Second UK Visit Visa Refusal

[Taurus2017]

Hi Guys,

 

Been a lurker for a while but finally signed up. Would be appreciative of some opinions on latest UK visit visa refusal for my girlfriend.

 

Background 

• I am 32 years old, earn c.UK2.5k  a month after tax, own two properties, one mortgage free, one 50% mortgage free, own a car, full time job in engineering at management level.
• She is 25 years old, earns only 12k baht a month, works in a beauty salon reception, rents a condo in Pattaya, and has a small rented shop which she employs her mother and sister (fairly recently opened).
• We have been 'together' since December 2015, I have visited her 7 times since and we have documented every visit in my supporting file.
• Made an application for visit visa to UK in June 2016 - rejected due to her old employer not giving a guarantee. She was actually earning much more then but employer was unreasonable in many ways.
• Left it another year, once again built up an impressive supporting file, going above and beyond on my part to prove my part as sponsor. She also now has a guarantee letter from new employer, saying to call them to confirm her leave of absence for 2 month visit to UK.
• Application submitted in Bangkok on 14th June - girlfriend was contacted at 9am on the 19th for additional questions, all OK. ( I was with her in Bangkok on holiday when she got said call).
• Waited, and waited, and waited. Got an email on 30th June saying apologies for the delay, they wanted to do additional checks, and a decision will be reached within 5 days. 
• Monday 3rd July - email at UK time 8.30am saying decision made.

 

Aftermath

• Documents arrived back to girlfriend in Thailand Wednesday 5th - refusal letter enclosed - no visa. Please see attached reason for refusal (singular)
• So they tried to contact her workplace only on 18th and 19th of June yet they waited and waited and said additional checks were needed - but seemingly didnt bother doing them?
• She has spoken to her boss (owner of shop) who said nobody has tried to call her and can she call (obviously we stated it is now too late as the application is finished and refused with no grounds for appeal, however shocking that is)
• She spoke to everyone in the shop who states to their knowledge they did not receive a call and the shop was open and no messages left. Who to believe? 
• The main issue is that they hung on and on, and apologised saying they would be making more checks - this isn't stated on the refusal!! If it said "we tried again on 30th June" etc then OK - something going on in the shop then.

 

I would appreciate anyone's thoughts on this being the sole reason for refusal and if there is any action I could take as it seems completely unfair considering they made no contact, then delayed us 2 weeks stating more checks needed - there is no mention of later contact trying to be made! With all this evidence, emails etc is there any right to appeal?

 

Would we be stupid to apply immediately again stating to call the shop owner on her mobile directly? We do have a feeling the manager of the shop, who has stated to both of us that "farang and thai relationship no good" (this older lady is clearly scorned by my girlfriends situation and has openly condemned our relationship to us numerous times - this lady works in the shop and apparently does some 'bar work' to support an unemployed Thai husband and child - you get the script) - could potentially be ignoring the phone calls or say something to jeopardize the application should she been the one contacted. This surely happens quite commonly?

 

I would be much appreciative of any advice on it as it has been a really upsetting one this time around as it looks like everything else was fine and had confirmation been made - she would be flying here on Tuesday. 

 

Many thanks!

 

 

[Mattd]

The thing that needs addressing by the looks of it is proving to the ECO that your girlfriend intends on returning back to Thailand at the end of the proposed visit, this is obviously what is causing the refusal, take a look at her situation and try to provide a meaningful reason why she would return.

A job to return to is certainly one reason and should definitely be included, provide the mobile number of her employer for sure, did her employer state that this LOA was granted in the letter?

Are the other reasons you can find, does she own any property, land etc.? The more the better.

Most everything else you have clearly shown the ECO, i.e. proven relationship, enough funds available for the sponsorship for her holiday and so on, however, until she can show that she will return to the satisfaction of the ECO, then the refusals will keep on coming I'm afraid.

[rasg]

Two months is a bit of a stretch for a first visit visa imho knowing how much time Thais get for holidays.

 

Having said that it sounds like you have a problem with her boss not answering the phone. What will she say if they do speak to her? Probably more worrying than her not answering from what you have said.

 

You need your GF to have a heart to heart with her boss and find out why she didn’t answer the phone. It's quite clear on the refusal notice that they tried to call over a period of a couple of days.

