries significant regional influence to expand their own trade deals.

 

http://theantimedia.org/end-of-petrodollar/

 

[Naam]

5 minutes ago, Asiantravel said:

If 1% were that confident about their ability to protect their wealth, why then almost on a weekly basis are they trying to start off nuclear world War 3 somewhere on the globe?

these kind of ridiculous claims are the reason why i refuse to waste my time with gloomers like you.

[Asiantravel]

4 minutes ago, Naam said:

these kind of ridiculous claims are the reason why i refuse to waste my time with gloomers like you.

they're not so ridiculous when you learn the REAL reason why Saddam Hussein and Gaddafi were murdered

[Naam]

12 minutes ago, Asiantravel said:

they're not so ridiculous when you learn the REAL reason why Saddam Hussein and Gaddafi were murdered

everybody knows both were aliens from the Delta quadrant placed by the Illuminati with the help of the Federal Reserve in their positions to protect the value of the US-Dollar.

[suzannegoh]

6 hours ago, Asiantravel said:

I guess it's your opinion at the end of the day .

Anyway I've been reading more than just a few people who claim there isn't even a real market anymore because it's ultimately ruled by bots

 

http://time.com/money/4668059/why-dollar-cost-averaging-is-a-lousy-retirement-investing-strategy/

I didn’t express an opinion.  It’s a fact that many people invest in 401k's by taking X% out of their salary each month and having it automatically invested in stocks at current market prices.  Often employers match the percentage that the employees invest, creating a strong incentive for them to invest that way.  And since it’s an automated thing, it requires no skill and no market timing.  Not sure why you wouldn’t be aware of that.  Even if you’ve never worked for a company that offers a 401k plan, given your keen interest in investing I would have thought that you would have at least read about how companies like Vanguard, Fidelity, and Betterment advocate that people invest for retirement.

Edited June 28, 2017 by suzannegoh
grammar

[Asiantravel]

26 minutes ago, suzannegoh said:

I didn’t express an opinion.  It’s a fact that many people invest by taken out of their pay of their salary and having it automatically invested in stocks at current market prices.  And since it’s an automated thing, it requires no skill and no market timing.  Not sure why you wouldn’t be aware of that.  Even if you’ve never worked for a company that offers a 401k plan, given your keen interest in investing I would have thought that you would have at least read about how companies like Vanguard, Fidelity, and Betterment advocate that people invest for retirement.

Quite frankly I don’t pay any attention or have any interest in the activities or promises made by pension companies anymore after reading about one of the largest pension funds in USA (Teamsters union) returning minus 0.81% followed by cutting its benefits and projecting it will be officially insolvent by 2025

[suzannegoh]

Quite frankly I don’t pay any attention or have any interest in the activities or promises made by pension companies anymore after reading about one of the largest pension funds in USA (Teamsters union) returning minus 0.81% followed by cutting its benefits and projecting it will be officially insolvent by 2025:sad:

 

Willful ignorance then. Doesn't the sheer incorrectness of your advice ever give you pause? You've been deriding people for investing in stocks since the DOW was at 8000. That's not a great track record.

 

[Asiantravel]

3 minutes ago, suzannegoh said:

 

 

Willful ignorance then. Doesn't the sheer incorrectness if your advice ever give you pause? You've been deriding people for investing in stocks since the DOW was at 8000. That's not a great track record.

 

ha ha  

and let's see what happens now they're taking the stimulus away

[soalbundy]

Consumers are struggling everywhere, only outrageous amounts of credit are keeping them afloat, my ignorant gut feeling says this has got to end badly.

[Brunolem]

58 minutes ago, Naam said:

everybody knows both were aliens from the Delta quadrant placed by the Illuminati with the help of the Federal Reserve in their positions to protect the value of the US-Dollar.

Not so...Gaddafi was removed because he planned to launch a new currency, an African Dinar, backed by gold, a very big red line for the US!

One can't threaten the almighty dollar and its offshots such as the petrodollar.

And yes there is a bunch of so-called neocons, mostly infesting the US administration, that are hell bent on starting a big war, convinced that it will be easily won, even though the US army has repeatedly proven itself unable to win any war since 1945!

Their objectives are not military at all, but rather to profit from the turmoil that will ensue.

Reality is not about being optimistic or pessimistic, but rather...realistic...