 

If the boss is being obstructive it's a problem.

[Taurus2017]

Mattd,

 

Thanks for the response...maybe I did not clearly state the following proof was given - 

 

• Signed, dated LOA letter on headed paper with two contact numbers - the ECO states they tried numerous times to call however no message was left or did they try again when they delayed the application (even they haven't stated that they tried, so why did they state on an email they needed extra time to do more checks) We issued shop issued photo's of her at works also.
• No, she doesnt have land but she rents a shop unit, and a condo - proof was given (for what it's worth). We have really done our homework this time and gave numerous reasons for return including proof.

Reading the letter it seems to look like, had they made successful contact with the shop owner as requested on her letter - the refusal wouldn't have been made as nothing else is stated. - this is my point. 

 

They then kept the application back for two more weeks and did not try again - even though they sent the email apologizing for the delay due to other checks being needed. This is why I am pretty annoyed if you get my jist - I'd rather have been rejected for a list of reasons, but the fact the refusal letter on lists that it was a phone call that the shop says was never made, nor was a call to the owner's mobile (she has subsequently said is there any way she can call them etc - obviously the application is now closed so no, she can't). They even state the contact was tried on 18/19 June however upon holding back the application - they don't mention trying to make additional later contact, albeit that was their explanation for holding it back.....

 

I understand there is absolutely no right of appeal, but its seems a bit of  trivial situation. 

 

 

Edited July 6, 2017 by Taurus2017

[Taurus2017]

Rasg,

 

Thanks for response.

 

The reason they would happily give her two months off is she works in a business catering to tourists - it's low season and it saves the owner paying a salary for someone to stand about! In high season - different story.

 

Also her overall boss did say to call her - surely an ECO has some knowledge that jealousy amongst working class Thai people has probably cropped up in similar scenarios, so a random person in a shop answering a phone is less likely to be a true picture than speaking to the business owner/her employer - who as I stated has subsequently said she will gladly talk to them however nobody tried her on her mobile as requested.

[7by7]

The email was simply letting her know about the delay in processing her application over the standard 15 working days. It is standard wording when they fall behind.

 

My stepson and his wife received a similar email on the 30th June, they received a further email on the 3rd of July to say a decision had been made and their passports ready for collection on the 5th, and on the 5th they collected their passports with their visas in them.

 

As rasg says, a two month holiday is very unusual for any Thai, so it is not surprising that the visa section should want to confirm this with your girlfriend's employer.

 

Employers letters need to be on headed paper, and they will call the number in that heading. They are not going to call a mobile number, that could be anybody! It is not their fault if on calling the shop no one there was willing to call the owner to the phone or, if the owner wasn't there, pass on any message!

 

IMHO, the problem here is with her employer, or her fellow employees. That is the situation which needs to be resolved before she applies again.

 

 

[Boycie]

Has the refusal letter got a signature from the Entry Clearance Officer at the bottom of the page with date of refusal?

 

The reason i ask is because a friend had tried 3 times (Thai wife and stepson) and on the last attempt they used an agent in the Trendy building. Refusal letter came back and i compared it to my wifes a few years back. No signature on theirs and reason for refusal the 3rd time was he never provided evidence that he was British!! All his paperwork was provided, I would have asked for my money back from the agent. He was in the UK at the time of the applications.

 

Do the UK Border Agency now write Thailand instead of Thai for nationality on the refusal letters?

 

Although his refusal letter looked genuine, i wasn't 100% sure. 

 

 

[Krataiboy]

16 hours ago, rasg said:

Two months is a bit of a stretch for a first visit visa imho knowing how much time Thais get for holidays.

 

Having said that it sounds like you have a problem with her boss not answering the phone. What will she say if they do speak to her? Probably more worrying than her not answering from what you have said.

 

You need your GF to have a heart to heart with her boss and find out why she didn’t answer the phone. It's quite clear on the refusal notice that they tried to call over a period of a couple of days.

 

If the boss is being obstructive it's a problem.

Two months is a bit of a stretch for a first visit visa imho knowing how much time Thais get for holidays.

 

A tourist visa to the UK automatically entitles the applicant to stay six months, so it is hard to see how a two month visit would be problematical. The bottom line,I suspect, is that for some reason they believe this young lady has plans to remain in UK when her holiday visia expires. A full time job in Thailand which pays what would be a derisory salary in the UK is routinely regarded as insufficient evidence of an intention to return.

 

One can understand why so many falangs end up marrying Thai girls just to get them into their home country (often with disastrous results). The system virtually forces one to do this - or kiss the relationship goodbye. Decisions about who to admit or bar are made often by very immigration officers with little exerience of life and relationships -and I gasther that the appeals system against debatable decisions has been abandonedf.

 

The plight of people like this young couple has not exactly been helped by the Brexit decision, which has put even more pressure on the British government to tighten up its border control policy. Unless this luckless couple can produce additional evidence to convince Immigration that she is sure to return to Thailand after her visit, the outlook is not sunny.

Edited July 7, 2017 by Krataiboy

[GOLDBUGGY]

Although you agreeing to Sponser her during her visit, and paying all costs which you were able to supply documentation that financially you could, this two months is a long time for just going on a vacation. Also mentioned by them that the primary focus on this application is on the applicant, and not you and your financial ability. 

 

The primary focus is if they have enough proof to indicate that she would return to Thaland on the agreed time. Giving up a job that pays 12,00 baht a month is not a big sacrifice. She could make double that cleaning rooms in a hotel anywhere in the UK. Your relationship with her is also week, and just being a Boy Friend/ Girl Friend type.

 

To be honest, and from what you have said, I don't see her as having strong ties to Thailand either. Since your job is in the UK, and where you derive you primary source of income, I would think that there is a better chance she would come with you to the UK, and stay with you there, which they don't like. Even if you apply for residency in the UK after she arrives. So by sponsering her, you may be actually hurting her application more than you are helping it. 

 

It is clear that you need to come up with some good reasons to convince them that she would come back to Thailand after her vacation there. It may seem unfare but this is how it works. I once almost had my wife refused entry because then we didn't own a house in her country. Even when I was married to her and had all kinds of proof of that, they felt she would go with me, and not return later. I was only able to get it approved as I knew the head man at the embassy.  

 

Good Luck!  

[Pilotman]

things have changed a great deal in the last few years and you may just be caught in the government's attitude to immigration in general and to the possibility of you and your GF eventually settling permanently,  despite all your evidence to the contrary.  My advice for what it's worth is to contact a London based immigration lawyer  for a future application and use their services.  Yes it's pricey,  but they tend to be effective if you pick the right one.  

[superal]

16 hours ago, Taurus2017 said:

Rasg,

 

Thanks for response.

 

The reason they would happily give her two months off is she works in a business catering to tourists - it's low season and it saves the owner paying a salary for someone to stand about! In high season - different story.

 

Also her overall boss did say to call her - surely an ECO has some knowledge that jealousy amongst working class Thai people has probably cropped up in similar scenarios, so a random person in a shop answering a phone is less likely to be a true picture than speaking to the business owner/her employer - who as I stated has subsequently said she will gladly talk to them however nobody tried her on her mobile as requested.

What has happened to you is not uncommon even for Thai ladies who can prove a good income , e.g my Thai girlfriend was refused a tourist visa because they did not believe she would return to the UK despite the fact that she owns her own house and business plus takes care of her parents . Have heard of married couples being refused the visa but  had been granted the visa on the previous 2 applications and nothing had changed . Lastly I heard of a Brit who who successfully secured a tourist visa for his girlfriend who worked in a bar had no money or assets and they had only been together for 3 months , she had every reason not to return to Thailand , an agency was used .

                 There is no consistency in the ECO decisions and no recourse .  Makes me angry when I hear a case like yours when at the same time  aliens are pouring in the UK to live full time mostly supported by the state benefits . Has been said to me that a tourist visa can be got far easier if your lady were to go on an official tour organised by a bona fide Thai company .   Or using an agency who will mostly guarantee a result at a price .  Good luck 

[paul18620]

I think you will have to bite the bullet and pay an agency the fees for their services and then you might get the visa for your girlfriend to visa the UK,had worked for some people ,but also failed for some ,so its a gamble, but maybe your willing to take it.Good Luck.