[Brunolem]

2 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Consumers are struggling everywhere, only outrageous amounts of credit are keeping them afloat, my ignorant gut feeling says this has got to end badly.

Indeed!

[Senechal]

On 6/26/2017 at 10:30 AM, F4UCorsair said:

There's never a shortage of doomsayers....they thrive on negativity, house prices are about to crash, the markets are about to collapse, we'll all be living on rabbit stew, etc.

I've been investing for a long time, and the value just keeps increasing, with 'corrections' along the way.

 

I've been falling from the 100th floor for over 2 seconds.

 

I'm really picking up speed at the 22nd floor now.

 

..No problems so far.

[Senechal]

2 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Not so...Gaddafi was removed because he planned to launch a new currency, an African Dinar, backed by gold, a very big red line for the US!

One can't threaten the almighty dollar and its offshots such as the petrodollar.

And yes there is a bunch of so-called neocons, mostly infesting the US administration, that are hell bent on starting a big war, convinced that it will be easily won, even though the US army has repeatedly proven itself unable to win any war since 1945!

Their objectives are not military at all, but rather to profit from the turmoil that will ensue.

Reality is not about being optimistic or pessimistic, but rather...realistic...

 

I've always felt wars were a lot like consulting contracts: As a consultant, the idea is not to solve the problem you were hired to address. The idea is to extend the contract as long as possible.  And to make the hiring company dependent on your services in perpetuity.

 

 

Edited June 28, 2017 by Senechal

[Asiantravel]

4 hours ago, Brunolem said:

Not so...Gaddafi was removed because he planned to launch a new currency, an African Dinar, backed by gold, a very big red line for the US!

One can't threaten the almighty dollar and its offshots such as the petrodollar.

And yes there is a bunch of so-called neocons, mostly infesting the US administration, that are hell bent on starting a big war, convinced that it will be easily won, even though the US army has repeatedly proven itself unable to win any war since 1945!

Their objectives are not military at all, but rather to profit from the turmoil that will ensue.

Reality is not about being optimistic or pessimistic, but rather...realistic...

 

 this kind of thing shows how desperate they are.

it's coming as sure as night follows day...............................................

 

Evidence that the White House is baiting ISIS into making a chemical weapons attack

 

Quote

 

U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. Nikki Haley in a tweet added that Assad’s allies would be responsible too.

 

“Any further attacks done to the people of Syria will be blamed on Assad, but also on Russia & Iran who support him killing his own people,” she tweeted. (CNS News)

 

Quote

Look at the all the rest of what the US ambassador said! She stated outright — no holds barred — that both Russia and Iran will also be held directly responsible for “ANY” attack that the US sees happen. This is a pledge to ISIS that, if they can pull this off, the US will also strongly attack their other greatest enemies, Iran and Russia!

 

 

http://thegreatrecession.info/blog/us-baits-isis-stage-false-flag-chemical-attack-justify-greater-us-attack-syria/

 

[Brunolem]

12 hours ago, Asiantravel said:

 

 this kind of thing shows how desperate they are.

it's coming as sure as night follows day...............................................

 

Evidence that the White House is baiting ISIS into making a chemical weapons attack

 

 

 

http://thegreatrecession.info/blog/us-baits-isis-stage-false-flag-chemical-attack-justify-greater-us-attack-syria/

 

They are desperate indeed.

They may be evil but they are not stupid and ignorant...they know full well that the West is stuck in a (economic) dead end with no way out, save for war, at least in their minds.

They replay the 1930s scenario, remembering how WWII wiped the slate clean and paved the way for decades of prosperity.

The only (little) problem is that there were no nuclear devices at that time, at least not before 1945, and no intercontinental ballistic missiles.

These days, even armchair warriors have to be careful because no one is really safe.

A nice war against Russia and Iran, over Syrian and Iraqi territories, would be perfect for them...if Russia and Iran would play ball...

[Asiantravel]

On ‎26‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 5:10 PM, Thaidream said:

I don't believe in conspiracy theories- but I do believe the super wealthy will resist any type of change that will redistribute wealth.  Their greed knows no bounds. At the moment- Trump plays directly into their hands and they would love to see him as President for 8 years so they can continue the assault against the other 99%.