[Mattd]

49 minutes ago, superal said:

Or using an agency who will mostly guarantee a result at a price

I have to admit that I do not understand how an agent can make any guarantees (mostly or not) when the applicant / sponsor are only going to provide the same amount of information as they would applying themselves, I do agree that there are inconsistencies in the way that visa applications are granted or denied, that is possibly due to the ECO at the time, different ECO's will define the guidelines differently? In most cases here in Thailand, the applicants would be in in a similar position to the OP, so trying to demonstrate a viable reason to return to Thailand is going to be difficult, if you use the logic that a 12,000 THB a month job can be dumped, most advise against using Children or Family as a reason, Land or property won't go away, so could also be dismissed as a reason by the ECO, in reality most things could be.

I tend to agree with the other posters now, 2 months was too much to ask for initially and this is why they want to contact the employer, perhaps not so much as to verify the employment, more to verify the two months absence from work, as they will be wondering why she is employed at all if the employer can do without her for 2 months.

[Taurus2017]

It's a tricky one because the manager of the shop (who is a nasty piece of work seemingly) is swearing blind to the owner that nobody called at all....I don't trust her however. I am just hoping the ECO had the foresight to call during business hours (11am to 11pm) and not before 9am as when they called my girlfriend! It isn't clear on the refusal whether anyone was reached or it just rang so we will never know the outcome. The owner requested on the headed letter to call her mobile if couldn't get through to the shop.

 

And the 2 month thing I even gave reasons why that would be ok at this time of year taking into account how quiet that business is as based around tourism solely. This is why her overall boss suggested she go now and better get back for high season. 

 

Secondly, as stated above, we provided evidence of her being a lease holder of her own business where she employs her mum and sister. Again I can see why this is taken with a pinch of salt. 

 

It just bugs me that we will never know if they did get in touch with the shop or they tried at a time when it wasn't open as I can only imagine they initially called right after talking with my girlfriend at 9am (it was the same date). The problem now is the whole thing has caused big upset in her work to the point she doesn't want to be there anymore as she believes this rat of a manager has said nobody can verify anything upon the ECO calling, however I have a suspicion they haven't even got through at all...we will never know. 

 

I can see how a strong sponsorship and weak reason to return could suggest an issue returning however this isn't mentioned on the letter - it appears to boil down to the phone calls. 

 

It is fairly disgraceful in this day and age that there is no appeal in a case like this or a way of seeing notes regarding whether they spoke to anyone or actually tried during business hours! 

 

I could really do with being pointed in the direction of someone that could have some sway with this so please PM me if you know of any avenues to go down.

 

and lastly thank you very much everyone, glad I finally joined, it's great to hear everyone's views on this! 

 

[misterphil]

She has no reason to return to Thailand, you have a hell of a lot more than she has so immigration think she wont come back hence the rejection.  

 

Don't reapply, she will get a 10 year ban if you are persistent. 

 

Reasons to return:

Land
House
Cars 

Motorbikes

Children

You, if you lived in Thailand she would have you to return to.  

 

[Taurus2017]

Appreciate your point. However I've heard of numerous examples where a lady has literally had nothing, I mean nothing and they've had a much shorter relationship and sailed through. The whole thing is antiquated and perplexing but yes, it is what it is! 

 

My point is that the only thing mentioned is the fact they couldn't verify the employment and nothing else was mentioned as previous. That's the annoyance because we will never know the truth behind the phone call carry on. 

 

so buying a scratty piece of land in her home town will satisfy as reason to return? I think not! 

 

We are going to leave it for now and look at other avenues however. Shame she isn't a 25 year old radicalised Iraqi man ?

 

 

[mick01827]

They very rarely approve a visa if you apply yourself as opposed to going through an agent, this has come from from agent/embassy. 

I've been through exactly the same situation, gf applied herself everything in order visa refused twice, went through an agent and got the visa 1st time, it's all about who you know and the agents know everyone in the embassy, my gf was asked 1 question at the interview 'what agent did you use', unfortunately you've just got to play the game if you want the visa. 

[rasg]

There has been so much inaccurate information in this threads it's breathtaking.

 

1 hour ago, misterphil said:

She has no reason to return to Thailand, you have a hell of a lot more than she has so immigration think she wont come back hence the rejection.  

 

Don't reapply, she will get a 10 year ban if you are persistent. 

 

Reasons to return:

Land
House
Cars 

Motorbikes

Children

You, if you lived in Thailand she would have you to return to.  