 

The real problem in the World is what I call materialistic capitalism which espouses the 'greed is good' philosophy.   During the last 40 years- large corporations and banks have  created little real essential goods but many services and financial instruments that have no real value. Such things as derivatives and bundled mortgages simply push money around the World like a Ponzi scheme.

 

The average person simply wants to make a decent living; have a home and a car; send their children to a  safe and decent school ; be taken care of when ill; and hopefully retire with dignity.All of this is under assault by the materialistic capitalists that will continue to push for more wars; increased military spending; higher prices for medical care and life saving drugs; and higher costs for education. None of this is sustainable simply because what has taken place in the last 40 years has shown the inequality of such a program.

 

This will only end when a leader emerges that cannot be bought by either money or fame; and tells the populace the real truth and the real solutions that will  allow the 99% to regain control over their lives. The interesting thing is that the wealthy will still be rich even with a radical restructuring of the economy- they just won't be super rich. If the wealthy were smart- they would co-operate in the restructuring and support it because during a revolution they won't fare as well.

I can only think that ending the Federal Reserve of  America would be a step in the right direction

 

The Federal Reserve Is A Saboteur - And The "Experts" Are Oblivious

 

Quote

 

Back in 2015, when I predicted that the central bankers would shift gears dramatically into a program of consistent interest rate hikes and that they would begin cutting off stimulus to the U.S. financial sector and more specifically stock markets, almost no one wanted to hear it. The crowd-think at that time was that the Fed would inevitably move to negative interest rates, and that raising rates was simply "impossible."

Many analysts, even in the liberty movement, quickly adopted this theory without question. Why? Because of a core assumption that is simply false; the assumption that the Federal Reserve's goal is to maintain the U.S. economy at all costs or at least maintain the illusion that the economy is stable.

They assume that the U.S. economy is indispensable to the globalists and that the U.S. dollar is an unassailable tool in their arsenal. Therefore, the Fed would never deliberately undermine the American fiscal structure because without it "they lose their golden goose."

.....................................The Fed is also responsible for almost every single major economic downturn since it was established. As I have noted in the past, Ben Bernanke openly admitted that the Fed was the root cause of the prolonged economic carnage during the Great Depression on Nov. 8, 2002, in a speech given at "A Conference to Honor Milton Friedman ... On the Occasion of His 90th Birthday:"

 

 

http://www.alt-market.com/articles/3221-the-federal-reserve-is-a-saboteur-and-the-qexpertsq-are-oblivious

[suzannegoh]

1 hour ago, Asiantravel said:

I can only think that ending the Federal Reserve of  America would be a step in the right direction

 

The Federal Reserve Is A Saboteur - And The "Experts" Are Oblivious

  Quote

 

Back in 2015, when I predicted that the central bankers would shift gears dramatically into a program of consistent interest rate hikes and that they would begin cutting off stimulus to the U.S. financial sector and more specifically stock markets, almost no one wanted to hear it. The crowd-think at that time was that the Fed would inevitably move to negative interest rates, and that raising rates was simply "impossible."

Many analysts, even in the liberty movement, quickly adopted this theory without question. Why? Because of a core assumption that is simply false; the assumption that the Federal Reserve's goal is to maintain the U.S. economy at all costs or at least maintain the illusion that the economy is stable.

They assume that the U.S. economy is indispensable to the globalists and that the U.S. dollar is an unassailable tool in their arsenal. Therefore, the Fed would never deliberately undermine the American fiscal structure because without it "they lose their golden goose."

.....................................The Fed is also responsible for almost every single major economic downturn since it was established. As I have noted in the past, Ben Bernanke openly admitted that the Fed was the root cause of the prolonged economic carnage during the Great Depression on Nov. 8, 2002, in a speech given at "A Conference to Honor Milton Friedman ... On the Occasion of His 90th Birthday:"

 

http://www.alt-market.com/articles/3221-the-federal-reserve-is-a-saboteur-and-the-qexpertsq-are-oblivious

That author apparently correctly predicted that the Fed would raise rates, as did InfoWars but how good have their predictions been about the consequences of that?  When the Fed ended QE  at the end of October 2015 the Dow was at 16974, the S&P 500 was at 1982 and the NASDAQ was at 4549, and gold was at 1142.  This is what InfoWars wrote at the time:
https://www.infowars.com/from-this-day-forward-we-will-watch-how-the-stock-market-performs-without-the-feds-monetary-heroin

[tonray]

InfoWars ? If you take anything but laughs and chuckles from them you are really being foolish.