Applying for visas to the UK will not get you a ten year ban unless you are foolish enough to lie on an application. There is no point in applying time after time unless you address the concerns of the ECO in the previous applications but UKVI like the money too much to ban people from applying.

 

Owning a car or a motorbike and having children have almost no weight as a reason to return. So many Thai women with kids work away from home to provide financially while family bring their kids up.

 

3 hours ago, superal said:

What has happened to you is not uncommon even for Thai ladies who can prove a good income , e.g my Thai girlfriend was refused a tourist visa because they did not believe she would return to the UK despite the fact that she owns her own house and business plus takes care of her parents . Have heard of married couples being refused the visa but  had been granted the visa on the previous 2 applications and nothing had changed . Lastly I heard of a Brit who who successfully secured a tourist visa for his girlfriend who worked in a bar had no money or assets and they had only been together for 3 months , she had every reason not to return to Thailand , an agency was used .

                 There is no consistency in the ECO decisions and no recourse .  Makes me angry when I hear a case like yours when at the same time  aliens are pouring in the UK to live full time mostly supported by the state benefits . Has been said to me that a tourist visa can be got far easier if your lady were to go on an official tour organised by a bona fide Thai company .   Or using an agency who will mostly guarantee a result at a price .  Good luck 

An agency will not and cannot "mostly guarantee" that an application is successful. You seem to have "heard of" a few instances of visa failures but I bet you haven’t seen the refusal notices of any of them. Without knowing what was in the applications and what the stumbling blocks actually were.

An example would be if an applicant who owns a house and business and looks after aging parents. The application is for a three month visit. The ECO will want to know who is running the business and who will look after the aging parents while the applicant is away. Maybe that wasn't explained in the sponsor letter.

Another example. My, now wife, who worked in the hotel I was staying in when I visited Thailand the first time in January 2015 was granted two visit visas in a six month period and after her second trip returned to Bangkok, applied for a Settlement visa, waited for 14 days for it to granted, picked it up from VFS and flew back to the UK that same evening. We'd only known each other three months and no agency was used.

 

All an agency will do is collate the information and present it in a professional way. The applicant and sponsor will do 95% of the work. A forum like this can guide somebody through the whole process and it's not that difficult. 95% of the agencies out there are shockingly bad and many provide inaccurate info.

 

4 hours ago, Krataiboy said:

A tourist visa to the UK automatically entitles the applicant to stay six months, so it is hard to see how a two month visit would be problematical. The bottom line,I suspect, is that for some reason they believe this young lady has plans to remain in UK when her holiday visia expires. A full time job in Thailand which pays what would be a derisory salary in the UK is routinely regarded as insufficient evidence of an intention to return.

 

One can understand why so many falangs end up marrying Thai girls just to get them into their home country (often with disastrous results). The system virtually forces one to do this - or kiss the relationship goodbye. Decisions about who to admit or bar are made often by very immigration officers with little exerience of life and relationships -and I gasther that the appeals system against debatable decisions has been abandonedf.

Just because a visit visa lasts for six months does not mean that an applicant should use the full six months. As I mentioned early on in the thread many request a visa for a few months and then don't explain how they can spend that much time away from the job, aging parents or business that typically can’t run without them.

 

If an applicant requests a two month trip to the UK and then stays four months, they will need a good reason and to explain why they stayed so much longer in any subsequent visa application.

 

I think UKVI have it pretty much right. I can’t remember the exact figures but more than 95% of visa applications are successful. I would give them far more credit than you seem to. I think they have seen it all before when it comes to visa applications. They have to strike a balance and look at a visa application in its entirety.

 

I think they only stopped the appeals for visit visas. Probably because they were taking up more time than the visas themselves. I doubt they could make any money from appeals...

[theoldgit]

On ‎07‎/‎07‎/‎2017 at 2:04 PM, mick01827 said:

They very rarely approve a visa if you apply yourself as opposed to going through an agent, this has come from from agent/embassy. 
I've been through exactly the same situation, gf applied herself everything in order visa refused twice, went through an agent and got the visa 1st time, it's all about who you know and the agents know everyone in the embassy, my gf was asked 1 question at the interview 'what agent did you use', unfortunately you've just got to play the game if you want the visa. 