[Brunolem]

22 hours ago, suzannegoh said:

That author apparently correctly predicted that the Fed would raise rates, as did InfoWars but how good have their predictions been about the consequences of that?  When the Fed ended QE  at the end of October 2015 the Dow was at 16974, the S&P 500 was at 1982 and the NASDAQ was at 4549, and gold was at 1142.  This is what InfoWars wrote at the time:
https://www.infowars.com/from-this-day-forward-we-will-watch-how-the-stock-market-performs-without-the-feds-monetary-heroin

They didn't expect, or imagine, that the ECB, the Japanese Central Bank and the Bank of England would immediately take over from the Fed and together create to the tune of 200 billion dollars a month...undefinitely...

In our "global" world, it doesn't matter much where the money is created, as long as it keeps on flowing.

On top of that, what they most probably didn't expect was the direct and massive intervention of central banks, especially the Japanese (again) and the Swiss (yes, the prudent Swiss) buying shares directly on the market with money they print at will!

When the game is rigged like that, no wonder that the markets are going higher.

Yet, one way or another, this will end, and this will end badly...otherwise it would be so easy...create wealth out of fake money...as if no one had thought about it before!

This kind of scheme can last for a few years, then the consecutive pain lasts for decades...actually, after Rome finished playing a similar game, the pain lasted for about a thousand years...they called it the Middle Age...

 

[Asiantravel]

4 hours ago, Brunolem said:

They didn't expect, or imagine, that the ECB, the Japanese Central Bank and the Bank of England would immediately take over from the Fed and together create to the tune of 200 billion dollars a month...undefinitely...

In our "global" world, it doesn't matter much where the money is created, as long as it keeps on flowing.

On top of that, what they most probably didn't expect was the direct and massive intervention of central banks, especially the Japanese (again) and the Swiss (yes, the prudent Swiss) buying shares directly on the market with money they print at will!

When the game is rigged like that, no wonder that the markets are going higher.

Yet, one way or another, this will end, and this will end badly...otherwise it would be so easy...create wealth out of fake money...as if no one had thought about it before!

This kind of scheme can last for a few years, then the consecutive pain lasts for decades...actually, after Rome finished playing a similar game, the pain lasted for about a thousand years...they called it the Middle Age...

 

the stock market right now reminds me of this picture because it's all in the eye of the beholder (because fundamental  economic activity  certainly doesn't support current valuations ) 

[Asiantravel]

Brunolem based on the contents  of your posts I have a strong feeling this book just released in May of  this year ( actually part of a  trilogy) could be of interest to you -if you haven't heard of it before

 

Quote

All content is Systematized by Cathal. All chapters were authored by numerous subject experts. For example, content pertaining to Nuclear destruction of Russia is authored by those with knowledge of such. The reader should understand content is not theoretical, actual power factions are presently and actively pursuing this proven solution, as they believe such a war is winnable. That also highlights the level of desperation at the Top.


You see, the alternative is The Reset which is just as dangerous. How to change the System Framework within which the economy operates, alongside operational and legal changes to ownership, without System and social disintegration? Think of all the dumbasses you know, and how they’ll react. The Reset is dangerous and that’s why ‘the can’ has been kicked for ten years. I’d like to personally thank the FED and other public officers for keeping the System stable for so long. It is popular to criticize such public servants, but as you’ll come to understand, such criticism is, at best, misdirected. Of course they're responsible for building the biggest Ponzi scam in human history which is on the brink of collapse; but as you'll see, they had no choice. Capitalism is a Usury driven system of growth which demands that future production is always greater than past production. If it isn't 'growth' must by synthesized by magic money; and before you complain contemplate the alternative: Collapse of the System which keeps you alive. It is assumed that the reader has read volume 1 and 2, without which, universal understanding is not possible.

https://www.amazon.com/Reset-Philosophy-Capitalism-3/dp/1546805605/ref=pd_bxgy_14_img_3?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=1546805605&pd_rd_r=X29T5D01CEEV05D72ENP&pd_rd_w=R6daC&pd_rd_wg=XQRK9&psc=1&refRID=X29T5D01CEEV05D72ENP