Totally wrong and misleading information, I suspect that most applicants don't use an agent to prepare their application and the vast majority of visa applications are approved.
Given that the majority of applications are considered only on the evidence submitted by the applicant, the Entry Clearance Officer more often than not has no need to carry out a telephone interview, and as there is no routine interview these days, and hasn't been for many years, I find it hard to believe that any applicant would be asked "what agent did you use" as you allege.
The process is not, as you suggest, a game, if the applicant can demonstrate that their applicant is both genuine and affordable and that, on the balance of probabilities, they will leave the UK at the conclusion of their visit, then Entry Clearance will be granted.
As a matter of interest my partner has successfully applied for three UK Visas, as well as three Schengen and a visa for the UAE, all were issued without question and she's never used the services of an agent.

[Taurus2017]

Using my experience talking with numerous sources here and in Thailand, and off some of your stories, I think I have been dealt a pretty harsh hand here considering the only issue brought up at all was the nobody answering the phone....would there be scope to get this investigated (as you would be able to here in the UK) using a lawyer?

 

Money is not really an issue here, hey if I thought a scratty bit of farmland would seal the deal I would have bought her one believe me! To me (yes I am not a draconian "computer says no" ECO) her lease on a shop unit employing two people (as well as her own job and documented LOA) would be more reason to get back, as well as the fact I have visited 9 times in the 18 months we've been together. Why would we risk all that?

 

I can't help feel we have been pretty unlucky. I might just get her to try again next week, now that we have confirmed with her boss that she will be expecting a call. 

 

 

 

[superal]

55 minutes ago, theoldgit said:

Totally wrong and misleading information, I suspect that most applicants don't use an agent to prepare their application and the vast majority of visa applications are approved.
Given that the majority of applications are considered only on the evidence submitted by the applicant, the Entry Clearance Officer more often than has no need to carry out a telephone interview, and as there is no routine interview these days, and hasn't been for many years, I find it hard to believe that any applicant would be asked "what agent did you use" as you allege.
The process is not, as you suggest, a game, if the applicant can demonstrate that their applicant is both genuine and affordable and that, on the balance of probabilities, they will leave the UK at the conclusion of their visit, then Entry Clearance will be granted.
As a matter of interest my partner has successfully applied for three UK Visas, as well as three Schengen and a visa for the UAE, all were issued without question and she's never used the services of an agent.

The Thai embassy encourage the use of agents as per attached link . Reason for my ladies refusal was , " do not believe she will return to Thailand " despite property , business  and parents in Thailand . I wrote to John Vine who was the Chief Inspector of Borders and Immigration   . He took time to reply to me twice and said that although there was an appeal procedure he felt that if I applied again using the same format a visa would be issued . I think it is true to say that some people are more gifted than others when it comes to forming an application pack or even general paperwork and of course the ECO is not a robot and its his interpretation and opinion . So some applicants are just unlucky    

Edited July 7, 2017 by theoldgit
Commercial link removed.

[theoldgit]

@superal Of course the company you provided the link to encourage applicants to use an agent, they are one why wouldn't they?

The website you suggest is owned by a firm of lawyers in Thailand and it's not a fact they attempt to hide, if you think it through why would the "Thai Embassy" offer advice regarding visas to the UK? 

[rasg]

54 minutes ago, Taurus2017 said:

Using my experience talking with numerous sources here and in Thailand, and off some of your stories, I think I have been dealt a pretty harsh hand here considering the only issue brought up at all was the nobody answering the phone....would there be scope to get this investigated (as you would be able to here in the UK) using a lawyer?

It wasn't the fact that nobody answered the phone. UKVI were unable to confirm and verify her employment. My feeling is that had she applied for one month it would have been granted. Their first thought would have been similar to mine. Two months? If she is so indispensable, how is it possible that her company can let her go for two months? The amount of holidays normally receive is minimal and they wanted to know.

 

Did you mention that it was low season for her job in your sponsor letter and the reason they wanted to confirm it? If you give UKVI all of the information that they need, they have no need to call.

[7by7]

5 hours ago, superal said:

Or using an agency who will mostly guarantee a result at a price

 

2 hours ago, mick01827 said:

They very rarely approve a visa if you apply yourself as opposed to going through an agent, this has come from from agent/embassy. 

 As rasg and theoldigit remark; these comments and similar are complete and utter rubbish.