[Brunolem]

14 hours ago, Asiantravel said:

Brunolem based on the contents  of your posts I have a strong feeling this book just released in May of  this year ( actually part of a  trilogy) could be of interest to you -if you haven't heard of it before

 

https://www.amazon.com/Reset-Philosophy-Capitalism-3/dp/1546805605/ref=pd_bxgy_14_img_3?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=1546805605&pd_rd_r=X29T5D01CEEV05D72ENP&pd_rd_w=R6daC&pd_rd_wg=XQRK9&psc=1&refRID=X29T5D01CEEV05D72ENP

Thanks...I will give it a look...

[timendres]

On 6/30/2017 at 11:38 AM, Asiantravel said:

Capitalism is a Usury driven system of growth which demands that future production is always greater than past production.

Capitalism is the natural result of personal freedom and private property.

It is the current debt-based monetary system, and it's mismanagement, that requires growth, not capitalism.

Whether or not capitalism is moral or amoral depends on it's participants, just like any organization of humans.

Personally, I have more faith in thousands of individual capitalist business owners than I will ever have in a few communist "leaders".

What we really need is a monetary system that serves it's true purpose, minimal government regulations that level the playing field and protect society's interests, and more leadership and social discussion about how to move towards a future that is sustainable.

In terms of sustainability, I have more faith in capitalism to deliver that than any other alternative.

[Asiantravel]

48 minutes ago, timendres said:

Capitalism is the natural result of personal freedom and private property.

It is the current debt-based monetary system, and it's mismanagement, that requires growth, not capitalism.

Whether or not capitalism is moral or amoral depends on it's participants, just like any organization of humans.

Personally, I have more faith in thousands of individual capitalist business owners than I will ever have in a few communist "leaders".

What we really need is a monetary system that serves it's true purpose, minimal government regulations that level the playing field and protect society's interests, and more leadership and social discussion about how to move towards a future that is sustainable.

In terms of sustainability, I have more faith in capitalism to deliver that than any other alternative.

 

Even if by some miracle  a new financial system abandoned the debt  based system entirely, I still simply don’t believe the level of freedom you refer to will ever be restored.  The surveillance society in which we now live and which has been slowly and meticulously assembled (while people slept through it all ) has gone much too far to be reversed.What incentive is there to abandon it now that it's been created?

You can choose any name you like for  any new  system  but those  in control of  information on our daily lives and follow every step we make as individuals  have the real power to herd  the sheeple.  A  small number of powerful people at the top  will always have the power to influence our actions and decisions  . I don’t consider that to be personal freedom.

[timendres]

44 minutes ago, Asiantravel said:

 

Even if by some miracle  a new financial system abandoned the debt  based system entirely, I still simply don’t believe the level of freedom you refer to will ever be restored.  The surveillance society in which we now live and which has been slowly and meticulously assembled (while people slept through it all ) has gone much too far to be reversed.What incentive is there to abandon it now that it's been created?

You can choose any name you like for  any new  system  but those  in control of  information on our daily lives and follow every step we make as individuals  have the real power to herd  the sheeple.  A  small number of powerful people at the top  will always have the power to influence our actions and decisions  . I don’t consider that to be personal freedom.

Well, of course, you are absolutely correct. The transformation of society over the past 30 years is nothing short of biblical. On the other hand, the more those in power depend on those information sources, the easier it will be to blind them if need be.

 

However, on a personal level, you still have the option of freedom. Without question, it is far more difficult than it was in the past - the new mandatory health coverage law being the perfect example of assaulting our freedoms. But it is still possible. It is just that most people cannot imagine the cost of total freedom. Others of us attempt to achieve a level short of that ideal. Unfortunately, today's youth have never tasted the freedoms we enjoyed 50 years ago, so I am afraid they have no concept of what we have lost.

 

Powerful people at the top have always had power to influence and control. And the bell curve dictates that society will usually move as a herd. Hopefully wise voices and good leadership will arise, as they have in the past. Only time will tell.

 

Real issues are on the horizon. We will see how our fellow citizens respond to the times ahead. I still believe people have an inherent desire for freedom and fairness. Unfortunately, there are times when they are lulled to sleep. Hopefully they wake up before we pass the point of no return.