 

All an agent can do is advise on how to prepare the application and supporting documents. They have no influence at all over the ECOs at the embassy. A reputable agency will never claim that they do; but, unfortunately, there are unscrupulous ones, some run by Brits, who not only lie about this, but also claim membership of official sounding organisations which only exist in their imaginations!

 

In the last four years I have sponsored 4 UK visit visa applications; all of them successful, none used an agent.

Edited July 7, 2017 by 7by7

[Taurus2017]

Yes, I am pretty sure we don't NEED an agent - we used an agent for the first one and it was shambolic. I knew it would be refused before submission. This one however we took everything (the refusal letter was actually more like an advice document) and we really went to town on it ourselves. 

 

rasg, yes we mentioned it being low season and that her boss needed her back for a certain time, hence the need for the trip now. You are correct though, maybe one month would have been better in hindsight. I would just love to know the truth behind the phone call scenario! That will forever remain a mystery. It has left a sour taste within the workplace I might add, to the point she wants to leave that job now as I suppose she has lost face and feels like the older, bitter ladies in the shop are laughing at her. All in all, I have my suspicions that the manager was obstructive, as she has voiced her opinion of me to my girl on numerous occasions. That is something a lot harder to solve, if they are to call the shop should we re-submit. Shame they didn't get through to the owner....

 

What to do....what to do....

 

Thanks all

 

 

[7by7]

I am not at all surprised that the ECOs wanted to check and have this unusually long leave of absence confirmed by your girlfriend's employer.

 

As others have mentioned, a two month holiday from work is very unusual in Thailand. My stepson and his wife arrive in the UK on the 10th August for a stay of just 10 days. They would like to stay longer, we would like them to stay longer; but they both work for banks and this was the maximum holiday their employers would allow. As this falls within the norms for Thailand, their employers were not phoned by the visa office for confirmation of the holiday.

 

4 hours ago, Taurus2017 said:

I am just hoping the ECO had the foresight to call during business hours (11am to 11pm) and not before 9am as when they called my girlfriend!

Did anyone tell them in the application that there would be nobody there before 11am?

[Taurus2017]

As I think I have mentioned 3 times now - It was stated WHY it was an unusually long leave - because of low season and it being beneficial to the boss because she wanted to retain her as she is good at her job, however during low season she could let her go for longer as it would be wage relief for her. Win-win for both of them. This is aside from my girlfriend having additional income from her own shop - again all detailed. 

 

The 11am issue was not mentioned, however I am sure the ECO are aware that a tourist centered spa may not open until later in the morning and remain open until late at night....then again maybe not. 

 

 

Edited July 7, 2017 by Taurus2017

[7by7]

3 minutes ago, Taurus2017 said:

As I think I have mentioned 3 times now - It was stated WHY it was an unusually long leave - because of low season and it being beneficial to the boss because she wanted to retain her as she is good at her job, however during low season she could let her go for longer as it would be wage relief for her. Win-win for both of them. This is aside from my girlfriend having additional income from her own shop - again all detailed. 

Yes, and as said, the ECO would want to confirm this by talking to the employer. After all, anyone can purloin some headed paper and write a letter (not saying you or your girlfriend did this, of course; but the ECO doesn't know that).

 

4 minutes ago, Taurus2017 said:

The 11am issue was not mentioned, however I am sure the ECO are aware that a tourist centered spa may not open until later in the morning and remain open until late at night....then again maybe not. 

Never assume!

 

Do you really expect the ECO to know the opening times of every spa in Thailand!

 

 

[Taurus2017]

7by7....Agree with both points!

 

I guess it will bug me for the foreseeable as to what the situation really was with the phone calls!

 

Now I just need to decide whether to get an amended letter stating the opening hours and to contact the owner directly should any additional checks be needed so that they can't be thrown off trail by the poison dwarf dried up bitter manager! To be fair, my girl has lost face now and has said just to leave it....it's her call at the end of the day. 

 

 

[rasg]

I'd be interested in seeing your sponsor letter. The ECO obviously saw holes in what you had to say about her employment or maybe it was just the two months that you requested.

 

With my wife's first visit visa we requested a month but she was laid off from work while she was away so she stayed 18 weeks. I explained it in her second visit visa application a few weeks later and also explained that I was financially supporting her and it went through without a hitch. The two visit visas actually overlapped by 12 days. With the four visas my wife has had since 2015 we have never had a call.